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...but the build quality on those cheap laptops though. Dear god.... o_O

I still have a Acer laptop with Core Duo (if you care to check with era that machine was made. Hint: it is last Intel processor that is 32-bit only) and it is still working (upgrade from 512MB to 1.5GB RAM and slap on Linux Mint). I never had problem with Acer. The Acer Nitro 5 is pretty well built with decent specification, unlike Apple is selling a 1300 dollar MacBook Air with crappy Intel graphic. I care less about how a laptop look, i care more about how laptop perform.
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So why do you keep buying them.

Just want try it out. I originally brought it from Costco and gonna return it within 3 months period (yes, Costco has 90 day return window on electronics) and I forgot to return it because I was extremely busy. I am not planning to buy other iPad nor I have that desire to buy.

The OG iPad Pro 9.7 was gifted.
 
Surface has always been Surface, it is versatile 2 in 1 devices. It is Apple following Microsoft's step by gradually adding laptop thing to iPad.
I am currently using a HP EliteX2 (some sort of surface clone) for work and it doesn't really feel versatile or the best of anything.

Windows tablet mode is just bad. Windows doesn't seem interested in improving any aspect of this and it feels like it's just there for the sake of being there.

In laptop mode, the use of a kickstand and the type cover mean that it takes up more space than it should on a flat surface, and is essentially a "laptop with a broken hinge" in every other scenario. I can't hold it up by the keyboard as I can a normal laptop (or even an iPad with Smart Keyboard), and it feels unstable on my lap, because it's so flimsy and top-heavy.

It really feels like the worst of both worlds.

Conversely, I have been using the iPad since 2012. It has always been an excellent tablet, and gains new laptop-style features ever so often. It feels like Microsoft and Apple both started at opposite ends of the spectrum, and Apple has been better at adding laptop functionality to a tablet, than the other way around for Microsoft.
 
So a tablet running iOS (okay ipad os but whatever) that is mostly touch based but now allows limited use of a cursor is now...the same as a surface pro? On what planet are you on? For that logic to even be remotely true, apple would have had to make a hybrid Mac OS tablet. Literally all apple did was release a better keyboard with a trackpad while its main focus is still to be used as a tablet. We don’t have a heavier device with cooling fans, we don’t have a full blown desktop os trying to squeeze into a small space. No. We have...a cursor.

I swear people confuse the hell out of me. People go on and on about what ipad is missing and when apple is responsive and adds new features, people still find a reason to complain.

If it not clear to you by now, then I don't know what to say. Why is Apple keep adding iOS apps into Mac? Why is Apple doing so hard to push Mac Catalyst? Why is Apple adding trackpad support just before the rumored ARM base Mac? Why is Apple keeping adding traditional laptop stuff into iPad Pro? Apple is going for hybrid devices route.
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I am currently using a HP EliteX2 (some sort of surface clone) for work and it doesn't really feel versatile or the best of anything.

Windows tablet mode is just bad. Windows doesn't seem interested in improving any aspect of this and it feels like it's just there for the sake of being there.

In laptop mode, the use of a kickstand and the type cover mean that it takes up more space than it should on a flat surface, and is essentially a "laptop with a broken hinge" in every other scenario. I can't hold it up by the keyboard as I can a normal laptop (or even an iPad with Smart Keyboard), and it feels unstable on my lap, because it's so flimsy and top-heavy.

It really feels like the worst of both worlds.

Conversely, I have been using the iPad since 2012. It has always been an excellent tablet, and gains new laptop-style features ever so often. It feels like Microsoft and Apple both started at opposite ends of the spectrum, and Apple has been better at adding laptop functionality to a tablet, than the other way around for Microsoft.

I disagree. I was given an Surface Pro 4 at work and it is grate experience. Maybe because i am more use to Windows environment, it is great. I am not doing to much on tablet mode, I am meanly browsing website and watching video and using Surface Pen to write stuffthis is pretty much I do with the tablet mode.

