Espresso Enthusiasts

[Kurwenal]

My experiments with the moka pot are going well. I haven't quite perfected the dose and grind, but I'm on my way. Admittedly I don't have a reference for what a 'good' moka brew should be, but of course this is subjective to begin with. I have to say I do enjoy this brew method: I fastidiously stare at the spout in anticipation of receiving its liquor. Somewhere between espresso and pour over comes this delightful creation.

Enjoying it thoroughly.

The learning curve is fun, and short. For me, the key variable is heat, not so much grind or even time. Whatever online guide I read at the start, now discarded, had me setting the heat too high, for my situation. I start now with the heat at medium-high and quickly reduce it, during the brew, to medium-low. No doubt every stove will be a bit different.

This has reduced the sputtering to the point where I can brew with the lid open and not have to wipe down the stove afterwards.

 

[mobilehaathi]

The learning curve is fun, and short. For me, the key variable is heat, not so much grind or even time. Whatever online guide I read at the start, now discarded, had me setting the heat too high, for my situation. I start now with the heat at medium-high and quickly reduce it, during the brew, to medium-low. No doubt every stove will be a bit different.

This has reduced the sputtering to the point where I can brew with the lid open and not have to wipe down the stove afterwards.

Do you preheat the water before pouring it into the bottom?

 

[Scepticalscribe]

Do you preheat the water before pouring it into the bottom?

Personally, for a moka pot, no, I have never heated the water before pouring it into the bottom; part of the fun is to allow the moka pot to do its stuff by itself, when the heat source has been applied to it.

(Although, in winter, I have heated cups, and when using a French press, heated the press using hot water, prior to making coffee, and whatever coffee cups/mugs I planned to use with it).

 

[Shrink]

Personally, for a moka pot, no, I have never heated the water before pouring it into the bottom; part of the fun is to allow the moka pot to do its stuff by itself, when the heat source has been applied to it.

(Although, in winter, I have heated cups, and when using a French press, heated the press using hot water, prior to making coffee, and whatever coffee cups/mugs I planned to use with it).

I completely agree about heating the cups. In fact, I would suggest that heating the cups in any weather or temperature is advisable since any coffee's flavor changes as it cools. Not just the effect of coolness per se, but chemical changes in the coffee which alters the taste for the worse.

 

[S.B.G]

I completely agree about heating the cups. In fact, I would suggest that heating the cups in any weather or temperature is advisable since any coffee's flavor changes as it cools. Not just the effect of coolness per se, but chemical changes in the coffee which alters the taste for the worse.

I agree. I always heat my cups with hot water, usually right from the Gaggia, before any coffee go in.

 

[Kurwenal]

Do you preheat the water before pouring it into the bottom?

I do. I use my kettle to take the water up to 180, and then finish heating it in the Bialetti. I do this for two reasons, it is quicker, and I have to heat up some water in the kettle anyway to heat whatever cup I will be using to drink the coffee.

(Although, in winter, I have heated cups, and when using a French press, heated the press using hot water, prior to making coffee, and whatever coffee cups/mugs I planned to use with it).

I heat up everything and anything that will touch the coffee, both for espresso and whatever version of drip/vac/filter I am using at the moment (including, for example, a paper filter if used and the top chamber of the Bialetti). Kettle works spectacularly for this. It's very quick and I can control the temp perfectly.

 

[mobilehaathi]

Personally, for a moka pot, no, I have never heated the water before pouring it into the bottom; part of the fun is to allow the moka pot to do its stuff by itself, when the heat source has been applied to it.

(Although, in winter, I have heated cups, and when using a French press, heated the press using hot water, prior to making coffee, and whatever coffee cups/mugs I planned to use with it).

I do. I use my kettle to take the water up to 180, and then finish heating it in the Bialetti. I do this for two reasons, it is quicker, and I have to heat up some water in the kettle anyway to heat whatever cup I will be using to drink the coffee.

I heat up everything and anything that will touch the coffee, both for espresso and whatever version of drip/vac/filter I am using at the moment (including, for example, a paper filter if used and the top chamber of the Bialetti). Kettle works spectacularly for this. It's very quick and I can control the temp perfectly.

Thanks for the thoughts! This morning I had a nice extraction with a medium low flame, and I think I have dose/grind about right.

