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Technarchy

macrumors 604
May 21, 2012
6,753
4,927
I think he is referring to scaling on low end hardware like how Apple has managed to get iOS to perform well on phones like the 3GS/iPhone 4 but similar specced phones will struggle to run the latest version of Android.

You got it. Cheerio.
 

gwelmarten

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Jan 17, 2011
476
0
England!
Hi Everyone

I noticed whilst on this thread that their seemed to be lots of Samsung supporters here. Something I didn't expect.

I'd be interested to hear where you stand on the Apple VS Samsung issue. Vote here.

Sam
 

daveathall

macrumors 68020
Aug 6, 2010
2,379
1,410
North Yorkshire
Hi Everyone

I noticed whilst on this thread that their seemed to be lots of Samsung supporters here. Something I didn't expect.

I'd be interested to hear where you stand on the Apple VS Samsung issue. Vote here.

Sam

You are obviously a big fan of Apple, nothing wrong with that, but why do you keep posting in this forum?

Which is surprising to me - as this is MacRumors - a site where you'd expect the majority of people to be Apple fans (or at least interested in Apple).

Have you noticed this;

ScreenShot2012-09-17at182352.png


Alternative to iOS and iOS devices. Do you know what that means?

Also, have a look at my sig line.
 

pear21

macrumors 6502
Mar 12, 2012
269
0
Michigan
I thought the us version of the s3 was dual core and the international was quad?

Yes that is correct so that means the s3 that people use in the US aren't much faster than an iPhone in my opinion and that's why I'm excited to test out an even faster iphone
 

Mrg02d

macrumors 65816
Jan 27, 2012
1,102
2
Yes that is correct so that means the s3 that people use in the US aren't much faster than an iPhone in my opinion and that's why I'm excited to test out an even faster iphone

Except it ISN'T faster, is it? Plenty of tests came out to show that the s3 is faster than the 5. 1800 or whatever at 1500Mhz is still faster than 1601, isn't it? You can't clock the 5 higher, so there you go bro.
 

pear21

macrumors 6502
Mar 12, 2012
269
0
Michigan
Except it ISN'T faster, is it? Plenty of tests came out to show that the s3 is faster than the 5. 1800 or whatever at 1500Mhz is still faster than 1601, isn't it? You can't clock the 5 higher, so there you go bro.

Will you ever notice that small of a difference though? No but you will say oh yeah I totally can notice bro.
 

Mrg02d

macrumors 65816
Jan 27, 2012
1,102
2
Will you ever notice that small of a difference though? No but you will say oh yeah I totally can notice bro.

I can feel when apple fanatics need to be sat down, thats for sure. Getting all ape like over erroneous results is ridiculous. Pages and pages of garbage the other night.

Its like watching a touchdown get called back. :D
 

pear21

macrumors 6502
Mar 12, 2012
269
0
Michigan
I can feel when apple fanatics need to be sat down, thats for sure. Getting all ape like over erroneous results is ridiculous. Pages and pages of garbage the other night.

Its like watching a touchdown get called back. :D

That doesn't even make sense
 

watchthisspace

macrumors 6502a
Apr 11, 2010
658
71
I'd like to point out, that as far as I'm aware of, the Geekbench results don't include the set of up of the devices. The iPhone for all we know, could be a fresh restore with only the Geekbench app, while the s3, could be running lots of apps in the background, or be stripped down.

That's the only thing I really don't like about these results.

Wait until the iPhone 5 is, and hopefully someone will have a video showing some objective benchmarks of the iPhone and S3 doing something. Even then the results are quite Apple's to Oranges because both devices can't run the exact same set up.
 

Mrg02d

macrumors 65816
Jan 27, 2012
1,102
2
I'd like to point out, that as far as I'm aware of, the Geekbench results don't include the set of up of the devices. The iPhone for all we know, could be a fresh restore with only the Geekbench app, while the s3, could be running lots of apps in the background, or be stripped down.

That's the only thing I really don't like about these results.

Wait until the iPhone 5 is, and hopefully someone will have a video showing some objective benchmarks of the iPhone and S3 doing something. Even then the results are quite Apple's to Oranges because both devices can't run the exact same set up.

Yup. That would explain why the 5 was bested by so many s3 users shortly after that crap was put out there.
 

Mrg02d

macrumors 65816
Jan 27, 2012
1,102
2
What's with all this talk of degraded battery life? My s3 lasts longer than ANY of my other smartphones...Sounds like regurgitated barf to me.
 

roxxette

macrumors 68000
Aug 9, 2011
1,507
0
i checked some results on geekbench, i dont know why its advertised the s3 score of 15xx when i see a lot of scores of 17xx, 18xx and higher :confused:
 

KnightWRX

macrumors Pentium
Jan 28, 2009
15,046
4
Quebec, Canada
It scales so well that android does not have a reputation for laggy performance...

Laggy performance (UI lag) is not an indication of lack of scaling or scaling. You do not understand the word if that is what you think, I'm sorry to say.

UI lag can come from many sources, but the main source is processing UI redrawing on the main thread, thus blocking all other events until you're done rendering your final buffer. Usually, this is where you will want to leverage your thread scheduler by offloading the rendering of the back buffer to a different thread, leaving your main thread free to still process events and prepare the datasets for the next UI frame. When the backbuffer is done rendering, you simply use the main thread to flip the buffers.

