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zakarhino

Contributor
Sep 13, 2014
2,521
6,791
Do you have a link to the source? I can’t find this “confirmation”


Confirmation by Moore's Law Is Dead is not a confirmation at all.

Outside of a company actually releasing a press statement MLID is probably one of the best sources of what's going on in the chip world. I have literally never seen him be wrong about any leak he can "100% confirm" as per his language, he is extremely careful about going 100% on anything unless he has strong sources to back it up. Go back and look at any of his videos on Zen 4, Intel's upcoming chips, Nvidia's 3000 series, PS5/Xbox Series X chips, etc. and find one instance of him being wrong about something he's "100%" about -- I have yet to find one.

Most recently he leaked actual pictures of Intel's upcoming graphics card which a lot of other major news outlets published, they trust his info.

He has constantly been leaking extremely accurate information about AMD and among that info he's been talking about AMD internal docs referencing "competition with Apple server chips" as one of their main upcoming competitors. This isn't the first time he's alluded to Apple making server chips.

MLID is the real deal. You might be one of those "well if it hasn't come out of Tim Cook's mouth it isn't true" sorta people but for the rest of us the certainty of a figure like MLID is enough of a confirmation. I'm looking forward to seeing what Apple does with their server chips.
 

senttoschool

macrumors 68030
Original poster
Nov 2, 2017
2,576
5,338
What you link to is (small) business, not enterprise. Apple always tried to bring hardware into small business. Enterprise is different. Say you buy 7- to 8-figure in hardware every year, you need this to be running 24/7 and with guaranteed 24h or same day support on-site. Where is that feature from Apple? Where are the servers? Where the redundant power supplies? Where is my 2 PB of redundant storage? Not even talking about custom software options. Apple wants to sell exactly the same hardware to businesses as the end-user consumer market. That's not going to work.

And if you think Apple Silicon is going to change that, you have not paid attention to the enterprise/business market in the past few decades. Where is all the specialized ERP software running on AS? If anything people won't change their software or update if not for security reasons. That's why they cling onto old versions of Windows, they don't want to make changes. For well over a decade, I've developed custom software solutions on Apple hardware for the healthcare market and consulted in other fields. If anything, the "switch" to Apple used to be much easier back then, than it is is today.
Apple just launched this:

There's the one-day hardware support right there.

Small to medium-sized businesses are a good start.

Specialized ERP software? Almost all ERP software I know runs on the cloud. You just need a browser. No, Apple doesn't have to build ERP software themselves. They just have to sell them Macs, iPhones, iPads.
 

throAU

macrumors G3
Feb 13, 2012
8,975
7,146
Perth, Western Australia
You're Tim Cook, sitting in his nice office, looking at how much money you just spent to make this giant SoC for a relatively small market. In fact, you have to do this every year or every two years to keep the Mac Pro relevant. How do you recuperate some of this money spent?

If you're Tim Cook, you just took 4 of the Max SOCs you already had and linked them together with a high speed motherboard interface. You don't go reinventing the wheel, just like the M1/M1-Pro/M1-Max are just iterations of the same cores found in iPhone.

You use the lego bricks you already have in larger amounts.


see: AMD with their Ryzen and EPYC platforms for an example of what's coming.
 

Gnattu

macrumors 65816
Sep 18, 2020
1,027
1,401
Uh... it has literally just been scaled up to the M1 Pro and Max... from the iPhone :D
M1 Pro/Max is a completely different design with fundamental changes. The M1 Pro/Max is designed to be scalable even to a multi-die system, and this is simply not possible with A14/M1.
 

jlc1978

macrumors 603
Aug 14, 2009
5,529
4,323
Apple just launched this:

There's the one-day hardware support right there.

Small to medium-sized businesses are a good start.

Specialized ERP software? Almost all ERP software I know runs on the cloud. You just need a browser. No, Apple doesn't have to build ERP software themselves. They just have to sell them Macs, iPhones, iPads.
Plus, ERP softwrae is often customized, which requires coders and consulatnst and is a whole different world. I doubt Apple wants to get into that and compete with the Oracles of the world.
 

satcomer

Suspended
Feb 19, 2008
9,115
1,973
The Finger Lakes Region
AMD is treat more to Intel more than Apple! First gamers went to AMD for about two years now! Now I've heard some higher servers going AMD now Intel has to be so saved they went to TMSC or Sony to make them a new processors instead of retooling their setups! Intel should have thought about a new equipment for modern processors but they refused for 3 years! In the Tech World that's a lifetime! Intel will always be casing what AMD for the future!
 

GrumpyCoder

macrumors 68020
Nov 15, 2016
2,074
2,654
There's the one-day hardware support right there.

