2016 Macbook Pro Issue - High Pitched Keyboard Clicking Sound

[MrGuder]

This seems to be an obvious issue with the 2016 models with heat making keyboard noise more apparent. I wonder if this is also a function of using the old battery design rather than the newer terraced style design from the Macbook which caused last year's desktop refreshes to be aborted?

Either way, the UK refurbished store has seen loads of variations of the 2016 Macbook Pros for a sustained period for several weeks. These could be repaired models, returned models, or even ones that Apple are putting in to the store just to boost sales because prices in the UK have gone up massively since the 2016 models went on sale. I don't recall the 2012 Retina models being so prevalent in the store for so long and in so many variants.

Apple could very well be planning a 2017 model to launch in October but should they instead be launching a replacement sooner than that - perhaps at WWDC? Kaby Lake CPUs should be available, allowing better energy efficiency, built in support for Thunderbolt 3 on the motherboard, and most importantly, the chance for engineering improvements to eliminate some of the issues that have arisen these last few months including a terraced battery.

Good post and points...
We will find out soon enough June 5 is right around the corner. October is most likely the update since Apple does not rush things to market and remember Apple is not hurting financially nor is their brand in jepordy for an update so quickly.

 

[emde]

Good news, I guess?

https://9to5mac.com/2017/05/16/macbook-pro-wwdc/

 

[TripleMoxy]

Good news, I guess?

https://9to5mac.com/2017/05/16/macbook-pro-wwdc/

I hope you're right. My fear is that they'll just update the processor and leave the keyboard untouched.

 

[sublunar]

I hope you're right. My fear is that they'll just update the processor and leave the keyboard untouched.

Kaby Lake is on 14nm+ process which is theoretically more power efficient. Power efficiency is why I think Apple go for the latest generation CPUs. I think they've probably seen enough issues to make those engineering changes to a new generation worthwhile - and they've brought them forward to a new 2017 model.

1. Early chance to re-align EU and UK prices. A glance at currency rates shows that the Euro and Pound have improved since last October. Apple could drop the prices a bit if they've noticed a slow-down in sales. They don't break out specific sales of lines but if there's talk of keeping the Macbook Air around because it's sold very well it could be because of the cost of Macs in Europe/UK. I can't recall so many third party retailers being able to offer over 10% off retail prices for MacBooks for so long. They are almost as cheap as Apple certified refurbished machines which suggests there's some price sensitivity in play and Apple may be concerned about a drop-off in sales in the run-up to October once people early adopters and folks who desperately needed a new Macbook have bought one.

2. Better power management by using newly available Kaby Lake CPUs.

3. Better power management by adding the terraced battery to the Macbook Pros that they originally meant to. This led me to believe that Apple didn't need a full year to perfect the terraced battery plus add Kaby Lake once it became available.

4. Better power management for Final Cut Pro X users due to HEVC video encode/decode hardware implementation.

5. Cost reduction through Kaby Lake Alpine Ridge Thunderbolt implementation. Could this mean a smaller motherboard and more space for battery?

6. Better performance from 200MHz boost across the board with Kaby Lake.

7. Chance for Apple to fix other engineering faults discovered from users with the Rev. A 2016 model. They must have plenty of data from real world examples of the Macbook Pro 2016 models and this may have delayed the introduction of the 2017 Macbook which might have been slated for March.

To be fair, many people thought the Retina Macs didn't become properly worth buying until Rev C Late 2013 models.

Rev B Early 2013 models came quite quickly after the mid 2012 model but still had Ivy Bridge HD4000 graphics which weren't quite up to smoothly running Macbook Pro 13" according to contemporary reports at the time.

Rev C Late 2013 brought Iris Graphic, Haswell, and Thunderbolt 2 for the Macbook Pro 13".

By a similar token, we can expect Kaby Lake to be available for Rev B Mid 2017 model, with Coffee Lake Rev C sometime in 2018 bringing a boost in the number of CPU cores. This could mean 6 core 15" models, and 4 core 13" models in the future. Or could Apple bring a 17" 4k Macbook Pro back with the 6 cores?

