Why Does Everyone Hate Vista?

[yetanotherdave]

Might be what people are used to. OS X is hardly intuitive when it comes to installing apps for example. Anyone used to double-clicking setup.exe tends to struggle when they come to the Mac, especially since Finder is a bit retarded... it opens .dmg's in a plain window and then you're supposed to drag it to Applications but as there's no sidebar in a dmg window the only way is to open another window through the menu system or CMD-N. Bit clunky.

That's not really true though. Some DMG's open without a sidebar, but only when that's specified by whoever created the DMG in the first place. Many DMG's like this have a shortcut to /Applications in the DMG and sometimes even have a big arrow from the app to the shortcut!

You may find dragging the app to applications non intuitive, but that's because you are clearly used to running an installer in windows.

Anyone used to double-clicking setup.exe tends to struggle when they come to the Mac

like you said, anyone used to windows installers has an issue at first with macs, but that's not because macs are counter intuitive, but because they are unlearning the windows way of doing it.

 

[Cloudane]

The point is that it's inconsistent. Some developers even put an alias to the Applications folder and a little arrow in there, some don't... it needs a standard.

I do think, with actual education and background in user interface usability, that it has room for improvement. OS X is *superb* for usability, but little issues like that (specifically the Finder which can't decide which interface it's going to bring up half the time) aren't quite up to the standard of the rest of the OS. Of course, saying that anything made by Apple has room for improvement, on this forum, is blasphemy

 

[Schtumple]

Why do I hate Vista?

"Cancel or Allow". It is seriously getting annoying.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FfetbidVUYw

It's like the nanny state in PC form

 

[JSchwage]

On my desktop it's slow and my scanner even randomly stopped working the other day and I can't figure out why. Also, don't even try using iTunes on my machine. It'll glitch up every 5 minutes.

Hence why I am downgrading to XP on the machine. And no, I don't really use that machine thank God. It's more of the family computer. Me, I stick with my MacBook and Power Mac.

 

[Dustman]

Might be what people are used to. OS X is hardly intuitive when it comes to installing apps for example. Anyone used to double-clicking setup.exe tends to struggle when they come to the Mac, especially since Finder is a bit retarded... it opens .dmg's in a plain window and then you're supposed to drag it to Applications but as there's no sidebar in a dmg window the only way is to open another window through the menu system or CMD-N. Bit clunky.

Your right. I'd much rather spend 20 minutes watching an installer freeze than drag and drop a file. You want to remove a program from OS X, drag it to the trash. You want to remove a program from Windows, and you get to go to Add/Remove, click through the wizard, then painfully watch it remove files that you've never even heard of before. Real intuitive.

I'm not going to sit here and trash Windows. XP isnt that bad, Vista... is alright when made to be like XP, but both make me angry being used to OS X. Nothing makes sense in Windows. It shouldn't take sooo much time to try to do something. With Mac it seems like everything is where you'd expect it to be.

 

[saltyzoo]

You have to measure the reboot time of a mature Vista machine with a typical array of applications installed in minutes - sometimes double digit minutes.

I always get a cold sweat when I think I'm going to have to reboot any of my windows boxes.

 

[fearful]

The biggest part I don't get is how oblivious Microsoft is. I don't mean to sound like an Apple fanboy, but jesus...anyone who's used OS:X and Vista for more than 10 minutes can see how much more intuitive OS:X is. It's like Apple has common sense and Microsoft...doesn't.

How, after 5 years, can they release a product that is still in it's infancy (a nice way of putting "a piece of ****")? They didn't even get to put WinFS (is that the new filesystem? i forget) into Vista! Apple has been releasing quite substantial OS updates on an almost yearly basis. I want to see what the Microsoft development center is like, rofl.

I can't agree with any of this, and a Mac fanboy is exactly what you sound like.

OSX does not have a intutive interface by any stretch of the imagination. Mac OS has had the same desktop arrangement since it was first appeared in the 80s: A single menu bar, that stretches across the entire length of the display, that is context sensitive to the application that has focus. I personally find this extremely frustrating, especially on larger displays.

Apple has not released a major OS upgrade since the first version of OSX either. There's been nothing substantial about any them, they've all just been evolutions of the same, with extra shiney bits here and there. MS have released a multitude of improvements to XP, and Vista for that matter since it was launched. They just don't put them in a pretty box an charge you for them every time like Apple do.