Small to medium-sized businesses are a good start.
Seems like they're targeting small businesses with it. Wonder what's included in 24/7. It reads more like phone support to solve issues, not same day on site hardware replacement. That might be the reason they're only targeting small businesses. It sounds a little like they target "YouTubers" with this, under 10 people to get production content out. But we'll see. Could be a good start, to goal must be what Dell, Lenovo and HP offer.
Specialized ERP software? Almost all ERP software I know runs on the cloud. You just need a browser. No, Apple doesn't have to build ERP software themselves. They just have to sell them Macs, iPhones, iPads.
I don't know many businesses running their ERP software in the cloud. Project management and managing staff, sure. But anything specialized not so much. And no, ERP software is nothing that Apple has to come up with, they have to get other companies to release their software for macOS.
 

Alameda

macrumors 65816
Jun 22, 2012
1,000
609
Mark Gurman is saying that Apple is working on a 40-core SoC for the Mac Pro for 2022.

You're Tim Cook, sitting in his nice office, looking at how much money you just spent to make this giant SoC for a relatively small market. In fact, you have to do this every year or every two years to keep the Mac Pro relevant. How do you recuperate some of this money spent?

You create "Apple Cloud". No, not iCloud. Apple Cloud. Like AWS. Where anyone can come and rent a 40-core M3 SoC running on macCloudOS. You get into the cloud hosting business. You file this under the "Services" strategy that you keep pushing to make Wall Street happy.

Soon, you'll be releasing 64-core SoCs with 128-core GPUs, then 128-core SoCs with 256-core GPUs, and so on. Somehow, you're actually beating anything AWS, Azure, Google Cloud can offer... without really trying.

Apple Silicon Cloud.

It wouldn't surprise me if Apple is already testing their own SoCs to power their iCloud service, which currently depend on AWS. Apple was reportedly spending $30m/month on AWS in 2019. It might be $100m+ per month by now given how fast services have grown.
I don’t think you understand the scope. It’s like you’re explaining how big the galaxy is by describing the orbit of the moon.

In the first place, Apple is already a MASSIVE cloud computing company. Hundreds of millions of multi-gigabyte phones and PC’s are already backed up to iCloud. And there’s Maps, and Siri, and
Mail, and on and on. I assume Apple already has M1-based motherboards in their data center, maybe 10,000’s of them. Out with the slow Intel, in with the new M1. But that’s all behind the curtains and whether they use M1 or Intel isn’t core to their datacenter business; I mean, if they didn’t have M1, they’d plow right along.

Apple brings in about $1 billion a day. A 7 nanometer chip design is breathtakingly expensive for most companies, at about $200 million. Apple makes that much by 10AM on January 1. It’s not something that takes Tim Cook’s attention.

The company has a silicon roadmap. They already know how many cores next year, and the next, and the next. There are LARGE software architecture and design teams coming up with ways to use that kind of power, such as giving Siri a lot more intelligence.

Apple’s money is in volume and the volume is in the phone and the services. Selling rack space to a university isn’t a distraction to them. Yes, they could compete with Microsoft and Amazon, but they’ll likely only do that if they have a unique usability edge that propels them above and beyond. They could, of course, but that’s never been Apple’s market. They never had a successful corporate database or even a truly competitive server product. It’s not in their DNA and it doesn’t seem like something they’ll do.
 

senttoschool

macrumors 68030
Original poster
Nov 2, 2017
2,576
5,338
I don't know many businesses running their ERP software in the cloud. Project management and managing staff, sure. But anything specialized not so much. And no, ERP software is nothing that Apple has to come up with, they have to get other companies to release their software for macOS.
Virtually all major ERP providers such as Oracle, SAP, Microsoft supports running ERP in the cloud.

More companies are transitioning to the cloud, not fewer. This trend is accelerating.

There's nothing in ERP client software that can't be run in the browser. Backend can be in the cloud.
 
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senttoschool

macrumors 68030
Original poster
Nov 2, 2017
2,576
5,338
It reads more like phone support to solve issues, not same day on site hardware replacement.
Just go to the official website.

1636974015755.png
 

GrumpyCoder

macrumors 68020
Nov 15, 2016
2,074
2,654
Virtually all major ERP providers such as Oracle, SAP, Microsoft supports running ERP in the cloud.
Those, sure. Look at more specific stuff, healthcare sector for example. Or production software for manufacturing. Even Apple with Foxconn is running Windows for this. Plenty of software is still non-cloud based and probably never will. There's a massive amount of healthcare software running on Windows written in ancient languages and still sold as state of the art. Ironically, this field is also using many Macs (iMacs specifically, but running Windows).
Just go to the official website.
Thank you. Did you read the fine print? "Onsite repairs apply only to some iPhone models and are subject to availability in specific cities.". This is totally useless for businesses except for those who make phone calls with their iPhone.

It's nowhere near the level of what Dell, Lenovo and others offer. Since not all details are known yet, we'll have to wait till spring 2022 and see what exactly is covered and where (won't help much if it's offered in LA or NY only).
 

