2023 Formula 1 Season thread

[Pezimak]

If Sainz had been able to stay second, I think he or LeClerc had an excellent chance to win. Max still looks vulnerable overall, however, so I think LeClerc still has a chance to pull it off. And with a fresh engine and such, I hope Sainz is able to just go 100% the entire race and get to the podium.



As I understand it, it cannot show a flashing Red, Blue or Yellow light as the reflections could confuse the drivers with track lighting (which also flashes in those colors). Solid colors appear to be okay. Most drivers have mentioned they don't really notice it because their focus is on the track.



Alas, rules are rules. That being said, Ferrari should send the bill for the parts they had to replace to the FIA and the FIA should pay the invoice.

Ah that explains why Russel said they can tell the difference between a giant sphere and LED panels, he meant the ones next to the track for red and yellow flags etc. IMO the whole thing should be turned off for the race, but then they won't be able to fully race under the Las Vegas 'glow'....

Yea rules are rules but you don't expect the rubbish track to wreck your car as it's not been properly made or tested by the FIA representatives.

 

[Pezimak]

The controversy over this race keeps on coming, their is now a class action law suite against F1 to sue them, on behalf of the 35,000 fans who only saw 8 / 9 minutes of the practice session before being forcibly moved out after the drain hole cover incident.

Formula One is being SUED after Las Vegas practice chaos

A loose drain cover ripped into Carlos Sainz 's Ferrari car and forced the first practice session to be canceled before organizers inspected every drain on the city's $500million city circuit.

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

I saw a video of a guy who booked a hotel for this race and paid over $1k a night for the privilege only to arrive and find half the hotel empty and rooms available for $100. Combine that with casinos that are empty and huge blocking screens being put up to stop people seeing the action, and it’s a bit of a farce. If you’re not interested in F1, it’s the wrong week to go to Vegas and that appears to be why it’s quiet and general punters have in fact stayed away.

Max was pretty damning in his assessment after qualifying from the interview I saw. The race is similar to Baku, another street race lacking in ‘emotion’ and the prestigious feeling you get from tracks like Spa, Monza and Silverstone. It’s clear they’ve spent a lot of money bringing ‘the show’ to Vegas with the impressive light shows, huge LED screens on the pit roof, and the Hunger Games style opening ceremony, but the sport should be doing the talking, not the pyrotechnics. An opening ceremony for a Grand Prix, let that concept sink in for a second lol. I’m sure our Netflix friends will make this one look like the most spectacular event of the year with their script, but with a championship over and nothing really to get excited about, Vegas has certainly been cross-examined in a much more thorough fashion.

 

[CWallace]

Las Vegas is meant to be "Singapore on steroids" and in that regard, I think it works because it is a much more impressive-looking track at night with the Las Vegas Strip as the main straight.

It is clearly not meant to be a "racing circuit" like Spa, Monza or Silverstone, but then, F1 has been moving away from adding those types of circuits to the calendar since the 1990s as F1 transitioned from a sporting event to just an "event" for sponsors, celebrities and the wealthy to mingle. We've been lucky that some older tracks (Imola, Mexico City, Zandvoort) were re-added and COTA was designed as an actual race circuit, but all too often F1 chooses "entertainment tracks" that look really nice and have great amenities for the sponsors, the celebrities and the wealthy, but where the racing is, at best, secondary.

 

[Glideslope]

Las Vegas is meant to be "Singapore on steroids" and in that regard, I think it works because it is a much more impressive-looking track at night with the Las Vegas Strip as the main straight.

It is clearly not meant to be a "racing circuit" like Spa, Monza or Silverstone, but then, F1 has been moving away from adding those types of circuits to the calendar since the 1990s as F1 transitioned from a sporting event to just an "event" for sponsors, celebrities and the wealthy to mingle. We've been lucky that some older tracks (Imola, Mexico City, Zandvoort) were re-added and COTA was designed as an actual race circuit, but all too often F1 chooses "entertainment tracks" that look really nice and have great amenities for the sponsors, the celebrities and the wealthy, but where the racing is, at best, secondary.

This is exactly why I don’t expect to see Max in F1 in 2029.

 

[Pezimak]

This is exactly why I don’t expect to see Max in F1 in 2029.

I suspect it’ll be a different breed of drivers by then. Mind you it could be electric cars by then too! If they don’t get the bio fuels developed by then.

 

[Zest28]

So Perez has the worst qualifying result of any Red Bull driver since 2008 despite driving the best Red Bull car in history.

Not a surprise since Perez was a nobody his entire career and somehow lucked himself in that Red Bull car.

And this is the guy who is supposed to fight Max for the championship? What a joke this season and the next seasons will be.

