8GB RAM in M3 MacBook Pro Proves the Bottleneck in Real-World Tests

[Unami]

And they should never disappear. If you are doing lots of video rendering and photoshop stuff, yeah 16gb is an important jump. But lots of people want the screen size, or the added ports, and work in industry, business, finance, and are perfectly happy and never see the difference.

This continues to boil down to the concept of vehicles. People saying they could never live and work by owning a Prius vs a F150 so they say ban the Prius!

Now a legit complaint with Apple and all the other tech companies is the price for the memory difference. They mark them up far more than it should be, but so does Lenovo, Microsoft, Dell, etc.

sure, but it's not Prius vs. F150, it's a F150 vs. a F150 that has it's gearbox limited so it can only bring 50 of it's 325hp on the road. granted, people who only drive on city roads wouldn't notice, but they still would have paid premium for a car with 325hp, because they didn't pay $3000 for a $300 part.

Then they can buy a MacBook Air. Stop apologizing for Apple’s cynical marketing decisions and lack of respect for its customers. A Pro should start with 16GB of RAM. And I agree with those who have already written that the ONLY response Apple will understand is poor sales of Pro’s the come with only 8GB.

Not sure about that, as it's the obvious scheme to not sell that much of the 8gb variant anyway. Every 8GB MBP sold is a win for apple because they sold an inhibited pro machine and will probably get to sell that person a new laptop earlier than if it bought a 16gb machine.

If you buy a MBP with 8GB you probably don't know better and don't really need a MBP (which you can't use as a MBP anyway with 8GB). If you buy an adequate machine with more RAM, you pay through the nose. So, either way, Apple wins.

 

[Kal Madda]

sure, but it's not Prius vs. F150, it's a F150 vs. a F150 that has it's gearbox limited so it can only bring 50 of it's 325hp on the road. granted, people who only drive on city roads wouldn't notice, but they still would have paid premium for a car with 325hp, because they didn't pay $3000 for a $300 part.

Not sure about that, as it's the obvious scheme to not sell that much of the 8gb variant anyway. Every 8GB MBP sold is a win for apple because they sold an inhibited pro machine and will probably get to sell that person a new laptop earlier than if it bought a 16gb machine.

If you buy a MBP with 8GB you probably don't know better and don't really need a MBP (which you can't use as a MBP anyway with 8GB). If you buy an adequate machine with more RAM, you pay through the nose. So, either way, Apple wins.

That’s not even a close analogy, it’s apples to oranges… My M1 is the same CPU running at the same speeds. RAM only affects performance where gobs of it are needed, and nothing I’m doing with my computer requires gobs of excess RAM. And by your logic, the 16GB version is supposedly “gearbox limited” compared to the 32GB RAM configuration…

“…which you can’t use as a MBP anyway with 8GB…”. So the display panel suddenly changes? The ports disappear? That extra battery runtime ceases to exist? That wonderful sound system starts sounding more tinny? I don’t think so. The “MacBook Pro” nomenclature is a marketing term for more premium displays and chassis hardware. And RAM doesn’t impact that at all.

And lest we assume that “8GB MacBooks are useless”, I use my 8GB M1 Mac for my professional graphic design software, 3D modeling and sculpting in Blender, many of my other professional duties with apps like Pages, Safari, etc., and on my off time, emulating Windows games. My 8GB M1 Mac does all of these things beautifully without issue.

 

[WeLikeVodka]

That’s not even a close analogy, it’s apples to oranges… My M1 is the same CPU running at the same speeds. RAM only affects performance where gobs of it are needed, and nothing I’m doing with my computer requires gobs of excess RAM. And by your logic, the 16GB version is supposedly “gearbox limited” compared to the 32GB RAM configuration…

“…which you can’t use as a MBP anyway with 8GB…”. So the display panel suddenly changes? The ports disappear? That extra battery runtime ceases to exist? That wonderful sound system starts sounding more tinny? I don’t think so. The “MacBook Pro” nomenclature is a marketing term for more premium displays and chassis hardware. And RAM doesn’t impact that at all.

And lest we assume that “8GB MacBooks are useless”, I use my 8GB M1 Mac for my professional graphic design software, 3D modeling and sculpting in Blender, many of my other professional duties with apps like Pages, Safari, etc., and on my off time, emulating Windows games. My 8GB M1 Mac does all of these things beautifully without issue.

I find it hard to believe you tbh.

