Interesting. I did install the bluetooth drivers that came with my OS X disk, and Windows does pick up all my bluetooth it just hangs when it tries to pair. I'll troubleshoot a little more.
I just get errors whenever I try and install drivers.
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Windows 7 RC Discussion
- Thread starter edesignuk
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Interesting. I did install the bluetooth drivers that came with my OS X disk, and Windows does pick up all my bluetooth it just hangs when it tries to pair. I'll troubleshoot a little more.
I just get errors whenever I try and install drivers.
Homegroups plus Libraries across the volumes on my desktop let my MacBook with 7 access everything.
No need for messy SMB mount points when it does all that traversal for me. Libraries lets you group mount points into a single group without the need for multiple shortcuts or a folder mess.
Did I mention this is all over wireless?
No need for messy SMB mount points when it does all that traversal for me. Libraries lets you group mount points into a single group without the need for multiple shortcuts or a folder mess.
Did I mention this is all over wireless?
If possible, I'd remove the bootcamp drivers for bluetooth and see if your mouse will pair then.
On my windows box, the bluetooth experience with 7 has been excellent. I just plugged in my generic HP bluetooth dongle and windows said "Oh hey, you've got bluetooth. That's cool, you're all set. I can handle your input devices, no problem."
T
Tonerl
Guest
I read the many posts that enumerated various problems; so, I began the installation of 32-bit Windows 7 RC on my iMac with some trepidation.
To my surprise, everything worked fine! Win7RC works well with full Aero facilities. The only slight irritation is that the keyboard layout is standard UK English rather than the Apple UK version (@ and " are swapped, for example).
I had run the Beta under VMware Fusion but Boot Camp is a much better experience.
To my surprise, everything worked fine! Win7RC works well with full Aero facilities. The only slight irritation is that the keyboard layout is standard UK English rather than the Apple UK version (@ and " are swapped, for example).
I had run the Beta under VMware Fusion but Boot Camp is a much better experience.
Here is a simple and somewhat incomplete comparison of memory usage and DPC Latencies between Vista and Windows 7 (and some XP) running on a bootcamped Macbook Pro with 4gb RAM after installing all drivers and Service Pack updates:
Windows 7 32-bit (Beta, not RC)
Number of service after startup: 58
Maximum available RAM: ~2600 out of 3046 mb
Vista Ultimate 32-bit
Number of services after startup: 70
Maximum available RAM: ~2600 out of 3046 mb
So while the number of services has decreased the memory usage seems to remain the same. Maybe some services have just been put together into one.
Windows XP
Maximum available RAM: ~2800 out of 3046 mb
Vista Ultimate 64-bit
Maxmimum available RAM: ~3400 out of 4070 mb
Maxmimum available RAM Aero + Defender + Superfetch deactivated: ~3600 out of 4070 mb
Seemingly Vista 64-bit uses over 200 mb more RAM compared to its 32-bit cousin, but on the other side it offers 1000 mb more RAM to begin with. Aero (DWM.EXE), Windows Defender and Superfetch each use around 30-70 mb RAM (varrying by time).
You can win another 15 mb by turning off Search Indexing and another 20 mb by turning off Windows Audio, but given the practical usefulness of Windows Search I wouldn't turn it off for that minor amount.
Both Windows 7 and Vista draw the very same minimum wattage! I did not test wether Windows 7 draws less average wattage, but I seriously doubt that, since most of the power is drawn by the graphic-card and CPU and energy-saving is up to the graphic-card's and CPU drivers for that and don't really lie under Windows' control.
Both Windows 7 and Vista show the same DPC Latencies with properly written drivers! One exception is W7's Idle DPC Latencies for the older Broadcom WLAN drivers, which are substantially better on W7. But once these older driver become active (network traffic happening via WLAN) they are equally bad on W7 as on Vista. New drivers completely solve that for Idle and Activity for on both W7 and Vista, which proves how important drivers are.