 

[jeh72]

Apple just replaced my keyboard/top cover on my 2016 15 mbp, and the replacement keyboard has a lot of keys with this issue. The old keyboard had a "B" key that would occasionally repeat, and an "R" key that would be high pitched every once in a while.

Now I have a keyboard where 8, 9, T, I, A, S, N, M, comma, and slash/question mark make the high pitched sound 100% of the time if the laptop is warm. Taking it back to the store tomorrow for servicing...

 

[MrGuder]

Apple just replaced my keyboard/top cover on my 2016 15 mbp, and the replacement keyboard has a lot of keys with this issue. The old keyboard had a "B" key that would occasionally repeat, and an "R" key that would be high pitched every once in a while.

Now I have a keyboard where 8, 9, T, I, A, S, N, M, comma, and slash/question mark make the high pitched sound 100% of the time if the laptop is warm. Taking it back to the store tomorrow for servicing...

Stay on it....the squeaky wheel gets the grease.

 

[jeroenvip]

Apple just replaced my keyboard/top cover on my 2016 15 mbp, and the replacement keyboard has a lot of keys with this issue. The old keyboard had a "B" key that would occasionally repeat, and an "R" key that would be high pitched every once in a while.

Now I have a keyboard where 8, 9, T, I, A, S, N, M, comma, and slash/question mark make the high pitched sound 100% of the time if the laptop is warm. Taking it back to the store tomorrow for servicing...

You could ask the service employee to take a random mbp from the store and heat it up. I bet 99 out of 100 times this high pitch sound will occur on any mbp build up until today.

 

[jeh72]

You could ask the service employee to take a random mbp from the store and heat it up. I bet 99 out of 100 times this high pitch sound will occur on any mbp build up until today.

I hope it's not a 99% defect rate, but if it is, this keyboard I have now is so bad compared to my first one that I hope the next one will be a significant improvement.

 

[jeh72]

I went back to the store yesterday, and I was told that this is now a "known issue" by Apple (it wasn't last weekend when I first came in?) and that they would be ordering special key caps with shims that are supposed to fix the problem. I'm skeptical of whether this will work or not. Hopefully it at least partially mitigates the problem...

 

[Nik]

Well, summer is here and temperatures are rising. The issue might grow really quickly now. If the failure rate is that high, then Apple has to revise the keyboard design somehow.

I am holding off with my purchase because I do not want to be bothered by paying 700 bucks for exchanging the keyboard after the warranty runs out. You guys ever thought of what happens after the warranty ends? They have to replace the whole top cover to fix the keys, which sets you back hundrets of bucks. Look at the long term effects, which are insane.

 

[jeroenvip]

I went back to the store yesterday, and I was told that this is now a "known issue" by Apple (it wasn't last weekend when I first came in?) and that they would be ordering special key caps with shims that are supposed to fix the problem. I'm skeptical of whether this will work or not. Hopefully it at least partially mitigates the problem...

Those "special key caps" will work. They offered this solution to me after they replaced the whole bottom part of the mbp while visiting the repair center the first time.

The caps will reduce the sound but won't actually fix the problem. One week after the second repair round other keys started to "crackle". If you accept these key caps as a working solution. Ask them to replace all keys on the keyboard with the caps. It will save you another trip for the same problem.

Regards Jerome

 

[turbineseaplane]

I do not want to be bothered by paying 700 bucks for exchanging the keyboard after the warranty runs out. You guys ever thought of what happens after the warranty ends? They have to replace the whole top cover to fix the keys, which sets you back hundrets of bucks. Look at the long term effects, which are insane.

That is a PRIME concern of mine with these new keyboard designs.

In all the years of buying, owning, selling, etc of the previous MacBooks, Pros all the way back to PowerBooks, I can't ever remember a time when I had a single keyboard issue or even had to worry about it.

The keyboard is not an area you want to have a hint of any reliability issues given how critical it is.

