2017 5k Imac or Imac Pro

[Ethosik]

Yes - there is a known issue with the thermal bonding compound in the 7700K (quantity and fill I believe since folks who delid and refill are claiming success in mitigating most of this. Firmware will not help - IMO.

Apple could release a firmware to have a better fan curve - instead of going from almost silent fan to OMG LOUD LOUD LOUD. But with Intel's reports that just opening a website causes the CPU to spike 30 degrees Celsius is normal, maybe it cannot be managed.

As I said, I expected the i7 to run HOT and LOUD. I am fine with that. I was used to my 2010 Macbook Pro running at almost 110 degrees Celsius almost constantly while I was working. I have not heard of reports that the iMac gets too hot and turns off. So it is still within the thermal limits.

 

[propower]

Just my opinion - The 2013 MacPro shows Apple knows very well how to properly cool a CPU. Hex Core - 100% load - 60degC. Laptops are totally constrained by the need for portability. The vanity choice for the iMac of form over function dictates the resulting compromise in how the unit behaves thermally. But there are of course many good things about the iMac. Even for me - these outweigh the negatives. And going forward - if one doesn't want/need the iMac Pro but want that gorgeous 5K screen....

 

[tipoo]

Where did I say 4Ghz was a magic number? The faster a processor is, the hotter it is. Compare a 1Ghz to a 4Ghz CPU. The fact that people need to liquid nitrogen cool a processor to achieve 6Ghz too. That was my point. So an i7 is faster than an i5, thus more heat. Having something generate heat, means it needs to run the fans to cool.

The i5 turbo boosts to that (4.2), but the i7 can turbo boost to 4.5.

Like I said, that is fine if you prefer silence over power. I expected the i7 to be loud. And I prefer speed to silence. I just find it shocking that people aren't expecting these to get hot and loud under load. Especially when there is A LOT of evidence that the 2015 5K i7 iMacs are loud. In some reports, even louder than the new ones. My fan RPMs spin up so much whenever I export, even on my desktops. It is not just my laptops that get loud.

Power draw is the only pertinent factor there. As process nodes improve, higher clock speeds are achieved in the same or lower power draw. I.e, a 3GHz G5 or Pentium 4 could run hotter than a 4GHz modern i7. Higher clocks = higher heat is much too simple an understanding.

You're comparing OPs 6 year old i7 to a modern one, multiple process node changes in between them, and saying OP should have known it runs hotter because the clock speed is higher. That just betrays a lack of understanding.

 

[macnmac]

if $ is not an issue, max imac pro...

 

[kingjames1970]

Just wanted to report back.

I ended up going for a 2017 5k Imac i7. Went for 64gb of Crucial ram, 2 tb SSD. So far so good. Haven't fully kicked in the transfer to this Imac yet. First real week of work next week to really test things out. However the only issue is it does get a touch noisy at times which has been reported throughout these forums. I don't think I stress things too much with what I am doing so far but at times you do get the Apache gunship taking off, but then it settles down and all is well. If i had to encode or anything more stressful I think i would have to consider sending it back. At present it happens rarely but enough to notice and slightly irritate.. it whirrrs up and then down, not constant.

The only slightly annoying thing for a designer is the resolution amazing as it is at 5k makes working on web projects tricky as they become super small and out of sync with browsers (Photoshop CC). You can scale things @200% but they are oddly pixelated and not 'real world.' Perhaps some clever folks here have a solution however this does seem to be a downside that I haven't found a fix for after a little investigation. I totally get why things are so tiny at 5k and understand the concept of resolution, this doesn't take away from the fact that they are small and hard to work on even @ 200% as you get odd pixelation and things are not pin sharp. Like i say though i may have missed a setting or a fix somewhere perhaps someone here knows the solution or it may be a Q for another area of MR and don't want to go off on a tangent.

Really happy so far though!

Thanks again guys for all your help and advice.