The kickstand is meant for using on table and not really meant on your lap (so is iPad with Smart Keyboard). I don't feel iPad is excel anything here. If I want pop the Surface up and using keyboard and mice, i will put the Surface higher up and attach keyboard and mouse with it. I don't feel anything is different. And it is certianly not worst of both worlds.
 
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Since Apple invented the mouse.. can we say that everyone else has been copying Apple for decades? By the way I am just trying to defuse the situation! :p:p

I actualy don't care if someone copies/gets inspired by someone else's product if it improves the usability of their product for the consumer. Many people were asking for this, so I am glad that they did, even if they did or they didn't copy.
 
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Disclaimer: I'm an English major, so my percentages make perfect sense to me.

75 percent of the time, I prefer a Mac for the ease of working with multiple windows/apps, the full size keyboard, the computational power, and the ability to run desktop applications. Usually, though, this 75 percent of the time occurs in my office or when I am working at home. I have multiple browser windows open, 2 different docs open, and I am working back and forth between items on a 27 inch monitor.

The other 75 percent of the time, I am shifting towards an iPad as preferential. When I'm in the classroom, I am generally displaying something I've already created (in my office) and don't need the same device (which is usually heavier and more unwieldy). I'm increasingly reading eBooks, pdfs, etc. and it's more natural on an iPad. iPad's offer pencil input, which adds to more "like writing in the margins" feel. For Web surfing, I'd rather be on by iPad.

The OTHER 75 percent of the time, I prefer my phone. I always have it. It's in my pocket. I can look something up quickly. I can avoid making contact with other people while walking around. I can access files I've created that I store in the cloud, etc. etc.

I mean I think our predispositions and use cases inform how we see these evolutions of the iPad. If I'm trying to do what I do the first 75 percent of the time on an iPad, it's a gimped Macbook. If I try to do what I'm doing the other 75 percent of the time on a Macbook Pro, it's a gimped iPad. If I try to do what I'm doing the OTHER 75 percent of the time on my iPad or Macbook, they're a gimped smartphone.

Personally, I dig the changes. I think Apple IS trying to think about how cursor integration should be different on a touch device and I think that mission has the ability to push innovation in input across all platforms, so that fundamental ways of interacting with computers don't remain stale and static.
 
Like that big circle on iOS 13 that can’t do squat? Mouse is meant for precision control, the iOS way is terrible.

You seem to be complaining about lots of Apple's decisions in this thread. If you disagree with so many of them, maybe just choose a different platform and move on?

At any rate, the "big circle" is part of the evidence that Apple is not merely copying Microsoft. If it were, you would see a normal mouse pointer -- everyone knows what they look like. And the iPad is indeed a precision tool -- that's precisely why artists and others who work on a pixel-by-pixel approach are drawn to it? So why the big circle? It's so that the iPad remains a touch-first device. If the main selector is the shape and size of a fingertip, app developers will continue to design interface elements large enough to be operated by touch. This solves a problem the Surface has had from the beginning, which is that the "true" Windows programs often don't work very well or easily that way.

Incidentally, this is exactly why the Apple Pencil played out the way it did. Jobs correctly eschewed the stylus early in the iPad's life, precisely because styluses were common and because allowing them would have meant that many app developers would have ported their apps with stylus usage in mind. By insisting on the finger, Jobs was able to get developers to create apps operated entirely by touch. Once that mindset was cemented, Apple could then release the Pencil as a precision tool for those with that particular need, and without disturbing what already worked about the iPad.

The Surface is a really good device in many ways. It has its own advantages, so absolutely use that if it works better for you. But your specific complaints in this thread strike me as off-base.
 
Except Apple is in a position for the future, with a touch first optimized for mobile platform that will only continue to expand and grow. Microsoft has the same old Windows with a touch layer over it. They still haven't figured out mobile yet, which is the future.
 
Apple just slap themselve very hard today, isn't it. After years of bashing Microsoft and discrediting Microsoft's Surface line, Apple is finally ready to admit they were wrong all the time. Apple is essentially copying Microsoft.