But I cannot deny that W7 improved the bad Idle behavior. Furthermore there is a difference between W7 32-bit, Vista 32-bit and Vista 64-bit. Both W7 32-bit and Vista 64-bit show no signs of DPC problems when the CPU is automatically clocked down via Speedstep while Vista 32-bit is negatively affected by this. This doesn't matter too much though, because under DAW load the CPU usually is clocked to higher rates anyway and thus Vista 32-bit is only partially affected.
Windows 7 32-bit Idle DPC Latencies (Beta, not RC)
Vista 64-bit Idle DPC Latencies
Here is a comparison between Vista 64-bit versus Windows 7 64-bit:
Vista Ultimate 64-bit
Number of services loaded: >70
Maxmimum available RAM: ~3400 out of 4070 mb
Maxmimum available RAM Aero + Defender + Superfetch deactivated: ~3600 out of 4070 mb
Windows 7 Ultimate 64-bit (Beta, not RC)
Number of services loaded: >50
Maxmimum available RAM: ~3300-3370 out of 4070 mb
Maxmimum available RAM Aero + Defender + Superfetch deactivated: ~3450-3500 out of 4070 mb (starts at only ~3300 mb and takes exactly 5 mins until System releases another 150 mb).
Seemingly Windows 7 64-bit is using more memory for less services compared to Vista 64-bit on an otherwise equally configured system (same hardware, fresh installations with same drivers).
If I find time I may have a look at RC and do another comparison, but I doubt that much has changed.
Windows 7 32-bit (Beta, not RC)
Number of service after startup: 58
Maximum available RAM: ~2600 out of 3046 mb
Vista Ultimate 32-bit
Number of services after startup: 70
Maximum available RAM: ~2600 out of 3046 mb
So while the number of services has decreased the memory usage seems to remain the same. Maybe some services have just been put together into one.
Windows XP
Maximum available RAM: ~2800 out of 3046 mb
Vista Ultimate 64-bit
Maxmimum available RAM: ~3400 out of 4070 mb
Maxmimum available RAM Aero + Defender + Superfetch deactivated: ~3600 out of 4070 mb
Seemingly Vista 64-bit uses over 200 mb more RAM compared to its 32-bit cousin, but on the other side it offers 1000 mb more RAM to begin with. Aero (DWM.EXE), Windows Defender and Superfetch each use around 30-70 mb RAM (varrying by time).
You can win another 15 mb by turning off Search Indexing and another 20 mb by turning off Windows Audio, but given the practical usefulness of Windows Search I wouldn't turn it off for that minor amount.
Both Windows 7 and Vista draw the very same minimum wattage! I did not test wether Windows 7 draws less average wattage, but I seriously doubt that, since most of the power is drawn by the graphic-card and CPU and energy-saving is up to the graphic-card's and CPU drivers for that and don't really lie under Windows' control.
Both Windows 7 and Vista show the same DPC Latencies with properly written drivers! One exception is W7's Idle DPC Latencies for the older Broadcom WLAN drivers, which are substantially better on W7. But once these older driver become active (network traffic happening via WLAN) they are equally bad on W7 as on Vista. New drivers completely solve that for Idle and Activity for on both W7 and Vista, which proves how important drivers are.
But I cannot deny that W7 improved the bad Idle behavior. Furthermore there is a difference between W7 32-bit, Vista 32-bit and Vista 64-bit. Both W7 32-bit and Vista 64-bit show no signs of DPC problems when the CPU is automatically clocked down via Speedstep while Vista 32-bit is negatively affected by this. This doesn't matter too much though, because under DAW load the CPU usually is clocked to higher rates anyway and thus Vista 32-bit is only partially affected.
Windows 7 32-bit Idle DPC Latencies (Beta, not RC)
Vista 64-bit Idle DPC Latencies
Here is a comparison between Vista 64-bit versus Windows 7 64-bit:
Vista Ultimate 64-bit
Number of services loaded: >70
Maxmimum available RAM: ~3400 out of 4070 mb
Maxmimum available RAM Aero + Defender + Superfetch deactivated: ~3600 out of 4070 mb
Windows 7 Ultimate 64-bit (Beta, not RC)
Number of services loaded: >50
Maxmimum available RAM: ~3300-3370 out of 4070 mb
Maxmimum available RAM Aero + Defender + Superfetch deactivated: ~3450-3500 out of 4070 mb (starts at only ~3300 mb and takes exactly 5 mins until System releases another 150 mb).
