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Apple Made Me Buy a Windows HP Workstation
- Thread starter Mark Holmes
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Apple used great products like the original Mac Pro's to get its foot in the door. It made professionals recommend Apple products to all sorts of people. Now that Apple have the popularity they are focusing on making as much money as possible which means selling products like iPads and iPhones due to the amount they can sell. Apple have forgotten what made them successful to start with and this can only end one way. In due time Apple will slowly decline unless they change their ways. We have seen other large popular companies share a similar fate. No company is invincible.
In all honesty, you can see where Apple is as a company; just by sales figures alone, you can see they are a mobile phone company (that also makes larger versions of their mobile phone, as well as computers that are slowly becoming even larger versions of their mobile phone.)
Dominant forces in technology usually last 10-15 years, if they're lucky, before being out-shined and outpaced by the new dominant force, and Apple is now past their peak, and I strongly believe on a steady slope downwards. You can easily see the iPhone following the decline of Blackberry's entire mobile line.
As for computers, no one thinks "Apple" for the latest and greatest computer anymore. Back in the days of the G5, original Macbook, and Mac Pro, those computers were so much of a better experience, it was a no-brainer.
The rate at which users are dropping Apple is not tremendous, but it is substantial enough to pay attention to, and Apple has really come to a halt in innovation. I think it's safe to say within 10 years Apple's mobile arm of the company will be as Blackberry is today, and maybe, just maybe they'll make a move towards the computer market again. But seeing as their entire computer lineup is such a tiny portion of their revenue, it's not likely in the very near future.
Dominant forces in technology usually last 10-15 years, if they're lucky, before being out-shined and outpaced by the new dominant force, and Apple is now past their peak, and I strongly believe on a steady slope downwards. You can easily see the iPhone following the decline of Blackberry's entire mobile line.
As for computers, no one thinks "Apple" for the latest and greatest computer anymore. Back in the days of the G5, original Macbook, and Mac Pro, those computers were so much of a better experience, it was a no-brainer.
The rate at which users are dropping Apple is not tremendous, but it is substantial enough to pay attention to, and Apple has really come to a halt in innovation. I think it's safe to say within 10 years Apple's mobile arm of the company will be as Blackberry is today, and maybe, just maybe they'll make a move towards the computer market again. But seeing as their entire computer lineup is such a tiny portion of their revenue, it's not likely in the very near future.
My purchase history predicted that I would have bought a new system in 2014. The specs I wanted: retina 21.5" iMac with just an iGPU. (I have no need for a fast dGPU nor do I want a large screen.) I predicted that retina would trickle up to the small screen first... Well that didn't happen! Apple has now released the machine I wanted in 2014 - but it was obsolete the day it was released. Broadwell when Skylake is coming out? (OK - Intel's fault, they've yet to release a matching Skylake.) And where's the USB-C? And 16GB max?
My alternate desired machine: Base MacPro with a ~21" retina (4K) display. Such displays are now starting to trickle out from other vendors, ... but now the nMP is obsolete.
The result: I still haven't bought anything.
I've lived through this stagnation before: In the mid '90's. In 1994 I wished for a machine with certain specs that I expected would be released RealSoonNow. It took Apple till '97 to release the machine I wanted. By then I wasn't paying attention.
I am old and becoming a Luddite faster than I had hoped.
I agree with you that a real computer is still a necessity but that seems to imply that a 'real computer' must have the latest specifications. If Toy Story was developed 20 years ago, I can sure hope to do similarly demanding work on a four year old Mac.
I don't need to make a full length animated feature film and neither, I suspect, do most MR forum members. Prosumers already have access to the tech they need to do their work and they are a really small proportion of Apple's customer base.
A successful company needs have 'purpose' and an obsessive focus on the direction they wish to travel in. Apple have this in spades. They haven't forgotten about prosumers, they are moving towards more lucrative markets.
