2016 nMP

[Ph.D.]

People want genuine leaks? No leaks for you, says Apple!

What we have instead is all the pieces falling into place. No, we won't know for sure until Apple wants us to. But the puzzle pieces all fit together: a major jump to 14 nm graphics, new processors, new ports, new memory, new faster flash. Basically, nothing is missing, hardware-wise. All Apple has to do is knit it all together. Pretty easy for them, even with their other distractions.

Relax, "the new Mac Pro is almost certainly coming!" (A reference to a long running thread in the Mini forum.)

 

[AidenShaw]

What is the point of being so back-handed about everything? You must be a hoot at parties.

The point is that many of the people here knew exactly what I meant.... If some newbies ask questions, so be it.

 

[sigmadog]

Not sure I even care about a new nMP anymore. As a small home office guy, past experience makes clear that whatever Apple puts out will be far more expensive (and likely under-powered) than it's worth for me. If it weren't for my big investment in Mac software, my next computer (if I needed one) would probably be HP or something. As it is, I'm only a few years from retirement, so I'll make do with my upgraded 5,1 for as long as it runs, and if it croaks, I'll go the used cMP route. I'm tired of supporting Apple arrogance and Ive's "Form Over Function" obsessions.

 

[linuxcooldude]

Not sure I even care about a new nMP anymore. As a small home office guy, past experience makes clear that whatever Apple puts out will be far more expensive (and likely under-powered) than it's worth for me. If it weren't for my big investment in Mac software, my next computer (if I needed one) would probably be HP or something. As it is, I'm only a few years from retirement, so I'll make do with my upgraded 5,1 for as long as it runs, and if it croaks, I'll go the used cMP route. I'm tired of supporting Apple arrogance and Ive's "Form Over Function" obsessions.

Of course everyones needs are different. The expensive/underpowered is relative to the perceived value you get out of it. Money saved by using a Mac Pro / FCP X versus monthly payments for Premiere Pro. I find I'm much faster and more productive on FCP X than any other editor, even on a more powerful system. I'm also learning DaVinci Resolve. The free version supports dual graphic cards on the 2013 Mac Pro ( Not so on any other system, single GPU only ) saving me 1K over the studio version it would cost me using dual GPU support on any other system.

 

[Beardy man]

Not sure I even care about a new nMP anymore. As a small home office guy, past experience makes clear that whatever Apple puts out will be far more expensive (and likely under-powered) than it's worth for me. If it weren't for my big investment in Mac software, my next computer (if I needed one) would probably be HP or something. As it is, I'm only a few years from retirement, so I'll make do with my upgraded 5,1 for as long as it runs, and if it croaks, I'll go the used cMP route. I'm tired of supporting Apple arrogance and Ive's "Form Over Function" obsessions.

This.
It sounds like I'm in exactly the same situation. I'm a graphic designer using Mac since my first quadra 800 many years ago. I feel as a demographic group Apple have decided not to cater for us since 2013. I've always used the tower format and left them running 24/7. Probably wrong but felt that most computers fail when turning them on , never had one fail while running, only on power up. Feel iMac is too heat intolerant for that setup. Anyway that's my choice. I've been on the fence about nMacPro for a year or so now but if my cMP doesn't take me to retirement then it will be a reconditioned cMP for me as well. Sad after all these years of buying Apples latest/greatest but I too have had enough.

 

[ManuelGomes]

HP Z1 AIO anyone?
http://anandtech.com/show/10267/hp-...n-4k-display-intel-xeon-professional-graphics

Like it or not, soon enough everyone will be following suit and ditch the "normal" form factor for WS. This is still upgradeable though.
This is not new of course but the trend will escalate I believe. The need/will for constant upgrades is fading, since performance enhancements are slower now.

 

[koyoot]

In the last day or two, there was a comment about how underwhelming and disappointing some of the Apple hardware announcements are. (Just check the comments across MacRumors after many of the recent ones.)

Look at the calendar. Computex is 31 May to 4 June. 9 days later is MacWorld SF 2016.