 

[JustinePaula]

With regard to the Sainz penalty, the stewards were right to not grant a dispensation, look, it is like this, F1 has a lot wrong, this weekend is just on the whole, a bad weekend, like Spa with that win behind the safety car, and Abu Dhabi 2021..

F1 is a tough sport, and sometimes life is tough, Ferrari/Alpine are no doubt behind the scenes filing claims for damage, but the on track penalty has to be applied, because once you start dishing out dispensation for this or that, who next, for what reason, it becomes a race to "cheat" the system.. No question it is harsh, but that is just part of the thing of F1, there are great and bad moments, this is a bad moment.. I feel for Sainz, rough, but looking at the circumstance of the whole weekend, no one should gain just because of 1 incident...It starts an avalanche that will consume the sport...

A sport already badly suffering from bad press, now the lawsuit, and the farce of a 2:30 90min session no one saw..

Greed is the word, Greed did not allow for staff overtime, no one wanted to pay the stadium security staff to stay on, that is why the spectators were removed, they were removed for their own protection, and that was right.. But the reason was money, no one wanted to pay the staff, they wanted to hoard the money, make has much profit as they could..

Greed is the word that would define Sin City GP 2023, from the thugs demanding $1500 a person "view" rights per hotel room, to the film.lights on bridges to prevent free viewing... Now a major class action.. Greed sums up the event..it should be called the Greedy GP..

 

[Pezimak]

With regard to the Sainz penalty, the stewards were right to not grant a dispensation, look, it is like this, F1 has a lot wrong, this weekend is just on the whole, a bad weekend, like Spa with that win behind the safety car, and Abu Dhabi 2021..

F1 is a tough sport, and sometimes life is tough, Ferrari/Alpine are no doubt behind the scenes filing claims for damage, but the on track penalty has to be applied, because once you start dishing out dispensation for this or that, who next, for what reason, it becomes a race to "cheat" the system.. No question it is harsh, but that is just part of the thing of F1, there are great and bad moments, this is a bad moment.. I feel for Sainz, rough, but looking at the circumstance of the whole weekend, no one should gain just because of 1 incident...It starts an avalanche that will consume the sport...

A sport already badly suffering from bad press, now the lawsuit, and the farce of a 2:30 90min session no one saw..

Greed is the word, Greed did not allow for staff overtime, no one wanted to pay the stadium security staff to stay on, that is why the spectators were removed, they were removed for their own protection, and that was right.. But the reason was money, no one wanted to pay the staff, they wanted to hoard the money, make has much profit as they could..

Greed is the word that would define Sin City GP 2023, from the thugs demanding $1500 a person "view" rights per hotel room, to the film.lights on bridges to prevent free viewing... Now a major class action.. Greed sums up the event..it should be called the Greedy GP..

Most other tracks do not destroy the cars during practice just because the car drove over it. Their needs to be exceptions, did the driver make a mistake, did the team make a mistake, or did the FIA and Race Directors make a mistake and then penalise Ferrari for their mistake? It is up to them to ensure the track is safe and ready to be raced on, and they obviously didn’t check well enough in this case. They know how much downforce is created, it’s in the rule book, so they know what they should be testing to.

Also I have not read anywhere that the reason they forced the crowds out was due to not paying security staff. Link please. I heard all staff wanted more pay, not that they wouldn’t pay them for work.

The entire Vegas race is a total joke and makes a mockery of the sport and the drivers and teams, but it’s not the only track to do that this year..

 

[JustinePaula]

F1 explains why spectator areas were closed and offers compensation to some fans

Formula 1 and the Las Vegas GP promoted issued a statement explaining the disruption on day one and offering compensation to some fans.

www.racefans.net

Yes I agree 100% with the sentiment that the penalty was harsh, unfair, and something better could/should have been done, but I am older, mature, I see the bigger picture, what happens if... This is a very controversial incident, and I am pretty sure the stewards hated making, they couldn't be right either way...

But ultimately the problem was that the team principles created this with the latest concorde agreement, in which they set the rules, they and they alone are responsible for the penalty.. You should direct your anger at the 10 team Principles.. Toto, Freddie, Christian et al... They negotiated, formatted and approved the rules.. They of course could not see this, but they should have, this has been part of F1 since 1950, drain cover accidents in every decade, no one thought to allow for dispensation..Cannot blame the stewards, they have to operate by the rules..

Maybe the next concorde agreement, this will be addressed, if not, oh well... The stewards are often criticized for not doing the right thing, here they took a stand, to protect the sport from itself, which on one hand sounds harsh, but in reality is kind..spare the rod, spoil the child.. meaning, if you don't punish, the child will turn out bad.. spoil as in goes off/rotten..