Seemingly Windows 7 64-bit is using more memory for less services compared to Vista 64-bit on an otherwise equally configured system (same hardware, fresh installations with same drivers).
If I find time I may have a look at RC and do another comparison, but I doubt that much has changed.
I'll have to check on my MacBook. The latencies were decent (green) on my tower until I'd pop up a UAC window.
This isn't really suprising. 64-bit executable files will always be bigger than 32-bit executable files, regardless of operating system.
Success
Well i just successfully installed the 64bit version of Windows 7 on my 15" UMBP.
Just used disc utility to burn the iso DVD. got rid of the XP OS and of course used BootCamp utility to install it.
Only ran into one hiccup that really wasn't really a problem. after installing it i put in the os x applications DVD to of course upload the drivers and bootcamp utility. Windows 7 got kind of mad at me saying that the drivers were incompatible. well i just eff you and installed them anyway. that was it they installed restarted and everything is working fine. so like i said i thought it might be a problem but it just turned out it was just Windows being anal as usual.
let me know if anyone has any questions or concerns about doing this.
Well i just successfully installed the 64bit version of Windows 7 on my 15" UMBP.
Just used disc utility to burn the iso DVD. got rid of the XP OS and of course used BootCamp utility to install it.
Only ran into one hiccup that really wasn't really a problem. after installing it i put in the os x applications DVD to of course upload the drivers and bootcamp utility. Windows 7 got kind of mad at me saying that the drivers were incompatible. well i just eff you and installed them anyway. that was it they installed restarted and everything is working fine. so like i said i thought it might be a problem but it just turned out it was just Windows being anal as usual.
let me know if anyone has any questions or concerns about doing this.
Actually, it wasn't really Windows being "anal."
The drivers you were trying to install have a digital signature for Vista. Even though most Vista drivers will work with Windows 7, there are a few odd ball drivers that do have problems with Windows 7.
Besides, all the dialogue box was trying to do was just warn you. That's typically seen as a good a thing. All it's just doing is warning you that those drivers can cause problems with Windows 7, and that if they do cause any issues, you're on your own.
Well used my MBP with Win 7 64 bit at a 12 hr LAN party last night, mostly solid gaming so pushed the machine and O/S pretty hard.
Most of the night used it in clamshell mode with external KB, monitor and mouse and it pretty much held up. Played Unreal Tournament 2004, Grid, Call Of Duty 4, Counter Strike and Hawx.
Only issues experienced was a BSOD when Counter Strike had to be killed via it's process in Task Manager because the server crashed, generated a 0x000000F4 Critical_Object_Termination. Game wouldn't load correctly after a restart, had to kill the process again and same thing happened. Tried loading a different game on second restart, worked fine so closed it and tried Counter Strike again, no issues on third attempt.
Second issue was palying Hawx, game crashed out and got an error message about it loading to a dump file. Had been in clamshell for about 9 hours at this point, the back left corner felt very hot, so shutdown, left it about half an hour to cool and then carried on with it. Spent the last hour or so with the external monitor and KB disconnected and not in clamshell.
So all in all, win 7 on the MBP stands up to some pretty sustained hardcore gaming, wonder if the Hawx issue had anything to do with clamshell mode, next time round will just use a mouse.
Got to say was quite amusing on the finish when everyone else was packing their large gaming rigs up, I just had to close the MBP and put it and the Magsafe adapter in my bag, was just so easy in comparison lol.
Most of the night used it in clamshell mode with external KB, monitor and mouse and it pretty much held up. Played Unreal Tournament 2004, Grid, Call Of Duty 4, Counter Strike and Hawx.
Only issues experienced was a BSOD when Counter Strike had to be killed via it's process in Task Manager because the server crashed, generated a 0x000000F4 Critical_Object_Termination. Game wouldn't load correctly after a restart, had to kill the process again and same thing happened. Tried loading a different game on second restart, worked fine so closed it and tried Counter Strike again, no issues on third attempt.
