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Which Win laptop has the best trackpad and keyboard?
- Thread starter navaira
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The “go-to” Windows laptops in order of sales market share are HP, Lenovo and Dell. Microsoft has a tiny market share on its own, somewhere below #6 Acer 6.5%.
Dell is a great choice and among the top brands for customer service.
Lenovo again remains a solid choice and one of the few things it had been missing from its lineup was a 15” model and one with discrete graphics. Both solved with the X1 Extreme.
https://www.google.com/amp/amp.laptopmag.com/articles/laptop-brand-ratings
The XPS was one of the first Windows laptops with a great screen in a compact form factor with good battery life. Today, there are many options. The XPS keyboards are pretty average, so if you are in a thread where people are asking for a laptop with the best keyboard, not too surprising the XPS did not come up.
Keyboards on the Dells are ok. But just ok, nothing great. Honestly, I didn't like them at all. Could use them easily, not a problem. But didn't like them. Thinkpads on the other hand are in the league of their own.
I would suggest X1C with HDR screen. One that I have. Excellent keyboard with excellent screen. As a programmer, those are the two things I really appreciate and I hit a home run with this little thing
Exactly what I am considering, but I'll check the Extreme first. I never needed a laptop with a 15" screen, but judging by the specs it's much lighter than I would expect. On the other side, X1C is easily hackintoshable, so...
So the XIC is the Lenovo Thinkpad X1 Carbon? I must take a look at one in person. I don't need much in the way of power, given this will be used purely for writing (and interneting).
I have tried out the Dell XPS in store, and actually thought it was a bit plasticky.
I have tried out the Dell XPS in store, and actually thought it was a bit plasticky.
Which did you find to be plasticky? The laptop or the keyboard? I find Lenovo to have a significantly better keyboard than the Dell. As much as I like the XPS, the keyboard is a bit of a shortcoming. I have also heard some reports of reliability issues with them.
If you don't need a lot of power, you might also want to look at one of the Lenovo Yoga 920's. It is lightweight with a beautiful 4K display and decent ports. It lacks discrete GPU but will be more than capable for your stated use.
The Microsoft Surface line also has better keyboards and trackpads than Dell imho and come in aluminum or magnesium alloy cases, if it was the overall construction of the Dell XPS you found to be plasticky.
The 13" Dell XPS I looked at was the 2018 update, in white. The keyboard felt okay (as much as you can really test one in a store display), but the surround/wrist rest/base shell seemed a little cheap. It wasn't flexing or anything (as I found with the Surface Laptop, which was a big surprise), but it just reminded me more of one of those $300 HP laptops.
My wife has a Yoga 920 for work - I have never typed on it, but the keyboard retracts into the base when you flip the screen around into tablet mode, and I wonder if that means it uses a different key mechanism which wouldn't be as good as the standard X1? I didn't realise the screen was 4k - I'll have to take a closer look!
Probably the best in-store keyboard test I did was on the Surface Book, and while I like that laptop, it is pretty big and relatively heavy. The Surface Laptop looks nice but the ones I have tested have flex on the keboard, and I am not 100% sold on the alcantara fabric covering. I have an alcantara folding sleeve for my iPad, and after a couple of years that thing is DIRTY DIRTY DIRTY.
That is good to know about the Surface Laptop. I have to admit that the Laptop is the one Surface Device that I have never tried. The 2-1 aspect is what has appealed to me with the Surface line. I own a 2017 Surface Pro and have looked extensively at the Surface Book 2. I love the keyboard on the Surface Book 2. Probably my second favorite to the Lenovo X1 lines. I even like the keyboard on the Surface Pro better than Apple butterfly keyboards though.
As for the Alcantara, I clean mine periodically with a little Sonax Alcantara cleaner and after a year it still looks great. But I don't know that it would hold up as well as a sleeve?
The 920 offers an FHD and UHD option for the display. The 4K UHD looks really nice. I didn't spend enough time with the keyboard though since I was looking for a 15" with discrete graphics. I couldn't help myself having a good look at the Yoga 920 4K, because it is just a great looking machine (mho), but didn't spend enough time with the keyboard. The hinge mechanism is a nice feat though. The pen support with the 2-1 touchscreen devices is also nice for note taking and markup.
One advantage of the Surface Book 2, of course, is that the display simply removes or reverses, so it doesn't need to accommodate the retractable keyboard design. So no compromises need to be made.
Yes, it is kinda amazing that Microsoft can do a better keyboard on the detachable keyboard case for the Surface Pro than Apple can on a laptop that costs at minimum $1300.
Admittedly, my iPad case does get a lot dirtier than the Surface Laptop would, but the wrist rests of my Macbook Pro can get pretty sweaty with long periods of work, so it just seems like an annoying extra step having to specifically look after the fabric on the Surface Laptop. They should really offer the laptop in two configurations, one with plain aluminium and the other with alcantara.