For years, Apple and its fans discrediting Surface, claiming tablet and mouse does not work together and claming mouse input is necessary for tablet and iPad is meant for touch input. LOL, boys, they were wrong. Apple added mouse support on crappy iOS 13 (yes, I am refusing update to iOS 13 acrossing all my iPhone and iPad, with exception of one by mistake).

Today Apple created Magic keybaord case for the iPad. Apple is essentially creating their own copycat of Microsoft Surface. Boy, Microsoft was right for all the time.
These people only see the hardware side of the equation and are blind to the software component.

You are absolutely right: Microsoft got the hardware (tablet with keyboard) first but its software were blatantly inadequate for mobility and touch UX. Apple started from the software and added more productivity/desktop-like features, then adds the hardware.

I’m amazed that some people can’t see this.
 
Except Apple is in a position for the future, with a touch first optimized for mobile platform that will only continue to expand and grow. Microsoft has the same old Windows with a touch layer over it. They still haven't figured out mobile yet, which is the future.

The first iPad was released around 10 years ago, 10 years after, iPad is still iPad. iPad hasn't taken over the world and replaced people's computers. 10 years after, tablet shipment has been declining year over year. I don't know how is this gonna be the future.
 
The first iPad was released around 10 years ago, 10 years after, iPad is still iPad. iPad hasn't taken over the world and replaced people's computers. 10 years after, tablet shipment has been declining year over year. I don't know how is this gonna be the future.

Does the iPad really need to replace the PC though? What I see is that there is room for many varied forms of computing on one’s life. Where you might just have a communal family desktop in the past, it’s not uncommon to find someone today with a desktop or laptop, tablet and smartphone (all of which are computers). In addition, we also have the Apple Watch (which is a miniature computer on your wrist) and AirPods (which are shaping up to be computers in your ears). A future pair of Apple glasses may well be a computer you wear on your face.

So for every one computer (in the conventional sense) that a vendor sells you, Apple is in a position to sell you 3-4 computers.

Windows has won the PC, but it seems like this is as far as it goes. Conversely, by having won mobile, Apple is in a better position to leverage them to create experiences that a conventional PC can’t.
 
Unless iPadOS 14 is like MacOS then I don’t think Apple are at that stage yet. I do think iPadOS needs to move a lot further away from iOS though
 
lets not forget that new generations are born with ipad in hands, no laptop/pc...so i put them also on the ipad replaced the pc for them category
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Unless iPadOS 14 is like MacOS then I don’t think Apple are at that stage yet. I do think iPadOS needs to move a lot further away from iOS though
like final cut pro, logic pro x, all adobe desktop suits...multiple users account..
 
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You seem to be complaining about lots of Apple's decisions in this thread. If you disagree with so many of them, maybe just choose a different platform and move on?
does not compute. Must complain. Moreeeeeee

i swear. If i liked hammers and hammers did a great job for me, I wouldn’t go to a screwdriver forum and complain about how stupid the screwdriver is and how nobody should use it. I would just stay where I’m happy. Both are tools for different people. Both have pros and cons.

I’ve seen these ridiculous “can a ipad replace a laptop” threads for literally a decade of my life and it’s just a pointless waste of time. Everyone has repeated every single point thats been said thousand times before. Why even make a new thread? Look at an old one right?

i guess i never really understood people though. I’m a simple person.
 
The first iPad was released around 10 years ago, 10 years after, iPad is still iPad. iPad hasn't taken over the world and replaced people's computers. 10 years after, tablet shipment has been declining year over year. I don't know how is this gonna be the future.

10 years later and the iPad could replace 90% of what people need computers for. I don't even see the need to replace altogether, just be a viable alternative, which is exactly what it has become. New features such as mouse/trackpad support, multitasking, file system improvements, a dock, drag and drop, etc. will only continue to expand the platform. It may not take over operational work like Windows is focused on, but it can absolutely be a viable alternative to all the old MacBook Pro's, MacBook's, and MacBook Air's that are out there. I am not expecting this to happen overnight, but you can clearly see which platform is primed for the future. Windows will always have it's place in the office, but as the generation that is hanging onto all these legacy ideas of what a computer is dies off - that will change. I expect mobile to be the dominant platform, where Windows has no footing.
 
