What would be keynote-worthy about AR? I think we'll see more about AirTags and other product categories. And as you say, if Mac is coming in the October keynote, it's no use putting a Mac announcement in the September keynote as well.
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ARM MacBook Pro I don’t want an Overpriced Netbook.
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I think early ARM is going to be a mixed bag for the power user. You will have:
- Apps recompiled for ARM and well optimised for multicore. I'm betting these will be faster and slicker than ever.
- Apps recompiled for ARM but not so well optimised for multicore. I've no idea how these will compare to Intel.
- Apps not recompiled at all. Hard to imagine these performing as well.
Windows 10 BootCamp has been stated to be not supported. There may be some x86 emulation capability in the future.
Gaming will be supported either via (1) Rosetta 2 emulation - don't expect great results (2) iOS applications (3) native ARM games - we'll see how many current MacOS games can be easily recompiled for ARM
eGPUs should be supported if the ASi Macs support PCIe over thunderbolt, which I expect they will.
I think that Apple is prepared to take the hit of the appox. 2% of Mac users who regularly used Windows via Bootcamp, in the expectation that being able to run iOS apps will compensate for this lost user-segment.
I can see that Bootcamp is important for gamers, but maybe the better option is just to buy a separate Windows PC or console for gaming. It's really not the Mac's forte.
Agree about point 1.
About point 2: If they are recompiled, they are optimised as well. They still will be faster than Intel because of the hardware.
About point 3: We know from early Geekbench tests that not recompiled apps will take a hit around 25 %, which should be virtually indistinguishable to the end user, that's because AS chips will be more performant than Intel processors.
...because the "best product" will take longer to develop, and will come towards the end of the ARM transition.
The initial ASi Mac needs to be compelling, but not so good as to eclipse the current top of the range Intel Macs. I suspect a new MacBook, MacBook Air or an entry-level MBP13 (without external redesign). They will pull out the big-guns in a year or so.
I am expecting a super thin and light with reasonable power all new macbook and hope for a 14” screen but probably will get 12” [which I wont buy as I have my iPad Pro for that size].
No more MacBook Air. Just the macbook and MacBook pro. Simplify the line up now, and go for the power in 2021.
Apple is NOT a cpu manufacturer neither cpu architecture designer.
Intel on the other hand is the LARGEST and highest valued semiconductor chip manufacturer.
Apple goes to "theirs" chips (in fact it is arms chips but awhole other discusion) to CONTROL the whole hardware in their products. Not because it is the best or the fastest cpus. Boy, they even will put their own modems in the new iphones and ipad (from 2021), not because theirs (apple acquired intels modem division) are better than qualcoms but to CONTROL the whole proccess. So, stop the debate of which is fastest, ofcorce intels chips are fastest.
My i9 10850k,a 430 euros cpu, f0ck!ng blows away my ipad pro 12.9 (6GB edition) and the fact is that apple have no competitor for the intels highest tier cpus. The A14X will be in par of some mid-range i5 cpus. Does anybody imagine a mac pro (desctop) with arm cpu?! NO. And no, because there isnt any arm cpus for this tier.
For my business/work (at the office) im using an ipad pro, iphone and mac mini but for other scenarios my DYI intel pc is much more suitable
From 2017 im using oculus rift for the past 4 months is my primary display in my home. I use it to mimic three 32inch displays, so inside my oclusus i load an virtual environment with 3, 4k 32 displays. Macs will never have a cpu/gpu THAT powerfull to adress a scenario like this. Also try to play Elite dangerous in vr in any updomming macs. Even if they had support for the oculus or/and for any vr platform, witch i dont think this will be the case, the upcomming macs are like comparing a Pentium III 800MHz with TNT2 gpu, with AMD athlon64 4000+ with Nvidia 6800 ultra.
I am afraid your information is outdated. Apple has been aggressively hiring CPU and GPU designers (among others from Intel, ARM and AMD), and they have been using chips of their own design since at least 2012. Apple's executive in charge of chip development is Johny Srouji, who worked as senior manager for Intel Israel (the group that developed Intel's most successful CPU architectures that are still being used today) and was considered as an Intel CEO candidate in 2019.
By now, it is an established fact that Apple-designed CPUs are the most efficient customer CPUs on the market today, offering per-core performance close to those of fastest Intel desktop CPUs at a fraction of power consumption. A 2.7 ghz iPhone CPU core is roughly equivalent in performance to a 4.5Ghz Intel CPU core, while consuming about 1/5 of power.
And of course your desktop 100W CPU is faster in absolute terms, it would be an absolute joke if it were otherwise. That's not the point. The point is — if Apple is able to scale up the number of CPU cores (and it is reasonable to assume that they can do it early easily) — an 8-core Apple CPU will match or maybe even outperform your 10850k while being low-power enough to be fit into a laptop.
All I read is Apple is not just going to walk in. They will not just come in and get a chunk of the smartphone market.
We see how this one played out in the smartphone, tablet and wearable market. Hint: They‘re all computers.
I'm going to say yes. I can't imagine that Apple would release them if they didn't. There's just no way they're going to be slower given the insanely high performance per watt of Apple chips. They could probably outperform Intel using less than 40% of the power.
I ment that this is not apples primary job. They are an electronics consumer designer developer and seller.
So they have a team that design cpus around arm architecture, so what? the same also do: Huawei (they own HiSilicon/kirin cpus,), samsung, that in fact they design arm cpus back from 90s, and other companies. Today anyone can design a cpu based on arm achitecture. Hell even in my college some guys they came up with arm-based design SoC and they are now in talk with the largest Consumer Electronics seller in my county to buy theirs business plan.
