"Cyberpower offers Pure Sinewave UPS alternative" - finally a cheaper UPS solution?

[w00tini]

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glad you're enjoying yours too icaras!

I'm confident this was the right choice for my needs. and hey, if something fails I've got AppleCare, American express, and my homeowners insurance behind me. I should be ok

 

[dissolve]

it will tell you in the cpanel if it has done so, and nope... no reports of that so far.

Great, glad it keeps a note of that.

Do you or Icaras happen to have a power meter (such as a Kill-a-Watt) handy? I'd be interested to see the power draw a fully charged UPS adds on top of the system. All it's actively doing is trickle charging the battery, right?

 

[w00tini]

Great, glad it keeps a note of that.

Do you or Icaras happen to have a power meter (such as a Kill-a-Watt) handy? I'd be interested to see the power draw a fully charged UPS adds on top of the system. All it's actively doing is trickle charging the battery, right?

hi dissolve,
sorry i dont have a watt meter... maybe icaras does?

 

[Icaras]

Nah, sorry, unfortunately I don't have one to measure, and it doesn't say on the manual.

I'll tell you this though, after 2 hours of on-time, the unit is cool to the touch. The only area where it feels warm at all, is the top side of it, particular the back, top side, but it is ever so slightly. I have the 1350va model and am currently using only 30% so far, and every other side of the unit has absolutely no sign of heat.

Though for now, I just emailed CP and asked. So i'll post back once I get a reply.

 

[dissolve]

hi dissolve,
sorry i dont have a watt meter... maybe icaras does?

Nah, sorry, unfortunately I don't have one to measure, and it doesn't say on the manual.

I'll tell you this though, after 2 hours of on-time, the unit is cool to the touch. The only area where it feels warm at all, is the top side of it, particular the back, top side, but it is ever so slightly. I have the 1350va model and am currently using only 30% so far, and every other side of the unit has absolutely no sign of heat.

Though for now, I just emailed CP and asked. So i'll post back once I get a reply.

Thank you both for replying. Glad you seem to be enjoying your units...as much as a UPS can be

I'm sure the power usage isn't significant. Just been reading from Cyberpower that they claim their Green UPS tech reduces power draw by 75% so I got curious. Of course, 75% means nothing without an initial value

 

[dissolve]

I just sent an email to CyberPower about the GreenUPS response time to voltage fluctuations or complete drop. They told me it would take 4ms for the battery to kick in or a voltage sag / overvoltage to be corrected. I checked out APC's Line-R voltage regulation series to get a comparison. Their spec sheet gives a response time of <2 AC cycles. At 60Hz (unless my math is wrong) the CyberPower is about 10x faster in responding compared to the worst case for APC.

Now this is not for APC's full-fledge APC units. I'm only comparing to their Line-R as it was an alternative solution for me at one point. Of course, I'm new to the UPS arena, but this makes the CPxxxxPFCLCD much more promising for me. I've got a Kill-a-Watt on the way to get a good reading on my system load and also voltage fluctuations.

BTW, their response was very quick and friendly. It's nice to get a good customer service department

 

[Icaras]

I just sent an email to CyberPower about the GreenUPS response time to voltage fluctuations or complete drop. They told me it would take 4ms for the battery to kick in or a voltage sag / overvoltage to be corrected. I checked out APC's Line-R voltage regulation series to get a comparison. Their spec sheet gives a response time of <2 AC cycles. At 60Hz (unless my math is wrong) the CyberPower is about 10x faster in responding compared to the worst case for APC.

Now this is not for APC's full-fledge APC units. I'm only comparing to their Line-R as it was an alternative solution for me at one point. Of course, I'm new to the UPS arena, but this makes the CPxxxxPFCLCD much more promising for me. I've got a Kill-a-Watt on the way to get a good reading on my system load and also voltage fluctuations.

BTW, their response was very quick and friendly. It's nice to get a good customer service department

I wonder if you're right too. That seems super fast.

I also tested my machine over the weekend under Windows like w00t and achieved essentially the same results. No buzzing sounds either!

And to answer your question dissolve, CP also replied back to me with this response about power draw:

If the battery is low and needs to recharge, it will draw about 75W.
If the unit is fully charged, it uses about 5-8W.

 

[w00tini]

Great work fellas!

It seems that we have made a solid decision thus far. Please report back with those KillAWatt numbers Dissolve

 

[dissolve]

I wonder if you're right too. That seems super fast.