Very hard to believe you, in fact.

8GB of RAM are literally the minimum specs required to run Blender. Graphic design software ask for a lot of memory (+ VRAM) and the only windows games you can emulate with 8gb of ram are old.

You'd make a good salesman tbh

 

[Kal Madda]

I find it hard to believe you tbh.

Very hard to believe you, in fact.

8GB of RAM are literally the minimum specs required to run Blender. Graphic design software ask for a lot of memory (+ VRAM) and the only windows games you can emulate with 8gb of ram are old.

You'd make a good salesman tbh

Well, you can be skeptical all you want, but it doesn’t change the fact it’s true. I’ve never had a problem running my graphic design software or any of the rest of it. I’ve mostly been emulating a game called Ranch Simulator. I don’t know how old it is, but I don’t think it’s that terribly old. I run these softwares regularly, and have never run into a snag. And I should note, I don’t use Blender for animation. Animation is more resource heavy, but 3D modeling and sculpting is more moderate on usage. And the emulator I use is called Whisky and it’s based on WINE.

 

[kagharaht]

So old colleague showed me his MBP M3 8GB Ram. After awhile it would start to pause and take up to 10 seconds to stop swapping RAM when having too many Safari Windows open and having indesign left open with work, mail, photos and other apple apps open. Had to force reboot to finally get it going again because it got stuck. Shame on Apple for still making 8GB RAM Standard.

 

[Heat_Fan89]

So old colleague showed me his MBP M3 8GB Ram. After awhile it would start to pause and take up to 10 seconds to stop swapping RAM when having too many Safari Windows open and having indesign left open with work, mail, photos and other apple apps open. Had to force reboot to finally get it going again because it got stuck. Shame on Apple for still making 8GB RAM Standard.

And that's quite possible. I'm a casual user so 8GB is more than plenty for me. The one thing we can take from 103 pages of this thread is that everyone and anyone's experience can be different. There are some in this thread who have had horrible experiences with Windows based products and I OTOH have had good to great results with Windows PC's and laptops. My two gaming rigs run Windows 11. That said for the basics and everyday computing I much prefer using a Mac. I love the integration of the hardware and software and once you get used to the system wide keyboard shortcuts, it's hard to use anything else.

So in my experience, I use macOS, Linux and Windows, no issues with any of them. For gaming, nothing beats a Windows gaming rig unless you have a console.

 

[chucker23n1]

So old colleague showed me his MBP M3 8GB Ram. After awhile it would start to pause and take up to 10 seconds to stop swapping RAM when having too many Safari Windows open and having indesign left open with work, mail, photos and other apple apps open. Had to force reboot to finally get it going again because it got stuck. Shame on Apple for still making 8GB RAM Standard.

I would need more information to make an assessment, but once you have Safari and InDesign and apps such as Mail and Photos open, 8 GiB does sound too cramped for me. (You'd probably have to only open apps like Photos when InDesign isn't open. Or, y'know, double the RAM.)

10 seconds' worth of swapping or having to reboot sounds like memory pressure reached red. IMHO, even hitting yellow a lot should make you consider if you picked the right machine.

Which does raise the question: should a $1,599 machine with the "Pro" suffix come with little enough RAM that you can't safely run InDesign, Safari, Mail, and Photos side-by-side. We've been discussing that for 103 pages.

 

[Kal Madda]

I would need more information to make an assessment, but once you have Safari and InDesign and apps such as Mail and Photos open, 8 GiB does sound too cramped for me. (You'd probably have to only open apps like Photos when InDesign isn't open. Or, y'know, double the RAM.)

10 seconds' worth of swapping or having to reboot sounds like memory pressure reached red. IMHO, even hitting yellow a lot should make you consider if you picked the right machine.

Which does raise the question: should a $1,599 machine with the "Pro" suffix come with little enough RAM that you can't safely run InDesign, Safari, Mail, and Photos side-by-side. We've been discussing that for 103 pages.

I’ve never used InDesign, but I’ve had Affinity Photo, Affinity Designer, and Affinity Publisher all open at once with many files open in them, plus Safari, Edge, Mail, Photos, Notes, and other smaller apps and it’s run just fine on my 8GB M1 Mac. As I’ve also previously mentioned, I’ve run Blender and emulated Windows games without problems as well…

 

[jlc1978]

Which does raise the question: should a $1,599 machine with the "Pro" suffix come with little enough RAM that you can't safely run InDesign, Safari, Mail, and Photos side-by-side. We've been discussing that for 103 pages.

