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16" MacBook Pro stuttering issue
- Thread starter rowbradley
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I"m getting this on my MBP with two HDMIs outputs. When they are connected to the monitor directly, I don't get this, if I insert the BM ATEM Mini in the signal path, I get this stutter. I guess it's related to the HDCP... but I'm no expert on that.
Recently bought a Macbook Pro 16 base model, same problem, cursor stuttering from time to time, and half a second delay while typing.
I'm currently performing some test with gSwitch to check if something changes running always on the integrated graphics, but it seems to stutter whith the same frequency that it has when set to dynamic GPU switching, maybe more.
Definitly more, as I can see while typing this.
Keeping the GPU set to dedicated graphics seems to solve the problem, but that's not a solution as it drains the battery much faster.
I'd really like to know if that's a software-patchable bug, or hardware related. It would be annoying to return it and buy a new one, expecially if (as in my case) it's a primary working machine.
I'm currently performing some test with gSwitch to check if something changes running always on the integrated graphics, but it seems to stutter whith the same frequency that it has when set to dynamic GPU switching, maybe more.
Definitly more, as I can see while typing this.
Keeping the GPU set to dedicated graphics seems to solve the problem, but that's not a solution as it drains the battery much faster.
I'd really like to know if that's a software-patchable bug, or hardware related. It would be annoying to return it and buy a new one, expecially if (as in my case) it's a primary working machine.
They all appear to have the iGPU stutter, although I can't say definitively if the stutter is more on one system versus another. It was identical on my two 16-inch models that were made about 6 months apart and used different GPUs. Every display 16-inch I have played with also has it, whether it be the 6 or 8 core models, and whether it have third party software installed or not. It appears to be a side effect of how Apple achieves such good battery life on a computer with a processor that is this power hungry and I imagine the inability to achieve both the best UI responsiveness with the simultaneous best battery life played a role in driving Apple towards the current Apple Silicon transition. You can exchange it, but your next unit will have it. If you notice it on one unit, you will notice it on others.
Most of the remedies come at the cost of battery life. As you have observed, using the dedicated GPU eliminates it but at the toll of runtimes. If there is a moving image on your desktop that causes the iGPU to have activity above its idle level, the stutter will generally be reduced or eliminated, although this obviously impacts battery life. Being logged into two user accounts simultaneously may also eliminate it, again at the expense of battery life.
After a few weeks you do begin to notice it much less, FWIW.
I found what was the issue on my setup : the external HD display connected via HMDI, but only when it is turned off (or not-used / sleeping).
I have 2 external displays connected to my 16" Macbook Pro :
- 1x 4K Dell monitor (via thunderbolt to displayport adapter, then displayport cable to my screen)
- 1x HD BenQ beamer (via Satechi USB-C SLIM Dock, then HDMI cable to the beamer)
... I'm using the Dell as main screen and my MBP is in clamshell mode.
I couldn't understand why there was a mouse (and CPU) stutter every 5 seconds... And it is actually caused by the HDMI cable when my beamer is turned OFF. It's as if the mac was "pinging" the HDMI source every 5s.
Only solution for now on my setup -> disconnect the HDMI cable from my satechi dock when beamer is not in use.
Hope this helps some of you guys with this annoying glitch.
I have 2 external displays connected to my 16" Macbook Pro :
- 1x 4K Dell monitor (via thunderbolt to displayport adapter, then displayport cable to my screen)
- 1x HD BenQ beamer (via Satechi USB-C SLIM Dock, then HDMI cable to the beamer)
... I'm using the Dell as main screen and my MBP is in clamshell mode.
I couldn't understand why there was a mouse (and CPU) stutter every 5 seconds... And it is actually caused by the HDMI cable when my beamer is turned OFF. It's as if the mac was "pinging" the HDMI source every 5s.
Only solution for now on my setup -> disconnect the HDMI cable from my satechi dock when beamer is not in use.
Hope this helps some of you guys with this annoying glitch.
Weirdly I never experienced this until upgrading to Big Sur. So Big Sur seems to have created this issue for me. But I'm noticing lag everywhere: while typing, moving the cursor, changing tabs in Chrome...
That lag is caused by the TouchBar and the T2. The system waits for the Touchbar to change what's on the (Touchbar) screen and the T2 (which actually drives the Touchbar) also handles all input.
Depending on applications and system load, the lag is more or less noticeable but you cannot completely fix it because of the way the system is built.
I also had some micro-freezes on my system when on the iGPU. First I got my machine exchanged like 6 times. All had the same issue. Finally, I got rid of that by installing the Big Sur beta back then when it was released (which updated the T2 firmware). It was completely solved even when booting Catalina. Now on Big Sur release, the freezing didn't came back yet.
But the iGPU still has some general lagginess. It's simply because the UHD630 is pretty weak and cannot properly drive the heavy UI system of macOS at the high resolution.