I also tested my machine over the weekend under Windows like w00t and achieved essentially the same results. No buzzing sounds either!

And to answer your question dissolve, CP also replied back to me with this response about power draw:

That's great news! Those numbers are very low...idle is basically negligible. Even charging is lower than I expected.

Great work fellas!

It seems that we have made a solid decision thus far. Please report back with those KillAWatt numbers Dissolve

It's really looking like it. Glad you two were our forum guinea pigs My Kill-a-Watt is due in tomorrow and once I get solid numbers for my MP power draw, I'll most likely go ahead and buy. I'm still keeping an eye on other refurb shops, but leaning towards the CP.

 

[tommyknockrs]

That's great news! Those numbers are very low...idle is basically negligible. Even charging is lower than I expected.



It's really looking like it. Glad you two were our forum guinea pigs My Kill-a-Watt is due in tomorrow and once I get solid numbers for my MP power draw, I'll most likely go ahead and buy. I'm still keeping an eye on other refurb shops, but leaning towards the CP.

Just to keep this thread alive, I was just wondering if anyone else has purchased the Cyperpower with adapted sine wave power and wondering if Dissolve has tested with the Kill-a-Watt and what the numbers were.

 

[w00tini]

still running like a champ on my end. no issues, no sound, no nada. i test it regularly and have had no issues.

 

[dissolve]

Just to keep this thread alive, I was just wondering if anyone else has purchased the Cyperpower with adapted sine wave power and wondering if Dissolve has tested with the Kill-a-Watt and what the numbers were.

I haven't bought it yet. I have the Kill-a-Watt and have figured out which model fits my usage. It'll be a couple weeks before I get serious about buying one, but I'll definitely post back in this thread if/when I do.

By the way, now that I have the Kill-a-Watt, I'm realizing it's going to be very difficult to figure out the extra power draw. Consumption fluctuates constantly and if the difference is as low as Icaras posted, I doubt I'll see much. Of course, charging will be a different story. Either way, I'll post back what I find.

 

[dissolve]

Great work fellas!

It seems that we have made a solid decision thus far. Please report back with those KillAWatt numbers Dissolve

Finally got mine! I went with the CP1000PFCLCD as my idle system comes in at under 200 watts. Haven't done any serious testing yet, but I'm impressed with this little guy. Much smaller than I expected!

Without anything pulling power from it, it comes in at around 4-6 watts. With roughly 180 watts of computer+peripherals plugged in, it seems to add about 20 watts on top of what it reports on the LCD. This obviously fluctuates a lot, but that's a pretty good average value.

I've only done one battery power test so far (just pulled the plug with everything running) and it responded well. No buzzing from the PSU (woo!!) and OS X recognized that the MP was on battery power. I didn't let it shut down but I presume it will with the appropriate settings...I'll test that later. I could certainly hear a little fan running after providing batter power, but it wasn't too audible and only lasted about one minute. The unit reported 7-8 minutes of run time, which is plenty as I have it set to shut down after only a minute. Surprisingly, it's not pulling much more power now that it needs to charge the battery. Seems to need about 30 watts (only 10 more than when it's full).

Going to continue some tests, but I think that sums up the power consumption aspect. Overall, a pretty small addition to your electricity bill, especially since that idle draw is so low. Thanks again Icarus, I think we've got a winner here for our purposes.

 

[PenguinMac]

I bought the CyberPower CP1000PFCLCD also, but my experience was quite different. My 6-core Mac Pro with an SSD and 4 WD Caviar Black 2TB worked with the CP1000PFCLCD for about 20 minutes, until I turned the Mac Pro off. When I turned it on again, the CP1000PFCLCD made an array of warning sounds and displayed a fault F02, Battery Output Short. The manual says to restart the UPS, but even after I did so it would not allow the Mac Pro to restart without entering this fault mode.

According to several sources, my Mac Pro could draw as much as 5 amps on starting, which would be 600 watts. While that should be within the range of the CP1000PFCLCD, it's certainly possible that it overloaded the UPS which will then commit electronic suicide to protect the attached devices. Anyway, I'm back to a large surge protector without battery backup while I decide whether to try the CP1500PFCLCD or wait for APC to come out with a similar product.

 

[philipma1957]

buy this from vanns.


http://search.vanns.com/sitesearch/search?q=apc+s15


the silver one is the same as the black one.