I think a part of what makes the wrist rests of the MacBook Pro get so sweaty is a twofold problem. The aluminum is non-porous/non-breathable and aluminum conducts heat. The wrist rests get warm and there is no airflow under your wrist to provide any cooling.
I do like the idea of two options for the laptop, or at least a removable Alcantara option. At least with the Surface Pro you can replace the keyboard cover if it gets too worn. It isn’t the cheapest thing to do since the keyboard is integrated, but a removable/replaceable Alcantara pad for the laptop should be able to be done at a reasonable price I would think.
That said in terms of maintenance, I always found I would wipe down the wrist rests or the MBP as well, particularly in summer, because it would get a little buildup. I don’t find a little foaming Alcantara cleaner too much maintenance on my Surface Pro
They did have the workstations that were 15" with dGPU, like the ThinkPad P1 (with Xeon processors, ECC RAM, and ISV certifications).
The X1 Extreme looks great. I really like that they have a low-cost entry model that's still well-spec'd and gets you the form factor. The cheapest 15" Apple is CAD $3200, while the X1 Extreme can be had at CAD $2400 (and it has decent port selection).
True. The P1 and X1 Extreme are the same machine for all intents externally. The big differences being the ECC memory and Quadro graphics for the P1 internally.
In addition to the lower entry price for the X1 Extreme and the fact that you can upgrade RAM and SSD down the road if needed, Lenovo has an almost rotating 20% off coupon. They had one LenvoXSale that expired on the 10th and that was replaced by Thinkpad20Sale or something like that. The Honey browser extension does a good job finding them.
Saving $1000 USD vs a similar spec MBP is easy to do.
I was looking at some video reviews of the Carbon X1, and while all of them compared the keyboard to the other ThinkPads, saying it was great, in side-by-side comparisons it seemed the X1 keyboard was a little smaller. However, no review I have found has mentioned this.
Am I just seeing things, or is the X1 keyboard smaller than a regular ThinkPad? One thing that Apple did do right (back in the day) was putting a full-size keyboard on every laptop model.
Am I just seeing things, or is the X1 keyboard smaller than a regular ThinkPad? One thing that Apple did do right (back in the day) was putting a full-size keyboard on every laptop model.
I have a Dell XPS 15. The keyboard and the trackpad are decent, but they are not extraordinary.
The Surface line has the best trackpad in Windows laptops, which is more noticeable on the laptops (Surface Book and Surface Laptop lines).
I used a 14-inch Dell Latitude 7000 series and the keyboard was just great. I preferred it over the keyboard of the ThinkPad.
I've had several ASUS notebooks, and they basically seem the closest in quality to Macbooks in regard to the touchpad and keyboard.
Playing around with the 15” Surface Book 2 on Thursday at the Microsoft Store, I gotta say they reminded me a lot of the pre-butterfly keyboard MBP and the pre-haptic touchpad.
The keyboard of my Surface Book 2 is awesome. It's one of the reasons I went that way instead of a Surface Pro. The keyboard cover is adequate, but not good enough for someone who does a lot of typing. The SB2 keyboard is extraordinary.
The trackpad is similar to Apple's pre-haptic trackpads. Apple still wins in the trackpad game, but the SB2 is basically the same as the pre-haptic Apple trackpad.
You know, it is funny, but I actually like the Surface Pro keyboard. I am not saying that is as nice as the Surface Book 2 but it is what I have been doing most of my typing on since it is such a portable and compact device and I like it for travel, sitting out on the deck, etc. I am not sure if there is any difference in the vinyl and Alcantara covers, I have the Alcantara version. I like it far better than the 2016 MBP gen 2 and better than the 2018 MBP Gen 3 keyboards. That and it is worlds better than the mushy P.O.S ASK keyboard that Apple sells for the iPad Pro.
That said I really have been eyeballing the 15" Surface Book 2 and they keyboard impressed me. The silver keys with translucent characters that allow the backlight to flow through them also remind me of older macs gone by. The trackpad is a nice glass pad and seems very responsive and even across its surface, no odd areas that are hard to click etc. (Looking at you Dell).
There is no doubt Apple still rules the roost in terms of trackpads, but I believe the SB2 is as nice as you will find in any non-mac computer. The Lenovo X1 Extreme also uses a Microsoft Trackpad and it appears to be of similar size and design to that of the SB2.
The SB keyboards are better than the Apple pre-butterly keyboards - there is a fraction more travel and resistance, and the keys sit a tiny bit higher. The differences only seem slight, but they add up to a much improved experience over even my 2013 MBP.
The SB2 would have been my choice of replacement laptop, had people in this thread not recommended the Thinkpad instead. Plus the SB2 is too big and heavy for me - I'm looking forward to something lighter than my MBP!