The webcam kind of sucks when compared to the rest of the system IMO, even with the AI filter and image processing. That said, these are entry level devices, they have vastly delivered in other areas making them some of the best price-to-performance systems on the market, and even if they did update it, it is not like the quality during most videoconferences would get much better. So I think it is fair to criticize the webcam but some make it into a much bigger deal than it is.
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Are we over-criticizing the 720p webcam?
- Thread starter ian87w
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Ha, you're not in any luck. You FF DSLR doesn't satisfy anyone but the people on the other side of the Zoom meeting. It doesn't benefit the person who owns the DSLR when on Zoom. I never get why people care so much about how perfect Apple's camera needs to be for Zoom meetings as if that's going to fix the main problem. The main problem is out of 6 people on a Zoom call POSSIBLY one will have a high quality web cam. POSSIBLY one will have very good lighting which matters more than anything regardless whether or not you're using a FF DSLR. Often people are not careful with their positioning of their laptops so the background isn't distracting such as open curtains in the background that ruin the picture.
So unless everyone involved on a Zoom call uses a 1080p web cam, perfect lighting, perfect positioning, fast internet this whole argument about Apple's webcam not being high quality or 1080p is absolute waste of time.
I love crappy webcams. The last thing I want is people to see exactly how ugly I am!
And yes, the built in webcams on Macs suck. Maybe it would cost them 3 more cents to put in a 1080p webcam? Pretty sure it would still be thin enough to fit in the display as well. Either way, I love being able to do video calls with the security of knowing that my rough edges are smoothed out. And blurred out. And grainied out.
And yes, the built in webcams on Macs suck. Maybe it would cost them 3 more cents to put in a 1080p webcam? Pretty sure it would still be thin enough to fit in the display as well. Either way, I love being able to do video calls with the security of knowing that my rough edges are smoothed out. And blurred out. And grainied out.
Yes, the iPhone has a higher quality camera for a reason. You usually don't take selfies with your MacBook, do you?
If you don't understand the cost and logistics of fitting a 1080p webcam in a MacBook, then why bother making those claims in the first place?
If they fit it in the bezels of an iPad Pro, why not a notebook?
The Surface Book, like the iPad Pro, is significantly thicker than the screen on the MacBook Air and the MacBook Pro. The hardware used for those higher resolution cameras is physically larger.
This is the hardware behind Face ID (from https://www.techinsights.com/blog/apple-iphone-x-teardown)
Isn't a 1080p cam too large for the current casing?
How the thickness is relevant.. iPad cam can fit nicely into the map lid, another thing iMacs has been stuck in 720 until lately and iMac has enough thickness.
The 720P camera is fine, and looks better than most 1080P cameras I've been seeing in my Zoom Calls.
Just like the bezels, it is another thing for people to complain about, because they have nothing better to complain about.
Just like the bezels, it is another thing for people to complain about, because they have nothing better to complain about.
The thickness of the MacBook Pro's lid does NOT limit the RESOLUTION of the sensor. It limits the SIZE of the sensor with a given set of optics.
If they wanted to, Apple could've put in a 12MP / 4k sensor, but at that size you're talking about incredibly tiny pixels with horribly compromised dynamic range and signal-to-noise ratios.
Given identical sensor technology, that hypothetical 4k webcam (and indeed a 1080p one) would look better than the 720p one in a highly optimised environment with carefully set studio lights (assuming the lens is able to resolve that amount of detail) - but the 720p one would be better in almost every other scenario.
In the end, I bet that Apple did try several webcam modules, including 1080p ones, and figured that the 720p one had the best balance of power consumption, dynamic range, noise, colour and cost, while delivering resolution that's good enough for the majority of users.
There is probably a 1080p module out there with superior sensor tech that could've produced better quality across the board, but Apple probably didn't think it was worth the cost and power consumption.
Having said that, I do think that the 720p webcam on this MBP is good enough for anyone who's not streaming professionally - it's excellent for Zoom meetings, and anything better would not be noticeable.