Nvidia is expected to announce at least part of their range of consumer Pascal (GP104 series) in Taipei. If Nvidia "knocks one out of the park" with the Pascal announcement (like they did with the GP100 announcement), Polaris would be "a day late, a dollar short" at MacWorld.

On the other hand, if Apple announces that the GP104 will be in the next cylinder - they could look very good!

Yeah, and you will not call it vaporware, because it is Nvidia branded, even if GP104 is held back by production. GP104-400 because it uses GDDR5X will be released in low quantity in Q3, since early July. Only GP104 chip that could go into MP will be the one from GP104-200 with GDDR5. Which will not be meaningfully faster than Polaris 10. It may be even slower.

 

[ManuelGomes]

Let's hope we don't get delays from either side...

 

[koyoot]

Let's hope we don't get delays from either side...

The most important thing: will Apple delay Mac Pro more?

I do not care about Polaris or GP104 delays, if Apple updates Mac Pro, and it is good update, with good GPUs.

 

[koyoot]

http://files.shareholder.com/downlo...Apr_24_16_Recommended_Customer_Price_List.pdf

Just for information: desktop Skylake GT4E chips available.

 

[t0mat0]

R suffix for Iris Pro and HQ for the quad cores -

Core i7-6970HQ (8M cache, 4 Cores, 8 Threads, 2.80 GHz, 14nm) - $623
Core i7-6870HQ (8M cache, 4 Cores, 8 Threads, 2.70 GHz, 14nm) - $434
Core i7-6770HQ (6M cache, 4 Cores, 8 Threads, 2.60 GHz, 14nm) - $378
Core i5-6350HQ (6M cache, 4 Cores, 4 Threads, 2.30 GHz, 14nm) - $306

From Sweepr http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2428363&page=276

Any ideas on ETA for first CPU to get to a builder to benchmark?

 

[AidenShaw]

GP104-400 because it uses GDDR5X will be released in low quantity in Q3, since early July.

Do you think that the nnMP will ship in high quantity?

 

[koyoot]

Do you think that the nnMP will ship in high quantity?

In low quantity in June or July?

GDDR5X model will be available since early July. In low quantity. Mac Pro can be available from mid June. That is quite a gap.

 

[Zarniwoop]

http://files.shareholder.com/downlo...Apr_24_16_Recommended_Customer_Price_List.pdf

Just for information: desktop Skylake GT4E chips available.

So my prediction for iMac update is about to happen.

All 21.5" retina iMacs (except low end) and low-end 27" 5k iMac will get one of these chips.

There's a change, that the best 21.5" iMac model will be supplied with Polaris 11. At least thermals would allow it.

Based on todays information, here's my bet for mid-2016 fleet base models:

• Macbook 12" Skylake Core-m, DDR3
• Macbook 14" Skylake Core-i5-6200U, DDR4, retina 2880x1800 (MBA replacement)
• Macbook Pro 14" Skylake Core-i5-6360U, DDR4, retina 2880x1800, TB3
• Macbook Pro 16" Skylake Core-i5-6350HQ (Iris Pro 580), DDR4, retina 4k, TB3
• Macbook Pro 16" Skylake Xeon-1505Mv5, Polaris 11 based Firepro, DDR4E, retina 4k, TB3

• iMac 21" Skylake i5-6685R with Iris Pro 580, DDR4
• iMac 27" Skylake i5-6685R with Iris Pro 580, DDR4
• iMac 27" Skylake Core i5-6600, Polaris 10, DDR4

• Mac Pro, Broadwell Xeon, Polaris 11 & 10 based Firepro's, DDR4E

No love for Mac Mini... (I'd take i3-6300 & Polaris 10 combination any day, thank you.)

iMac's will get silent update before summer. Except the one with Polaris. New laptops and nMP v2 + new displays are introduced at WWDC.

 

[t0mat0]

Would the eDRAM from Iris Pro prove useful to even the Macs with discrete graphics?