 

[Icaras]

Going to continue some tests, but I think that sums up the power consumption aspect. Overall, a pretty small addition to your electricity bill, especially since that idle draw is so low. Thanks again Icarus, I think we've got a winner here for our purposes.

Nice! Glad its working out so far. W00tini also definitely motivated me to try and research this more too. Actually, I probably wouldn't have looked into this unit more if he didn't point out the fuss going on at Newegg (don't really peruse there often).

I actually ended up selling my hex-core Mac Pro and I'm now on a new iMac quad i5 as of yesterday (needed less), but it would appear that iMacs also have PFC based PSUs (Energy Star 5.0 device). So I also ordered a new cp850pfclcd to go with it, in exchange for the 1350 I just had. I should be getting that by the end of the week, so I'm glad to hear you really like the smaller sized unit.

I bought the CyberPower CP1000PFCLCD also, but my experience was quite different. My 6-core Mac Pro with an SSD and 4 WD Caviar Black 2TB worked with the CP1000PFCLCD for about 20 minutes, until I turned the Mac Pro off. When I turned it on again, the CP1000PFCLCD made an array of warning sounds and displayed a fault F02, Battery Output Short. The manual says to restart the UPS, but even after I did so it would not allow the Mac Pro to restart without entering this fault mode.

According to several sources, my Mac Pro could draw as much as 5 amps on starting, which would be 600 watts. While that should be within the range of the CP1000PFCLCD, it's certainly possible that it overloaded the UPS which will then commit electronic suicide to protect the attached devices. Anyway, I'm back to a large surge protector without battery backup while I decide whether to try the CP1500PFCLCD or wait for APC to come out with a similar product.

I read about in rushes of power usage somewhere on the APC forums and I think that's where having a more head room for the watt capacity of the battery definitely helps. Just from the sound of your system (with 4 WD Caviar blacks), it sounds like a bit much for the 1000 model. I'm pretty sure a 1350, and definitely the 1500 will be able to handle whatever you throw at it.

I'm also very curious about APC and other competing manufacturers, and how they will react to CyberPower's PFC models.

Edit: Here you go. Just found the link to the APC thread about in rush current of Mac Pro startup: http://www.apc-forums.com/thread.jspa?messageID=13837

 

[dissolve]

Nice! Glad its working out so far. W00tini also definitely motivated me to try and research this more too. Actually, I probably wouldn't have looked into this unit more if he didn't point out the fuss going on at Newegg (don't really peruse there often).

I actually ended up selling my hex-core Mac Pro and I'm now on a new iMac quad i5 as of yesterday (needed less), but it would appear that iMacs also have PFC based PSUs (Energy Star 5.0 device). So I also ordered a new cp850pfclcd to go with it, in exchange for the 1350 I just had. I should be getting that by the end of the week, so I'm glad to hear you really like the smaller sized unit.

I extend my thanks to w00tini as well

That unit should serve well for the iMac. IIRC it pulls around 150 watts with the display on at idle. Let us know how it works out for you.

I bought the CyberPower CP1000PFCLCD also, but my experience was quite different. My 6-core Mac Pro with an SSD and 4 WD Caviar Black 2TB worked with the CP1000PFCLCD for about 20 minutes, until I turned the Mac Pro off. When I turned it on again, the CP1000PFCLCD made an array of warning sounds and displayed a fault F02, Battery Output Short. The manual says to restart the UPS, but even after I did so it would not allow the Mac Pro to restart without entering this fault mode.

According to several sources, my Mac Pro could draw as much as 5 amps on starting, which would be 600 watts. While that should be within the range of the CP1000PFCLCD, it's certainly possible that it overloaded the UPS which will then commit electronic suicide to protect the attached devices. Anyway, I'm back to a large surge protector without battery backup while I decide whether to try the CP1500PFCLCD or wait for APC to come out with a similar product.

Yeah the 1000PFCLCD is definitely not enough for your system. If you are seeing 600 watt start ups, you've already reached its limit. I'm surprised yours gets that high, but I guess the hex and those 4 HDDs really add a lot (I've never seen over 250 on my quad core). You should definitely look into a 1500VA unit as you suggested.

 

[w00tini]

glad you guys are enjoying the unit! just this AM we had a power outage. first one I can confirm. ran the hex Mac pro for two minutes and shut down as smooth as silk.

 

[dissolve]

I've got a question and, although it pertains to any UPS, I thought I'd post back here rather than start a new thread.

