Anyone going to buy a current Mac Pro?

[cobie8]

"cool" depreciates a lot quicker in value than "utility and function"

Pro users pay a premium for power especially on a mac and they expect to get lasting value & flexibility out of that purchase. Bricking the graphics, dropping down the number of cpus and making all expandability a more costly and speed choking external only option are all things that reduce the life & flexibility of the product and therefore its value.

I don't see this new Mac Pro doing well at all. Most loyal Mac Pro owners seem to be holding on to what they have, buying old and planning to wait this out. Even if I liked the new mac pro (which obviously I don't) and wanted to buy it, I don't think I'd risk my money on this new design with the bugs I'm sure it'll have. The price will likely be as high or higher than previous Mac Pros so I don't think they are expanding its accessibility in that regard.

If in reality this is the only new Mac Pro we will be dealing with for the foreseeable future I think Apple has just fragmented their mac pro market more than anything else - provided none of the issues I mentioned are somehow addressed in future versions of it.

i completely agree. i hate the fact that apple is turning expensive machines such as these into "disposable" computing machines. virtually their entire product line has become "disposable", and look at what's happened to their stock.

i just don't think $2.5k is disposable. $299 might be (such as an ipad mini) but i'd expect a $2.5k machine to keep its value longer than four years at least.

this is the last draw from apple in my opinion. it's come to a point where i don't even recommend apple portables anymore. it's all about cost vs value, and these days, "cool" depreciates a lot quicker than "utility and function". apple must realize this, and i hope jon ive realizes this too. otherwise, their stock will just continue to sink.

im hanging on to my MP and remaining MBPs (v8,2 & 9,2). even thinking about getting another macpro5,1 before they run out of the dual-socket options, specially if i can stick newer CPUs in it in a couple of years.

 

[Michaelgtrusa]

The New Mac Pro

A great article from Kickingbear. http://kickingbear.com/blog/archives/349

 

[tamvly]

Yup, I'm considering buying a hex core. My 3,1 MP still works relatively OK, but I'm stuck with a ancient ATI 2600 video card and no inexpensive way to upgrade beyond the 12 GB, two SSDs and a couple of Caviar Black HDDs.

I have a bit of a credit at the Apple Store, which makes the normal $3K purchase price a bit more tolerable. Plus, I think I can get at least $1K for my current machine. Memory is much more reasonable.

I tend to think of the new MP as an xMac. But workstation or not, I don't need the processor power. And the lack of $$$ details and tech path to attaching two Dual DVI monitors and the four disks makes me think the 5,1 would be a good solution for at least a few years - time for the new MP and third party TB products to mature.

Personally, I would have been happy to have the current form factor with new processors, SATA III, USB 3 and TB, but that's not going to happen.

 

[AtmChm]

Here's one man's perspective (I am a professional photo retoucher)

After seeing the new Garbage Can "Pro" mac (sic) last week...had to weigh consider both potential hardware, software issues and costs for the next 2-3 years.

I ended picking up a mint 1 year old 3.33ghz MP last week and loaded her up with 48GB ram, a 480GB OWC 6G exteme SSD boot drive, 4X4TB SATA black caviar drives.and 2X OWC 480GB PCI accelsior cards. (1 dedicated scratch for PS and one work drive).

My trusty 2x2.26 2009 machine (purchased new) is identically equipped (but 32GB ram of course) and will relegated to a back up machine. It has been well maintained and still runs flawlessly but the 6-core MP is better suited to
my needs.

I routinely work with large PS files (up to 18GB) and my experience with Lion and ML (CS 5.5 and CS6) = Kernel panics galore and frequent Photoshop crashes on any files larger than 2GB or so.

SL 10.6.8 and CS 5.5 are stable, fast, 99% crash free and an absolute joy to work with. (Didn't even know what a "kernel panic" was until I foolishly ventured into the Lion's den.) Thankfully having pristine back ups of my 10.6.8 HD made taking the SSD drive back to the promised land a piece of cake.