 

[atarin]

I personally hate Vista because when I setup my Dad's new machine, I got two successive blue screens of death when I turned the darn thing on the first two times! I mean, really, right out of the box?! Two blue screens of death in a row?! That's unstable! I never had that problem with Windoze before, and I have been installing and maintaining PCs since Windoze 3.1 - been through every MS OS since then, including NT and NT server. This was just ridiculous. The machine was supposedly made for Vista, and I still had to hunt down drivers for the video card, and also for everything else. Since setup, it has crashed almost daily. I am really tired of being called to deal with it! I'm sure it has something to do with the fact that it's a crappy E-Machine, brand new though it may have been, but that's another problem with Windoze in general: you can install it on almost any piece of crap, and there seems to be no standards. You really can't trust those stupid "Made for Vista" stickers. They mean nothing! People buy Windoze machines because they're cheap, and because they think it's the standard for home computing, but it's a waste of money and time. I have since told my family that I no longer support Windoze. If they want me to be their free IT person, they will just have to switch to Mac!

Since my aunt and I switched to Mac in August, we have had none of the problems one gets with Windoze. Our machines work the way they're supposed to, all the time. No matter what we hook up to our Macs, it just works. Amazing! I think that people hate Vista because they hate Windoze in general. Once you've seen how an OS is supposed to work, how can you not hate Vista? The price of the OS is outrageous, and what do you get for the money, other than headaches? Just my humble opinion.

I'm getting two people in my family iMacs for Christmas, including my Dad. I can't wait to destroy that E-Machine! What should I do with it? Take an axe to it? Set it on fire? Oh, the cathartic possibilities!

 

[atarin]

will this thread ever die?

You asked why everyone hates Vista on a Mac board. You're gonna get a lot of people adding their two cents. You had to see that coming, no? Most people on here are Mac devotees. Whether that's because they have been using Mac forever, or like me, were frustrated with Windoze for a long time before they came to appreciate Macs, there is just going to be some animosity towards MS that just needs to be vented when an opportunity such as this arises. At least you didn't post your question on a Linux board - the flame war would have been far more intense!

 

[killerrobot]

I wonder if this "Vista Sux" mantra stems from mostly overzealous Mac users who have never really used it before, much in the same way the "A Mac isn't a computer" mantra comes from PC people that have never really used a mac.

Hmm... I guess ignorance IS bliss.

 

[Cloudane]

Hehe ^

Very, very few people (especially on fan forums) are capable of holding a balanced opinion or have the concept of "best tool for the job". You will worship only the One True God!

Be thankful to be one of the few with intelligence

 

[Neil321]

i spend all day around xp & vista and cant wait till i get home to use my mac, i have to teach xp & vista
basics at college and find vista naff to say the least

 

[GoodWatch]

The only thing that I keep scratching my head about is the continuous flow of Windows related posts on this forum. Which is called MacRumors, not WinRumors. But perhaps it makes people feel better. Whatever floats your boat.

 

[FX120]

I have been using Vista for a few months now, just last night installed the SP 1 RC.

From what I have learned, Vista will never "blue screen" unless you have a serious hardware issue. It has been very stable for me, and up until I had to reboot for the update last night my machine had been on for 46 days.

Have applications crashed? Yes. Have I had driver issues? Yes. Is it perfect? No. Is it as bad as everyone seems to say it is? No.

Another thing I have observed: Vista puts much less of a dependency on virtual memory, loading more of the OS into physical RAM. This means to the people who only have 1GB Vista will use up half of their available physical RAM. With memory prices being as low as they are these days, every one should have at least 2GB of RAM. And then Vista really zooms...

 

[Quillz]

I don't hate Vista. Therefore, not everyone hates Vista. Thread title is incorrect and misleading.

 

[rumbletum]

The only thing that I keep scratching my head about is the continuous flow of Windows related posts on this forum. Which is called MacRumors, not WinRumors. But perhaps it makes people feel better. Whatever floats your boat.

The thing that makes me scratch my head is all the people who profess to hate windows and/or never use it yet spend their time reading and replying to discussions about it

 

[Nordichund]

I guess Vista will be okay, when it's finally finished Until then I'm sticking with XP on my Mac. As a recent switcher I have to admit each time I boot into Windows from OS X it looks pretty feeble compaired to Leopard.

 

[Cleverboy]

I can't agree with any of this, and a Mac fanboy is exactly what you sound like.

Wow. I was just going to agree with you, but then you said...

OSX does not have a intutive interface by any stretch of the imagination. Mac OS has had the same desktop arrangement since it was first appeared in the 80s: A single menu bar, that stretches across the entire length of the display, that is context sensitive to the application that has focus. I personally find this extremely frustrating, especially on larger displays.