Similar position to you but I'm going to wait for the Pro as I'm doing 4K video now as well. Got some killer Illustrator files with so many blends etc, they slow my MacBook Pro down horrendously in ai and when placed in id, hopefully the iMac Pro will help out here too.

I suggest you just stick to 'default for display' and enjoy everything looking pin sharp - don't use 5K everything is just too tiny. I use a separate monitor if I need extra workspace.

 

[thefriendshipmachine]

I suggest avoiding the iMac like the plague. They thermal throttle like crazy and the retina panels have image retention problems (it's quite a common problem if you search the forum for "image retention" and "imac image retention").

I would advise you to either wait for a new mac pro or honestly to just build a hackintosh.

I can basically promise you with a 100% certainty that if you buy the new iMac and run the GPU/GPU hard that you're going to get throttled aggressively and that the screen will develop retention.

 

[kingjames1970]

I suggest avoiding the iMac like the plague. They thermal throttle like crazy and the retina panels have image retention problems (it's quite a common problem if you search the forum for "image retention" and "imac image retention").

I would advise you to either wait for a new mac pro or honestly to just build a hackintosh.

I can basically promise you with a 100% certainty that if you buy the new iMac and run the GPU/GPU hard that you're going to get throttled aggressively and that the screen will develop retention.

You've said the same thing elsewhere, repeating it doesn't make it true.

 

[joema2]

I suggest avoiding the iMac like the plague. They thermal throttle like crazy and the retina panels have image retention problems...I can basically promise you with a 100% certainty that if you buy the new iMac and run the GPU/GPU hard that you're going to get throttled aggressively and that the screen will develop retention.

This is not correct. There were some thermal issues unique to some 2014 retina iMac 27s but that is not representative of the 2015 or 2017 iMacs. I have a 2013, 2015 and 2017 iMac 27 and I have used them all extremely hard.

As a documentary film editor my 2015 and 2017 iMac 27 are often transcoding video for several days straight. For days at a time the CPU cores are high, and the fan is at high speed. Despite this stress the 2017 in particular does not thermally throttle to any significant degree. This was also shown by Max Yuryev's tests on the 2017 iMac. I've also never had any problem with screen retention:

 

[RuffDraft]

This Apple Insider post seems to suggest that the iMac Pro will be shipped this year.

Although it does suggest that pre-orders may be available by the end of the week, it also looks like the bigger businesses are going to get first dibs, which is another move that will be frustrating if true, considering how many bigger businesses have fobbed off Apple and yet the small independent companies keep rallying behind them. I'll be annoyed if I have 0 chance of getting one by January considering the wait, which was already too long to begin with.

There should be ample units available and configurations should take no longer than a week or two.

Those stating that there is no demand for the iMac Pro are clearly clueless if that article is true.

 

[thefriendshipmachine]

You've said the same thing elsewhere, repeating it doesn't make it true.

the fact that it's true makes it true unless you don't know how to use the search feature on the forum.

 

[kingjames1970]

the fact that it's true makes it true unless you don't know how to use the search feature on the forum.

I have bought three of my own iMacs and at least 200-300 for business and been on this site daily for years and never heard of these problems. I've never experienced any reason to 'avoid like the plague' - neither image retention or excessive throttling that impacts performance in any significant way. Hunting for a problem on the forum rather suggests that your statement: "I can basically promise you with a 100% certainty that if you buy the new iMac and run the GPU/GPU hard that you're going to get throttled aggressively and that the screen will develop retention" is simply hyperbole.

 

[thefriendshipmachine]

I have bought three of my own iMacs and at least 200-300 for business and been on this site daily for years and never heard of these problems. I've never experienced any reason to 'avoid like the plague' - neither image retention or excessive throttling that impacts performance in any significant way. Hunting for a problem on the forum rather suggests that your statement: "I can basically promise you with a 100% certainty that if you buy the new iMac and run the GPU/GPU hard that you're going to get throttled aggressively and that the screen will develop retention" is simply hyperbole.