To fix that you have to do one or more of the following
a) Reduce (render) resolution
b) Reduce complexity of the window and UI system (will never happen)
c) Increase performance of the iGPU (not possible)
d) More aggressive clock scaling on the iGPU (possible by Apple). This increase power consumption and will only reduce lagginess to some degree.
Alternative: Run on the AMD GPU all the time and say goodbye to your battery time.
Yeah I’ve opted for running the AMD GPU all the time since I typically use the computer plugged into the wall (and I noticed no lag when on the dGPU). I am definitely excited for Apple Silicon. No more switchable graphics.
I finally tried the two user trick. Can't believe how much smoother it is. In iStats it shows that the Radeon is drawing a steady 2 watts. So I have no idea what it's being used for. Is it augmenting the UHD-630 by way of memory or processing? I suppose only Apple knows. So weird!
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I've had these issues since I got mine in February. Unfortunately it's been my only machine during that time and work has been too busy to even consider a repair or sending it back. But the stuttering is horrible. It's typing lag, yes, but things like switching windows are a mess as well. Mission Control is particularly cumbersome. Nothing is using much CPU right now, so it being a GPU issue makes sense. I'm also not connected to any peripherals as I'm writing. I've tried troubleshooting it a few times with no luck and as another user above posted, contacting Apple Support is just a time sink.
I'll wait for an M1 16 inch and then abandon it. Which is a crazy reality for a fairly new €2.5k purchase.
I'll wait for an M1 16 inch and then abandon it. Which is a crazy reality for a fairly new €2.5k purchase.
I’ve got an issue with my one. It’s an 8core 2.3 model with 5500m 4GB and 64GB ram.
I’m mentioning this here because I first noticed the problem as general lag. Slow opening apps. Safari slow to load grid of favourites. Slow doing everything including typing etc.
After much investigation, I’ve discovered there is an issue where the CPU reduces its clock speed to 1ghz. It won’t go higher. This issue is resolved temporarily with a restart. Then once a day or so, the problem reappears.
When working correctly I get Geekbench score of around 1100SC & 7200MC. When the glitch is occurs gET around 250SC & 2200MC. It is painfully slow.
I’ve been talking to apple about it and their only real advice is to try a full reinstall and see if that helps. If not, I’ll have to take it to the Genius Bar.
I thought I’d mention it here because it seems like there might be a chance that some of you are suffering from the same issue. The thing that first alerted me to the problem was that the fans weren’t coming on when doing CPU intensive tasks despite everything taking forever.
To check the clock speed of your CPU, search for and install the intel power gadget. You should see that the graph for GHZ varies over time. Mine is a flat horizontal line at 1Ghz.
I’m mentioning this here because I first noticed the problem as general lag. Slow opening apps. Safari slow to load grid of favourites. Slow doing everything including typing etc.
After much investigation, I’ve discovered there is an issue where the CPU reduces its clock speed to 1ghz. It won’t go higher. This issue is resolved temporarily with a restart. Then once a day or so, the problem reappears.
When working correctly I get Geekbench score of around 1100SC & 7200MC. When the glitch is occurs gET around 250SC & 2200MC. It is painfully slow.
I’ve been talking to apple about it and their only real advice is to try a full reinstall and see if that helps. If not, I’ll have to take it to the Genius Bar.
I thought I’d mention it here because it seems like there might be a chance that some of you are suffering from the same issue. The thing that first alerted me to the problem was that the fans weren’t coming on when doing CPU intensive tasks despite everything taking forever.
To check the clock speed of your CPU, search for and install the intel power gadget. You should see that the graph for GHZ varies over time. Mine is a flat horizontal line at 1Ghz.
The 16" has a design flaw with the VRM cooling. The VRMs overheat after some minutes of full load of CPU and GPU depending on ambient temperature.
Putting the machine into a vertical dock with the exhaust pointing upwards, or applying the thermal pad mod mostly solves that issue. The problem is that heat collects right behind the macbook when using it on a desk. The fans not only blow hot air out, they also draw air in from the back. So after some time, the can only draw in warm air. Cooling hot components with warm air is not going to work well. Putting it in a vertical dock or on a cooling pad will reduce or even solve that problem because heat cannot build up right at the exhausts and intakes behind the MBP.
Building upon that, if you are using with the clamshell open, something like this stand improves the sustained performance of the system substantially. I use one with my MBP-16 when pushing two or three displays with the clamshell open and using it for harder, sustained tasks. I also have a small USB fan at the back designed to push the hot air away when exiting the rear vents. The system has no problem sustaining its performance indefinitely with real-world apps or alternatively looped benchmarks. The spec I have is pretty close to yours (2.3 GHz 8-core i9, 5600M with 8 GB HBM2, 32 GB RAM) although mine was made around October of 2020 so it is a later version that may have unpublished hardware revisions from launch versions.
I also use the system a lot when it is sitting on a couch, a bed, my lap, or a desk...I don't use it for extremely intense tasks in these situations as obviously these materials can trap more heat and/or block some of the air exchange. If I was I would probably use a stand designed to elevate the rear (hinge-side) end of the system.
