MP All Models 40 core ASI with PCI-E slot is around the corner!!

[Mago]

Apple's divisive courage: Trashcan Mac Pro

That is, and being TRUE: no matter form factor ASi Mac Pro won't be CPU neither GPU upgradeable, maybe you could add later compute accelerators whatever it shapes, but won't ever be PimpMyMac material, besides possible Compute accelerator and high speed i/o interfaces the tower cheese grater won't offer you Anything a trashcan can't, further Apple even could go beyond thunderbolt and offer Occulink ports for external high speed peripherals (Occulink it's moreless like an thunderbolt on steroids), consider Apple unapologetically buried the MP5,2 for the trashcan, there where people angry because apple 'had no right on changing their workflow' (move/delivery projects on burned DVDs).

At this point I believe odds at 2:3 for the ASi Mac Pro to be either an trashcan or an cube, with barely no expansion besides ram, internal PCIe storage and external thunderbolt/Occulink devices.

What I can write down here and bet my home on this the Mac Pro may not be what some or most want but will be an WOW product in a Way or other.

 

[avro707]

with barely no expansion besides ram, internal PCIe storage and external thunderbolt/Occulink devices.

Why RAM expansion? Wouldn't it be more logical for them to charge $10,000+ for a machine with fixed built in RAM that you then have to throw away and spend another $15,000+ for another new machine (and wait a month or more for delivery) when you want more RAM. So much better.

Any other idea is just out-dated and "legacy".

(possible sarcasm warning)

 

[MacPoulet]

Why RAM expansion? Wouldn't it be more logical for them to charge $10,000+ for a machine with fixed built in RAM that you then have to throw away and spend another $15,000+ for another new machine (and wait a month or more for delivery) when you want more RAM. So much better.

Any other idea is just out-dated and "legacy".

(possible sarcasm warning)

Sounds courageous…

 

[kiiso]

Oh @Amethyst, goddess of knowledge and wisdom divine,
I come before you seeking guidance on a matter that is on my mind.
I am eagerly awaiting the release of the new Apple Mac Pro,
And I know that you hold the key to unlocking its secrets, that's no joke!

Please, @Amethyst, I beseech thee, to grant me this request,
And reveal to me some information, that will help me to be at my best.
What will be the specs of this new machine, that we have been waiting for so long?
Will it be faster, stronger, and better, than any that have come along?

I know that you are privy to the information that I seek,
So please, oh mighty @Amethyst, leak some details, so I can take a peek.
Tell me about the processor, the graphics card, and the storage too,
And anything else that will make this new Mac Pro workstation something new.

I place my trust in your divine wisdom and knowledge so profound,
And I know that you will grant my prayer, and reveal what is yet to be found.
Thank you, @Amethyst, for all that you do, and for guiding me along my way,
May you always be with me, as I seek knowledge and wisdom every day.

Amen!

 

[deconstruct60]

March made more sense than April or May. It’s getting too close to WWDC. ....

Plus if there are any change with the Mac Pro developers will need to know about - those will be WWDC sessions.

I don’t have any insider information and could be wrong. But a release before WWDC doesn’t seem right to me.

The part that doesn't make sense about that is that if there is some huge tight coupling to macOS 14 how was this ever going to get released in the "about two year" timeframe? Huge macOS 14 constraint and this system is a late October earliest system(and more likely Nov-December if a six month lead time. ). Pretty near closer to sliding into 2024 as opposed to to some previous plan of squeaking in before end of 2022.

Similarly this whole thread stated in July 2022. Those beta testers probably got some branch of macOS 13 to pair the hardware with. Perhaps the limited education and substantive changes combined to produce problematical software. If the developers have been deeply struggling to grasp concepts in the beta then it would make sense to delay. However, that is also a bit of a red flag if the API remain "hard to grasp" over the long term.

'too close to WWDC' ... what? like if announce Mac Pro in April May that WWDC would implode due to lack of content. With 5-6 operating to cover , it is highly unlikely that 'lack of content possibilities' is a problem that WWDC has. Would a May/April Mac Pro introduction so overshadow the WWDC content that hardly anyone would show up for the conference? Probably not.

If ready to go and pushed into WWDC is more indicative that it can't really stand on its own value propostion merits. It is more like TV cable content bundling. Have to wrap it up with other stuff that most folks want to look at to arm wrestle some marketing for the highly bundled channel.

 

[dgdosen]

(non engineer post - so take with a grain of salt)

There's speculation on how difficult it would be for Apple/TSMC to use the same kind of UltraFusion from the M1 Ultra on "Jade 4C"/4x Max chips. I know schedules have been all up in the air - but TSMC has presentations showing that 3nm processes would showcase their "TSMC-SoIC" 3D Fabric.

Well, Apple is a (the only?) 3nm customer - So might they be trying some kind of Chip on Wafer or Wafer on Wafer packaging? It seems like an Ultra (2x) or Extreme (4x) could take advantage of that packaging.

You gotta start somewhere...

 

[Mago]

Apple/TSMC to use the same kind of UltraFusion from the M1 Ultra on "Jade 4C"/4x Max chips. I know schedules have been all up in the air - but TSMC has presentations showing that 3nm processes would showcase their "TSMC-SoIC" 3D Fabric.