I am happy for you, but unfortunately you're wrong about them throttling and you're wrong about retention. Your experiences of not having the bug don't mean the bug doesn't exist, obviously.......

As I said, learn to use the search features on the forum because the problems are there and they're the most common issues people have with the iMac.

 

[kingjames1970]

I am happy for you, but unfortunately you're wrong about them throttling and you're wrong about retention. Your experiences of not having the bug don't mean the bug doesn't exist, obviously.......

As I said, learn to use the search features on the forum because the problems are there and they're the most common issues people have with the iMac.

I think you missed the point where you have to search the forums to find the problem. If I haven't come across a case of it, it doesn't make sense that you GUARANTEE that iMacs will have these issues.

 

[briloronmacrumo]

Given the iMac Pro's pending ship date of December 14, 2017, the thread's title might explore those considering upgrading from 2017 iMacs to 2017 iMac Pros. A tempting proposition for me and each time working in Xcode spurs me to consider it again.

 

[thefriendshipmachine]

I think you missed the point where you have to search the forums to find the problem. If I haven't come across a case of it, it doesn't make sense that you GUARANTEE that iMacs will have these issues.

If you're literally never heard that the imac thermal throttles or that it has image retention then you must be living under a rock mate.

 

[Martyimac]

Without taking sides, I suggest the naysayers google "iMac image retention" The info is out there. How serious is it? Not for me to determine.

 

[joema2]

Without taking sides, I suggest the naysayers google "iMac image retention" The info is out there. How serious is it? Not for me to determine.

Nobody is saying this has never happened. Some have reported they have not *personally* experienced thermal problems or image retention, but they are not saying nobody on earth has experienced it just because they have not.

As I posted above there are obviously cases of 2014 iMacs having some thermal problems. There are some image retention issues on some machines but the majority of people here are not reporting those.

By contrast we have one person saying there is 100% chance anyone with a retina iMac (IOW every single person) will have these problems. Which of those is a rational statement?

 

[richinaus]

Nobody is saying this has never happened. Some have reported they have not *personally* experienced thermal problems or image retention, but they are not saying nobody on earth has experienced it just because they have not.

As I posted above there are obviously cases of 2014 iMacs having some thermal problems. There are some image retention issues on some machines but the majority of people here are not reporting those.

By contrast we have one person saying there is 100% chance anyone with a retina iMac (IOW every single person) will have these problems. Which of those is a rational statement?

I have not experienced either so not sure I would trust his guarantee......

 

[Lesser Evets]

I am a Freelance Graphic Designer working in London. I work mainly in CC versions of Photoshop, Illustrator and Indesign.

The most taxing projects I work on are large events, so stage sets and wall sized posters things like this. Large multilayered Illustrator and Photoshop files. And large multipage Indesign documents with plenty of high res imported images. The largest files can sometimes hit 3 or 4 GB +. I usually have Multiple apps running, all of the above plus MS PPT, Excel and Word, flicking between all these constantly.

The main Q here, or at least i think so is, would the 8 Core Imac pro be significantly better than the full fat i7 5K IMac 2017 in these apps or not.

I am the same, but not the specific job you have, and my files tend to be circa 1GB+.

Just got a mid-level iMac, and it is quite good. Power is always better. I'd have preferred a high-end iMac, and it would make any job easier. Even nothing-jobs are better on faster computers.

However, since you aren't doing video or CGI, I'd forget about the iMac Pro. Unless you want to make sure you will get your work ultra-quickly done for a few $$$ more, just stay with the top-most iMac. Benchmarks of the top iMac are impressive.

Photoshop and Illustrator files can be hogs, and I'd imagine 4GB files are extremely burdensome on any computer. InDesign never bogged down too much even on my 2012 i7 MacMini, aside from loading endless GBs of illustrations. You can always order/get a standard iMac and test it out for a day, and then return it, if you need more power.