I think the majority of the workstation class of Mac Pro users will move to Windows or other platforms. While I think Windows 10 is an okay operating system, I do not like the "*-as-a-Service" bandwagon they are jumping on. I will probably continue to use Windows 7 or 8.1 Enterprise for production use until Microsoft offers a more privacy-conscious option. I do think the current Mac Pro that I have, a 2012 12 core will be my last Apple desktop computer. They are simply not offering anything I am interested in at the moment, and I don't see them doing so. The single port on my the new MacBook was a letdown for me, and if the rumors are true about the iPhone no longer offering a 3.5mm headphone jack, I will certainly avoid that device. Perhaps an iPhone SE will continue to have an "outdated" or "uncool" 3.5mm headphone jack.
Not a fan of the 21.5" iMac, that would have been an option until they started limiting the upgradable RAM. Omitting obvious beneficial features to become the most thinnest and most sexy device is not the product design I am looking for.
Not a fan of the 21.5" iMac, that would have been an option until they started limiting the upgradable RAM. Omitting obvious beneficial features to become the most thinnest and most sexy device is not the product design I am looking for.
You don't need to use a Microsoft account with Windows 10, and in Settings -> Privacy most of the telemetry can be disabled.
http://windowssecrets.com/forums/sh...ing-Windows-10?p=984347&viewfull=1#post984347
Windows 8.1 Enterprise makes me cringe when I have to go back to it, and Windows 7 will be getting long in the tooth. Windows 7 also has a 192 GiB RAM limit, Windows 10 supports 2 TiB.
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A little side note on "working" with computers or "professional" use.
Every time I need to concentrate and finish something important I need at least the following.
- Sitting at a desk with an office chair and a monitor in front of me.
- Using a mouse and keyboard that I can move to have a comfortable working position
- Probably a wired network connection to have a non-shared, reliable data transfer
- A large enough display (not resolution) to arrange what I need in front of me
All this talk about mobility and great portable hardware is 80% just to show off how advanced technology has become.
Maybe I'm really getting old, but to get stuff done I need a working environment that enables me to get the job done.
This is true wether I'm writing documentation, do some programming or setting up some remote servers.
What I want to say is that, regardless of what future Apple innovations might come out, I need a workplace with appropriate hardware. If Apple thinks I'm still living in the PC era, that's fine.
Carrying laptops to meetings and discussing some project related stuff at a cafe is all nice and shiny, but work means something else to me.
I love Apple hardware, but if I'm unable to buy what fits my needs, I look somewhere else.
This is the main reason I will always be looking for a nice workstation type machine.
This is all fine using a macbook, but here's my minimal connectivity:
- Power Supply (I like MagSafe)
- Large display (DP or HDMI, don't care)
- Ethernet for corporate network access. I love WiFi for fun, but most places I work at require ethernet
- USB mouse and keyboard because I usually close the laptop and move stuff on my desk. I hate BT.
- USB to be able to connect my iPhone
- USB or analogue audio to connect a headset if I need to use Skype.
Now you can tell me this is all 199x, but this is how I work. I know a lot of people that do so as well.
If Apple limits its products to minimalistic gadgets I have to switch.
I wrote this because most people assume I complain mostly about recent CPU/GPU and GHz.
No, the above stays true regardless of specs.
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Every time I need to concentrate and finish something important I need at least the following.
- Sitting at a desk with an office chair and a monitor in front of me.
- Using a mouse and keyboard that I can move to have a comfortable working position
- Probably a wired network connection to have a non-shared, reliable data transfer
- A large enough display (not resolution) to arrange what I need in front of me
All this talk about mobility and great portable hardware is 80% just to show off how advanced technology has become.
Maybe I'm really getting old, but to get stuff done I need a working environment that enables me to get the job done.
This is true wether I'm writing documentation, do some programming or setting up some remote servers.
What I want to say is that, regardless of what future Apple innovations might come out, I need a workplace with appropriate hardware. If Apple thinks I'm still living in the PC era, that's fine.
Carrying laptops to meetings and discussing some project related stuff at a cafe is all nice and shiny, but work means something else to me.
I love Apple hardware, but if I'm unable to buy what fits my needs, I look somewhere else.