Thanks, but I'm not sure you've read the whole of my post.
The issue I have is that the CPU doesn't ramp up at all so the fans do not come on. The clock speed of the CPU cores are locked at 1Ghz even if they are only around a temp of 40c.
I think there's all likelihood that this is a different issue to which others are having. I've mentioned it here because some symptoms of it are similar to those discussed.
Edit, here's a screenshot of running geek bench. You'll see the core clock is pegged at 1Ghz and core temperatures are not high, nor are the fan speeds.
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I have had the same problem from day-1 of owning the MacBook Pro 16". As others have noted, I am fairly confident that the problem is caused by slow graphics switching. This was especially apparent when using Chrome, as that browser seems to engage the video card / hardware acceleration pretty frequently. I suspect that this is a hardware issue that is unlikely to be fixed anytime soon.
See this post on my experience:
forums.macrumors.com
The problem does not occur for me when I am connected to an external monitor, probably because the dedicated graphics is "always on" when an external monitor is connected (and graphics switching therefore never occurs).
I use https://gfx.io/ to manually disable the dedicated video card whenever I am running the laptop without an external monitor. This eliminates the graphics switching stutter, and also helps to preserve battery life. I use GFX to enable the video card if I know that I am doing something that would benefit from it. Incidentally, you can also have GFX notify you when the graphics card switches on/off; this will tell you pretty succinctly whether your stutters are video card related.
Hope this helps!
See this post on my experience:
Macbook Pro 16 inch lag issues (video & while typing)
I was experiencing this issue as well, where the system would lock up or stutter for 1-2 seconds (keyboard input lag, screen not updating, etc). This would happen all the time, but most notably while I was using Chrome or switching between apps. Disabling font smoothing made no difference, and...
forums.macrumors.com
The problem does not occur for me when I am connected to an external monitor, probably because the dedicated graphics is "always on" when an external monitor is connected (and graphics switching therefore never occurs).
I use https://gfx.io/ to manually disable the dedicated video card whenever I am running the laptop without an external monitor. This eliminates the graphics switching stutter, and also helps to preserve battery life. I use GFX to enable the video card if I know that I am doing something that would benefit from it. Incidentally, you can also have GFX notify you when the graphics card switches on/off; this will tell you pretty succinctly whether your stutters are video card related.
Hope this helps!
Howdy robinp,
It sounds like your system is "glitched." Have you tried to reset the SMC? https://www.ifixit.com/Guide/How+to...+NVRAM+on+a+MacBook+Pro+Touch+Bar+2018/113258. Your symptoms are the classic signs of a CPU stuck in low-power mode. For some reason, your system will not throttle up the CPU, causing your issues. If you don't have an actual hardware problem, a reset of your SMC *should* do the trick. The general advice of doing a fresh install of macOS might do it too, but the SMC reset is quicker and will take less time. Good luck!
Rich S.
Thanks, yeah, I tried that before the reinstall. Sadly neither helped. Apple have now said they think it’s hardware.
2nd repair in 6 months of having this Mac. That was after getting a refund for my 2017 13” because it went wrong 3 times. Got to wonder what’s going on with quality control.
Just the limitations of the antiquated Intel HD630 showing.
If you force the AMD GPU on it should go away.
sudo pmset -c gpuswitch 1
Will do that when plugged in.
If you force the AMD GPU on it should go away.
sudo pmset -c gpuswitch 1
Will do that when plugged in.
It could be some background tasks taxing the system. I notice a bit of lag when cloud sync services kick in.
I HAD exactly the same issue with my 2019 MacBook Pro 16, Intel i9 2.3GHz, 1 TB SSD, Intel UHD Graphics 630 1536 MB, AMD Radeon Pro 5500M 8 GB.
Stuttering while typing, watching videos, simply scrolling a web page...
Switching to the dedicated graphics card makes it much better but drastically reduces battery life.
Then I found https://chromeisbad.com. I had Chrome installed on my system but was only using Safari. I followed the steps to completely uninstall Chrome and the stuttering problem immediately went away.
This is unbelievable. We all were blaming Apple for bad graphic card drivers, returning hardware and so on...
The problem is caused by Googles keystone stuff which is always active even if you are not using chrome.
Give it a try and please report here if that helps you too.
I'm so happy my MacBook is running smooth now!
Stuttering while typing, watching videos, simply scrolling a web page...
Switching to the dedicated graphics card makes it much better but drastically reduces battery life.
Then I found https://chromeisbad.com. I had Chrome installed on my system but was only using Safari. I followed the steps to completely uninstall Chrome and the stuttering problem immediately went away.
This is unbelievable. We all were blaming Apple for bad graphic card drivers, returning hardware and so on...
The problem is caused by Googles keystone stuff which is always active even if you are not using chrome.
Give it a try and please report here if that helps you too.
I'm so happy my MacBook is running smooth now!
I've had the exact same experience. At first I thought how could Chrome cause this, but I completely removed it and things are smooth under the UHD Graphics 630!