FYI inFO-LSI bridges do not require being manufactured with the same process as the chips it links, so far no inFO-LSI bridge required that, all this is Gurman BS (actually a non engineer).

 

[Boil]

...TSMC has presentations showing that 3nm processes would showcase their "TSMC-SoIC" 3D Fabric.

Well, Apple is a (the only?) 3nm customer...

FYI inFO-LSI bridges do not require being manufactured with the same process as the chips it links, so far no inFO-LSI bridge required that, all this is Gurman BS (actually a non engineer).

The chips this bridge are connecting would be on the 3nm process, but that does not mean the bridge has to be of 3nm construction, nor was that ever stated...

 

[Mago]

The chips this bridge are connecting would be on the 3nm process, but that does not mean the bridge has to be of 3nm construction, nor was that ever stated...

This issue is absolutely imaginary, let briefly educate: the XXnm in a process showcases is the smallest feature you can define on a chip, for inFO-LSI it means just the bias used to interconnect an 3nm chip with an 7nm interposer requires an feature RELATIVELY bigger than if said chip shares process, said bias is fixed in size (not process) to the size used at the interposer, and said size even has nothing to do with chips process mutually matching feature size, but with assembly accuracy, often the bridge has to be ridiculous bigger than the actual 'wire' it links just to adjust to the assembly tolerances.

What imposes a restriction on inFO-LSI is the interface noise (which is not process related), it implies to move higher está volumes there's a roof or limit on serial speed which just implies you should move in parallel if don't fit on a single serial channel (UltraFusion uses 2000, I'd expect UF2 at at least 4000), 2000 data connections directly on silicon are trivial, Nvidia AMD have designs even widers.

 

[Mago]

After today Apple invites for WWDC23 more than one having trashcan nightmares...

 

[Adult80HD]

After today Apple invites for WWDC23 more than one having trashcan nightmares... View attachment 2185118

The logo is the shape of their building. Stop trying to somehow link it to the old 6.1.

 

[Mago]

The logo is the shape of their building. Stop trying to somehow link it to the old 6.1.

That's not me... also apple seemly sent directions to their affiliated press and influencers to remember the trashcan...

In case I 'm not wrong, I want to share I predicted it two years ago: https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/waiting-for-mac-pro-8-1.2186154/post-27466461

Trashcan ComeBack ...

 

[Boil]

After today Apple invites for WWDC23 more than one having trashcan nightmares... View attachment 2185118

The logo is the shape of their building. Stop trying to somehow link it to the old 6.1.

Looking at proportions & the angle of the top black band, it is definitely the Mothership...

That's not me... also apple seemly sent directions to their affiliated press and influencers to remember the trashcan...

Links / references / anything to substantiate...?

In case I 'm not wrong, I want to share I predicted it two years ago: https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/waiting-for-mac-pro-8-1.2186154/post-27466461

Trashcan ComeBack ...

Okay, Gruber... ;^p

 

[IconDRT]

6,1 haters are fervently praying that it’s the mothership on the invite and not the return of the greatest engineering marvel known to mankind!

“Thermal corner, my a##!” - Phil Schiller, maybe

Long live the 6,1!

 

[Boil]

6,1 haters are fervently praying that it’s the mothership on the invite and not the return of the greatest engineering marvel known to mankind!

“Thermal corner, my a##!” - Phil Schiller, maybe

Long live the 6,1!

Not a hater, just a realist, because that is definitely the Apple Mothership...

For me though, if we see a return to the SFF Mac Pro, then make mine a new Cube, thanks...! ;^p

 

[ZombiePhysicist]

Not a hater, just a realist, because that is definitely the Apple Mothership...

For me though, if we see a return to the SFF Mac Pro, then make mine a new Cube, thanks...! ;^p

If the trashcan was a Mac mini pro, the cube was more of a Mac Pro mini. You could upgrade the video cards, memory, storage, and probably other things in the cube. It is a definite upgrade design-wise.

In the overall world of expandability I would rate things roughly as so
7,1>5,1>cube>trashcan>studio

Somewhere between trashcan and studio would be old Mac mini's that let you upgrade their ram and storage space, but that is now gone too.

 

[Boil]

• Mn Extreme Mac Pro Cube
• Mac mini style PSU (just taller) up right side
• Double-sided mobo up left side
• SoC & RAM on front of mobo
• NAND blades & RAM on rear of mobo
• Ports to front & rear
• Massive heat sink filling interior volume
• 3D bottom intake venting
• 180x35 intake fan
• 3D top exhaust venting
• No handles
• ASi MBP-style feet

 

[prefuse07]

It's not the trashcan.

 

[avro707]

6,1 haters are fervently praying that it’s the mothership on the invite and not the return of the greatest engineering marvel known to mankind!

“Thermal corner, my a##!” - Phil Schiller, maybe

Long live the 6,1!

I'm a realist. I have all the recent Mac Pro generations - two 5,1 models both upgraded, a totally original maximum spec 6,1 and a mid-spec 7,1.