In conclusion what i ment to say is apple is a consumer electonics seller, that they have a SMALL experience in designing a LOW to MID tier range cpus for their products. In the other hand, intel have the experience of, what?, 50+ yrs?
Again: hands up If anyone here thnks that apple can have an arm-based cpu of their own desing in a desktop mac pro,
They happen to design the best cpus, and yes, I think they will go Apple Silicon with their Mac Pro. Likely in 2022.
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macrumors 65816
It is true that Apple licences some core designs from ARM, as does QUALCOMM, Samsung and Huawei. It is also true to say that none of the above have produced their own ARM based chips that come close to those found in the latest iPhone and iPad Pro models. There's a lot more to CPU design than the cores used.
ARM Macs have been in development for probably years now. This isn't something that Tim Cook just decided to do then sent to production. Big guns might be a new Mac Pro desktop. No way they're going to shove an ARM chip into the 13" MBP. That would be a terrible move. The latest rumors that it's going to be a 14" MBP makes the most sense IMO. This is going to be the longest five day wait LOL
Google is your friend. You wrote a huge paragraph that many might not read especially after the first sentence is completely incorrect.
Since 2016? Ah I had an early 2011 13inch MBP which was actually the first 3x3 laptop they sold with one. 802.11n= 450mbps over 5GHz.
But yes they wouldn’t want to go backwards
Whether it's faster or not, I just gotta have one. Inject that ARM goodness right into my carotid.
Apple has it's hooks in me deep, man.
Apple has it's hooks in me deep, man.
This! This right here is what I'm most excited for. Same or better performance using considerably less battery power. The iPhone 11 has a 3110 mAh battery. The MBA has what... a 39.9 watt-hour battery. How they compare? I don't know. All I know is my iPhone 11 lasts all day. My MBA lasts about 8-9 hours off a single charge. Imagine having 2-day battery life + same or higher performance in a MBA with ASi. That would be epic!
So how badly does Apple freak out when NVIDIA buys out ARM ? Heck Apple should buyout ARM. And screw Qualcomm which all they do is License ARM architecture.
The only reason companies go with ARM is mobility and power otherwise
- ARM is a Reduced Instruction Set Computing (RISC) (RISC) architecture, which means that the processor itself handles far fewer instructions in hardware than, say, x86. This means that there is less actual material used in each chip, so they're dirt cheap to produce.
You are talking about something you have zero understanding about. Everything in your post is blatantly wrong. Both on conceptual level and on factual level. For your own and other users sake, I strongly suggest that you go out and educate yourself on the basics of how modern CPUs work and specifically about what’s special about the architecture of Intel, AMD, Apple and Cortex CPUs.
Exactly my experience with the iPad Pro. And it's not only high load that leads to thermal issues. I had a burning hot iPad Pro when watching 4k movies on iTunes outside at about 23 degrees Celsius in the shade. After half an hour I couldn't comfortably touch the back of the iPad Pro anymore. The battery depletes quite fast in that case as well, even though it is still quite impressive for the size of the device and the content. IMHO that chip is good for bursts of compute power but not for prolonged use. And on an iPad it is only one or two applications running in the foreground and minimal compute in the background. I can't imagine running Teams, VS Code, Docker Container-VMs, Slack and Mail at the same time on this chip when inside a MacBook Pro. Actually I am wondering what will happen to software like Docker and Virtualbox and the guest systems running on those VMs. The architecture virtualisation is a long lasting issue on Linux for many years already. At least when trying to match the performance. Will it still be a seamless experience or does the professional user have to suffer in this case?
And this is why a lot of us insist on not calling Apple Silicon "ARM"...
Apple Silicon uses the ARM instruction set (plus their own instructions) and that is where the similarities end. They stopped using Cortex designs way back with A6 and their own designs (which are the super performant ones) resemble the Intel Core 2 microarchitecture more than anything else. And given where Apple went to poach a lot of their design talent (Including as noted Johnny Srouji from Intel Israel) it is not that surprising.
Apple Silicon uses the ARM instruction set (plus their own instructions) and that is where the similarities end. They stopped using Cortex designs way back with A6 and their own designs (which are the super performant ones) resemble the Intel Core 2 microarchitecture more than anything else. And given where Apple went to poach a lot of their design talent (Including as noted Johnny Srouji from Intel Israel) it is not that surprising.
Yep, it’s because the chip is too powerful for the chassis (mostly the GPU). It’s something Anandtech noted in their review: the iPad Pro would actually occasionally crash when starting a game benchmark from cold state because the GPU would boost very aggressively and draw more power the system could provide. A laptop - even as small one as a 12” MB would provide more space for both cooling and power delivery.
As to the rest, you might be overestimating the stress caused by a multi-process environment. Its not like all this software has to literally run at the same time - most of them are just idling in the background, waking up very infrequently for some occasional state update here and there. An Apple CPU is almost guaranteed to do better under prolonged stress than an Intel one simply because Apple CPUs need less power.
While Apple Silicon Macs are hotly talked, personally I want Apple to re-use those chips to resurrect their infamous router a.k.a Airport....
So many inferior router in a market flooded with low dual core processor. The decent one is still expensive and some of them resembling alien aircraft.
With Apple sleek design, powerful CPUs (event the older A10 still suffice), meshed design, combined with the latest IEEE 802.11ax standard and maybe they can make integration between Macs and iOS device more tight ecosystem.
So many inferior router in a market flooded with low dual core processor. The decent one is still expensive and some of them resembling alien aircraft.
With Apple sleek design, powerful CPUs (event the older A10 still suffice), meshed design, combined with the latest IEEE 802.11ax standard and maybe they can make integration between Macs and iOS device more tight ecosystem.