Which undermined any sense of integrity or balance you may have been attributed. I'm going to share a story... but its for others, not you.

My mother constantly has problems playing "find the menu bar" on Windows. When she had a Mac, it was always in one place. I'd moved her from a severely dated PowerMac to a Dell Outlet, El Cheapo box. She's been asking questions and feeling helpless ever since. The only app she seems to have a decent time with is iTunes. For instance, I was over there with my iMac recently, and we were looking at the same email my sister sent us. On my Mac, to view my picture attachments was a dream. One-click, and they're full-screen in a slideshow. Meanwhile, in Outlook she tries to click on each image to view it, and it launches a "trial" app, and even after I've disconnected it and put back Windows Image viewer, its still highly unintuitive.

Apple has not released a major OS upgrade since the first version of OSX either. There's been nothing substantial about any them, they've all just been evolutions of the same, with extra shiney bits here and there. MS have released a multitude of improvements to XP, and Vista for that matter since it was launched. They just don't put them in a pretty box an charge you for them every time like Apple do.

Yeah, Apple makes you pay for service packs, blah, blah, blah. We already know what you are. Welcome to the forum, btw. Don't play all your cards at once, or you'll get banned. Be more Machiavellian in your trolling, and you'll go far. If you can manage it, goad other, regular forum members into making the most outragous comments thereby drawing attention from yourself.

The thing that makes me scratch my head is all the people who profess to hate windows and/or never use it yet spend their time reading and replying to discussions about it

LOL. I can believe the reverse, but unless one lives a sheltered PC life, I think few people on any forum have "never used Windows". Usually people who've never used the Mac OS comment about Macintoshes all the time. Not sure I'd ever buy your version though. In fact, I'm trying to architect a plan to bring Macs into my workplace, because Macs have such a superior environment for it (especially with Leopard: Quickook, Spaces, etc). Most of the time, I'm trying not to be mad as my Windows computer with 2GB of ram complains that it can't open another window, or I try to find something and it searches FOREVER. I need to look into some 3rd party additions to "fix" these problems.

Penny Arcade - Forbidden Fruit (Mmm...)
http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2006/03/03

~ CB

I wonder if this "Vista Sux" mantra stems from mostly overzealous Mac users who have never really used it before, much in the same way the "A Mac isn't a computer" mantra comes from PC people that have never really used a mac. Hmm... I guess ignorance IS bliss.

Most Mac owners have used Windows, but I'll agree that Apple's Vista kicking ads have probably spawned a whole branch of people who hate Vista without seeing it. Vista's got a TON of desirable, advanced features the Mac doesn't have, that no one seems to talk about... least of all Microsoft. Which wouldn't be so bad, except that Apple's marketing is SO much better. It's like whoever does Windows product marketing needs to be FIRED. Sorry whoever you are, but you really really suck. There are subtleties about Vista that I've only found out about because I was drilling down on "solutions" on how to do things, instead of "features". It's terrible, Windows XP is the same way.

I mean, look at websites like MyFirstMac:
http://www.myfirstmac.com/

Try to find a comparably inviting Windows website, and you're probably up a creek. Most are geeky, poorly contructed websites with no sense of practicality. Did you know that XP users can request remote assistance from other XP users? Here's how. Did you know how to remove "trial ware" from your computer and make it perform normally? Follow these steps and pictures.

Meh. I should just up and do it myself, right?

~ CB

 

[Sesshi]

Well, when you have Ballmer as your patron saint you can say 'bye bye' (or more accurately <monkeydance+chairthrow>**** off you ******* ****, I'm gonna ******* kill you ************* </monkeydance+chairthrow> ) to slick marketing.

With the advent of mass Internet outreach by interconnected blogs where popular media-type people masquerade as people who know what they're talking about, and where these people mix with 'traditional' media far more often than they used to, Apple marketing advantage is in with a lock among the sheeple.

I think there's a lot that can be improved with both, but Vista and OS X are broadly comparable now in terms of personal productivity across a wide range of disciplines. It got a bad press on release which was more down to third party incompatibility, which Microsoft didn't really do anything about mitigating. Case in point: Vista is very much usable and stable now, and yet there hasn't really been any huge changes from Microsoft - what's changed is that the companies around the Windows ecosystem are now starting to get their act together.

To me, how they get Vista reasonably stable on so many varied platforms is the bigger achievement, when you compare it to the reasonably stable OS X which runs on a severely limited number of hardware platforms. Sheeple wouldn't notice things like that though, they will undoubtedly be seduced by the flash of the Macs.

