8GB RAM in M3 MacBook Pro Proves the Bottleneck in Real-World Tests

[WeLikeVodka]

I have not felt like my M1 MBA was garbage simply because it could not run blender.

Which brings me back to my original point - too much emphasis on specs (going on and on about 16gb ram like it's the be-all and end-all of what makes a PC great), and not enough on the user experience (the video by MAC address touches on a number of pros of the MBA, from the better battery life to the better trackpad to build quality).

Saying this as someone who also has a windows laptop for work with i7, 16gb ram and 512gb storage and well, I am reminded every day why I prefer macOS. And if it means I have to pay a little more to get what I want, I will glad fork out the extra cash.

Yeah yeah, even if your use case for 8gb of ram is enough, it won't in two years.

Of course MacOS seems better when you're cherry picking scenarios. The fact that you use jargon like "user experience" kinda makes me understand how some people think.

The battery life is objectively way better... but the trackpad? 99% of the time you'll have enough space to hook up a mouse. Oh wait the MBA doesn't have an USB-A port. The build quality argument is also kinda dodgy because the aero13 doesn't look like an unibody to me.

The M1 MBA has a lot of issues not brought up either... no Windows, no customizability, can't do much with it actually, doesn't work with many peripherals, can die if you insert certain USB-C cables, stuff that just doesn't happen on windows.

Just because the media constantly touts MacBooks as the best computers for most people doesn't make it true.

 

[Abazigal]

The battery life is objectively way better... but the trackpad? 99% of the time you'll have enough space to hook up a mouse. Oh wait the MBA doesn't have an USB-A port.

I am using a mouse that connects wirelessly without needing a dongle. And people like to mention hooking up a wireless mouse, and maybe that excuses a crappy trackpad to some extent, but I do find myself using my MBA in plenty of situations where a mouse is not feasible (like when I am on the sofa), and in those scenarios, you still can't beat the MBA's trackpad.

And well, the MBA does what I need it to do. The issues you mentioned, just hasn't come up for me. Plus in 2 year's time, it would mean my MBA has lasted me 6 years. Pretty impressive however you slice it.

 

[chucker23n1]

Yeah yeah, even if your use case for 8gb of ram is enough, it won't in two years.

I don’t know about two years, but yes, exactly.

The fact that you use jargon like "user experience" kinda makes me understand how some people think.

That’s not jargon. It matters.

The battery life is objectively way better... but the trackpad? 99% of the time you'll have enough space to hook up a mouse.

I prefer a trackpad. macOS integrated very well with them. Most mice don’t even support gestures. What century is this?

Oh wait the MBA doesn't have an USB-A port.

You don’t need USB-A to connect a mouse.

The build quality argument is also kinda dodgy because the aero13 doesn't look like an unibody to me.

I don’t know what the aero13 is, but Apple’s laptops are top-notch in terms of build quality.

The M1 MBA has a lot of issues not brought up either... no Windows, no customizability, can't do much with it actually,

I assure you one can do a ton with an Air. I have one colleague who does Flutter and .NET development on it, and another who uses it for sales.


Like what?

can die if you insert certain USB-C cables,

Is this something you read on Facebook? Come on.

Just because the media constantly touts MacBooks as the best computers for most people

They do?

doesn't make it true.

They’re great laptops. If your workflows are highly dependent on Windows, I wouldn’t recommend them. If your workflows require a lot of CPU or RAM, get a Pro instead.

 

[Kal Madda]

You and I do not know what Apple have planned for the next few years. If they know that more than 8GB will be required, then moving on to a higher specification base model is entirely reasonable. It might not be Apple Intelligence which requires the increase. Or at least, not the current implementation.

And if they think a move is necessary, I’m sure they’ll do it. They know best how to develop and market their product. The problem is people who basically don’t know anything about Apple’s plans or goals with the Macs saying that Apple is wrong for offering 8GB Macs. Apple knows much better than anyone in this forum what options they should be offering. And this argument seems silly on it’s face considering the high sales of the 8GB base specs and the high customer satisfaction…

 

[polyphenol]

And if they think a move is necessary, I’m sure they’ll do it. They know best how to develop and market their product. The problem is people who basically don’t know anything about Apple’s plans or goals with the Macs saying that Apple is wrong for offering 8GB Macs. Apple knows much better than anyone in this forum what options they should be offering. And this argument seems silly on it’s face considering the high sales of the 8GB base specs and the high customer satisfaction…

Mind, I have decided that if/when I upgrade my mini, a replacement will have at least 16GB. I managed to run Parallels on my 8GB mini. Definitely not ideal but very impressed I could even manage to have Windows and macOS simultaneously in just 8GB.