IMHO, it comes down to several things:

1) Pro is a way to differentiate product lines, not that one is somehow a professional machine. If the called it the Air+ would we have the same discussion?

2) Use case determines the value of the product. If you want some of its features over the Air and your use case works with 8GB, then it is an individual choice if the price is worth it.

3) No one is saying 8GB is good enough for everyone. Not everyone runs InDesign, a bazzilion open Safari Tabs, etc. but may want a nicer or slightly larger screen. Then the machine may be for them. However, bcasause soem people need more doesn't mean Apple should up the base RAM.

4) Personally, I think, unless you have a compelling reason to get the base MBP, the Air makes more sense from price/value perspective; and if the machine works for you, great. YMMV.

5) Some posters keep focusing on the cost of RAM, but that is irrelevant in terms of value pricing. It does impact margin, and Apple would have to raise prices to keep the margin steady; and a 20 -30 $ chip would likely add 60 - 90 $ to the final price, based on some rules of thumb for pricing. I think some want more RAM but at the same price and couch the argument taht "Apple's greedy; selling underpowered machines" to make their argument seem reasonable.

 

[chucker23n1]

I’ve never used InDesign, but I’ve had Affinity Photo, Affinity Designer, and Affinity Publisher all open at once with many files open in them, plus Safari, Edge, Mail, Photos, Notes, and other smaller apps and it’s run just fine on my 8GB M1 Mac. As I’ve also previously mentioned, I’ve run Blender and emulated Windows games without problems as well…

Yes, yes, you’ve cured cancer on a Commodore 64. We know.

 

[jlc1978]

Yes, yes, you’ve cured cancer on a Commodore 64. We know.

Why is it so hard to believe someone when their use case differs from what you want to believe represents all use cases?

The poster stated it works for them and never claimed it would work for all.

 

[chucker23n1]

IMHO, it comes down to several things:

1) Pro is a way to differentiate product lines, not that one is somehow a professional machine. If the called it the Air+ would we have the same discussion?

I don't really know how to answer this hypothetical. They call it "Pro" for a reason.

2) Use case determines the value of the product. If you want some of its features over the Air and your use case works with 8GB,

Use cases that work with so little RAM are disappearing.

3) No one is saying 8GB is good enough for everyone. Not everyone runs InDesign, a bazzilion open Safari Tabs, etc. but may want a nicer or slightly larger screen. Then the machine may be for them. However, bcasause soem people need more doesn't mean Apple should up the base RAM.

I need 32, ideally more, so that isn't the point.

But for almost everyone now, 8 is the bare minimum. Which I imagine isn't exactly how Apple wants to pitch the MacBook Pro. "You'll get by… barely!"

4) Personally, I think, unless you have a compelling reason to get the base MBP, the Air makes more sense from price/value perspective; and if the machine works for you, great. YMMV.

This is true, although the Pro does offer a nicer display, sound system, etc., so it's nicer even for consumer uses. (OTOH, if you know you don't need the power, you may enjoy the Air being fanless!)

5) Some posters keep focusing on the cost of RAM, but that is irrelevant in terms of value pricing.

It isn't that relevant, but it also isn't irrelevant. There comes a point where the margin is absurd. Apple can't ask $500 for going from 8 to 16.

It does impact margin, and Apple would have to raise prices to keep the margin steady; and a 20 -30 $ chip would likely add 60 - 90 $ to the final price, based on some rules of thumb for pricing.

Again, Apple bumps specs all the time while leaving the price tag the same. They do it every single year with the iPhone's, and they do it often enough on Macs as well. The M3 Air isn't more expensive than the M2 Air was when it first shipped. The M1 Air wasn't more expensive than the Ice Lake Air when that shipped. (The M2 Air did bump the price tag, but it also came with an entirely new chassis.)

Margins also change over time, as component costs go further down. An iPhone 16 Pro with A18 Pro gives them lower margins today than it will 9 months from now. That cycle is normal.

Having said that, I wouldn't be surprised if they either go with 12 GiB as the new base, and leave the price the same, or go with 16, and bump the price by $100 for a year or two or three, meeting things in the middle. And yes, in those cases, it would temporarily eat into the margin. But that isn't reason enough to do it.