That is also a good thing I think since with the manufacturers feeling the heat of more direct competition it should result in better-styled PC's as well - just as long as the Windows PC manufacturers don't compromise style for quality and good engineering, as Apple have clearly done since the Jobs re-takeover.

 

[Cloudane]

Well, when you have Ballmer as your patron saint you can say 'bye bye' (or more accurately <monkeydance+chairthrow>**** off you ******* ****, I'm gonna ******* kill you ************* </monkeydance+chairthrow> ) to slick marketing.

Quite true. From what I hear, Steve Jobs also goes into these little hissy fits (usually when something is leaked and thus steals his thunder), but at least he has the sense to do them behind closed doors where he won't end up on Youtube.

Ballmer tends to come across as a raving lunatic... not exactly the charisma required for a marketing strategy.

 

[Sesshi]

I've always thought that Ballmer must have made a critical mistake when he bought a book on How Not To Look Like a Serial Killer.

Every mannerism he has when making a pitch also seems to come straight from a book - and in this case one he's reading too much into. You know those 'present better' books? Every time I've seen him when in a keynote he looks like he's been sitting at home the night before reading those books and repeating them in front of the mirror. Also I've often wondered if he takes a little "assistance" before he goes out due to his clear nervousness.

The guy has no charisma at all, even when his serial killer eyes aren't boring into you. Not a good figurehead in any way. Gates had the slightly dreamy ramblings of a true nerd, and you knew where you were with that, even if you were asleep on your chair dribbling on the shoulder of the person sitting next to you after a keynote.

 

[Cloudane]

I've always thought Alan Sugar was one of those "I've read a book on positive body language and presenting myself" books. Watching him on the NS&A ads he's there being so 'honest' with his arms free and palms facing the camera etc.

 

[dstearns96]

I don't hate or like vista. I don't have it but I used to have windows xp, but after a while it stopped working (my old windows 95 stopped working too) so I switched to mac. They should have only one version of vista. too expensive anyway.

 

[Towhead]

So "All user consideration is thrown out (#6)" meaning you're basing everything regarding end user consideration based on the ability to watch pirated content?

regarding old hardware... there are plenty of old hardware that are supported. I had it installed on a Compaq P3 800Mhz box with all its hardware detected without me installing anything. Most older mainstream driver will work. Think of how many pieces of hardare did not have XP drivers when XP first came out btw....Sure many 2k drivers worked but not all.

Hardware - Anything 1Ghz and up with 1Gig RAM will run quite well. A P4 3Ghz box with 1Gig ram and a 60gig drive is more than vista capable in terms of power. How old is that like 4 years already? So you're saying that Vista is crap because machines older than 4-5 years (maybe even 6) may be a little slower? Wonder how a 4-5 year old 1Ghz quicksilver will run leopard with 1gig ram. Please these excuses regarding hardware are pretty senseless. Hardware is like 10 cents these days.

I have a SAWTOOTH + Radeon 8500 + Giga 1.8Ghz upgrade running Leopard. It runs as fast as Tiger, if not faster. One thing I should mention, but Visage which sort of caused windows to get locked into place under tiger works beautifully under Leopard. Love those animated backgrounds!!

BTW, I'm posting this from my SR Macbook (white, of course).

 

[AlexisV]

After using Vista for 6 months earlier this year, the main problems are that it's still Windows. After all that time in development I was expecting some brilliant new navigation method. But actually using the thing is the same as XP, with the exception of some explorer improvements. I hate the start menu and have always been loathed to use it. You spend more time tidying it up than using it productively.

The Control Panel is mad. I literally had to sit there for 30 seconds thinking about where the tool I wanted was and then trying to find it.

Everything bad about Windows is still there, including all the components that have made it so vulnerable to malware in the first place. The registry system is just the same, which means that it will become more and more bloated as time goes by, as crap accumulates.

I also hate the nannying of everything. Instead of making it secure and never bothering me, I get messages for 'Windows Defender', virus scanners, security updates. It shouldn't get viruses in the first place. Microsoft shouting about how 'Defender' will keep me safe is indicative of the problem. Instead of just fixing it, they stick a big fat sticking plaster over the problem and then boast about how good everything is because they've 'listened' and done something about it.

In fairness, they are in between a rock and a hard place. Everybody uses Windows, even though it's a bloated, fat relic of an OS. In an ideal world they should start from scratch. But then they'd alienate developers and users who were too used to what they have.

As a result, some things don't work with it, but what choice have MS got if they don't start again and make nothing work with the new OS?

There's going to come a time when MS need to do an OS 9 to OS X major transition.