 

[Brookzy]

The keyboard is not an area you want to have a hint of any reliability issues given how critical it is.

The same can be said if you're a company making million of them in such a way that any real repair requires a top case replacement that includes a custom OLED strip, a sapphire-covered fingerprint sensor, and a custom-matched silicon chip.

If this becomes a repair programme it's going to cost Apple a bloody fortune.

 

[turbineseaplane]

The same can be said if you're a company making million of them in such a way that any real repair requires a top case replacement that includes a custom OLED strip, a sapphire-covered fingerprint sensor, and a custom-matched silicon chip.

Agreed!
Bring on the 15" non Touch Bar models! I'm in!

 

[SeanG1027]

Hey guys. My 2016 15 MacBook Pro was experiencing the popping sound and high pitched keyboard noise. Apple sent me a brand new unit. I am now experiencing more of the keyboard issue. They told me to take it back to the Genius Bar. I think this is a design defect.

 

[sublunar]

Hey guys. My 2016 15 MacBook Pro was experiencing the popping sound and high pitched keyboard noise. Apple sent me a brand new unit. I am now experiencing more of the keyboard issue. They told me to take it back to the Genius Bar. I think this is a design defect.

When did you purchase the original one? Was it off the shelf or a custom build?

If it's a design defect it would be more prevalent on the early batches. If it's from a model that's been built in the last few weeks then I'd worry. The fact that the refurbished stores (in the UK at least) have plentiful supply of multiple configurations day in, day out suggests that one of the reasons for a WWDC Macbook launch would surely be to start the Rev B models with engineering fixes in place.

These 'shims' under keys we read about, and heat from CPU/GPU heavy workloads affecting the noise from keys may be solved with a mild internal re-working at the build stage.

You wonder if Apple could alleviate this by reintroducing a 17" higher resolution model which would attract the power users back again but the price is bound to be ridiculous.

 

[SeanG1027]

When did you purchase the original one? Was it off the shelf or a custom build?

If it's a design defect it would be more prevalent on the early batches. If it's from a model that's been built in the last few weeks then I'd worry. The fact that the refurbished stores (in the UK at least) have plentiful supply of multiple configurations day in, day out suggests that one of the reasons for a WWDC Macbook launch would surely be to start the Rev B models with engineering fixes in place.

These 'shims' under keys we read about, and heat from CPU/GPU heavy workloads affecting the noise from keys may be solved with a mild internal re-working at the build stage.

You wonder if Apple could alleviate this by reintroducing a 17" higher resolution model which would attract the power users back again but the price is bound to be ridiculous.

I purchased it back in late November. I was advised by Apple to take it back to a genius and I did that today. He agreed that it had to be a design defect and that I needed to be escalated to a senior engineer. I already know they can't fix it. We'll see what happens.

 

[polee]

If rumors are correct and if they release the MacBook Pro with Kaby Lake during WWDC, would the keyboard issue have been resolved by then?

 

[MrGuder]

If rumors are correct and if they release the MacBook Pro with Kaby Lake during WWDC, would the keyboard issue have been resolved by then?

It depends if Apple makes a change on the production line for components. My guess is they update to Kaby lake but all other components inside and out stay the same. Then in Oct they will add new battery and update keyboard for mass production. There is no way Apple is going to update the battery and the keyboard and the processor all on June 5

 

[sublunar]

It depends if Apple makes a change on the production line for components. My guess is they update to Kaby lake but all other components inside and out stay the same. Then in Oct they will add new battery and update keyboard for mass production. There is no way Apple is going to update the battery and the keyboard and the processor all on June 5

June to October is too short a run. Apple have had months to work out what the issue with the terraced battery was that caused engineers to be pulled off desktop Macs and resulted in old style batteries to be used instead.

By way of comparison, the 2012 Retina was released at WWDC in June 2012.
There was an early 2013 model released in February 2013 7 months later - and the 15" model with Nvidia GT650M is the subject of an extended repair program to do with the GPU.
There was then a late 2013 model (the 15" of which has Nvidia GT750M) in October of 2013 - 8 months later - which apparently doesn't have issues.