 

[Kal Madda]

It may be laughable when it comes to business and pricing decisions, since clearly Apple knows what it's doing there. And they have info. we do not. But I wouldn't make that as a general statement about all of Apple's decisions, especially when it comes to product design.

I don't have a dog in the base RAM fight—my working machine has 128 GB RAM, so this doesn't affect me personally. Further, I think Apple knows exactly what's it's doing with the starting RAM—they're offering a cheap machine for students, who are critical to bring into the Apple ecosystem and thus ensure its future growth—while maintaining profit margins by charging huge upgrade prices to everyone else.

[Yes, it's not all base model = students, but they are a key part of that market.]

But I disagree with the general position that 'Apple always knows best.'

For instance, many, myself included, thought the Trashcan MacPro was a compromised design at the time it was introduced, and Apple later acknowledged we were right. This was a clear case of Apple's users understanding their needs better than Apple itself. Apple finally wised up and put together a "Pro Workflow Team" of various pro-level users to provide them with much-needed outside "boots on the ground" input.

Another example was the poor thermal design on their last generation of 27" Intel iMacs (leading to noisy operation under load), which could have be easily corrected at a low BOM by adding an 2nd fan and some extra plastic ducting.

And then there's the butterfly keyboard.

And this applies to their software as well. Users can often see what the company cannot.

I’m not saying that’s always true, but it is true in this case, and it’s true most of the time. 👍🏻

 

[Kal Madda]

A non-gaming laptop of 2000 euros, containing the monicker “pro”, but it is not meant for professionals. Great piece of marketing.

Then go buy Windows crap since you seem to think it’s marketed so much better… 😂🤣

 

[Kal Madda]

Huh? Gotta love the reverse logic. How about you pay extra for 32GB and let those who have NO problems with 8GB, pay less?

He was being sarcastic because that’s essentially what the person he was responding to was arguing. 👍🏻

 

[jlc1978]

The contention is obviously that at some point, making it a $200 upgrade won’t yield more revenue.

At some point, the $200 will be to 32 or whatever, yielding marginal revenue.

The only argument is how close we are to that point.

Certainly at some point 16GB will be standard, given the historic increase in RAM as OS's and programs' memory requirements increase.

However, I don't think we are yet at the point where 16GB should be the minimum, despite some posters' opinion.

How about fitting 32GB but charging to permit access - initially 8, then 16, 24 or 32.

A quick visit to Apple store and pay for the next memory increment. Seconds to minutes later, your machine needs to restart and has more available memory.

People would complain about Apple crippling the machines. If someone found a way to activate it without paying Apple it would be a nightmare scenario for Apple. Then there is the question of what regulators might do. It's simply not worth the downside risk for a questionable upside.

Yeah yeah, even if your use case for 8gb of ram is enough, it won't in two years.

You are assuming the use case changes; which isn't true for many people whose machines will meet their needs way past 2 years.

The battery life is objectively way better... but the trackpad? 99% of the time you'll have enough space to hook up a mouse.

Bluetooth.

Oh wait the MBA doesn't have an USB-A port.

Since it is a legacy port.

 

[Kal Madda]

I have not felt like my M1 MBA was garbage simply because it could not run blender.

Which brings me back to my original point - too much emphasis on specs (going on and on about 16gb ram like it's the be-all and end-all of what makes a PC great), and not enough on the user experience (the video by MAC address touches on a number of pros of the MBA, from the better battery life to the better trackpad to build quality).

Saying this as someone who also has a windows laptop for work with i7, 16gb ram and 512gb storage and well, I am reminded every day why I prefer macOS. And if it means I have to pay a little more to get what I want, I will glad fork out the extra cash.

I literally run Blender on an M1 8G Mac Mini, and so far I haven’t run into any major snags. I haven’t tried animation with it, but I’ve used Blender for 3D modeling and sculpting and it’s worked fine.

 

[Abazigal]

I just realised that the larger MBPs don’t have usb-A ports either. I suppose that based on this definition, they aren’t really “pros” either if you can’t fit a mouse dongle into them.

 

[jlc1978]

I literally run Blender on an M1 8G Mac Mini, and so far I haven’t run into any major snags. I haven’t tried animation with it, but I’ve used Blender for 3D modeling and sculpting and it’s worked fine.