This is the main reason I will always be looking for a nice workstation type machine.
This is all fine using a macbook, but here's my minimal connectivity:
- Power Supply (I like MagSafe)
- Large display (DP or HDMI, don't care)
- Ethernet for corporate network access. I love WiFi for fun, but most places I work at require ethernet
- USB mouse and keyboard because I usually close the laptop and move stuff on my desk. I hate BT.
- USB to be able to connect my iPhone
- USB or analogue audio to connect a headset if I need to use Skype.
Now you can tell me this is all 199x, but this is how I work. I know a lot of people that do so as well.
If Apple limits its products to minimalistic gadgets I have to switch.
I wrote this because most people assume I complain mostly about recent CPU/GPU and GHz.
No, the above stays true regardless of specs.
[doublepost=1462117542][/doublepost]
Thanks. Made my day
Apple has become a 'let's focus on the wife of the pro users, they do like our gadgets to make a selfie!' company. Apple is dying a very slow and - for the shareholders - very painful death!
Apple is dying a very slow and - for the shareholders - very painful death!
I wouldn't say that. Even with this recent slow quarter, mostly due to the fact that the smartphone/tablet market is reaching maturity, Apple is still an absolute juggernaut. They have enough brains on the payroll, and god knows they have enough money, to weather just about any downturns or changes over the next 20 odd years at least.
With all due respect. This thread was not about the nth "Apple Is Dying" discussion, but the "Why Some Of Us Actively Looking For Alternatives".
I personally do NOT care about Apple and its stock price, I care about availability of choice to let me purchase powerful hardware in 2016. Unfortunately the "Thinner", "Not Upgradable" trend has spread to other vendors as well.
It's not about money. It'a about regretting a purchase because of an inflexible, shiny product that can not be adapted to a certain personal workflow. See my point about desk type workplaces above.
I personally do NOT care about Apple and its stock price, I care about availability of choice to let me purchase powerful hardware in 2016. Unfortunately the "Thinner", "Not Upgradable" trend has spread to other vendors as well.
It's not about money. It'a about regretting a purchase because of an inflexible, shiny product that can not be adapted to a certain personal workflow. See my point about desk type workplaces above.
Yeah, it's pretty easy to admit that they're quickly becoming more of a tech fashion company than a productivity oriented one.
Apple is diversifying, not dying. It's just doing what Samsung and Sony did before it. You can't make specialist markets happy when you do that. That's why the custom hand built PC market has become so popular. None of the major computer makers truly offer a solution that can match what you can do yourself.
So I sold off all those cMP upgrades that were being advocated around here (sorry but they just don't cut the mustard when installed in an old system) and with the same money I built a Skylake workstation. So now I have that next to my barebones 12 core cMP. When I need OSX and 12 cores I use the cMP. Otherwise the Skylake for everything else.
So I sold off all those cMP upgrades that were being advocated around here (sorry but they just don't cut the mustard when installed in an old system) and with the same money I built a Skylake workstation. So now I have that next to my barebones 12 core cMP. When I need OSX and 12 cores I use the cMP. Otherwise the Skylake for everything else.
When I install anything after Windows 7, I is typically in a VM and not connecting the network adapter in the VM makes it not nag to use a Microsoft account. I never do for the most part since my machines are domain joined - unless I need to download something from the Windows store.
I just do not like the harvesting of information that Microsoft has defaulted to. You have to avoid Express Setup prompts at every corner and deselect an unreasonable number of settings in my opinion. These should be opt-in options.
I recall the fight Microsoft had when Windows XP wanted to enable automatic updates, which were a good idea for the majority of users because they were skeptic of what Microsoft was doing behind the scenes. Now a 180° turn Microsoft does indeed collect things that many people would object to if the read the T&C. Windows as a Service gives them the argument of doing this, since the product is free for the majority of users.
Only for this first year. Once October comes along, you'll have to buy it if you want it.
Can't wait for it to turn November, so we can get over it, wanting a Windows 10 upgrade! ))
Cheers
There's already been a major upgrade to Windows 10 (1511).