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Apple just slap themselve very hard today, isn't it. After years of bashing Microsoft and discrediting Microsoft's Surface line, Apple is finally ready to admit they were wrong all the time. Apple is essentially copying Microsoft.

For years, Apple and its fans discrediting Surface, claiming tablet and mouse does not work together and claming mouse input is necessary for tablet and iPad is meant for touch input. LOL, boys, they were wrong. Apple added mouse support on crappy iOS 13 (yes, I am refusing update to iOS 13 acrossing all my iPhone and iPad, with exception of one by mistake).

Today Apple created Magic keybaord case for the iPad. Apple is essentially creating their own copycat of Microsoft Surface. Boy, Microsoft was right for all the time.

I think its a much more nuanced situation than that. Which is kind of what The Verge article came round to after a slightly clickbait headline.

Both companies are coming at it from opposite ends of the spectrum I think.
 
does not compute. Must complain. Moreeeeeee

i swear. If i liked hammers and hammers did a great job for me, I wouldn’t go to a screwdriver forum and complain about how stupid the screwdriver is and how nobody should use it. I would just stay where I’m happy. Both are tools for different people. Both have pros and cons.

I’ve seen these ridiculous “can a ipad replace a laptop” threads for literally a decade of my life and it’s just a pointless waste of time. Everyone has repeated every single point thats been said thousand times before. Why even make a new thread? Look at an old one right?

i guess i never really understood people though. I’m a simple person.

Yeah, I just don't understand why so many people seem to assume every device has to somehow work for their individual needs or it must be a failure. What a boring world that would be.
 
Apple is essentially creating all in one hybrid devices, like Microsoft Surface Tablet line up. With the rumors that Apple is switching to ARM devices for their Mac line, Apple is going for Microsoft route.

First, Apple is discrediting Stylus, then Apple created Apple Pencil. Second, Apple is discrediting mouse input on touch devices, then Apple added mice input. For years, Apple discrediting Surface line as something half-assed product that is bad for everything. Now Apple is creating the same thing.

Apple fans has claiming iPad is designed for touch input and does not need mouse input. What made Apple changed their mind? The success of Microsoft Surface line made Apple rethink.

As of the stylus part. Steve Jobs was against that but only on the iPhone itself when asked about this from what I remember, I don’t think he said this regarding the OG iPad (but then this and the iPad 2 were the only available iPads he witnessed before his death so I can’t say from there)
 
Apple just slap themselve very hard today, isn't it. After years of bashing Microsoft and discrediting Microsoft's Surface line, Apple is finally ready to admit they were wrong all the time. Apple is essentially copying Microsoft.

For years, Apple and its fans discrediting Surface, claiming tablet and mouse does not work together and claming mouse input is necessary for tablet and iPad is meant for touch input. LOL, boys, they were wrong. Apple added mouse support on crappy iOS 13 (yes, I am refusing update to iOS 13 acrossing all my iPhone and iPad, with exception of one by mistake).

Today Apple created Magic keybaord case for the iPad. Apple is essentially creating their own copycat of Microsoft Surface. Boy, Microsoft was right for all the time.

You obviously do not understand the iPad and how this works to compare it to the Surface. Mouse/trackpad support on the iPad is an extension of touch.
 
For years, Apple discrediting Surface line as something half-assed product that is bad for everything. Now Apple is creating the same thing.

Unlike Microsoft (and Samsung), Apple doesn’t need to mention a competitors products in its ads, because Apple’s products speak for themselves. So Apple has never discredited any other manufacturer. They don’t need to. I used the Surface for work, and have a Surface Book right now for work, and I’m not sorry - it is a half-assed product. At least the Surface Book is better than the Surface, but not by much. Constant, constant problems. I hate the Surface and the Surface Book. I will never ever ever buy a Microsoft product for personal use. Using their products has discredited their products. Apple has nothing to do with it.

And, I’ll ad, Microsoft was the first to develop any of the technology you’re talking about.
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true and who cares.

I do.
 
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