I had an X for a couple of weeks and then an XS just to check the problem was still there and both iphones gave me eye strain and migraines. I changed to an s10 in April this year and have been using it without issues. I'm still checking this thread though as I would consider going back if they brought out a new oled display I could use without these issues.
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Other Eye-strain while using iPhone X and up
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I had an X for a couple of weeks and then an XS just to check the problem was still there and both iphones gave me eye strain and migraines. I changed to an s10 in April this year and have been using it without issues. I'm still checking this thread though as I would consider going back if they brought out a new oled display I could use without these issues.
sagiicorn
macrumors newbie
Talk about eye strain. I’m only 48 years old here. I can barely read any of the print on any of the app, features, or software. It’s just so damn tiny! How could any.company that sells these iPhones, smartphones, or even basic cell phones even have a market in the seniors community? They most likely can’t see anything compared to me.
One plus 7 pro has pwm and with low freq (200Hz)
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That 120 hz has nothing to do with flicker
Looks like another year of eye strain... (11 Pro)
iPhone 11 it is...
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One Plus 7 has DC dimming options that significantly mitigates the PWM issue
iPhone 11 it is...
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One Plus 7 has DC dimming options that significantly mitigates the PWM issue
TDDM
macrumors 6502
I'm still at work and couldn't watch the event, did they mention this in the keynote?
"Apple’s also upgraded the display to a new OLED panel, which goes up to an even brighter 1,200 nits, a 2 million to 1 contrast ratio, and is 15 percent more energy efficient."
Any chance this could lead to a better PWM implementation?
Anyone else find it ironic that Apples new blockbuster “See” was showcased and they did nothing to their “Pro” phone’s display for increased usage, accessibility and eye health?
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I seriously doubt it. I would LOVE to be wrong and would be very happy to purchase it.
Just here to say that it is most likely another year of:
iPhone 11 Pro and iPhone 11 Pro Max -- PWM
iPhone 11 -- No PWM (fingers crossed)
Apparently, the iPhone 12 is going to be redesigned, so here is hoping they do not use PWM there. I feel like I said the exact same thing one year ago...
iPhone 11 Pro and iPhone 11 Pro Max -- PWM
iPhone 11 -- No PWM (fingers crossed)
Apparently, the iPhone 12 is going to be redesigned, so here is hoping they do not use PWM there. I feel like I said the exact same thing one year ago...
TDDM
macrumors 6502
Could be wrong, but I think the 1HZ thing only applies to the always on display aspect. I’m definitely gonna get the S5, my S1 watch is way past its prime 😀
TDDM
macrumors 6502
Considering that we literally can’t use the phone at all, I’m sure most of us would be alright with a hit to picture quality if it removed PWM 😛
francerex
macrumors member
It is well worth the upgrade! The s4 is a fantastic device
Yeah the 1hz only comes with the always on display. But I mostly use the watch for quick glances at time and notifications, which should be visible on the AoD. I would love to remove any possible cause of strain
So much this
miniyou64
macrumors 6502a
sagiicorn
macrumors newbie
I do realize that. I have tried increasing the size. It doesn’t make much of a difference. The increase in print size is minimal.
johannnn
macrumors 68030
You can’t read the text when the iOS accessibility text size is set to max? That text is huge. Have you played around with the accessibility zoom feature?
Well, i have just resigned on oled phones, gonna buy 128gb ip8 or ip8 plus (which are finally reqsonably priced) and gonna stay on it for several years... apple is charging too much today for new iphones which aint any better that much cheaper android phones
miniyou64
macrumors 6502a
I really want iPhone 11 Pro. But I am a pro user, use my phone constantly and I don’t think I can take the constant headaches. Its equally unbelievable that Apple hasn’t fixed the problem and that places like Macrumors have not covered that this pwm problem exists.
But maybe the new display of the pro is going to be better concerning pwm?!
Maybe anyone made a video during the hands on...?
Maybe anyone made a video during the hands on...?
GlenK
macrumors 68000
This is what bothers me the most. They don't even acknowledge the issue and appear to not be making efforts to correct it.
austyn23
macrumors 6502a
We have to wait for "real" users; no one on the hands on post event is going to criticize apple... IMO
And if they fixed the PWM; I think they would not have mentioned it in the event, is like saying "we had a problem, now is fixed".
user1234
macrumors 6502a
If Apple solves the problem with PWM in OLED displays they would sure talk about their innovative new screen technology on stage. Color accurate OLED without PWM is not a thing yet, and it's a difficult problem to solve unfortunately. I really hope they have engineers on this, because the same problem will exist with MicroLED
TDDM
macrumors 6502
I agree, they'd definitely make it a huge talking point if they solved the PWM issue.
I'm still slightly hopeful though, because:
-Apple said this is a new OLED screen (This is important because some people have said that they only have issues with Apple's PWM, but not other android phones. Maybe this new oled screen is better?)
-They don't necessarily need to completely solve PWM, they could've just increased the Hz rate like other phones
-DC Dimming seems to help certain people with the symptoms (iOS14 maybe?)
On a related note, I've been looking at comment sections on articles and videos on PWM, and it's kinda funny seeing all these comments like "Huh, I've had headaches from my phone for years, is THIS why?"
I wonder how many people out there just put up with the headaches and eye strain because they have no idea about the horrible flickering 😕
user1234
macrumors 6502a
They could raise the frequency, but there are no OLED devices that I know of that use much higher frequencies than 250-260 Hz. I think there's still a technical limitation preventing higher frequencies. DC dimming is the true solution, but LEDs tend to color shift to a ridiculous level when dimmed in this way. Not good for color accuracy, and it would look aweful at low brightness levels.
It could be an accessibility option I guess, but for it to be truly as good as I can be it needs to be implemented as the primary brightness control method. We need a technological breakthrough for the flicker issue to be solved with OLED and MicroLED. And it needs to be solved because I expect MicroLED to be everywhere when the technology is ready. It solves the biggest issue with OLED (aside from flicker) and that is "burn-in" and uneven ageing.
I think it's sad that the industry isn't paying more attention to this. There are even studies and recommendations when it comes to flickering light. Very few LED light sources live up to these recommendations, and as far as I know, no OLED phones do (at least out of the box). It has been said that there are OLED phones that don't use PWM but I haven't been able to find solid confirmation.
That people go around experiencing headaches, migraines and other symptoms from using their digital devices, and even walking around at home or at stores with badly engineered LED light sources is just unacceptable. That most people doesn't even realize why is even worse. I have heard from people that regularly have headaches that they've been to see their doctor and been told that having headaches regularly can be due to stress and all kinds of things, which it can, but very few doctors know that flickering light also can be a reason. Not even neurologists I have met are aware of this problem, which they absolutely should be.
What makes the issue with LED light sources even more sad is that it's really easy to make an LED light source that doesn't flicker. It costs a few cents more per unit, maybe a dollar, and this would be a non-issue for light sources. Instead it's nearly impossible to know which ones will trigger a migraine and which will be fine without testing every single batch of products bought. Let's hope this will be brought to the attention of smart people whose opinions has some real weight.
So buy the 11 "without" Pro? So we get an non PWM screen...