Second issue was palying Hawx, game crashed out and got an error message about it loading to a dump file. Had been in clamshell for about 9 hours at this point, the back left corner felt very hot, so shutdown, left it about half an hour to cool and then carried on with it. Spent the last hour or so with the external monitor and KB disconnected and not in clamshell.
So all in all, win 7 on the MBP stands up to some pretty sustained hardcore gaming, wonder if the Hawx issue had anything to do with clamshell mode, next time round will just use a mouse.
Got to say was quite amusing on the finish when everyone else was packing their large gaming rigs up, I just had to close the MBP and put it and the Magsafe adapter in my bag, was just so easy in comparison lol.
They mean that some driver is hogging the CPU and keeping other drivers from getting CPU cycles.
In practice that mostly shows as audio drop-outs, especially in situations where instant audio-output (with any delay from large buffers) is needed like with gaming and professional audio applications. But even simple Mediaplayer playback can be affected.
Here is a thread that explains how to optimize Windows on a Macbook (Pro) in order to workaround several driver problems. Beside better performance these tweaks help some people fight off freeze issues in combination with the Trackpad (and mostly Firefox) on Windows.
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/614302/
Yep, nevertheless some people (including me) like to know the exact difference.
What is surprising is that W7 64 uses around 100-150 mb more memory than Vista 64 on the very same system. But that could be attributed to the Beta state, like additional Beta services running in the background to collect informations. On the other hand 32-bit W7 does not use more RAM than Vista 32!? Maybe I'll have to try the RC in order to get a new impression.
Another surprise is that once you turn off Superfetch, Defender and Aero then Vista uses about the same amount of RAM as an XP installation. Aero uses the least amount of RAM compared to the other two while Superfetch wastes the highest amount of RAM: about 100 mb only for itself, not for file-caching!
I never believed the bla about XP being so much superior to Vista. Since Vista SP1 and proper driver support this simply isn't true anymore. Concerning RAM many people simply got confused by Superfetch filling their RAM for file-caching (which by itself is a good thing). Once you go 64-bit you have plenty of RAM to burn anyway.
All those people hailing W7 like if it was saving western culture from damnation while picking on Vista have no idea what they're talking about. W7 is much more of a Service Pack 3 to Vista than anything else. That being said I really like W7, but I wish I wasn't asked to pay a full upgrade price just because Microsoft needs to get rid of the bad associations of the "Vista" brand.
Thanks for the flowers!
I wrote this some months ago already, but simply didn't post it on this forum here but only on audio related forums (like RME, KVR and Cakewalk).
You still get lowest DPC latencies with XP, but once optimized this is all in a range where it simply doesn't matter whether you get 10 us or 100 us. Anything below 1000 us is good and anything around 100-300 us is perfect enough.
Oh come on, Windows 7 has a bunch of new features, besides, Apple pulled a similar thing with Leopard and disguised it with the "300+ new features" gimmick. They also said Snow Leopard is going to be more polish and less features, just like W7, yet noone is saying "they should just call it 10.5.8". Double standards anyone?
Actually, it wasn't really Windows being "anal."
The drivers you were trying to install have a digital signature for Vista. Even though most Vista drivers will work with Windows 7, there are a few odd ball drivers that do have problems with Windows 7.
Besides, all the dialogue box was trying to do was just warn you. That's typically seen as a good a thing. All it's just doing is warning you that those drivers can cause problems with Windows 7, and that if they do cause any issues, you're on your own.
ok buddy.
no need to get your panties in a bunch. so far all the drivers have worked perfectly.
I installed Win 7 RC on a 2005 HP NC4200 (P-M 1.7Ghz, 1GB RAM) this week. It runs amazingly well. The fancy graphics are disabled because of the crappy integrated graphics, other than that it all runs quite nicely, much to my surprise.
A couple of questions to ask you, if I may.
(a) How are you measuring available RAM?
(b) When you count the services after startup,
are you counting only those that are running?
(Some may have been loaded and then stopped.)
Thanks.