You have to realise, to run anything at 60 fps, you have to have your rendered buffers ready in 16 ms each time.

All of this, as you probably don't know, has nothing whatsoever to do with scaling. Nothing. Nada.

Scaling is the function of simply being able to scale to bigger or lesser configuration. If you have a performance of 100 on a certain processor by a certain metric, linear scaling will mean you have 200 on twice that processor and 50 on half of it. Linear scaling is most impossible to reach due to overhead, but the Darwin and Linux kernels are both very good at scaling and reducing that overhead, on both sides. That means that the OS is capable of utilizing the extra hardware you throw at it very well as to make your investment worthwhile and will gracefully give you what you expect of lesser hardware.

But really, I don't think you really are here to learn or actually use the proper language. You just want to bash Android don't you ?

----------

I think he is referring to scaling on low end hardware like how Apple has managed to get iOS to perform well on phones like the 3GS/iPhone 4 but similar specced phones will struggle to run the latest version of Android.

Which has nothing to do with the "OS scaling" at all. That's not what scaling means or is. Anyway, you and I both know what Techanarchy is here to do, I don't know why we bother with him anymore. The guy is basically doing what he accused others of doing in the iPhone forums.

Goes to show where the real troublemakers were. Guy is so obsessed with his vendetta against Android, he can't stop himself from posting in threads about it. Of course, anyone else that doesn't like something wouldn't bother wasting all their energy on it...
 

cotak

macrumors regular
Feb 24, 2011
224
0
Laggy performance (UI lag) is not an indication of lack of scaling or scaling. You do not understand the word if that is what you think, I'm sorry to say.

UI lag can come from many sources, but the main source is processing UI redrawing on the main thread, thus blocking all other events until you're done rendering your final buffer. Usually, this is where you will want to leverage your thread scheduler by offloading the rendering of the back buffer to a different thread, leaving your main thread free to still process events and prepare the datasets for the next UI frame. When the backbuffer is done rendering, you simply use the main thread to flip the buffers.

You have to realise, to run anything at 60 fps, you have to have your rendered buffers ready in 16 ms each time.

All of this, as you probably don't know, has nothing whatsoever to do with scaling. Nothing. Nada.

Scaling is the function of simply being able to scale to bigger or lesser configuration. If you have a performance of 100 on a certain processor by a certain metric, linear scaling will mean you have 200 on twice that processor and 50 on half of it. Linear scaling is most impossible to reach due to overhead, but the Darwin and Linux kernels are both very good at scaling and reducing that overhead, on both sides. That means that the OS is capable of utilizing the extra hardware you throw at it very well as to make your investment worthwhile and will gracefully give you what you expect of lesser hardware.

But really, I don't think you really are here to learn or actually use the proper language. You just want to bash Android don't you ?

----------



Which has nothing to do with the "OS scaling" at all. That's not what scaling means or is. Anyway, you and I both know what Techanarchy is here to do, I don't know why we bother with him anymore. The guy is basically doing what he accused others of doing in the iPhone forums.

Goes to show where the real troublemakers were. Guy is so obsessed with his vendetta against Android, he can't stop himself from posting in threads about it. Of course, anyone else that doesn't like something wouldn't bother wasting all their energy on it...

The whole scaling thing about iOS is stupid. Really stupid because if you actually look at what they do, they give you less and less of the new features so it'll run ok on the older hardware. So yes you might get a bigger numerical version but you aren't getting all the new features. Sometimes the new features are not given even when the hardware should be able to run it, all to drive sales. After all Apple makes almost all it's money from hardware sales. If you need to buy a new phone to get all the new features, it's no different from Android where some manufacturers aren't good at providing updates. In either camp you can't sit on a phone for decades and expect to have the latest and greatest software.

As for Android performance. VM code is not really a major performance bottleneck. If VM code is that bad Java would not be so popular. Yes there's an overhead but it's a lot less than most people think. And the ability to do some optimization with VM code which you cannot with native code (such as C++) means that in some situation it's actually faster (http://blog.cfelde.com/2010/06/c-vs-java-performance/). Before you boys shoot your mouth of try asking Siri these question eh? (Or just google, it might be quicker typing).

The whole Java VM vs native code thing shows just how little some guys who wrote in this thread knows about the devices they are using. Much as you like to think you are very clever most of you haven't faced and pass the sort of interviews the leading tech firms have for hiring their employees. Believe me, the guys who works for Apple and Google knows their stuff. They don't make silly choices like using a VM when it's clearly a lot slower.

So why is Android seemingly slower? Well, first of all they decided to do a iterative process vs what apple did with the iPhone. Being late to market means they either do what RIM is choosing to do (and losing users because of it) and waiting to release a "perfect" product. Or they can release something that sort of works and iterate on it to get better. Considering their market share they made the right choice. And the latest Android version is perfectly fast and usable.

As for the benches, the S3 comes in faster in some test (using the same bench) and then in other tests slower. Which makes sense considering that Android has real multi-tasking. So I wouldn't make a judgement till some more reliable testing gets done.
 
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