F1/FIA/Liberty should pay the damage, they then sue for their losses, as there is a loss, as there will be no doubt some sort of judgement in the class action, greed was the reason, no overtime, staff safety, what is clear is they only had 1 plan, and when that went south, no plan B..take a risk, ban spectators, they may have a case, hopefully lessons for next year, other events...

But the point is, F1 is sometimes unfair, illogical, yes I feel for Sainz, no question, at times life is just that, harsh and uncaring, see it for what it is, someone has to be brave and prevent further rot...

 

[cyb3rdud3]

Ok, the racing itself was actually good and fun. Some insane speeds.

But everything around it I really cannot stand. Las Vegas isn’t my kind of town anyway, can’t think of a more classless place. The lights, the lack of crowd involvement, the show instead of race atmosphere. All horrible. I also thought the camera angles were terrible, as were the choices of what to show when. It’s like it was done by a team who never done F1 before.

And then this stupid drive to the other side to do a post race interview to then be driven back again. Followed by those stupid platforms, with bars in front of the steps.

Still can’t get over how armed police and security were moving fans out of the stands. And they were expensive seats.

 

[pachyderm]

ooohhh.... the race was yesterday...?

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

ooohhh.... the race was yesterday...?

I hadn’t realised either lol, woke up to the news Max had won the race and I had no clue it was being held on a Saturday. I suppose Vegas wants to reopen ASAP.

 

[Pezimak]

F1 explains why spectator areas were closed and offers compensation to some fans

Formula 1 and the Las Vegas GP promoted issued a statement explaining the disruption on day one and offering compensation to some fans.

www.racefans.net

Yes I agree 100% with the sentiment that the penalty was harsh, unfair, and something better could/should have been done, but I am older, mature, I see the bigger picture, what happens if... This is a very controversial incident, and I am pretty sure the stewards hated making, they couldn't be right either way...

But ultimately the problem was that the team principles created this with the latest concorde agreement, in which they set the rules, they and they alone are responsible for the penalty.. You should direct your anger at the 10 team Principles.. Toto, Freddie, Christian et al... They negotiated, formatted and approved the rules.. They of course could not see this, but they should have, this has been part of F1 since 1950, drain cover accidents in every decade, no one thought to allow for dispensation..Cannot blame the stewards, they have to operate by the rules..

Maybe the next concorde agreement, this will be addressed, if not, oh well... The stewards are often criticized for not doing the right thing, here they took a stand, to protect the sport from itself, which on one hand sounds harsh, but in reality is kind..spare the rod, spoil the child.. meaning, if you don't punish, the child will turn out bad.. spoil as in goes off/rotten..

F1/FIA/Liberty should pay the damage, they then sue for their losses, as there is a loss, as there will be no doubt some sort of judgement in the class action, greed was the reason, no overtime, staff safety, what is clear is they only had 1 plan, and when that went south, no plan B..take a risk, ban spectators, they may have a case, hopefully lessons for next year, other events...

But the point is, F1 is sometimes unfair, illogical, yes I feel for Sainz, no question, at times life is just that, harsh and uncaring, see it for what it is, someone has to be brave and prevent further rot...

Thank you for the link about the security staff not being paid, however your idea of the blame being at the principles ignores the fact safety of the track falls on the FIA and Race Director, not the team Principles. Also they would needed to have known the track layout and what man hole covers were on it and where months in advance, as I understand the track was built in less then a year, so they wouldn’t have been able to see where the man hole covers were, also they will have been reassured by the FIA it was safe to use.
Shifting blame doesn’t exclude the FIA from its duties which they have failed at in this circumstance, and they do so at any other track where man hole covers come up, and yes I’ve known a few to do so over the years, Also you are assuming that team principles all agreed on being given grid place penalties if the track itself damages their cars just for driving on it, again accepting the FIA are not responsible for the track safety. And I don’t think they would have done that myself.

 

[Pezimak]

ooohhh.... the race was yesterday...?

I hadn’t realised either lol, woke up to the news Max had won the race and I had no clue it was being held on a Saturday. I suppose Vegas wants to reopen ASAP.

Just checked and yes it was held on Saturday night at 10PM, what a total farce. I mistakingly saw the results but apparently it was packed with incidents.. I’ll give it a watch later.

 

[cyb3rdud3]

ooohhh.... the race was yesterday...?

Yes, that is another thing. The timings of this thing is all over the place. Just doesn't work in my opinion.

I hadn’t realised either lol, woke up to the news Max had won the race and I had no clue it was being held on a Saturday. I suppose Vegas wants to reopen ASAP.

