Apple Demands Microsoft Pull Laptop Hunter Ads

[LagunaSol]

Section 1 of the Sherman Anti-Trust Act states, "Every contract, combination in the form of trust or otherwise, or conspiracy, in restraint of trade or commerce among the several States, or with foreign nations, is declared to be illegal".

I hate to burst your bubble, but OS X is not a civil right. Apple has every right to restrict their software to their hardware. Your misinterpretation of the law is irrelevant - but justify it all you want if it helps you sleep at night.

The market will decide this issue.

And based on their quarterly report today, I think the market is deciding in Apple's favor.

 

[Goona]

Yeah Apple really called with their record number Mac sales and profits, these guys must think we are little kids..

 

[polaris20]

Why would Apple have to worry about the ZuneHD? It doesn't have the app store like the iPod Touch, and is more of a media device than a full-on PDA replacement/pocket computer that the Touch is. Besides, a new one will be out in Sept/Oct that leapfrogs anything the HD offers.

As for Windows 7: it is a fantastic OS, but I don't see it actually causing the Mac OS market to shrink. I like it, but I won't be formatting my MBP and installing 7 in it's place. Plus comparing 7 to Leopard and Ubuntu on same hardware it's still slower for the heavy engineering computations we do. Snow Leopard should be even faster. Your mileage may vary, of course.

Still, it'll be nice to get 7 on all the new machines coming in. We bypassed Vista entirely (save a couple machines) and XP is getting long in the tooth.

 

[Goona]

Forget the Zune HD, it won't do jack but make a whole lot of noise like first Zune did. People said people will dump their iPods for Zunes wen it was first announced, but it didn't happen. Meanwhile the Zunes are losing money for Microsoft. The iPod touch was announced in 2007 and Microsoft is announcing the Zune HD 2 years later, what compelling feaure is going to drag iPod users away? Last time around it was te squirt feature, we all saw how well that worked. Even the Palm Pre bought more to the table against the iPhone but Apple keeps reporting report quarters and number of iPhones sold. The Zune HD will barely be a blip on Apple's radar.

 

[celtikmind]

Lot of childish gibberish

Oh, Laguna, how you have fallen from grace since I was here last...

 

[ilovefanboyz]

Apple lowered their prices. Clearly they were affected by the commercial. Or was it a coincidence?

Isnt it 30 PC's sold for every 1 Mac worldwide? That sounds like the majority speaking to me

 

[pdjudd]

Yeah Apple really called with their record number Mac sales and profits, these guys must think we are little kids..

I think it's fairly obvious that any communications between Apple and Microsoft where the intent is for one company to demand the other company terminate a certain action done by that company it is not done by a phone call from the legal department. It is done by a messenger, certified mail, or a serving of a cease and desist order so that there is a record that the second party received said C&D.

In other words, the whole thing sounds like Ballmer dung. Made up. Apple would never do something to acknowledge that MS' ad's were having an affect on their sales. That goes double from what we learned about Apple's sales last quarter. I am gonna need proof before we can this is anything but garbage.

 

[iEdd]

Apple lowered their prices. Clearly they were affected by the commercial. Or was it a coincidence?

Coincidence. Production economics - the CNC machines that make the unibody cases are starting to pay for themselves, so they can afford to lower the prices while maintaining profit margins.

Microsoft's ads might've helped mac sales a bit to cause this[*], so maybe the prices were indirectly lowered due to the commercial. Certainly not directly though - everyone knows Macs cost more, what they might not have known is they have shiny new cases.


[*]Though I highly doubt the ads affected sales at all. Everyone knows macs cost more. Those that think macs are overpriced crap won't change and those that think macs are worth the extra cost won't change because of the ad.

 

[Goona]

Apple lowered their prices. Clearly they were affected by the commercial. Or was it a coincidence?

Isnt it 30 PC's sold for every 1 Mac worldwide? That sounds like the majority speaking to me

Yeah this is the first time Apple has lowered prices for Macs.

 

[Goona]

Instead of worrying about their falling sales and profits, they are more interested in Apple:

http://www.engadget.com/2009/07/23/microsoft-sees-first-annual-sales-decline-in-its-history-for-fis/

 

[DiamondMac]

Apple lowered their prices. Clearly they were affected by the commercial.

Only helps Apple with sales so I am fine with it.