I think some want more RAM but at the same price and couch the argument taht "Apple's greedy; selling underpowered machines" to make their argument seem reasonable.

Personally, I'm less concerned with cost as I am with a good base experience; we're approaching the point where 8 GiB of RAM just isn't a good experience on macOS any more. Apple isn't in the business of selling Mediocre, OK, Good options; they're aiming for Good, Better, Best.

If that means some people buy a previous-generation Air which then costs $100 or $150 less, or buy the current-gen but have to spend $100 or $150 more, that's fine by me. Some others in this thread have a different opinion on that, and I don't care.

 

[chucker23n1]

Why is it so hard to believe someone when their use case differs from what you want to believe represents all use cases?

The poster stated it works for them and never claimed it would work for all.

It has nothing to do with "the use case"; it has to do with absurd assertions.

Let me repeat what they wrote: "I’ve had Affinity Photo, Affinity Designer, and Affinity Publisher all open at once with many files open in them, plus Safari, Edge, Mail, Photos, Notes, and other smaller apps and it’s run just fine on my 8GB M1 Mac."

The claim is laughable.

If I open Safari with one tab, Chrome (i.e., roughly Edge) with one tab, Mail, Photos, Notes, and Activity Monitor (so that counts as one "smaller app"), "Memory Used" is already at 15.76 GiB while I'm doing almost nothing. Now add Affinity Photo, Affinity Designer, and Affinity Publisher "all open at once" on top of that and then have half as much RAM available and it should be pretty clear that macOS will be memory-constrained.

Which doesn't mean that it won't work, but it will not "run just fine".

And that's before we get to the fact that one intends to keep a machine for several years, at which point memory use will go up even further.

 

[Kal Madda]

It has nothing to do with "the use case"; it has to do with absurd assertions.

Let me repeat what they wrote: "I’ve had Affinity Photo, Affinity Designer, and Affinity Publisher all open at once with many files open in them, plus Safari, Edge, Mail, Photos, Notes, and other smaller apps and it’s run just fine on my 8GB M1 Mac."

The claim is laughable.

If I open Safari with one tab, Chrome (i.e., roughly Edge) with one tab, Mail, Photos, Notes, and Activity Monitor (so that counts as one "smaller app"), "Memory Used" is already at 15.76 GiB while I'm doing almost nothing. Now add Affinity Photo, Affinity Designer, and Affinity Publisher "all open at once" on top of that and then have half as much RAM available and it should be pretty clear that macOS will be memory-constrained.

Which doesn't mean that it won't work, but it will not "run just fine".

And that's before we get to the fact that one intends to keep a machine for several years, at which point memory use will go up even further.

MacOS uses more RAM when more RAM is available for indexing and other background processes. I’ve observed this with some of my friend’s Macs who have higher RAM configurations. All I can say is that I’ve done this type of workflow many times, and have never had an issue with it. I have no reason to lie about it or make it up… 🤷🏼‍♂️

 

[WeLikeVodka]

Why is it so hard to believe someone when their use case differs from what you want to believe represents all use cases?

The poster stated it works for them and never claimed it would work for all.

Because it's made up.

Kal doesn't post from a defensive position, but an offensive one. Look at him never mentioning how well those apps run. He never says how well those apps work.

And the reason why the RAM price is a joke argument is because they make *phones* in China with 16GB of good quality RAM for a fifth of the price. Apple does not exist in a vacuum.

8GB is fine for cheap laptops because they are meant for people who just want to get by. The MacBook Pro is not this kind of laptop. The screen and os arguments are just red herrings meant to deflect from the main issue. A $500 Chinese laptop will be more usable in a few years just because of the extra memory.

 

[WeLikeVodka]

I’ve never used InDesign, but I’ve had Affinity Photo, Affinity Designer, and Affinity Publisher all open at once with many files open in them, plus Safari, Edge, Mail, Photos, Notes, and other smaller apps and it’s run just fine on my 8GB M1 Mac. As I’ve also previously mentioned, I’ve run Blender and emulated Windows games without problems as well…

I used to run affinity and infinite painter back on my redmi note 5. A phone with 4GB of RAM from 2018.

You see, it's very subtle what you're doing. You seem to defend your choice while also extending it to the average consumer. If you noticed, people do not actually criticize you for buying the lower-end model - especially since back in 2020, the memory usage was lower - but rather for vehemently defending a company that offers a handicapped laptop for a luxury price.