I will wait until the new MP has been out for a year or so and let Apple work out the inevitable hardware/software bugs before passing any judgement.

Also holding out hope Mavericks will a more serious and stable OSX for of us who have to depend on our workstations to make a living day in and day out. I know some of you will deride me for not accepting whatever the latest thing Apple serves up, but for now, I'll stick with what works.

I think you are dead on with this. The new MP will be a big gamble - new hardware AND new OS. It's almost certain the new MP will only work with Mavericks, not ML or anything backward. I need to get a new MP to replace a high end iMac I've been using, but just doesn't have the computing power. I'll be going with a new current MP so that I have expandability and can run SL, which is rock solid.

 

[MacMadness]

I think you are dead on with this. The new MP will be a big gamble - new hardware AND new OS. It's almost certain the new MP will only work with Mavericks, not ML or anything backward. I need to get a new MP to replace a high end iMac I've been using, but just doesn't have the computing power. I'll be going with a new current MP so that I have expandability and can run SL, which is rock solid.

@AtmChm
Thank you.
2012 Mac Pros will not run Snow Leopard as there's a firmware issue that will not allow them to go backwards on OS. In fact I believe there's an issue using an older OS than what any Mac ships with.

Some folks have reported being able to run 10.6.8 but I believe there are issues using disk utility should the need arise. That's why I went with the best 2010 MP I could find.

If I am mistaken, Someone please feel free to correct my facts....

 

[macuser453787]

Traditiooooooooooon! Tradition!
La Da Da Di Da Di Da Di Da
Traditiooooooooooon! Tradition! Tradition!

LOL now THAT's funny!!

----------

I think there is a significant third group: those wanting change, but not this particular set of changes.

Ain't that the truth. I reckon I'm in that category, but seeing as how didn't change the MP to our liking, I'll get a 5,1 MP and have a nice set up.

----------

Can't understand why they just didn't plop in USB3.0, Thunderbolt, and the latest Zeon's to the enclosure they already have. Would have made much more sense.

Dig it - my thoughts exactly.

 

[macuser453787]

Pro users pay a premium for power especially on a mac and they expect to get lasting value & flexibility out of that purchase. Bricking the graphics, dropping down the number of cpus and making all expandability a more costly and speed choking external only option are all things that reduce the life & flexibility of the product and therefore its value.

I kinda feel the same way - it doesn't make sense that they would change it this radically.

Most loyal Mac Pro owners seem to be holding on to what they have, buying old and planning to wait this out.

I'm a loyal Mac user and have been wanting an MP for a while now, but held off because of the promised new model this year, as many others did.

If in reality this is the only new Mac Pro we will be dealing with for the foreseeable future I think Apple has just fragmented their mac pro market more than anything else

Does it seem odd to anyone else that Apple has done this? Surely they knew that the MP community on the whole would not do well with the new design. Again, I agree that key things like the processor upgrade, SATA III, USB 3, PCIe 3.0 and TB in the existing case (or even a slightly cosmetically modified case) would have been just about right, and maybe even what most of us were hoping for...?

 

[monkeybagel]

@AtmChm
Thank you.
2012 Mac Pros will not run Snow Leopard as there's a firmware issue that will not allow them to go backwards on OS. In fact I believe there's an issue using an older OS than what any Mac ships with.

Some folks have reported being able to run 10.6.8 but I believe there are issues using disk utility should the need arise. That's why I went with the best 2010 MP I could find.

If I am mistaken, Someone please feel free to correct my facts....

This is false.

2012 Mac Pro will run 10.6.5+ fine.

 

[brand]

Surely they knew that the MP community on the whole would not do well with the new design.

Thats yet to be seen. Just because you do not like it does not mean the the community on the whole does not like it. The community on the whole will speak for themselves after it is released in the form of sales figures. The device has not even been released yet and you are passing judgment.