 

[mosx]

The best "Apple" for under $2k has 4GB memory.

Ad says 2GB memory.

And, again, there are plenty of Apple notebooks under $2,000 with only 2GB of memory. In fact, I see five of them.

Theres also three products that only ship with 160GB of HDD space or less.

And to be honest, it really doesn't matter how much memory you throw in that MacBook Pro when its still only shipping with a 256MB GeForce 9600M GT at $1,999. You have to go under $500 in the PC world to get that kind of a weak GPU.

I dunno, the vibe I get from the ad is a screaming "I want the Mac, but it is too expensive so I will dump all my previous criteria and get this PC". Seems to just reinforce the fact that it is a luxury item rather than damage the brand.

And what "previous criteria" would that be? Considering that all of the people in the ads so far have ended up with exactly what they wanted (like a 17" system for $700) or systems that were far more fully featured than Macs and offer standard features that Apple does not.

For all every single ad featured so far, every single shopper would have had to give up what they wanted in order to get a Mac. The people in these ads so far have gotten things that would have cost them 2-3x as much, on average, with a Mac, or they've gotten features that simply do not exist on a Mac, like blu-ray, powerful GPUs, proper HDMI with audio support.

When you say "luxury item", you are NOT describing a Mac. "Luxury items" have features and build quality that standard items do not. Macs are missing boatloads of features compared to PCs, the OS isn't as good as Windows, nor as capable, and the build quality is certainly not up there with what you get in a PC. Its that simple.

First, my MBP plays L4D just fine, for the times I actually have time to play a game (this laptop is for real work, not watching movies and video games)

L4D is a game built on a 5 year old engine with advanced lighting tacked on. Thats nothing anything to be impressed with.

Let's compare any of the MacBook Pros to any of the Asus, MSI, Gateway, and other PC notebooks out there that ship with GeForce GT 220, GeForce 9800M GS, etc. for $1200 and below. Let's compare the MacBook Pros to those systems while running GTA4 on all of them.

Thats fine you don't use your MBP for games or movies. It's not quite capable of it anyway, if you're not running Windows natively. You seem to forget, however, that there are more movie lovers and game players out there than there are Mac owners. These things are more important to some people than the vanity of owning a Mac.

Second, Macs are a good value to those who like their workflow and stability.

Workflow? You mean the workflow that gets slowed down because of the ridiculous single menubar, the malfunctioning alt-tab (sorry, command tab) functionality, not to mention the OSes ability to be brought down crashing by any number of apps, including (and especially) Safari?

Yeah, smooth workflow and stability do not exist on OS X. OS X is all about adding to the vanity of the computer.

You apparently are once again having a tough time separating fact vs opinion again; do I need to link the definitions again?

Do I need to link you to all of the debates you've lost and run away from?

However for me, being able to interface seemlessly with the Linux workstations and servers while still having MS Office open, as well as RDPing into Windows machines and running VMWare for testing is just too convenient.

Because none of that can be done on Windows.

Did you sell your MB yet?

Nope. The girl that was supposed to buy it, a life long Mac user, saw me playing with a Dell Studio XPS 13 with dual GPUs and Windows 7 RC1. She loved it. After a couple of hours of using it she wondered why she had stuck with Macs for all the years and promptly used her dying MacBook to order one from the Dell website. So I still have my uMB. However, it's running Windows 7 as its primary OS

 

[LagunaSol]

The girl that was supposed to buy it, a life long Mac user, saw me playing with a Dell Studio XPS 13 with dual GPUs and Windows 7 RC1. She loved it. After a couple of hours of using it she wondered why she had stuck with Macs for all the years and promptly used her dying MacBook to order one from the Dell website.

Uh huh.

 

[iEdd]

And, again, there are plenty of Apple notebooks under $2,000 with only 2GB of memory. In fact, I see five of them.

Again?

"BEST" is the key word here. In the context of memory, the best has the most, and it is 4GB. The other Macs are significantly less than $2000 with only 2GB, so yes, they are less than $2000, but they are not all the "best".

There are not _five_ *best* notebooks. There is one, and it is obvious in the context of the ad that "under $2000" means "$1999" or really close to $2000, otherwise it's not a significant point.

The point of the ad is saying: You have to spend over $2000 to get a mac with more than 2GB RAM. i.e. You are breaking the $2k budget to get more RAM, which simply isn't true anymore (and has apparently been fixed by Microsoft).