I still like the 6,1 but some elements of it are not the best (GPUs).

The 7,1 just kills them all. Brilliant machine, just been absolutely trouble free from day one.

 

[Mago]

Links / references / anything to substantiate...?

Apple classics: If it ain't broke, don't replace it [Setups]

Today's setup boasts a 2013 "trash can" Mac Pro driving three Cinema Displays from yesteryear. And that's only about half the retro gear here.

www.cultofmac.com

Just one, there are more (and more coming).

Mac Rumors December article remembering the trashcan I felt it s bit apologetic too.

 

[Mago]

Ok, that ASi Trashcan it's just a ghost haunting, as the performance is another ghost haunting, a German? blogger speculates about an Mac Pro AI, just like the 7,1 but being capable to host 5 M2 extreme, One at the main boars and 4 on MXP-like modules, he quotes apple need desperately it for providing Siri chatGPT like capabilities and for Apple car development.

(Maybe he is eating the dog food we leave here), btw interesting reasoning (and the Mac Pro i want).

MojaConsult Services - Will the Apple Mac Pro 2023 be full on optimized for AI?

Author: Olaf Zanger, 01.02.2023

www.mojaconsult.com

 

[Boil]

That's not me... also apple seemly sent directions to their affiliated press and influencers to remember the trashcan...

Links / references / anything to substantiate...?

Apple classics: If it ain't broke, don't replace it [Setups]

Today's setup boasts a 2013 "trash can" Mac Pro driving three Cinema Displays from yesteryear. And that's only about half the retro gear here.

www.cultofmac.com

Just one, there are more (and more coming).

Nothing in that Cult of Mac article points to "Apple directing press/influencers"...

 

[Joe The Dragon]

Ok, that ASi Trashcan it's just a ghost haunting, as the performance is another ghost haunting, a German? blogger speculates about an Mac Pro AI, just like the 7,1 but being capable to host 5 M2 extreme, One at the main boars and 4 on MXP-like modules, he quotes apple need desperately it for providing Siri chatGPT like capabilities and for Apple car development.

(Maybe he is eating the dog food we leave here), btw interesting reasoning (and the Mac Pro i want).

MojaConsult Services - Will the Apple Mac Pro 2023 be full on optimized for AI?

Author: Olaf Zanger, 01.02.2023

www.mojaconsult.com

datacenter??
where is
dual redundant power supply or more? (Hot sawp bays even nicer for that)
HOT SWAP STORAGE (With no DFU mode needed)
OS storage on any boot device (even net boot) (No apple storage lock in)
IPMI (maybe can have it setup to do DFU tasks if needed)
Network nic choice (apple can not do something like lock SFP what ever ports to apple only transceivers)
smaller case size for racking the mac pro is very bad fit as what it is now.

 

[Mago]

datacenter??
where is
dual redundant power supply or more? (Hot sawp bays even nicer for that)
HOT SWAP STORAGE (With no DFU mode needed)
OS storage on any boot device (even net boot) (No apple storage lock in)
IPMI (maybe can have it setup to do DFU tasks if needed)
Network nic choice (apple can not do something like lock SFP what ever ports to apple only transceivers)
smaller case size for racking the mac pro is very bad fit as what it is now.

The guy obviously failed it's analysis, an MPX compute module even multiplied by 5 barely matches dual RTX A6000 ada, and in tensor bf16 performance way behind, but it support what is obvious for people in the industry: Apple desperately needs to triple down on AI efforts, not just providing developers with useful tools but also building it's infrastructure.

It's where (if I could advise apple) consider the ASi Mac Pro strategy as the following:

A modular MXP-like Cheese grater, populated will MXP modules with computer modules build on m2 extreme or m2 ultra even with some cores disabled (to increase yield and low cost re-purpose semi defective silicon this was as is the norm in the industry), we talked about that LEGO like Mac pro, add to this apple should develop or outsource (as the excellent tersortorrent' grayskull) a dedicated AI silicon (TPU/NPU etc) properly integrated into MLkil etc, and both offer that to Mac Pro users (even 7,1, studio, etc/TB4) AND consume it at its own datacenter on an true industrial Mac pro, or assuming Linux server as cloud platform with provisions on toolchain so an Apple devoloper could rent said apple ai cloud without changes at the source code, details as redundant PSU may not be necessary (but welcome) on the Mac Pro but unlikely, as IPMI neither I see apple selling it.

That Mac Pro won't disappoint (assuming you can install as much compute module inside).

But also make me think about or ghost, under said escenario apple may opt to kill the tower and resurrect the trashcan and only sell external compute/ai modules on demand as well offer cloud compute for huge workloads.

 

[NC12]

datacenter??
where is
dual redundant power supply or more? (Hot sawp bays even nicer for that)
HOT SWAP STORAGE (With no DFU mode needed)
OS storage on any boot device (even net boot) (No apple storage lock in)
IPMI (maybe can have it setup to do DFU tasks if needed)
Network nic choice (apple can not do something like lock SFP what ever ports to apple only transceivers)
smaller case size for racking the mac pro is very bad fit as what it is now.

I think an xserve like design would accommodate these features better