 

[Macsonic]

I think you are dead on with this. The new MP will be a big gamble - new hardware AND new OS. It's almost certain the new MP will only work with Mavericks, not ML or anything backward. I need to get a new MP to replace a high end iMac I've been using, but just doesn't have the computing power. I'll be going with a new current MP so that I have expandability and can run SL, which is rock solid.

@AtmChm
Thank you.
2012 Mac Pros will not run Snow Leopard as there's a firmware issue that will not allow them to go backwards on OS. In fact I believe there's an issue using an older OS than what any Mac ships with.

Some folks have reported being able to run 10.6.8 but I believe there are issues using disk utility should the need arise. That's why I went with the best 2010 MP I could find.

If I am mistaken, Someone please feel free to correct my facts....

Hi AtmChm and MacMadness. I have a 2012 Mac Pro that came with Mountain Lion 10.8.2. I inserted another hard drive that was formatted as Snow Leopard 10.6.8 and booted up and ran fine. Works fine with no problems. The SL hard drive was formatted from a different Mac Pro machine which is my 2008 Mac Pro. I heard that for SL to run on a 2012 Mac Pro the OS version should not be lower than 10.6.8.

 

[barmann]

Yup, I'm considering buying a hex core. My 3,1 MP still works relatively OK, but I'm stuck with a ancient ATI 2600 video card and no inexpensive way to upgrade beyond the 12 GB, two SSDs and a couple of Caviar Black HDDs.

I'm in exactly the same position, with a very similar MP 3.1 .

The 3.1 looked fine till the 6.1 was announced, and moving from one MP to the newer one got more demanding, and less predictable than it's been the past few years .

Now I need to figure what to do until getting one of the new MPs in Rev B or so .

A much needed Ram upgrade (12-24GB), and a GPU upgrade (8800GT to 5770) , will set me back about 600 Euros .
I like tinkering, but for my workstation I'd rather get only the officially supported components, so no hacked stuff for me .

That's not much less than the MP 3.1 resale value, even considering the upgrades, for a computer that's been running constantly for 5 years and might go belly up at any time .

Or, sell the 3.1, buy a 2012 MP 5.1 with some Applecare left on it .

That's what, 700ish for my MP 3.1; 2.5k - 3k , for a used 3.33 Hex or 2.93 Octo (incl. decent GPU, 32GB Ram) to get a bit of a performance gain ?

Decissions, decissions ...

 

[JesterJJZ]

I'm still rockin' my 1.1.

Not sold on the new design. Definitely don't want to be a guinea pig on it either. Waiting another year or more for rev B isn't an option anymore. Probably springing for the current model in the next few weeks.

 

[snarfquest]

I want a "MAC" Pro or otherwise that I can:

#1 - upgrade the video card in to suite my needs and upgrade as time marches on.
#2 - have plenty of internal storage and not have a clutter of external junk on my desk.
#3 - have the ability to upgrade CPUs at least once in its' lifespan.

I use a MacPro3,1 now with 16GB RAM, 2x2.8 Quad Core Xeon, Radeon HD 7970 3GB. It has and still is serving me very well. It just seems my upgrade path is Hackintosh rather then something offered from Apple. I refuse to use Windows.. Hate it with a passion!

 

[MacMadness]

Hi AtmChm and MacMadness. I have a 2012 Mac Pro that came with Mountain Lion 10.8.2. I inserted another hard drive that was formatted as Snow Leopard 10.6.8 and booted up and ran fine. Works fine with no problems. The SL hard drive was formatted from a different Mac Pro machine which is my 2008 Mac Pro. I heard that for SL to run on a 2012 Mac Pro the OS version should not be lower than 10.6.8.

@Macsonic-

Thanks for the useful information.

I went round and round for 3 months when I wanted to upgrade to a new 2012 MP 5.1earlier this year. I was told by 3 different people at Apple (visa phone, a "genuis" at the store and a tech at my authorized repair center that 10.6.8 would NOT run reliably on it.