Whether or not you think Macs are poor value has nothing to do with whether or not there is false advertising. Microsoft understand this.

 

[NoSmokingBandit]

Instead of worrying about their falling sales and profits, they are more interested in Apple:

http://www.engadget.com/2009/07/23/microsoft-sees-first-annual-sales-decline-in-its-history-for-fis/

A lot of people are holding out for 7. This fall/winter will probably make up for it.

 

[charlituna]

Apple lowered their prices. Clearly they were affected by the commercial. Or was it a coincidence?

I would suspect more coincidence than the ads. If you look at Apple's history for the last few years, they typically revamps the laptops in the fall right after the Back to School ends. they kept the same price but bump the specs. this has probably pissed off some parents who just dropped $1500 or so and now 3 weeks later (and a week after they can return the old one with no issues) there's a better system

THAT combined with the general economy (and more than one complaint about cutting firewire from the 13 inch models) is more likely what provoked the respec and price drop plus the timing.

 

[mosx]

Again?

"BEST" is the key word here. In the context of memory, the best has the most, and it is 4GB. The other Macs are significantly less than $2000 with only 2GB, so yes, they are less than $2000, but they are not all the "best".

There are not _five_ *best* notebooks. There is one, and it is obvious in the context of the ad that "under $2000" means "$1999" or really close to $2000, otherwise it's not a significant point.

The point of the ad is saying: You have to spend over $2000 to get a mac with more than 2GB RAM. i.e. You are breaking the $2k budget to get more RAM, which simply isn't true anymore (and has apparently been fixed by Microsoft).

Whether or not you think Macs are poor value has nothing to do with whether or not there is false advertising. Microsoft understand this.

"Best" is a subjective term in some cases. To her, the MacBook Air could have been "the best".

Anyway, the $1999 MacBook Pro can't even be described as "best", considering it comes with a GPU thats so low on video memory and so weak that you get better by spending $700 on a notebook PC.

 

[polaris20]

Thats fine you don't use your MBP for games or movies. It's not quite capable of it anyway, if you're not running Windows natively. You seem to forget, however, that there are more movie lovers and game players out there than there are Mac owners. These things are more important to some people than the vanity of owning a Mac.

I'm a movie lover too, which is why I have a 52" HDTV to watch movies on, not a laptop.

Workflow? You mean the workflow that gets slowed down because of the ridiculous single menubar, the malfunctioning alt-tab (sorry, command tab) functionality, not to mention the OSes ability to be brought down crashing by any number of apps, including (and especially) Safari?

Yeah, smooth workflow and stability do not exist on OS X. OS X is all about adding to the vanity of the computer.

You might want to get your computer checked out; I have none of these problems.

Stability exists just fine on my Mac and the Macs I support. Again, you see seem to have a rough time discerning personal anecdotes and fact. Just because you don't like it doesn't mean there's something wrong with it.

Do I need to link you to all of the debates you've lost and run away from?

You mean the debates in which you've provided no proof, but all personal anecdotes or opinions? Then whined to the moderators because people were "picking on you"? Waaaa, waaaaa, waaaaa.

All this from a guy that can't even say what industry he works in when asked to back up anything he says.....to provide one shred of credibility. It's like arguing with a child.

Also funny how it takes you 5 days to respond to my post, and I'm the one that runs away? Also you conveniently ignore everything positive I've said about Win7 in the thread arguing with LagunaSol, and choose just that one post? Wow, you must be stalking me! I'm flattered, I think.

Because none of that can be done on Windows.

When did Windows get the ability to do X session forwards natively? And yes, the rest works fine on Windows (though VMWare Workstation sucks on Windows, IMO). In case you're having a tough time with reading comprehension again, I have no major issues with Windows, particularly 7, which I quite like. I use that on my Thinkpad (please see sig, in case you missed that for the umpteenth time). I prefer OS X as my main machine because it works well for me. It does the same for many other people. It's a shame you don't have the ability to understand this, and just leave it alone.

