Do you think Apple checks with their lawyers before they use some other companies intellectual property in their hardware/software?
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Apple's iPhone scanning scandal and the Mac
- Thread starter Blue Quark
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Apple already has access to iCloud Photos and under this system will continue to have access to iCloud Photos. The same amount of data is shared with Apple regardless. This feature accomplishes nothing new while bringing about serious privacy concerns.
you have no control of what gets uploaded to a database or not once it's in the open.
How can you say it does not qualify?
Not true. In fact, while Apple does have a policy of informing account holders when their account is subject to a government request, there is a specific exception carved out to this policy for matters relating to child endangerment. Presumably, that includes CSAM, so that evidence isn’t tampered with before authorities are able to serve a search warrant.
From Apple's point of view, it accomplishes keeping CSAM off of their iCloud services and acts as deterrent to these criminals activating iCloud. Very few will likely be caught but this feature will guarantee that CSAM will not exist on a Apple server.
I never believed that Apple actually cares about any of us, but like any business, it cares about making a profit. Privacy was just part of their business model. Now I don't even think that anymore.
But in terms of privacy they are probably not worse than Google or Facebook -- yet -- just much more hypocritical. Just think for yourself and choose hardware+software that most suit your needs and preferences.
But in terms of privacy they are probably not worse than Google or Facebook -- yet -- just much more hypocritical. Just think for yourself and choose hardware+software that most suit your needs and preferences.
I am pretty sure this is because Apple does this because they don't want to be able to view your photos. If they can encrypt the photos in the cloud without holding a key, whenever there is some search warrant is coming, they can legitimately claim they cannot read the data.
The problem is that there are already laws in place that require them to search for child pornography, which is undisputedly a legitimate thing. So they are moving it to the device before the photos are encrypted and where they don't have access to it.
There is this slippery slope where governments could demand detection of other content. With regard to the iCloud this is a non-argument. If the photos in the cloud are not encrypted, as they are now, they can do that already.
And there is the slippery slope where Apple could snitch on its users even when they are not uploading something. It's something you have to trust the vendor on. And governments to not install ******** on your phone. An uneasy feeling remains.
The problem is that there are already laws in place that require them to search for child pornography, which is undisputedly a legitimate thing. So they are moving it to the device before the photos are encrypted and where they don't have access to it.
There is this slippery slope where governments could demand detection of other content. With regard to the iCloud this is a non-argument. If the photos in the cloud are not encrypted, as they are now, they can do that already.
And there is the slippery slope where Apple could snitch on its users even when they are not uploading something. It's something you have to trust the vendor on. And governments to not install ******** on your phone. An uneasy feeling remains.
From Apple’s point of view it doesn’t make a difference whether it exists on their server or not, as long as they make a good-faith effort to remove and report it once discovered, and of course, they’re already performing this scanning server-side.
This feature does not “guarantee” anything.
The feature does what it needs to do to protect Apple which is the point. These are customers that they don't need and any feature that can get rid them is a good thing.
Then Apple can pay for that CPU time all by itself instead of making me pay for it.
Apparently it’s not an ‘Apple Scandal “ as other manufacturers and social media, and cloud storage services have been doing this for quite a while.
LMAO I just love how you just posted a laugh emoji without answering the question. That's code for you don't have one. And yes if you think a multi-trillion dollar corporation doesn't check with their legal team before anything they do then you need to take Business 101.
There are already several threads on this, I'll just use this one.
We've had this technology for years, decades even. Any time I'm typing a search, it's scanning all my files and show results. But this happened on my device and the results are not send anywhere. I have no problems at all with this.
Apple allows people to opt out by disabling iCloud Photos. So the question everyone should ask is, why they're not simply scanning uploaded files in the cloud? They're scanning on my machine and then report results to the cloud. And that is the problem. They're implementing a mechanism in the core of the operating system that allows them so scan files (hash or not) and then forward information based on that scan to their systems. If anyone can't see the bigger picture and what's happening here in early stages, go wash your eyes with bleach (... no don't do that). When using Twitter, Facebook and Instagram I'm well aware that people can see it and process it in any way they want. I can choose not to use it. Apple lets me disable it for now, but it won't change that fact that I have these mechanisms, actual implemented functionality sitting on my system waiting to send stuff tobig brother Apple. The right way would be to offer this as an optional download, a plug-in for those who want it to run on their own device.
I've used Apple for decades, defended most of what they did including the touchbar and butterfly keyboard. I accepted by closing down macOS more and more I can't get some my work/research done anymore and bought additional hardware, while still using Apple. This thing is where I draw the line. They can scan cloud stuff all they want, they can make money off of it. I'm not a die hard open source supporter, even though I have released open source stuff in the past. I'm also all for people selling their ideas/work and make money off it, just like I did. When it comes to the base OS, there has to be a certain transparency of what they do.