Incidentally, I too heat my vessels.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

Thanks for the thoughts! This morning I had a nice extraction with a medium low flame, and I think I have dose/grind about right.

Incidentally, I too heat my vessels.

This thread is very, very bad for me.

On the topic of heating prior to preparing, and then, sipping, I will concede that mugs are usually (not necessarily in summer) heated; espresso cups are always heated; pots (not the moka, mind you, though I may now try it) are heated; and, a recent purchase (you corruptors, on this thread, in pursuit of the dream of impossible perfection), a Hario ceramic coffee drip (to replace the plastic, durable one, which has since travelled with me to Foreign Parts and Distant Places where such things Are Not Easily Obtained) - the Hario is really nice, extraordinarily well built and solid, and yes, it, too is invariably heated, prior to being used.

A tale to tell: When ordering coffee from Intelligentsia (as prompted by some here) some time ago, my mouse inevitably hovered over the 'Accessories' section, and, as you all well know on this thread, my friends and fellow espresso lovers, well, the rest is history. A click, a credit card, a Hario coffee dripper purchased, and well, such is our life.

However. However. I am not a morning person. Indeed, I don't 'get' mornings. Mornings in winter, especially.

One of the reasons that I drink espresso in the morning is to apply the heavenly nectar of caffeine to the crank-shaft of my mind and body in a futile attempt to get some sort of vague movement. There is a reason that I can effortlessly consume three double espressos before a nine a.m. meeting. There is a reason I am never jittery, or afflicted with shaking-hand syndrome even if swallowing several double espressos in rapid sequence (to the utter amazement and stupefaction of colleagues). Conversations (scripted dialogues run much as follows): Colleague: What? You've just drunk three double espressos. Are you not shaking?" Me: (Suavely): No, I am merely upright, awake and functional. And no longer even remotely homicidal.

Elaborate and detailed preparations, requiring attention, and concentration, (rather than the gentle joy of waiting for a moka pot to gurgle happily) - before my first espresso - are what I view as the sort of multi-tasking torture that is entirely beyond me. Part of the point of an espresso is to get me to there, ("there" = functioning non-homicidal adult, whose countenance can manage a rictus commonly misinterpreted as a genial greeting) not to be part of the challenge of getting there. While it is a delusion held by many that those of us who are born Daughters of Eve Multi-Task by Default in our DNA, I can assure you that multi-tasking (at least before my first five double espressos) is as alien to me as it is to any self-respecting nerd.

 

[S.B.G]

Yeah, she's not addicted to caffeine.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

Okay. My friends. I am staying (at my expense) in a lovely hotel in the centre of the capital city of my country; I travelled here this evening to attend a formal dinner where we were to host senior police officers from another country to dinner.

Inexplicably, our guests missed their flight from, um, Istanbul airport, a fact, I was only made aware of when already on a train en route to the capital. I lie. I was made aware of this while sitting in the train, three minutes prior to departure. Cue debate. Does one leap off the train (having already booked hotel, donned glad rags), or does one suffer for democracy and proceed with a bizarre travel arrangement, which, on amendment, may require further - ah - adjustment.....

Indeed, it is thought that their arrival may be delayed by a further two days, which may require my attendance, at, um, further, ah, meetings....

At one level, this is dreadful - at another, bizarrely hilarious, in the sense of the rich fabric of human life, blah, blah, blah....

However. I spent some time tonight, commingling with cherished colleagues, (all of us around to deal with our, as yet, unarrived, guests) in interesting pubs, and, even odder, (and unknown to me - life is a journey, where the unexplored and unknown is fascinating) strange dives....

I returned to my hotel at an impressively godforsaken hour (having ascertained before hand that they would be prepared to serve espresso to my room on my return, 'But, ma'am, we serve espresso 24 hours to guests' was the response which elicited a whispered 'bravo' from me), and politely requested a double espresso, which took a mere half hour to materialise, and when it did, the saucer lacked a spoon.

Yes. This reveals my deep inadequacy, my inability to contemplate an espresso without the indignity of adding copious amounts of sugar (brown, soft, organic, handpicked by mute [wasn't there a ghastly Puritanical fashion to Christen female children with horrendous names such as 'Silence' in the years written about with such insight and feeling by Nathaniel Hawthorne?] -male angels during the period of the waxing moon for preference).