 

[Zarniwoop]

Would the eDRAM from Iris Pro prove useful to even the Macs with discrete graphics?

Sure, if developers just would utilize it. There's 1152 GFLOPS compute power in that chip. Even today most iMac 27" users could find more than 400 GFLOPS of unused compute power from their non-Iris Intel CPU's. But developers have been lazy and Apple has not provided them with proper tools like Cuda to make it easier. I expect the situation to change very soon though.. maybe macOS 11 and next version of Xcode will improve things. Complete version of Metal is needed too, I suppose.

FCPX and iMovie use Intel Quick Sync Video to speed up Video encoding. Haven't heard much of others. I've seen some demos, that you could even render a game engine using both iGPU and dGPU same time.. but nothing else but demos.

Economically I'd change the Iris Pro model to regular one on a computer that has dGPU. Why pay extra for power if it's not used.

 

[koyoot]

Guys, how about a software that is able to bring VR content to films tangled with appropriate hardware?


You may now know what next Final Cut Pro and Mac Pro will target.

 

[tuxon86]

In low quantity in June or July?

GDDR5X model will be available since early July. In low quantity. Mac Pro can be available from mid June. That is quite a gap.

Micron is already manufacturing it (with high yield) and both AMD and NVidia have already their hands on plenty for their pre-release testing. Your info is a bit out of date it seems.

 

[koyoot]

Micron is already manufacturing it (with high yield) and both AMD and NVidia have already their hands on plenty for their pre-release testing. Your info is a bit out of date it seems.

I am not talking about GDDR5X chips, but GDDR5X equipped GPU model. Of course they have, otherwise it would be impossible to see die shots of qualification silicon of GPU equipped with them, dated for 14th week of 2016.

 

[t0mat0]

Given Apple is rumoured to have pushed Intel to doing Crystalwell, and they've changed things since Haskell, might Apple have had a hand in the Skylake eDRAM changes. What could Apple do? Surely Apple through the OS could lever it to give benefits to developers, or just for improvements directly for the user.

Guys, how about a software that is able to bring VR content to films tangled with appropriate hardware?


You may now know what next Final Cut Pro and Mac Pro will target.

That anything to do with the NAB FCPExhange NDAs?

 

[tuxon86]

I am not talking about GDDR5X chips, but GDDR5X equipped GPU model. Of course they have, otherwise it would be impossible to see die shots of qualification silicon of GPU equipped with them, dated for 14th week of 2016.

They have the new GPU chip, They have the GDDR5X memory controller, they have the GDDR5X memory chip... Why oh why would there be any delay in releasing GDDR5X equipped GPUs? Because you say so?

 

[koyoot]

They have the new GPU chip, They have the GDDR5X memory controller, they have the GDDR5X memory chip... Why oh why would there be any delay in releasing GDDR5X equipped GPUs? Because you say so?

Because if you've missed it, qualification silicon is dated for 14th week of 2016. Which was 3 weeks ago. There is still 3 months from qualification silicon to market release. Which means: early July.

16 - year, 14 - week

QUAL SAMPLE. See the point? And this is not even GP104-400 which will have GDDR5X. This GDDR5 version. Early July.

Edit. And here is die shot of GDDR5X version of the silicon:

The same time of production.

 

[Mago]

So my prediction for iMac update is about to happen.

All 21.5" retina iMacs (except low end) and low-end 27" 5k iMac will get one of these chips.

There's a change, that the best 21.5" iMac model will be supplied with Polaris 11. At least thermals would allow it.