Still worth watching as it was a pretty good race. Some excellent performances, I think everyone can be happy, bar Mercedes and Lando...

 

[pachyderm]

I feel like I've missed nothing...

 

[Pezimak]

Yes, that is another thing. The timings of this thing is all over the place. Just doesn't work in my opinion.

Still worth watching as it was a pretty good race. Some excellent performances, I think everyone can be happy, bar Mercedes and Lando...

They were well off the pace even in practice, so not surprising if they failed to finish or finished down the pack. I laughed at the fans calling for Lewis to retire, he gets podiums a few times this year, but when one race he has miserable performance they demand he quits lol.

I think but am not sure that the race was at 6AM ish UK time? This morning. Could be wrong on that though.

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

They were well off the pace even in practice, so not surprising if they failed to finish or finished down the pack. I laughed at the fans calling for Lewis to retire, he gets podiums a few times this year, but when one race he has miserable performance they demand he quits lol.

It’s smoke and mirrors I think, as there were calls straight after 2021 for him to quit and it’s not because they think he’s past it, they just know he’s still very capable. If he retires, he is one less threat and quite a few fans are insecure about his rather acquired fashion tastes and his reserved responses to questions. I think the more successful you are in this sport, the more criticism you get and Max is experiencing that. They all claim to brush it off but it must be very tiresome and it often gets to them.

I think he’s done well this season overall, he’s had one or two silly moments but all racing drivers have those. It’s a season to forget for me and if it’s like this next season, I’ll cut back on what I’m following until it’s a bit more competitive. It’s the first season I can remember where I haven’t watched a full race live and probably only watched 4 highlights shows. Time is precious and there are more entertaining sports at the moment.

 

[cyb3rdud3]

They were well off the pace even in practice, so not surprising if they failed to finish or finished down the pack. I laughed at the fans calling for Lewis to retire, he gets podiums a few times this year, but when one race he has miserable performance they demand he quits lol.

I think but am not sure that the race was at 6AM ish UK time? This morning. Could be wrong on that though.

It's a very strange place, and the loud fans are even weirder.

Lewis has done remarkably well this year considering the car they had. Checo been incredibly lucky, and Lewis very unlucky. The final standing doesn't tell the full story, although they are what they are. I really hope things turn around for him next season, as a driver, he has shown some outstanding skills. As has Alonso. It is too early for these guys to go.

 

[ericwn]

So Perez has the worst qualifying result of any Red Bull driver since 2008 despite driving the best Red Bull car in history.

Not a surprise since Perez was a nobody his entire career and somehow lucked himself in that Red Bull car.

And this is the guy who is supposed to fight Max for the championship? What a joke this season and the next seasons will be.

Yup just like Baricello, Irvine were planned as a WDC contenders.

 

[sunapple]

For once a really interesting and fun race with lots of overtakes in the front. Was a bit sceptical as the USA usually takes it way too far "off track", but the track itself seems fun enough. The show on Thursday however... And the interview taxi after the race... Pretty cringeworthy.

 

[cyb3rdud3]

So Perez has the worst qualifying result of any Red Bull driver since 2008 despite driving the best Red Bull car in history.

Not a surprise since Perez was a nobody his entire career and somehow lucked himself in that Red Bull car.

And this is the guy who is supposed to fight Max for the championship? What a joke this season and the next seasons will be.

Then again, that nobody is 2nd in the overall rankings I know it really doesn't feel like it, but those facts don't lie. Good result for RBR.

 

[Glideslope]

Well, just watched the race.

Firstly, glad Lando was released from the LV Medical Center and is ok.

Racier than I was expecting. Less of a Burlesque Show leading up to the race next year and I might stay up for it.

Superb drive by Leclerc for P2. Max drops a full second on the final lap to try and give Sergio a tow and Sergio couldn’t close. Will he be at RBR next year?

Master Class by Max. Calling out the Vegas Burlesque Show all week, then receiving a 5 sec penalty, George tries to take him out and wins by 2 sec with a missing winglet, and singing Viva Las Vegas on the cooldown. 😂

Sergio pretty much guaranteed P2 in the WDC now. A first for RBR. Well done RBR.

 

[Apple fanboy]

So the race was better than expected. But pretty much all the passing was straightforward DRS passing where the driver in front was a sitting duck.
Charles did well to fight back for second. At least Max tried to give Perez a tow at the end.
Ready for 2024. This season has been the worst.
Really fed up of the stats. Most wins in a season. Do me a favour. How many other drivers would have beat or equaled that if their team mate was so poor, their car was so much better than the rest and the season was so long.
You are not comparing Apples with Apples.