Anyway. Please permit me my flights of fantasy. A sort of retrospective, if entirely useless historical retribution.

In any case: A spoon was produced, and an explanation vouchsafed. (Some stupid stag party, and one over-worked staff member). I was and am entirely understanding. And am now sipping a double espresso, which I am assured will not be added to my account, and which came fortified with an impressive array of Scottish biscuits. It is rather nice....

 

[Kurwenal]

Yeah, she's not addicted to caffeine.

And am now sipping a double espresso

My god! After all these years, I finally understand why agents are called "double Os."

 

[S.B.G]

How many of you watch Jerry Seinfeld's series Comedians in Cars Getting Coffee?

Here's an episode with Jay Leno and about halfway through there is a bit about that coffee which is um, passed through an animal, then consumed. It's quite funny.

 

[Shrink]

How many of you watch Jerry Seinfeld's series Comedians in Cars Getting Coffee?

Here's an episode with Jay Leno and about halfway through there is a bit about that coffee which is um, passed through an animal, then consumed. It's quite funny.

YouTube: video

It's called Kopi Luwak. I do think they might brush it off a bit before bagging.

 

[S.B.G]

Oh, that looks delicious.

 

[decafjava]

Oh, that looks delicious.

Sarcasm I hope?

Anyway I've learned something new this morning. Heating cups before drinking coffee. Well I never. I have to try it but not sure how to here at work. Would hot water from the tap be sufficient?

 

[S.B.G]

Sarcasm I hope?

Anyway I've learned something new this morning. Heating cups before drinking coffee. Well I never. I have to try it but not sure how to here at work. Would hot water from the tap be sufficient?

Hot water is all I use, usually from the Gaggia, but wherever you get it, as long as it's hot.

 

[Shrink]

Hot water is all I use, usually from the Gaggia, but wherever you get it, as long as it's hot.

Agree ^^^

Any source of the hottest water you can get is fine. I don't know what kind of machine you use, but dispensing the very hot water from your machine is best, if possible. (Take care...if you use water from your machine it is HOT...don't splash on your hands.)

My timing is to dispense water from my machine first thing, then do my grinding, tamping, etc. as the cup heats up. Be sure to dry out the cup before doing your extraction.

Also suggested is a ceramic or something like the Bodum double wall cup. Both hold heat well, and keep your coffee hot longer.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

It's called Kopi Luwak. I do think they might brush it off a bit before bagging.

Image

Oh, that looks delicious.

As I posted earlier, my brother (after much online research) decided to order a small quantity of the above for me as a Christmas gift (albeit belated); now, he is not a coffee drinker, but, as denizens of this thread know, I am.

This is supposed to be the acme, the apex, the summit, of coffee experience (and the expense seems to bear this out - a small packet of the stuff is in excess of €60. In any case, I will happily brief you with detailed tasting notes, when I finally get to drink a cup of the stuff; my brother is also anxious to try it when we finally obtain it.

My god! After all these years, I finally understand why agents are called "double Os."

Ah, but when I graduate to triple espressos how will this [ig]noble profession be identified by number? 'Triple 0 7' doesn't have quite the same ring to it, and, as for 'Quadruple 0 7', well, I should think that any self-respecting enemy agent would just guffaw with a burst of laughter to your face if you identified yourself thus, rather than trembling in a becoming manner.

 

[Shrink]

As I posted earlier, my brother (after much online research) decided to order a small quantity of the above for me as a Christmas gift (albeit belated); now, he is not a coffee drinker, but, as denizens of this thread know, I am.

This is supposed to be the acme, the apex, the summit, of coffee experience (and the expense seems to bear this out - a small packet of the stuff is in excess of €60. In any case, I will happily brief you with detailed tasting notes, when I finally get to drink a cup of the stuff; my brother is also anxious to try it when we finally obtain it.

The notable thing about coffee processed in this manner is that unless specified, you have no idea what beans were used in the processing technique.

The name Kopi Luwak only specifies the processing technique; i.e. how the cherry pulp is removed leaving the beans (actually seeds) clear of pulp. There are two more traditional methods...wet and dry processing. All this is is a third method of processing...having the digestive process of the civet remove the cherry pulp. So when you buy it, by name, you have no idea what beans were used, as the civet can be fed ANY beans to "process".