So, you also refuse to use ITunes, the AppStore, GooglePlay and Chrome, right?
And, even if you accept all of the defaults - in Settings -> Privacy you can turn just about everything off in a few seconds. (Basic "Windows Error Reporting" for OS and app crashes can't be turned off from the GUI.)
You can opt in and out of just about everything, but this idea that MS is harvesting data was being hawked by blogs and news sites because paranoia is fantastic clickbait. Reporters milked it for a few months, made **** loads of advertising revenue, and now that they can't exploit these fears any longer it's not a big story anymore.
MS isn't collecting any personally identifiable data. It's just anonymised telemetry, search and Cortana data. The data they do collect has nothing to do with your personal documents, otherwise they would be sued by thousands of people for keystroke logging, violation of privacy and corporate theft/espionage. There isn't a country or user agreement that could protect them.
However, there are people in government who are aggressively pursuing a lowering of privacy standards and this should not be tolerated at all. So it is good to be concerned and always voice your opposition to these policies, otherwise we will come to the point when government agencies will simply abuse you or your data for their personal and political gain, rather than for national security.
I typically do not use Google products. I use the App Store and iTunes. These products do not claim to collect the same information that Windows 10 can if enabled or running an Insider Build, which much cannot be disabled. (Keystrokes to learn autocorrect, etc.) Who knows - Apple may collect this, but it has not been publicly state that I know of. Perhaps it is just perception, but Apple appears to be a more privacy-centric company.
I am not comfortable with where Microsoft is going. I have no doubt most of their corporate products will go full Adobe in a relatively short amount of time.
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I feel sure this is already being logged and archived. I don't agree with it, but there is little that can be done about it.
I am not new to Microsoft or their practices. I have been an MCT, and beta tested their products since Windows 98/NT 5.0. I have had a good relationship with them overall, but just don't like the direction everything is headed.
I don't let the clickbait stories influence my opinion - I just use common sense when it comes to these types of things.
Common sense isn't often correct
it's more than often paranoid, repressive, suspicious and resistant to change. It accepts new ways very slowly and sometimes slides into regressive trends. Use an evidence based thinking process and you can never go wrong. You just have to say, there is no evidence MS is collecting my personal data in any way that violates my rights...BUT I'm not happy with any direction that companies may take that could violate my privacy.So you see how both sides of a debate can meet the middle way
)Keep in mind that the Windows 10 telemetry 'features' have been also pushed to Windows 7,8 and 8.1 via optional updates (in Windows Updates). Some prefer the old version of Windows, but keeping an old version for privacy is not a good reason.
If I recall correctly 'enterprise version' that are connected to a domain won't send telemetry. If that's not your case, there are a few tools that disable 95% of the tracking stuff.
Glasswire firewall is perfect for tracking outgoing stuff. Windows firewall is programmed out of the box to let MS stuff out. It's a good idea to not use it. This suggestions applies from everything above/including Windows 7.
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Glasswire is perfect for that and have very nice visual.. I'm not affiliated, just a believer!
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this is true for telemetry but doesn't apply to documents stored in OneDrive. They scan it, collect metadata and do what they want with it. Like google they also use deep image analyzer to check the content of images. When using encryption, the local EFS encryption key is also stored in Onedrive.
The reason Microsoft gives out "insider builds" is for quality assurance (AKA debugging) new releases. Of course they want to collect telemetry on problems, and not depend on the user to log into a website and make vague statements about something that "didn't work".
The Insider Builds are often "checked builds" - which means that run-time debugging and consistency checking are constantly on, slowing the system down. Microsoft isn't doing you a favor by giving you early access, you are doing Microsoft a favor by being part of a huge pool of beta testers.
It seems to be working fairly well.... Don't run insider builds if the telemetry bothers you.
Common sense isn't often correct
So you see how both sides of a debate can meet the middle way
They would not disclose to you if they were using your data in a way that may be violating your privacy, like many companies would not.
Just view some of the slides that were leaked in the past two years as to what companies are more complicit to sharing private data.