That's a key point some posters miss - 8GB works fine for the use cases of many users. Just because one user needs, or thinks they need, 16GB or more doesn't mean that is true for the users.

I used a 4GB and later 8GB Mac.MBP for years, and finally went to 16 simply for the occasional times I ran Parallels and even the 8GB would still have been fine, for my use case.

 

[henkie]

That's a key point some posters miss - 8GB works fine for the use cases of many users. Just because one user needs, or thinks they need, 16GB or more doesn't mean that is true for the users.

I used a 4GB and later 8GB Mac.MBP for years, and finally went to 16 simply for the occasional times I ran Parallels and even the 8GB would still have been fine, for my use case.

You also suggest that if you could have upgraded just the ram, you would be fine? But now bought a new computer because of lack of ram? That is exactly the point! I added additional ram when this was still possible (“member those days…”). Gave it additional 2-3 years. Now, you have to buy a complete new Mac if your needs change (ie run parallels). With 8GB base ram (in a MBP even!), Apple leaves little headroom for their arguably great CPUs to do their thing.

 

[jlc1978]

You also suggest that if you could have upgraded just the ram, you would be fine?

No, because the devices were old enough to be at EOL already, so more base RAM was part of the upgrade.

But now bought a new computer because of lack of ram?

No, simply when it became time to upgrade, the MBP 14" came with 18', as did the previous 15" I replaced an 8GB MB came with 16. The 14 was the only one that had the features I wanted so 16 was an added bonus.

That is exactly the point! I added additional ram when this was still possible (“member those days…”). Gave it additional 2-3 years.

Yea, as long as the processors were up to the task.

Now, you have to buy a complete new Mac if your needs change (ie run parallels).

And that's the point - if your needs are met with 8GB and they don't change, you do not need a higher priced 16GB model.

Had I not been at my upgrade point I would not have bothered to upgrade either the machine or even RAM if I could; as I pointed out, even 8GB was good enough for running Parallels.

With 8GB base ram (in a MBP even!), Apple leaves little headroom for their arguably great CPUs to do their thing.

However, for many use cases 8GB will be fine over teh life of teh system, whih is the whole point that it comes down to an individual's use case. I'm not saying 16 isn't nice to have, just for many any added cost to have a 16GB base model at a higher price than the 8GB is money they need not spend.

 

[Motorola68000]

We shall see if Apple raises the RAM which will be game set and match

 

[Motorola68000]

You would not believe it possible, but I go out of my way to be polite, yet someone tried to get me banned.

Agreed! The YouTube clickbaiters need an artificial scandal to rile people up every Mac release cycle, so they keep coming back to this and making an artificial “scandal” out of it. It’s very dumb. Of course the base spec isn’t good enough for everyone, and even if they upped the spec to 16GB or 12, you’d just have the 24-32GB crowd complaining that wasn’t good enough, and on and on and on… 🤦🏼‍♂️

Kal, hope you are well. I know it may be unbelievable but someone tried to get me banned. Let's hope the new M4 makes any question of base RAM of no real consequence. Best regards

 

[henkie]

No, because the devices were old enough to be at EOL already, so more base RAM was part of the upgrade.

There it is: standard more Ram in the base model. Without added kost, because that is what progress is. So why has this been at 8Gb for so long?
FYI Base configuration Air:
2008-2011: 2GB
2012-2015: 4GB
2017-2024: 8Gb
Apple needs to go to 12 or 16 next year if it wants to be serious about AI on device.

 

[jlc1978]

There it is: standard more Ram in the base model. Without added kost, because that is what progress is. So why has this been at 8Gb for so long?

Because it was a good number for a base machine.

Apple needs to go to 12 or 16 next year if it wants to be serious about AI on device.

Ideally it will be without a significant cost.

 

[name99]

I just realised that the larger MBPs don’t have usb-A ports either. I suppose that based on this definition, they aren’t really “pros” either if you can’t fit a mouse dongle into them.

C-to-A adapters cost like $2.50 at AMZ. I assume they handle mouse dongles, they handle everything else.

But this sort of complaint is NEVER about solving a real problem, it’s just performative whining isn’t it…

 

[henkie]

Because it was a good number for a base machine.