JMacHack

Suspended
Mar 16, 2017
1,965
2,423
I keep seeing “ERP” and I don’t think the definition of “ERP” I know is the same one people are talking about.
 

senttoschool

macrumors 68030
Original poster
Nov 2, 2017
2,576
5,338
Those, sure. Look at more specific stuff, healthcare sector for example. Or production software for manufacturing. Even Apple with Foxconn is running Windows for this. Plenty of software is still non-cloud based and probably never will. There's a massive amount of healthcare software running on Windows written in ancient languages and still sold as state of the art. Ironically, this field is also using many Macs (iMacs specifically, but running Windows).
Most hospitals run Epic Systems, which you can already deploy to the cloud easily: https://aws.amazon.com/health/solutions/epic/

Sure, and Apple doesn't have to work for every enterprise from day one. And within an enterprise, there are different departments that could use Apple, and already do.

I worked for a large tech company (and plenty of smaller ones), and pretty much all of them had combinations of Macs and Windows for workers. In the product departments, everyone used a Mac. And everyone had iPhones.

All I'm saying is that Apple's new Macs make them extremely attractive for small businesses, medium businesses, and enterprises. No, not all companies can switch to Macs. But the average worker can certainly do it. Every day, more and more companies are switching to browser-based tools. More and more apps are built with cross-platform in mind. When a company tool is built for iOS and iPad, it can work on macOS.

It's blindingly obvious that Apple wants a bigger pie of the business phone, tablet, and computer market. They're already there with iPhones and iPads. Now they just have to replace Windows computers with Macs. Their new Business Essentials software clearly signals Apple's intention.
 

senttoschool

macrumors 68030
Original poster
Nov 2, 2017
2,576
5,338
Thank you. Did you read the fine print? "Onsite repairs apply only to some iPhone models and are subject to availability in specific cities.". This is totally useless for businesses except for those who make phone calls with their iPhone.
The truth is that onsite repairs don't matter too much for Apple. Why? Because, unlike Dell/HP, there's likely always an Apple store near that can immediately help business customers. And not to mention the countless Apple authorized shops.

Driving 10 minutes to your nearest Apple store might be faster than waiting a few hours for a tech to come onsite.

Regardless, I fully expect Apple to expand their onsite coverage for iPads and Macs in the future too. This is a brand new service for them so they'll likely slowly expand it over time.
 

dtm84

macrumors member
Oct 10, 2021
79
167
Pushing core count isn't usable for so long as developers continue to lack multi-threading development tool sets and paradigms. Apple needs to get in to universities and the development community and really figure out a way how to make development for high core count easy and efficient. There is still too much trash tier single thread software out there on macs that are abstracted and wrapped.
 

leman

macrumors Core
Oct 14, 2008
19,319
19,336
Pushing core count isn't usable for so long as developers continue to lack multi-threading development tool sets and paradigms. Apple needs to get in to universities and the development community and really figure out a way how to make development for high core count easy and efficient. There is still too much trash tier single thread software out there on macs that are abstracted and wrapped.

For Swift, Apple pretty much solved this with the new concurrency features. Other languages also have robust solutions, it’s up to the devs to use them.

Bigger issue is that not that much software can inherently benefit from large amount of cores and that’s not something that going to change any time soon. This is why Apples Silicon paradigm of delivering high, consistent per core performance makes much more sense for computing than the typical „many slow cores“ approach taken in the industry.
 

ian87w

macrumors G3
Feb 22, 2020
8,704
12,636
Indonesia
That is not just about the hardware. You need data centers all around the world, and I don't think Apple have that. It took Amazon a long time to build up their infrastructure that enables them what they are today. Apple doesn't even want to invest any infrastructure for their own support in many markets.

Amazon and Google are already building data centers in Indonesia. Meanwhile Apple doesn't even have an official presence.
 

the8thark

macrumors 601
Apr 18, 2011
4,628
1,735
The Mac Pro is a very niche market relative to iPhones, iPads, and low-end Macs. Investing a significant chunk of your Apple Silicon R&D into the smallest market doesn't seem to make sense.
Unless that Mac Pro R&D investment can be used in the future for tomorrow's consumer level Macs.
As in parts of (or ideas coming from) today's Mac Pro end up in tomorrow's lower end Macs.
 

deconstruct60

macrumors G5
Mar 10, 2009
12,366
3,936
The truth is that onsite repairs don't matter too much for Apple. Why? Because, unlike Dell/HP, there's likely always an Apple store near that can immediately help business customers. And not to mention the countless Apple authorized shops.

Just absurdly not true. Apple's store-in-a-store with Best Buy is necessary to plug the gaps.

".. The electronics retailer already serviced Apple products at about 225 stores and now does so at all of its 992 stores nationwide, according to Reuters, which is good news for customers who reside in states without any Apple Stores, including Montana, North Dakota, South Dakota, Vermont, West Virginia, and Wyoming. ... "


News flash there actually are businesses in those six states. There are actually businesses that are not near hipster , trendy malls in other States too. Apple has "sherlocked" a number of VARs in some highly wealthily cities and locations, but that has little to do with geographic distribution of where businesses are located.
 
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