Anyone else feel like they are forced to upgrade

[ricketysquire]

I have a 2017 15" MacBook Pro. I use it as my primary computing device and outside of the crappy keyboard it's been working for me. I've had AppleCare+ on it since getting it in 2018. With Apple dropping MacOS support for previous MacBook Pro models, I feel like this model is next to be dropped come this WWDC. I know Apple typically provides security updates for older MacOS versions for 2 additional years but its an unwritten policy and could change. I hate how Apple isn't upfront about the minimum amount of years they'll provide security updates for their OS releases.

Last thing I want to do is be running insecure software on a computer I use for online banking and bill paying. I got plenty of devices so I don't feel like buying a new one, but I feel like I should go ahead and just upgrade. I don't really need the power that a 14/16" MacBook Pro offers, so a MacBook Air or 13" Pro would be fine. But I feel like the one I have is fine for my needs and would continue to work (outside of the horrible keyboard and the fact I have to get it replaced at least once every year with AppleCare when keys get stuck).

Not sure if anyone else feels this way.

 

[Nbd1790]

Unfortunately that whole generation of MBP's were a mess from a design standpoint. If it's working for you, hang onto it until it really doesn't receive updates anymore. It sounds like it wasn't that long ago, but it's now a 6 year old model. Minus the keyboard issues, that's a pretty good run - not to mention that you'll probably be fine with updates until year 7/8.

Given the timeframe, I wouldn't feel like its a forced upgrade. There are few other laptops / devices that will receive updates for as long as yours did / will. As far as the banking / bill paying goes, there's always your phone which is just as easy.

 

[EssentialGadget]

Mac hardware becomes vintage 5 years from the date they are last sold. After 7 years they become obsolete per Apple.

So your 2017 15" is already vintage and will probably go obsolete in 2024/2025.

Apple supports free upgrades to new Mac OS versions when announced and typically supports upgrades to current Apple products. Current Apple products are less than 5 years from date last sold. Sometimes they will slip a vintage into an upgrade.

Apple supports security fixes on the latest 3 Mac OSs. So you will probably be able to get security fixes for your Mac for 8-10 years. You won't get the latest OS version but will still get security updates.

You should be good until 2027 from a security standpoint.

This level of support is the best in the PC industry.

 

[ChrisA]

Wait until you actually need to upgrade, then upgrade, not before.

 

[ricketysquire]

Unfortunately that whole generation of MBP's were a mess from a design standpoint. If it's working for you, hang onto it until it really doesn't receive updates anymore. It sounds like it wasn't that long ago, but it's now a 6 year old model. Minus the keyboard issues, that's a pretty good run - not to mention that you'll probably be fine with updates until year 7/8.

Given the timeframe, I wouldn't feel like its a forced upgrade. There are few other laptops / devices that will receive updates for as long as yours did / will. As far as the banking / bill paying goes, there's always your phone which is just as easy.

Yeah the keyboard is the biggest issue. I didn't mention it in my original post, if I keep using this as my primary machine I'll need to keep paying for AppleCare+ each year which is $139. The keyboard has regular issues like clockwork and I can't afford to keep paying Apple the out of warranty costs for the once a year (if not more) keyboard issues I have.

 

[Boyd01]

it's been working for me.

I know Apple typically provides security updates for older MacOS versions for 2 additional years but its an unwritten policy and could change.

I got plenty of devices so I don't feel like buying a new one, but I feel like I should go ahead and just upgrade.

It's working for you, Apple's policy hasn't changed and you don't feel like buying a new one. So, I don't see why you would feel "forced" to upgrade.

I say: wait until it doesn't work for you, Apple changes their policy or you feel like buying a new one.

 

[coffeemilktea]

Yeah the keyboard is the biggest issue. I didn't mention it in my original post, if I keep using this as my primary machine I'll need to keep paying for AppleCare+ each year which is $139. The keyboard has regular issues like clockwork and I can't afford to keep paying Apple the out of warranty costs for the once a year (if not more) keyboard issues I have.

If you mostly use this laptop at home, you can probably get away with just using a Bluetooth keyboard all the time; I've been using the same $129 Magic Keyboard since 2018 and it's worked great for me.

 

[McScooby]

Unless you have need for intel apps i.e. Windows, I’d get shot asap, despite apple’s intention so far as security updates go, you know their intention for intel, it’s for the past.

 

[ZircoBen]

Mac hardware becomes vintage 5 years from the date they are last sold. After 7 years they become obsolete per Apple.