In 2017, yes. But 2024? Especially with AI computation becoming mainstream. Not so much. Again, selling a 8GB “pro” machine for 2000 euros. Who is it even for? In almost every scenario, anyone is better served with a (refurbished) M2Pro or M1Pro that come with 16GB standard and cost less (and drive more external monitors). Rumors suggest that all M4 Macs will come with 16GB standard. I will not be surprised with the next MacOS release, 16GB will be required for certain tasks, but this will be disguised by Apple as needing a MxPro or M4 at least. Similar to how last years iPhone 15 is unable to run the biggest new feature (AI) due to lack of ram, but Apple disguised it as needing A17Pro for it to function…

 

[henkie]

C-to-A adapters cost like $2.50 at AMZ. I assume they handle mouse dongles, they handle everything else.

But this sort of complaint is NEVER about solving a real problem, it’s just performative whining isn’t it…

This forum is meant for whining and discuss very first world “problems” . But usbA is still used a lot: usb stick especially are often usbA. Or older yubi keys. These things simply do not break easily. And are often used for work related purposes.
Why not leave out hdmi, card reader and just leave a single usbc while you are at it.
That is not to say that I would love having just to use usbc, but even Apple still uses the lightning port…

 

[Abazigal]

C-to-A adapters cost like $2.50 at AMZ. I assume they handle mouse dongles, they handle everything else.

But this sort of complaint is NEVER about solving a real problem, it’s just performative whining isn’t it…

Pretty much.

The best way of covering Apple is to begin with Apple. You have to focus with Apple, and then you move outwards. You start with Apple, and then you analyse the industry that Apple operates in. Instead, what I see a lot of people still do today is that they just treat Apple as any other company. But Apple does a lot of things differently, and if all you are doing is simply comparing Apple to everyone else and then go “Hey, Apple isn’t following what everyone else is doing, so I don’t think whatever Apple is doing is going to work”, I think they go down the wrong path.

 

[chucker23n1]

Ca. 2015, if the Mac mini would've had only USB-C, I think that would've been a valid complaint. In part because most accessories were still USB-A, and in part because early USB-C hubs and docks weren't good.

These days, yeah, I still have some USB-A devices, but they're getting fewer and fewer. I don't need Apple wasting space on the computer for them; a hub is fine.

 

[polyphenol]

Ca. 2015, if the Mac mini would've had only USB-C, I think that would've been a valid complaint. In part because most accessories were still USB-A, and in part because early USB-C hubs and docks weren't good.

These days, yeah, I still have some USB-A devices, but they're getting fewer and fewer. I don't need Apple wasting space on the computer for them; a hub is fine.

The ONLY things for which I really need USB-A are about three devices which, despite themselves having USB-C sockets, simply will not charge from USB-C. That includes about six chargers as well as sockets on computers. I have to use the USB-C to USB-A cables they came with and plug into a USB-A socket. Everything else will work happily via USB-C - sometimes with an adaptor, sometimes with a cable.

 

[jlc1978]

In 2017, yes. But 2024? Especially with AI computation becoming mainstream. Not so much. Again, selling a 8GB “pro” machine for 2000 euros. Who is it even for?

Someone who wants more ports than a base Air, better screen and raytracing; for example. Do I think it is worth the upgrade price for most Air users? No, unless they have a specific need for one of its features.

In almost every scenario, anyone is better served with a (refurbished) M2Pro or M1Pro that come with 16GB standard and cost less (and drive more external monitors).

Or an M1 Air with 8gb for even less. It's all about use cases, and if you are worried about future proofing an M1/M2 will be EOL'd before teh M3.

Rumors suggest that all M4 Macs will come with 16GB standard.

Which would be fine, but that does negate the 8GB versions being a fine choice for many users.

I will not be surprised with the next MacOS release, 16GB will be required for certain tasks, but this will be disguised by Apple as needing a MxPro or M4 at least. Similar to how last years iPhone 15 is unable to run the biggest new feature (AI) due to lack of ram, but Apple disguised it as needing A17Pro for it to function…

So? It still does everything you needed when you bought it. If it doesn't and you need a new feature, upgrade. That's what I did from my 14 when they introduced the new button on the 15. The 16 doesn't have a feature I need so I'm skipping it.

This forum is meant for whining and discuss very first world “problems” . But usbA is still used a lot: usb stick especially are often usbA. Or older yubi keys. These things simply do not break easily. And are often used for work related purposes.

An adapter should solve that problem so why keep a large legacy port? My scanner uses FireWire, should Apple have kept that port as well?

Why not leave out hdmi, card reader and just leave a single usbc while you are at it.

Clearly users liked it so Apple includes them. Anecdotally, that's one reason why I bougth a MBP.

That is not to say that I would love having just to use usbc, but even Apple still uses the lightning port…

Which generates a lot of whining...