 

[jlc1978]

I don't really know how to answer this hypothetical. They call it "Pro" for a reason.

For teh same reason we have iPhone Pros and AirPod Pros, product differentiation. Do you really think iPhone and AirPod Pros are soehow related to professional use?

Use cases that work with so little RAM are disappearing.

But still exist and that is the ones it is targeted.

I need 32, ideally more, so that isn't the point.

But for almost everyone now, 8 is the bare minimum. Which I imagine isn't exactly how Apple wants to pitch the MacBook Pro. "You'll get by… barely!"

Key is "almost everyone."

It isn't that relevant, but it also isn't irrelevant. There comes a point where the margin is absurd. Apple can't ask $500 for going from 8 to 16.

They can if people pay it, it's simple economics.

Personally, I'm less concerned with cost as I am with a good base experience; we're approaching the point where 8 GiB of RAM just isn't a good experience on macOS any more. Apple isn't in the business of selling Mediocre, OK, Good options; they're aiming for Good, Better, Best.

I agree, at some point 16 or so will be the base; bt that doesn't mean 8GB today is not enough for some users. If you truly belive that then teh 8GB Airs need 16 as well.

If that means some people buy a previous-generation Air which then costs $100 or $150 less, or buy the current-gen but have to spend $100 or $150 more, that's fine by me. Some others in this thread have a different opinion on that, and I don't care.

Exactly. Thier money, their choice.

 

[Abazigal]

You see, it's very subtle what you're doing. You seem to defend your choice while also extending it to the average consumer. If you noticed, people do not actually criticize you for buying the lower-end model - especially since back in 2020, the memory usage was lower - but rather for vehemently defending a company that offers a handicapped laptop for a luxury price.

The arguments seem to be flying over the place, IMO.

On one hand, you have people claiming that 8gb ram is clearly insufficient for users and that all Macs ought to come with 16gb ram standard. On the other hand, I see arguments like yours claiming that 8gb ram is a disgrace in a laptop like the M3 MBP which costs as much as it does.

So which is which now? Are you admitting that there are scenarios where 8gb ram can suffice for a Mac user, or not at all?

To me, there is no hypocrisy at all. Buy what you need, at the price point you can afford, and if you simply aren't willing to spend a little more money adding more ram to a Mac for whatever reason, there are always other options like the myriad of cheaper windows laptops. We each pick our poison.

There is nothing right or wrong about Apple supposedly offering "a handicapped laptop for a luxury price". It just is. We each vote with our wallets, and life goes on.

 

[Kal Madda]

I used to run affinity and infinite painter back on my redmi note 5. A phone with 4GB of RAM from 2018.

You see, it's very subtle what you're doing. You seem to defend your choice while also extending it to the average consumer. If you noticed, people do not actually criticize you for buying the lower-end model - especially since back in 2020, the memory usage was lower - but rather for vehemently defending a company that offers a handicapped laptop for a luxury price.

And how did you run Affinity on an Android device when there is no Android version of the Affinity apps? Heck, there is no iOS version of the Affinity apps, there is only Mac, Windows, and iPadOS versions. I’m curious.

To me, I don’t feel the need to “defend my choice”. I made my choice, and I’m happy with it. What I’m opposing here is a couple of notions being argued. 1. That 8GB isn’t a good configuration for anyone’s needs. My own use-case along with others here proves that isn’t the case. And 2. That Apple is somehow being dishonest or tricking customers by offering an 8GB base spec. I certainly don’t feel tricked or lied to, and many others agree with me. I knew what configuration I was buying, and knew roughly how it would perform for my workflow based on previous experience with 8GB Macs, and seeing the difference in performance the M1 chip made in my friends machines. It performs very well for my needs. I have never had an issue with it. Why would I spend $200 extra for more RAM I don’t need that wouldn’t make a difference for my workflow?

And by your logic, a 16GB configuration would be a “handicapped device” for a “luxury price”. Because some people need 32GB. In fact, by your logic, I don’t see how you could argue anything other than the highest spec configuration isn’t “handicapped”. This kind of argumentation doesn’t make any sense. Apple offers many different configuration options. Some are suited better for some than others’ needs. None of these configuration options are “handicapped”, they’re just different pricing levels that offer varying specs so that people don’t have to spend more than they need if they don’t have to, and Apple can make money when people do need higher specs. It’s very simple business. There is nothing immoral about Apple offering a device with cutting-edge hardware at a cheaper price point with less RAM for those who want the cutting-edge hardware, but don’t want or need gobs of extra RAM… You keep trying to pretend that the RAM is the only important spec in the computer, and that the price is unreasonable because of the RAM configuration. I would agree with you if we were talking about selling a Raspberry Pi or some other such cheap computer for this price-point. But MacBook Pro models have always been more expensive because they offer more premium hardware. The higher price relative to the MacBook Air is dictated by the premium hardware like the display, sound-system, battery runtime, etc.