What do you use as a "boot disc" if you need to run utilities. (Did you make a
clone copy of the OSX with the 10.6.8 on a DVD or USB stick?)

 

[FastEddy]

Best bet for those of us on the continuous upgrade bandwagon: Spend this years budget on better monitors, fresh keyboards & mice, accessories, etc.

Best bet for gamers: Get a discounted 'Pro somehow, some way, upgrade the video to the gamer's latest choice and keep 'em flyin'.

Best bet for the strapped: Add RAM, add PCIe cards, upgrade the OS as needed ... "Wait 'till next year".

A few of us who just absolutely have to have the latest and greatest for our biz: That new puppy will co-process across the T'Bolt ports. Order the newest, lash it together with your other hot rods and ... to render that CGI. Even a stack of Mac Minis can do it!

 

[Macsonic]

@Macsonic-

Thanks for the useful information.

I went round and round for 3 months when I wanted to upgrade to a new 2012 MP 5.1earlier this year. I was told by 3 different people at Apple (visa phone, a "genuis" at the store and a tech at my authorized repair center that 10.6.8 would NOT run reliably on it.

What do you use as a "boot disc" if you need to run utilities. (Did you make a
clone copy of the OSX with the 10.6.8 on a DVD or USB stick?)

Hi MacMadness. Hope you're enjoying the weekend. I was also told by different Mac technicians that Snow Leopard would not run in a 2012 Mac Pro that came with Mountain Lion. I did not clone my DVD installer or used a flash USB drive. I also have a Mid 2010 5,1 Mac Pro that originally came with Snow Leopard and with an install DVD having Snow Leopard 10.6.4 version. I then transferred the boot HD with SL 10.6.8 FROM my Mid 2010 Mac Pro and loaded that HD to my 2012 Mac Pro. Take note I still have the main boot HD with Mountain Lion in my 2012 Mac Pro. And I was able to boot and run Snow Leopard to my 2012 Mac Pro. One techician told me , to make SL work in a 2012 Mac Pro, you must ALSO have Mountain Lion bootable drive in another hard drive. I have not tried like just having the SL boot drive installed without the Mountain Lion boot drive.

I read in another thread in this forum, that to make SL run in a 2012 MP, you must have an original DVD SL installer that came from a Mid 2010 Mac Pro.

Here is a screenshot of the Apple profile with 10.6.8 SL on a 2012 Mac Pro

This is also why internal storage is important to me ( this is in my case, I know others can do without internal storage ) Whenever a new OS is released, you have a back up of the previous OS to go back to if there are glitches in the new OS. Thanks

 

[clamnectar]

Image

Your startup disk is called MASTERBT. You are a MASTERBTR.

 

[MacMadness]

I also have a Mid 2010 5,1 Mac Pro that originally came with Snow Leopard and with an install DVD having Snow Leopard 10.6.4 version.

@Macsonic

More great info. Hope you're havng a great weekend a well.
I'm stuck working this weekend, but always great to be busy.

I forgot about that 10.6.4 wrinkle in my earlier post. You have the "magic OSX 10.6.4"disc to use Disc utility from booting from the DVD. Apparently the retail "10.6.3" disc won't do the trick if the the MP shipped with the later version. (And there are several different build versions which make it even trickier)

But my guess is if you have a bootable OS X 10.6.8 on a DVD, USB or back up external clone drive, you'd be able to use them to run utilities on the HD/SSD for routine maintenance/repairs on a 2012 machine.

Thanks again for the info. I'm sure it will be extremely helpful for many folks here who plan on extending the life of current MP's and would prefer to run Snow Leopard.

 

[macuser453787]

Thats yet to be seen. Just because you do not like it does not mean the the community on the whole does not like it. The community on the whole will speak for themselves after it is released in the form of sales figures. The device has not even been released yet and you are passing judgment.