Throughout this I recall teardown articles mentioning the increasingly improved internals (less Heath Robinson) as Apple figured out how to elegantly construct the retina models by learning from returned/repairing 2012 models. By the time of the 2014 models there was even a price cut although you can put this down to cost reductions or exchange rate shifts, or perhaps even Apple's costs for R&D on the line were paid off.

What we know at the moment is that Apple should have an engineering fix in place for the keyboard issues but a lot of these issues could be triggered by heat (from the CPU) which in turn may be affected by the internal layout of the laptops (heat sink/ventilation?) due to the size/positioning of the old style battery.

In the mean time, suitable Kaby Lake processors have been available for a while, these should allow onboard Thunderbolt 3 controllers - saving space and cost - and perhaps even eking out additional battery life over the Skylake CPUs. Every little helps.

If they do release a refresh it'll be because of the ongoing keyboard issues so they don't get so many returns (which are featuring on the refurbished store). They could then leave October to the desktops refresh while planning for a February/March 2018 laptop refresh in the timescale of the Coffee Lake CPUs but featuring further engineering improvements based on mass usage of the June 2017 models.

With Coffee Lake potentially introducing 6 core 12 thread mobile CPUs Apple simply can't afford to let Dell, Alienware etc steal a march on them for too long before introducing a new model. For that reason Apple could be reducing the lifetime of the Touchbar generations to get Coffee Lake into a 3rd generation Touchbar Macbook Pro in early 2018 rather than late 2018.

To be fair if they needed an excuse to bring back the 17" model it would be to house a 6 core Intel Coffee Lake CPU because I'd dread the battery life on a 15" model with a 6 core CPU and discrete GPU if it doesn't have a bigger battery.

 

[clickityclackity]

created an account just for this. Have insanely loud clicking on my 2-week old latest-gen MBP. In my case, it's the T and U keys. Very distracting

 

[jeh72]

I got my 15" back from servicing yesterday. I think they replaced all of the 15 keys that I specified with their new keycaps. So far it seems to work great. I played a lot of WoW yesterday evening to test it, and none of the ones I had specified as being problem keys made any noise. Unfortunately I couldn't get them to replace all of the keys, and I did find two more keys that have the issue so I will be taking it in to have those replaced on Saturday.

 

[turbineseaplane]

Man these stories are insanity.
These things are tremendously expensive and Apple's own insistence on messing with the keyboards to this level has made a formerly always reliable part (the KB) a new source of issues for many many people.
Super frustrating.

 

[TripleMoxy]

Man these stories are insanity.
These things are tremendously expensive and Apple's own insistence on messing with the keyboards to this level has made a formerly always reliable part (the KB) a new source of issues for many many people.
Super frustrating.

I absolutely agree. If this was any other company, it would play very differently.

If I might be allowed to use a small measure of hyperbole, this generation really is starting to feel like the emperor's new clothes, and there will always be those insisting that the emperor is wearing a fine, kingly garment.

I am happy with everything else, and some aspects of the pro (the screeen) are amazing, but to hobble such a fundamental part of the machine seems like an odd decision. I am happy that I returned mine, and I'm keeping my fingers crossed that they update the keyboard for any new release and test them more thoroughly.

 

[dan9700]

I absolutely agree. If this was any other company, it would play very differently.

If I might be allowed to use a small measure of hyperbole, this generation really is starting to feel like the emperor's new clothes, and there will always be those insisting that the emperor is wearing a fine, kingly garment.

I am happy with everything else, and some aspects of the pro (the screeen) are amazing, but to hobble such a fundamental part of the machine seems like an odd decision. I am happy that I returned mine, and I'm keeping my fingers crossed that they update the keyboard for any new release and test them more thoroughly.

this Mac is a joke had 2 with pop sound from hinge then 3rd one has 0 key clicking loud this is a £3300 machine this isn't right I'm gonna get refund and wait for refresh