Based on todays information, here's my bet for mid-2016 fleet base models:

• Macbook 12" Skylake Core-m, DDR3
• Macbook 14" Skylake Core-i5-6200U, DDR4, retina 2880x1800 (MBA replacement)
  
• Macbook Pro 14" Skylake Core-i5-6360U, DDR4, retina 320x1800, 2xTB3 + USB3.1 Type-C
  
• Macbook Pro 16" Skylake Core-i5-6350HQ (Iris Pro 580), DDR4, retina 3200x1800, TB3
• Macbook Pro 16" Skylake Xeon-1505Mv5, Polaris 11 based Firepro, DDR4E, retina 2880x1800, TB3

• iMac 21" Skylake i5-6685R with Iris Pro 580, DDR4
• iMac 27" Skylake i5-6685R with Iris Pro 580, DDR4
• iMac 27" Skylake Core i5-6600, Polaris 10, DDR4

• Mac Pro, Broadwell Xeon, Polaris 11 & 10 based Firepro's, DDR4E

No love for Mac Mini... (I'd take i3-6300 & Polaris 10 combination any day, thank you.)

iMac's will get silent update before summer. Except the one with Polaris. New laptops and nMP v2 + new displays are introduced at WWDC.

Moreless my updated prediction is:

• Mac Mini Skylake i5-6300HQ with HD530, upto i7-6970HQ with Iris Pro 580, DDR4, 4 TB3 + 2 USB3.1 Type-C 500$-1200$

• Macbook 12" Skylake Core-m, DDR3 <already launched>
• Macbook 14" Skylake Core-i5-6360U upto i7-6567U, DDR4, retina 2880x1600, TB3, TouchID Thin Unibody 1xTB3 + USB3.1 Type-C
  
• Macbook 16" Skylake Core-i5-6350HQ (Iris Pro 580) upto i7-6770HQ (Iris Pro 580), DDR4, retina 3200x1800, TB3, TouchID Thin Unibody 1xTB3 + USB3.1 Type-C
  
• Macbook Pro 15.6" Skylake Xeon-1505Mv5, Polaris 11 Baffin Pro , DDR4E, same retina as current 2880x1800, almost same Unibody in SpaceGray, 2xTB3 2xUSB3.1 Type-C HDMI 2.0, TouchID

• iMac 21" Skylake i5-6685R with Iris Pro 580, DDR4, 2 TB3 + 4 USB3.1 Type-C
• iMac 27" Skylake i5-6685R with Iris Pro 580, DDR4, 2 TB3 + 4 USB3.1 Type-C
• iMac 27" Skylake Core i7-6700K, Polaris Elsmere Pro, DDR4, 2 TB3 + 4 USB3.1 Type-C
• iMac 27" Skylake Xeon E3-1270, Polaris Elsmere XT, DDR4, 2 TB3 + 4 USB3.1 Type-C, SpaceGray Unibody

• Mac Pro, Broadwell Xeon 135W, Polaris Elsmere Pro (Firepro D310) & XT (FirePro D510), nVidia Pascal 104 (Quadro P7000), DDR4E(256GB), 6 TB3 + 4 USB-C USB3.1, HDMI 2 dual 10GbT, 1TB NVMe

• Mac Blade Server, Apple A-X 48 Core ARMv8 1TB RAM, 1TB NVMe, 8 SAS
• Mac Mini Server, Apple A-X 4 Core ARMv8 upto 4GB Ram, Dual Spinner 4TB+1TB Fusion

 

[tuxon86]

Because if you've missed it, qualification silicon is dated for 14th week of 2016. Which was 3 weeks ago. There is still 3 months from qualification silicon to market release. Which means: early July.

16 - year, 14 - week

QUAL SAMPLE. See the point? And this is not even GP104-400 which will have GDDR5X. This GDDR5 version. Early July.

Edit. And here is die shot of GDDR5X version of the silicon:

The same time of production.

Is that 3 month set in stone by the old all mighty? Is that a law that they have to obey?
See, unless you're in charge of NVidia or AMD production, all you have to go on are some picture that can be interpreted any which way you want and some speculation about what they mean and how both company really manage their production line and testing...

 

[Zarniwoop]

Macbook 12" Skylake Core-m, DDR3 <already launched>

• Macbook 14" Skylake Core-i5-6360U, DDR4, retina 2880x1600, TB3, TouchID Thin Unibody

16:9 for a small laptop... noo! Go away S**an!