 

[henkie]

And the iPad mini update proves that doubling the storage and ram does not mean the price will increase…The iPad mini, a famous multitasking monster, now also 8GB ram. But Apple should keep selling 8GB MBPs.

 

[WeLikeVodka]

And how did you run Affinity on an Android device when there is no Android version of the Affinity apps? Heck, there is no iOS version of the Affinity apps, there is only Mac, Windows, and iPadOS versions. I’m curious.

To me, I don’t feel the need to “defend my choice”. I made my choice, and I’m happy with it. What I’m opposing here is a couple of notions being argued. 1. That 8GB isn’t a good configuration for anyone’s needs. My own use-case along with others here proves that isn’t the case. And 2. That Apple is somehow being dishonest or tricking customers by offering an 8GB base spec. I certainly don’t feel tricked or lied to, and many others agree with me. I knew what configuration I was buying, and knew roughly how it would perform for my workflow based on previous experience with 8GB Macs, and seeing the difference in performance the M1 chip made in my friends machines. It performs very well for my needs. I have never had an issue with it. Why would I spend $200 extra for more RAM I don’t need that wouldn’t make a difference for my workflow?

And by your logic, a 16GB configuration would be a “handicapped device” for a “luxury price”. Because some people need 32GB. In fact, by your logic, I don’t see how you could argue anything other than the highest spec configuration isn’t “handicapped”. This kind of argumentation doesn’t make any sense. Apple offers many different configuration options. Some are suited better for some than others’ needs. None of these configuration options are “handicapped”, they’re just different pricing levels that offer varying specs so that people don’t have to spend more than they need if they don’t have to, and Apple can make money when people do need higher specs. It’s very simple business. There is nothing immoral about Apple offering a device with cutting-edge hardware at a cheaper price point with less RAM for those who want the cutting-edge hardware, but don’t want or need gobs of extra RAM… You keep trying to pretend that the RAM is the only important spec in the computer, and that the price is unreasonable because of the RAM configuration. I would agree with you if we were talking about selling a Raspberry Pi or some other such cheap computer for this price-point. But MacBook Pro models have always been more expensive because they offer more premium hardware. The higher price relative to the MacBook Air is dictated by the premium hardware like the display, sound-system, battery runtime, etc.

Oops mixed up affinity with autodesk, thought for a sec they made sketchbook.

Regardless, just because you don't "feel tricked" doesn't mean apple respects you. It's how companies take advantage of you. Buying the base model in 2021 was also a bit different. Less memory usage and a little thing called COVID were present back then. Even then, 8GB was kinda low imo, but it was understandable.

The thing with the highest spec is that there is a range of configurations to be sold based on how much money the product costs, what it offers, and how much its provider respects you and your loyalty.

"Premium hardware" is another buzzword term that no one can define lol. It's basically "woohoo shiny" but every company describes their flagship models as premium. RAM is obviously not the only important spec of a computer but it is one of the primordial aspects unlike the quality of a screen. Memory allows the computer to function properly regardless of having a TFT or WOLED display. Otherwise that Macbook pro has little more value than a raspberry pi because it will become basically useless in 3 years if the trend keeps up. You can't sell me a 8GB ram laptop you market as premium when I can buy a 16gb ram cheap phone for a fifth of the price

 

[Kal Madda]

Oops mixed up affinity with autodesk, thought for a sec they made sketchbook.

Regardless, just because you don't "feel tricked" doesn't mean apple respects you. It's how companies take advantage of you. Buying the base model in 2021 was also a bit different. Less memory usage and a little thing called COVID were present back then. Even then, 8GB was kinda low imo, but it was understandable.

The thing with the highest spec is that there is a range of configurations to be sold based on how much money the product costs, what it offers, and how much its provider respects you and your loyalty.