If they wanted to, Apple could've put in a 12MP / 4k sensor, but at that size you're talking about incredibly tiny pixels with horribly compromised dynamic range and signal-to-noise ratios.
Given identical sensor technology, that hypothetical 4k webcam (and indeed a 1080p one) would look better than the 720p one in a highly optimised environment with carefully set studio lights (assuming the lens is able to resolve that amount of detail) - but the 720p one would be better in almost every other scenario.
In the end, I bet that Apple did try several webcam modules, including 1080p ones, and figured that the 720p one had the best balance of power consumption, dynamic range, noise, colour and cost, while delivering resolution that's good enough for the majority of users.
There is probably a 1080p module out there with superior sensor tech that could've produced better quality across the board, but Apple probably didn't think it was worth the cost and power consumption.
Having said that, I do think that the 720p webcam on this MBP is good enough for anyone who's not streaming professionally - it's excellent for Zoom meetings, and anything better would not be noticeable.
To this point, I suspect that when you see yourself on a Zoom call, you're not seeing the compressed final image as the others will see you—you're basically getting a live look as if you were in the Photo Booth application or something. A good comparison would be to be on a third device and see how the Apple 720p webcam compares to a different company's 1080p one.
Very true. I brought up the bezel issue on Thinkpads on Reddit once and on here just a few weeks ago and people highly defended the overly thick bezels on the Thinkpads, especially the really ugly thick bezel at the bottom. But when it comes to Apple (who's bezels are actually just fine) people have nothing better to do but trash Apple over it. This Thinkcrap is ugly enough but those thick bezels just push it over the top. Just think how this forum (who loves Apple so dearly, SMH) would react if Apple had bezels that thick on the MacBooks?
Are you suggesting that every other person on a Zoom call that is not on a Mac is using a PC with a 1080p camera? Because that has not been my experience at all. 9 times out of 10 people are running Windows laptops on Zoom calls and they all look like crap. This is not an Apple issue. One person with a better camera on their Mac is not going to fix the other crap PC's that people have to stare at while on Zoom calls.
I mean it really is inexcusable for a company worth almost $2 Trillion in 2020. Now it does seem to be a hardware limitation with the thickness of the lid but I’m sure Apple would have figured it out if they wanted to. Hopefully next year with the rumored redesign they’ll come up with something.
No. Because users also rely on it for factors such as work interviews, potential meetings whereby them looking well put due to a higher resolution does have an impact on their lives and ability to buy / keep the MacBook. The biggest reason is if Apple was not able to do it at all, then it would've been fine. iMac Pro and the new 5K iMac already have a 1080 camera apple makes. Asking to put a "pro" technology into a MacBook "Pro" is not an unreasonable or unnecessary ask.
Apple knows better. and that camera would've surely helped sell even the MacBook (I think they still sell 'em) and the air even better. may be it would've drained the battery a bit? in which case they can lower the resolution temporarily at best if that's a concern or change it whereby when plugged it's projecting in 1080.
Quite frankly floored. 720p isn’t the worst thing in the world, it’s just very much outdated and behind the times. It’s not in line with the rest of Apple’s innovations. 1080p should be the standard, there’s no doubt about that. I can see where we don’t need 4K/UHD, but 1080p HD should be a given. This is coming from someone who just slaps a sticker over it anyways. But nonetheless, a $1500-2000 machine should have a 1080p webcam without question.
I feel like the answer is YES, people are too picky about the webcam. It's mostly just for Zoom/FaceTime/Skype so what is the big deal? We aren't using it to take hi-def video for movies or anything and most YouTubers use better higher-end stand-alone cams and equipment so... I just don't see the issue. But, of course, that is just my opinion. I can say that it certainly didn't affect my decision to buy the new M1 MBA, even a tiny bit.
The front-facing camera in my $3000 MacBook Pro should be higher quality than my iPhone. But it’s not.
Yes, and if you’re a professional face model who needs 4K video, you can easily add an external webcam.