Nope. The girl that was supposed to buy it, a life long Mac user, saw me playing with a Dell Studio XPS 13 with dual GPUs and Windows 7 RC1. She loved it. After a couple of hours of using it she wondered why she had stuck with Macs for all the years and promptly used her dying MacBook to order one from the Dell website. So I still have my uMB. However, it's running Windows 7 as its primary OS

I guess we'll be blessed with your trolling for awhile then, huh? I think what really happened is the "girl" you were going to sell the laptop from never existed, and you just love coming here and trolling.

"Best" is a subjective term in some cases. To her, the MacBook Air could have been "the best".

You're the last person I'd figure would understand what subjectivity is, when you continue to troll a Mac-centric forums with your MS fanboyism.

 

[LagunaSol]

You're the last person I'd figure would understand what subjectivity is, when you continue to troll a Mac-centric forums with your MS fanboyism.

I suggest adding mosx to your ignore list, as I'm doing now. Seriously, the inane Mac bashing on this forum has gotten out of control. This is a Mac users forum. These trolls have plenty of places on the Internet to spew their anti-Apple hatred. MacRumors shouldn't be one of them. It's pathetic that every thread devolves into a Windows vs. Mac war when the preference of the readers of this site is clear.

I'm going to start using my ignore function more liberally. Please feel free to join me. Time to squelch these moronic griefers by stuffing a virtual sock in their virtual pie holes.

 

[polaris20]

"Best" is a subjective term in some cases. To her, the MacBook Air could have been "the best".

Anyway, the $1999 MacBook Pro can't even be described as "best", considering it comes with a GPU thats so low on video memory and so weak that you get better by spending $700 on a notebook PC.

Unless you have no need for anything greater than a 9400m or 9600m, and prefer the Mac with OSX. Again, why is it so hard for you to comprehend that many people prefer Macs? Why?

The 15" MBP for $2000 is the best laptop FOR ME. I'm not trying to talk other people into buying one; I couldn't care less what computer someone buys.

Why do you care so much to slag Macs here? It's mind boggling. You're either a troll or someone that's somehow been emotionally damaged by Apple and now feels the need to act as some sort of MS evangelist on a Mac forum. I just can't figure out if it's funny or sad.

 

[polaris20]

I suggest adding mosx to your ignore list, as I'm doing now. Seriously, the inane Mac bashing on this forum has gotten out of control. This is a Mac users forum. These trolls have plenty of places on the Internet to spew their anti-Apple hatred. MacRumors shouldn't be one of them. It's pathetic that every thread devolves into a Windows vs. Mac war when the preference of the readers of this site is clear.

I'm going to start using my ignore function more liberally. Please feel free to join me. Time to squelch these moronic griefers by stuffing a virtual sock in their virtual pie holes.

As much as you and I disagree Laguna, you're right on this one. I just can't help it though; it's like a trainwreck of text that I have to read.

 

[Eidorian]

I suggest adding mosx to your ignore list, as I'm doing now. Seriously, the inane Mac bashing on this forum has gotten out of control. This is a Mac users forum. These trolls have plenty of places on the Internet to spew their anti-Apple hatred. MacRumors shouldn't be one of them. It's pathetic that every thread devolves into a Windows vs. Mac war when the preference of the readers of this site is clear.

I'm going to start using my ignore function more liberally. Please feel free to join me. Time to squelch these moronic griefers by stuffing a virtual sock in their virtual pie holes.

I've tried using the ignore list but you usually end up reading their posts anyways. It just makes it more annoying to do it.

 

[LagunaSol]

I just can't help it though; it's like a trainwreck of text that I have to read.

Yeah, it used to be slightly entertaining, until the overwhelming number of griefers turned this forum into a junkyard full of trainwrecks.

Many of these tools have joined in the last couple of months. Coordinated astroturfing campaign? You decide.

 

[polaris20]

I've tried using the ignore list but you usually end up reading their posts anyways. It just makes it more annoying to do it.

Yeah, I ignored him before, but ignoring here is like seeing the smoke from the trainwreck, but not the actual wreck. You end up walking over the hill to see the mess anyways. Still, I think I'll try it again.

 

[LagunaSol]

I've tried using the ignore list but you usually end up reading their posts anyways. It just makes it more annoying to do it.

True. MacRumors seriously needs to revamp their ignore/block functionality. Just don't post their name in the thread at all - that's what I'd like to see (along with a quicker/easier way to block the user).

Sadly, I still have to see their nonsense when someone else replies to them and it shows up in my email on threads I've subscribed to.