Ease up, chief. It was not my intent to pass judgment. I made that statement based on several other posts that I read just prior to posting that remark, and the general sentiment--more often than not--seemed to be what I was trying to describe. Ergo, the community on the whole, of which the members of this forum can be reasonably considered a representative sample. I'm well aware that people can and will speak for themselves.

 

[AtmChm]

I also have a Mid 2010 5,1 Mac Pro that originally came with Snow Leopard and with an install DVD having Snow Leopard 10.6.4 version.

@Macsonic

More great info. Hope you're havng a great weekend a well.
I'm stuck working this weekend, but always great to be busy.

I forgot about that 10.6.4 wrinkle in my earlier post. You have the "magic OSX 10.6.4"disc to use Disc utility from booting from the DVD. Apparently the retail "10.6.3" disc won't do the trick if the the MP shipped with the later version. (And there are several different build versions which make it even trickier)

But my guess is if you have a bootable OS X 10.6.8 on a DVD, USB or back up external clone drive, you'd be able to use them to run utilities on the HD/SSD for routine maintenance/repairs on a 2012 machine.

Thanks again for the info. I'm sure it will be extremely helpful for many folks here who plan on extending the life of current MP's and would prefer to run Snow Leopard.

I too have a 2012 Mac Pro. Got one after they came out last summer. Bought an OWC SSD. I can't recall now if I set up the SSD before hand, but I too used a 10.6.4 mac pro install DVD I had from a mac pro I bought in early 2011. Everything works like a charm and I have had no issues whatsoever with that Mac Pro. I actually use the original HDD with 10.8 on it as the Time Machine volume. I plan to use the same process when I get a new mac pro in the next few months.

 

[MacMadness]

I too have a 2012 Mac Pro. Got one after they came out last summer. Bought an OWC SSD. I can't recall now if I set up the SSD before hand, but I too used a 10.6.4 mac pro install DVD I had from a mac pro I bought in early 2011. Everything works like a charm and I have had no issues whatsoever with that Mac Pro. I actually use the original HDD with 10.8 on it as the Time Machine volume. I plan to use the same process when I get a new mac pro in the next few months.

I contacted Apple tech support last night and an OSX 10.6.4 disc is on the way.
(My recently 2010 machine did not come with the install discs and it will not boot from a retail 10.6.3 disc)

Thanks again for the info for all those who want to run 10.6.8 on 2012 machines. (Not sure I will need one at this point, as my soon-to-be upgraded 2x 2.93 8-core stuffed with 96GB ram and the 2010 3.33Ghz MP should be hopefully enough to get though the next 3-4 years. By then we should all know for certain whether the nex-gen MP's/OS X's are worthwhile purchases.

Cheers.

 

[MattDSLR]

No drive in this mac
so no wat of recording or playing blue rays
why have 4k support?
will this pro las as long as a cube, or much shorter

 

[ValSalva]

I've got a 2010 Hexacore Mac Pro and so luckily am not in the market for the first iteration of the new Mac Pro. I'd be a little nervous buying version one of this new computer. I know Apple does a lot of R&D but there are going to be issues in real world situations.

 

[Belly-laughs]

next door company is moving out. by chance i passed the electronics recycling bin and saw a cheese grater among the pcs they'd thrown out. took it out, hooked it up – it was still fully functional! 8 core 2.8 with 6gb ram and 3x1tb disks, early 2008 i believe. even managed to save a pristine matte 23" cinema hd they were going to bin. i'll be sticking with this scratched up puppy for a while. perhaps until i find the new bin in a bin…

 

[BJonson]

next door company is moving out. by chance i passed the electronics recycling bin and saw a cheese grater among the pcs they'd thrown out. took it out, hooked it up – it was still fully functional! 8 core 2.8 with 6gb ram and 3x1tb disks, early 2008 i believe. even managed to save a pristine matte 23" cinema hd they were going to bin. i'll be sticking with this scratched up puppy for a while. perhaps until i find the new bin in a bin…

Ka Ching!