This whole thing is not going to fly well with the EU and other countries. So we'll see where it goes. I wouldn't be surprised if this becomes a US (and maybe China/Russia) only thing. I guess Apple will just raise prices to compensate lost customers. It's a shame, because I love what they've done with the M1 and I'm looking forward to the next generations, but maybe, just maybe, it's time to leave the (sinking) ship. It looks like Apple's becoming the thing they fought most back in the day.
We've had this technology for years, decades even. Any time I'm typing a search, it's scanning all my files and show results. But this happened on my device and the results are not send anywhere. I have no problems at all with this.
Apple allows people to opt out by disabling iCloud Photos. So the question everyone should ask is, why they're not simply scanning uploaded files in the cloud? They're scanning on my machine and then report results to the cloud. And that is the problem. They're implementing a mechanism in the core of the operating system that allows them so scan files (hash or not) and then forward information based on that scan to their systems. If anyone can't see the bigger picture and what's happening here in early stages, go wash your eyes with bleach (... no don't do that). When using Twitter, Facebook and Instagram I'm well aware that people can see it and process it in any way they want. I can choose not to use it. Apple lets me disable it for now, but it won't change that fact that I have these mechanisms, actual implemented functionality sitting on my system waiting to send stuff to
I've used Apple for decades, defended most of what they did including the touchbar and butterfly keyboard. I accepted by closing down macOS more and more I can't get some my work/research done anymore and bought additional hardware, while still using Apple. This thing is where I draw the line. They can scan cloud stuff all they want, they can make money off of it. I'm not a die hard open source supporter, even though I have released open source stuff in the past. I'm also all for people selling their ideas/work and make money off it, just like I did. When it comes to the base OS, there has to be a certain transparency of what they do.
This whole thing is not going to fly well with the EU and other countries. So we'll see where it goes. I wouldn't be surprised if this becomes a US (and maybe China/Russia) only thing. I guess Apple will just raise prices to compensate lost customers. It's a shame, because I love what they've done with the M1 and I'm looking forward to the next generations, but maybe, just maybe, it's time to leave the (sinking) ship. It looks like Apple's becoming the thing they fought most back in the day.
As far as I know on-device scanning will be under "parental control," eg you turn it on.
My kids are grown up now, but given what I have heard from friends about the abuse problem with their kids, this problem is RAMPANT.
Apple's approach is simply the lesser evil. At least they are disclosing what they are planning on doing.
In the end, our choices are limited. Google, Microsoft, or Apple. I take Apple for now.
Your mileage may vary.
My kids are grown up now, but given what I have heard from friends about the abuse problem with their kids, this problem is RAMPANT.
Apple's approach is simply the lesser evil. At least they are disclosing what they are planning on doing.
In the end, our choices are limited. Google, Microsoft, or Apple. I take Apple for now.
Your mileage may vary.
being allegedly accused of having child pornography is already enough to wreck your entire life; marriage, friends, children, job, assets, all gone. even if you sue and win, and you better have some deep pockets to sue apple which is tough to do because you lost your current and any potential jobs due to the allegations, your life has been hell until then and the repercussions will follow you long after it.
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^^
This is the point that everyone keeps missing
It always starts with something that seems "ok" (like working to deal with CSAM)
Excellent point.
Normal law enforcement needs a cause and a warrant...yet people are ok with just circumventing all that process to go looking everywhere?
This is totally unacceptable, no matter what is being "looked for"
The ends do not justify the means when it's this level of invasiveness.
WOW that's really pushing it way over the edge. Firstly, "wreck you're entire life"? How so? If Apple doesn't post a picture of yours on their iCloud server and they made a mistake in judgement you may contact them or have your lawyer contact them for verification. Simple as that. AND if Apple is in fact misjudging your picture it won't go any further than either you or your lawyer contacting them. Only if it needs to go court it will be a private hearing. It won't make the TV news. 😂. There's no way your life can be ruined unless you're posting illegal pictures. If you are in fact doing that then you're deserving of facing the consequences. You're being overdramatic.
Same here.
In the EU this „feature“ is almost certainly illegal due to GDPR.
I am in the process of considering my options. I‘d switch immediately to Linux were it not for the ASi chips - those are hard to beat in particular in notebooks. The upcoming ASi 16“ MBP is very luring indeed.
However, I don‘t trust them any more, certainly do not want to depend on Apple with my data.
Dunno what the future brings; however, right now I am inclined to sell all my Apple stuff (watch/phone/iPad/MBPs) and go for Linux. After more than 20 years being a Mac afficionado. What a shame
Of course not. Plus I enjoy iOS/macOS programming - try that under Linux
Hence my dilemma
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Eh you just said you'd switch if weren't for the Apple Silicon chips so you are saying you're willing to give up you're privacy. I think you should go for the Linux machine and be done with Apple entirely since they aren't doing the right thing for you.