So your 2017 15" is already vintage and will probably go obsolete in 2024/2025.

Apple supports free upgrades to new Mac OS versions when announced and typically supports upgrades to current Apple products. Current Apple products are less than 5 years from date last sold. Sometimes they will slip a vintage into an upgrade.

Apple supports security fixes on the latest 3 Mac OSs. So you will probably be able to get security fixes for your Mac for 8-10 years. You won't get the latest OS version but will still get security updates.

You should be good until 2027 from a security standpoint.

This level of support is the best in the PC industry.

Is this level of support really the best? Windows 10 support will last until October 14, 2025; and computers built in 2010 can still run Windows 10 comfortably.

Apple is way behind Windows in supporting computers long-term.

 

[dmccloud]

Is this level of support really the best? Windows 10 support will last until October 14, 2025; and computers built in 2010 can still run Windows 10 comfortably.

Apple is way behind Windows in supporting computers long-term.

Poor analogy at play there. While Windows 10 will be supported through 2025, many of those 2010-2015 PCs running the OS are already past the window to get new updates, drivers, etc., simply because the hardware requirements for Windows 10 in 2022-23 are higher than they were when the OS was first released. Additionally, most device manufacturers stop updating device drivers well before OS support ends, so those machines are using outdated drivers and either older builds of Windows 10 or more recent builds but running them noticeably slower due to the hardware inside the machines. Also, as software requirements increase, many of those older PCs are unable to run updated versions of those applications due to the older hardware inside the machines.

Microsoft isn't supporting all the various configurations of PC hardware, just the OS itself. Driver support is left to device manufacturers, so other than generic drivers, Microsoft is largely hands-off on that side of the equation. Apple is supporting both the OS and hardware simultaneously, so hardware is fully supported for longer on the Mac side than the Windows side.

 

[MauiPa]

No. This sounds like a totally made up issue

 

[aranhamo76]

I have a 2017 15" MacBook Pro. I use it as my primary computing device and outside of the crappy keyboard it's been working for me. I've had AppleCare+ on it since getting it in 2018. With Apple dropping MacOS support for previous MacBook Pro models, I feel like this model is next to be dropped come this WWDC. I know Apple typically provides security updates for older MacOS versions for 2 additional years but its an unwritten policy and could change. I hate how Apple isn't upfront about the minimum amount of years they'll provide security updates for their OS releases.

Last thing I want to do is be running insecure software on a computer I use for online banking and bill paying. I got plenty of devices so I don't feel like buying a new one, but I feel like I should go ahead and just upgrade. I don't really need the power that a 14/16" MacBook Pro offers, so a MacBook Air or 13" Pro would be fine. But I feel like the one I have is fine for my needs and would continue to work (outside of the horrible keyboard and the fact I have to get it replaced at least once every year with AppleCare when keys get stuck).

Not sure if anyone else feels this way.

I used my last MacBook Pro for ten years. I finally got a new one when we had a little money and my wife convinced me I deserved it. I handed down the old one to my oldest son who used it for a couple of years, and he handed it down to my next son who is using it now. The battery has been replaced once.

 

[ZircoBen]

Poor analogy at play there. While Windows 10 will be supported through 2025, many of those 2010-2015 PCs running the OS are already past the window to get new updates, drivers, etc., simply because the hardware requirements for Windows 10 in 2022-23 are higher than they were when the OS was first released. Additionally, most device manufacturers stop updating device drivers well before OS support ends, so those machines are using outdated drivers and either older builds of Windows 10 or more recent builds but running them noticeably slower due to the hardware inside the machines. Also, as software requirements increase, many of those older PCs are unable to run updated versions of those applications due to the older hardware inside the machines.

Microsoft isn't supporting all the various configurations of PC hardware, just the OS itself. Driver support is left to device manufacturers, so other than generic drivers, Microsoft is largely hands-off on that side of the equation. Apple is supporting both the OS and hardware simultaneously, so hardware is fully supported for longer on the Mac side than the Windows side.

That is a good point, and well said.

I think the reality is; the PC that I built in 2013 still runs well for all intents and purposes AND still gets security and Windows updates. Sure, many of the drivers haven't been touched in five years, but it still functions flawlessly.

Apple simply shuts out those computers from receiving any sort of support. A 2013 iMac, in comparison, is insecure and has been shut out from updates completely.