"Premium hardware" is another buzzword term that no one can define lol. It's basically "woohoo shiny" but every company describes their flagship models as premium. RAM is obviously not the only important spec of a computer but it is one of the primordial aspects unlike the quality of a screen. Memory allows the computer to function properly regardless of having a TFT or WOLED display. Otherwise that Macbook pro has little more value than a raspberry pi because it will become basically useless in 3 years if the trend keeps up. You can't sell me a 8GB ram laptop you market as premium when I can buy a 16gb ram cheap phone for a fifth of the price

Then you don’t have to buy one. Nobody is forcing you to. Apple isn’t holding a gun to anyone’s head. People choose to buy the base spec MacBook Pros with 8GB of RAM because it suits their needs and wants.

Ok, that makes sense. I could not do my graphic design work with Autodesk Sketchbook, I can with Affinity.

And no, it doesn’t necessarily mean Apple “respects” me. But their great customer service has convinced me they do. I’ve never felt any disrespect from them. Ultimately, I think most businesses respect their customers because respecting your customers is in your best interest as a company. If you don’t respect your customers, then you likely won’t be very successful… And I’ve never seen anything from Apple to make me believe Apple doesn’t respect their customers…

Premium hardware on computers is basically nicer and more expensive hardware. Like nicer and more expensive displays, sound-systems, etc. While these aren’t necessarily “core” to the functionality of the device being able to run, they are “core” to the user experience. There’s a big difference in the experience the user will get from a computer with a cathode ray tube display vs a MiniLed display… The more premium hardware is worth more to many customers, and for many of those same individuals, they don’t need gobs of excess RAM for their use-cases… The nicer displays, sound system, additional ports, and longer battery runtime provides additional value over the MacBook Air. And there’s zero evidence that 8GBs will supposedly be “insufficient” anytime soon. And all of the evidence points to Apple supporting the 8GB configurations just as long as the other RAM specs for the same CPU. Apple isn’t dropping CPUs with only certain RAM specs, they’ve consistently dropped all of the configurations for the same CPU. So there’s no reason to believe that Apple will drop support for Macs with the M3 with 8GBs before they drop support for Macs with the M3 with 16GB…

 

[0423MAC]

Still going huh.

I hope the late 2024 and 2025 Macs still come with the 8GB/256GB base.

If it means another 100+ pages of people trying to hash out what “Pro” then bring it on.

 

[Doomtomb]

The price of RAM hs nothing to do with the utility of the machine for a user.

By raising the price to protect margins, resulting some users paying extra for power they don't need.

Only to people who belive component pricing should determine the selling price; which is not how pricing works.

Doesn't mean it's a bad product, either; just that it is seen as meeting the needs of a large customer base.

That's the crux of many 16GB arguments - "I want 16GB at the price of 8GB." Rather than a cash grab, it's providing users an option at a compelling price point.

It's really simple economics, not a cash grab, greed , or many similar accusations leveled at Apple.

In the end, simple answer is if you need more than 8GB, buy it. If not, don't. If you don't like Apple's prices, buy something else. It's simply a business.

Not really in this argument but that's how businesses begin to die. Becoming arrogant, out of touch, set in their old ways. Apple's iOS,iCloud,etc ecosystem very strong but the Mac could be more successful if it was more price or spec competitive, and it's not the M series of chips but RAM/SSD that is the achilles heel. It has to be a deliberate choice to squeeze more margin but it's become quite excessive at this point, I mean the 8GB/256GB base spec has been a mainstay for over a decade but the rest of the industry has moved on. That's hitting the user experience and/or making some customers salty about instead of a baked in Apple tax, it's literally a line item at checkout.

 

[Kal Madda]

Not really in this argument but that's how businesses begin to die. Becoming arrogant, out of touch, set in their old ways. Apple's iOS,iCloud,etc ecosystem very strong but the Mac could be more successful if it was more price or spec competitive, and it's not the M series of chips but RAM/SSD that is the achilles heel. It has to be a deliberate choice to squeeze more margin but it's become quite excessive at this point, I mean the 8GB/256GB base spec has been a mainstay for over a decade but the rest of the industry has moved on. That's hitting the user experience and/or making some customers salty about instead of a baked in Apple tax, it's literally a line item at checkout.

Many competitors still offer 8GB RAM configurations as well. Because 8GB still is plenty for lots and lots of users…

PS, I don’t think Apple is anywhere close to dying, lol! 😂. They simply offer a configuration that you don’t like but many others do…