Under Energy Saver Preferences, I have it set to shut down after being on UPS battery for 1 minute. I wanted to make sure it has enough power to wake the MP and then shut it down so I pulled the plug while sleeping, but nothing happened after a minute passed. Is this expected behavior? I feel like there's something I'm missing.

This isn't too big an issue because the unit should get about 3 hours of battery life with only a sleeping MP plugged in, but I'm still curious. Any ideas?

 

[nanofrog]

I've got a question and, although it pertains to any UPS, I thought I'd post back here rather than start a new thread.

Under Energy Saver Preferences, I have it set to shut down after being on UPS battery for 1 minute. I wanted to make sure it has enough power to wake the MP and then shut it down so I pulled the plug while sleeping, but nothing happened after a minute passed. Is this expected behavior? I feel like there's something I'm missing.

This isn't too big an issue because the unit should get about 3 hours of battery life with only a sleeping MP plugged in, but I'm still curious. Any ideas?

Start simple; shut down the system, wait a bit, and restart it (be sure the settings you made actually take effect).

 

[dissolve]

Start simple; shut down the system, wait a bit, and restart it (be sure the settings you made actually take effect).

Thank you for the input. I had the settings checked when I first got the UPS so it's been through a few shutdowns and they appear to have remained. I just tried that test today and no luck. The only shutdown options I have chosen are to shutdown after a time limit so it shouldn't be defaulted to some other option.

 

[nanofrog]

Thank you for the input. I had the settings checked when I first got the UPS so it's been through a few shutdowns and they appear to have remained. I just tried that test today and no luck. The only shutdown options I have chosen are to shutdown after a time limit so it shouldn't be defaulted to some other option.

I presume you've checked that OS X recognizes the UPS (trying to think of quick and easy things to check that can cause such aggravation).

 

[dissolve]

I presume you've checked that OS X recognizes the UPS (trying to think of quick and easy things to check that can cause such aggravation).

Yes, OS X recognizes the UPS and a new pane appeared in Energy Saver Preferences. I've pulled the plug with the system running, OS X displayed an appropriate dialog box, and the UPS responded as well. I didn't let it shut down, so I'll check that soon. I just assumed that since OS X recognized it was on battery power, it would take the appropriate actions.

So am I correct in believing OS X should wake up the MP and shut it down after the allotted time?

 

[nanofrog]

Yes, OS X recognizes the UPS and a new pane appeared in Energy Saver Preferences. I've pulled the plug with the system running, OS X displayed an appropriate dialog box, and the UPS responded as well. I didn't let it shut down, so I'll check that soon. I just assumed that since OS X recognized it was on battery power, it would take the appropriate actions.

So am I correct in believing OS X should wake up the MP and shut it down after the allotted time?

It depends.

You'd need the USB ports set to Wake if there's any signal over the USB devices when in sleep mode (UPS will send one when it goes to the inverter, just like it would when tapping a key on the keyboard or mouse, assuming it's USB). Without this, the system won't respond, and thus not shut itself down.

This tends to get missed, as it's been past practice to leave the systems on (just use power management settings on the monitor; system stays fully active). This has been to allow for nightly maintenance runs, ... and in some cases, was a necessity for RAID as it tends not to sleep properly (card's firmware gets dumped, so you have to shut down and reboot to get it loaded again).

Please understand, I'm trying to keep this simple, so I've pieced this out instead of one post (wanted your response feed back as to what you did/didn't do).

 

[dissolve]

It depends.

You'd need the USB ports set to Wake if there's any signal over the USB devices when in sleep mode (UPS will send one when it goes to the inverter, just like it would when tapping a key on the keyboard or mouse, assuming it's USB). Without this, the system won't respond, and thus not shut itself down.

This tends to get missed, as it's been past practice to leave the systems on (just use power management settings on the monitor; system stays fully active). This has been to allow for nightly maintenance runs, ... and in some cases, was a necessity for RAID as it tends not to sleep properly (card's firmware gets dumped, so you have to shut down and reboot to get it loaded again).

Please understand, I'm trying to keep this simple, so I've pieced this out instead of one post (wanted your response feed back as to what you did/didn't do).

That's alright, I understand. Thank you for your input.

I've now tried it both the front and rear USB ports as well as with/without the "Start up automatically after power failure" box checked. No options seem to get it to wake and shut down. This isn't too big an issue, but I just wanted to be sure if this was normal for OS X or not.