Reading some of the coffee fora, there seems to be a fairly general consensus that this is a gimmick, and since you don't know the beans processed in this manner (unless specified), you really have no idea what you are drinking. It could be great beans, or less wonderful beans.

That said...curiosity may well justify giving it a taste...as long as Scepticalscribe is buying!

 

[Scepticalscribe]

The notable thing about coffee processed in this manner is that unless specified, you have no idea what beans were used in the processing technique.

The name Kopi Luwak only specifies the processing technique; i.e. how the cherry pulp is removed leaving the beans (actually seeds) clear of pulp. There are two more traditional methods...wet and dry processing. All this is is a third method of processing...having the digestive process of the civet remove the cherry pulp. So when you buy it, by name, you have no idea what beans were used, as the civet can be fed ANY beans to "process".

Reading some of the coffee fora, there seems to be a fairly general consensus that this is a gimmick, and since you don't know the beans processed in this manner (unless specified), you really have no idea what you are drinking. It could be great beans, or less wonderful beans.

That said...curiosity may well justify giving it a taste...as long as Scepticalscribe is buying!

Actually, while I am known for - what some may even deem extravagant - spending on occasion, (many occasions; actually, my philosophy is simple - I try to buy the best), the Kopi Luwak is being/has been ordered by my brother as a gift to me, and so, on this occasion, it is his credit card that betrays signs of serious singeing.....

Actually, he made it clear that he did not wish to buy me 'more fat books of at least a thousand pages' but rather, something that I would be obliged to consume. He has also requested a cup 'so that I can taste what is supposed to be the best and see if I finally get to sort of like coffee'. We shall see.

Detailed tasting notes to follow in due course, and, on this occasion, every precaution to aid the process (heated cups and so on), will, needless to say, be undertaken with sober mien, too........

However, I, too, have read that this may well be a triumph of marketing. Nevertheless, in the spirit of living life, and satisfying curiosity, I am one of those who will sample anything once; and some things, as a result, are indeed sampled, only once.....

 

[Shrink]

Actually, while I am known for - what some may even deem extravagant - spending on occasion, (many occasions; actually, my philosophy is simple - I try to buy the best), the Kopi Luwak is being/has been ordered by my brother as a gift to me, and so, on this occasion, it is his credit card that betrays signs of serious singeing.....

Actually, he made it clear that he did not wish to buy me 'more fat books of at least a thousand pages' but rather, something that I would be obliged to consume. He has also requested a cup 'so that I can taste what is supposed to be the best and see if I finally get to sort of like coffee'. We shall see.

Detailed tasting notes to follow in due course, and, on this occasion, every precaution to aid the process (heated cups and so on), will, needless to say, be undertaken with sober mien, too........

Your tasting notes are eagerly awaited with much curiosity!

And if you brother is buying...

 

[S.B.G]

I too, await this cupping and subsequent taste report of the, um, "special" beans. I'm afraid that this is one product that I am unwilling to try, at least, with the prior knowledge of how it's processed!

 

[Scepticalscribe]

I too, await this cupping and subsequent taste report of the, um, "special" beans. I'm afraid that this is one product that I am unwilling to try, at least, with the prior knowledge of how it's processed!

For now, some lovely stuff from 'Intelligentsia' also awaits - indeed, had arrived before my (brief) return home; the aroma was amazing.

Meanwhile. the Kopi Luwak (and I have no idea of what sort of beans have been harvested in this manner) will be sampled when we manage to get it.

Earlier, last autumn, I had tried the 'Los Inmortales' from El Salvador and found it excellent, smooth, rich, almost sweet, and delicious. Their standard 'Black Cat' brand is also very good.

 

[Kurwenal]

I hope the coffee is wonderful.

Not a chance in hell I will ever try it.......

 

[Shrink]

I too, await this cupping and subsequent taste report of the, um, "special" beans. I'm afraid that this is one product that I am unwilling to try, at least, with the prior knowledge of how it's processed!

I hope the coffee is wonderful.

Not a chance in hell I will ever try it.......

Geez...you'd think they didn't even brush it off a bit before packaging!

As long as someone else was willing to pay for this novelty coffee...I'd try it.

While traveling in other counties, I've eaten foods that would be considered icky no-eat'em stuff here. No, not made from poop, but then, the coffee isn't made from poop either.

Where...oh where...is the spirit of adventure. So it's got a little poop on it...