 

[ilikewhey]

Yeah the keyboard is the biggest issue. I didn't mention it in my original post, if I keep using this as my primary machine I'll need to keep paying for AppleCare+ each year which is $139. The keyboard has regular issues like clockwork and I can't afford to keep paying Apple the out of warranty costs for the once a year (if not more) keyboard issues I have.

are you outside the us? why is your ac+ so much higher. my 14inch m1max only cost 99 a year.

 

[Rychiar]

id sell it and upgrade. I just did so with my iPad Air 2 and I'm so much happier with my new iPad Pro.

 

[ricketysquire]

are you outside the us? why is your ac+ so much higher. my 14inch m1max only cost 99 a year.

Nope Im in the US. Maybe it costs more since it's a 15" MacBook Pro. Maybe, they got to make their money back from all the top case replacements they've done.

 

[ilikewhey]

Nope Im in the US. Maybe it costs more since it's a 15" MacBook Pro. Maybe, they got to make their money back from all the top case replacements they've done.

that is so strange, my mbp msrp around 4300 usd, and yet i pay a lower ac+ annual than you.

 

[Paddle1]

IMO the faulty keyboard sounds like a more pressing reason to upgrade rather than software support which is currently still ongoing. It sounds like you are regularly having to spend money for a subpar experience all because of a flawed design.

 

[antibolo]

Your MBP will likely be fully supported by OpenCore Legacy Patcher for a good few years after Apple drops official support. If you're still happy with your machine there is no need to throw it away just yet.

 

[Unami]

Yes, it's the longest service-period in the PC-industry. OTOH, last year I upgraded a MBP to Monterey that only got to official install Catalina as it's last version. It still worked flawlessly, fluently and fast. It's frustrating that some machines don't get any updates although they would work fine with them. There's also the argument: "But it still works fine, there's just no software updates" - but that's just as long as you got no other apple devices with newer, not backwards-compatible software.

So, yes, I often feel like apple strongly nudges me to update although it's often a waste of ressources. And it won't get better with needlessly soldered-on SSDs with a limited life-span.

 

[jeshanros]

I have a 2017 15" MacBook Pro. I use it as my primary computing device and outside of the crappy keyboard it's been working for me. I've had AppleCare+ on it since getting it in 2018. With Apple dropping MacOS support for previous MacBook Pro models, I feel like this model is next to be dropped come this WWDC. I know Apple typically provides security updates for older MacOS versions for 2 additional years but its an unwritten policy and could change. I hate how Apple isn't upfront about the minimum amount of years they'll provide security updates for their OS releases.

Last thing I want to do is be running insecure software on a computer I use for online banking and bill paying. I got plenty of devices so I don't feel like buying a new one, but I feel like I should go ahead and just upgrade. I don't really need the power that a 14/16" MacBook Pro offers, so a MacBook Air or 13" Pro would be fine. But I feel like the one I have is fine for my needs and would continue to work (outside of the horrible keyboard and the fact I have to get it replaced at least once every year with AppleCare when keys get stuck).

Not sure if anyone else feels this way.

I'd cross that bridge when you come to it. I've been an Apple user for a decade and have never felt forced to upgrade due to a lack of security updates. Apple was still updating my iPhone 5s with security updates when the carrier finally stopped supporting the phone. I recently updated my 2015 Retina MBP because I had swapped out the hard drive several years ago and I couldn't get the OS to updated without an Apple hard drive installed. Ended up getting an M2 Macbook Air which for my purposes is more than capable and feels snappier than the MBP it replaced.

 

[Apple Knowledge Navigator]

The model of MacBook Pro you have was poorly designed and ill-conceived, so it’s natural you feel a ‘need’ to upgrade.

I was in the same position - using it became something that, for the first Mac I owned, I didn’t look forward to. It got hot just from browsing the web, the keyboard was absolute trash, the screen got fingerprints on it from the keyboard just from having the lid closed, only four USB-C ports, the Touch Bar had no benefits to me…

I now own the 14-inch and it’s the best Mac I’ve ever owned, and can’t wait to see what Apple comes up with in years to come with their renewed focus on functionality.

 

[nvmls]

That keyboard was an aberration indeed, on the plus side, at least you don't carry a notch.

 

[v0lume4]

Nope, never. I used my last MacBook for 12 years, the last few years all being on an "out-of-date" macOS version. Take that, Tim Apple.

 

[brandoman]

Sorry, but your MBP had a terrible keyboard.