Other Eye-strain while using iPhone X and up

[PwmMen]

I've ordered it myself. It arrives tomorrow.
I couldn't help it as it's the only iPhone from the 14 series that I haven't tested yet.

 

[5105973]

Hello. I have also a iPhone XR , can’t use the iPad mini led without feel not perfect and same with oled phones or laptops.
Even with strong Wi-Fi I get sometimes a problem.

I don’t know what’s the reasons for anyone, but for me it’s for sure because I have Asperger. A very high function version , so for me even the plus side is much much more on this condition then negative effects. But one negative effect is for sure to react much more sensitive for touch, noise and light (stroboscopic light, Silvester rockets, laser shows sometimes , fast moving lights …..).
Maybe some of you have a problem because of same reason and don’t even know, I did very late learn about my condition, always thought the others are little different 😊.

Yes I’m sensitive to all of that stuff (not sure about the WiFi), and smells. Covid temporarily impaired my sense of smell and it was the first time I felt like I knew what it was like to be “normal” like my husband and live life not hyper aware of every scent. I still don’t think I have fully regained my original sense of smell. I do want it back. To put it in Harry Potter terms, I’m tired of being a Nose-Muggle. It’s boring. I want my Wizard Nose back. 😆

I’m not diagnosed with any kind of neuro divergence, my official diagnosis is “atypical migraine”, but I’m a female in my mid 50’s and girls just weren’t evaluated at all for ADHD, nor subtle manifestations of autism, and especially not in my lower economic class nor ethnicity in my schooldays.

I do have much younger fully affluent male cousins who were diagnosed with ADHD and now have a daughter who I’m hoping to have evaluated for ADHD over the summer. So I suppose it’s possible I have something along those lines that’s slipped through the cracks. Goodness knows, even now, my daughter just narrowly slipped through the cracks. But that’s due to the pandemic.

It’s an interesting theory to follow up on. But I suspect pwm isn’t good for ANYONE, whether they suffer noticeable symptoms or not. I’m sure temporal dithering that Apple now enforces on the LCD’s isn’t a treat for the nervous system, either.

I’m now back on my iPhone 11 for general web surfing and emails. I decided I can’t afford any more falls or crashing my head into hard objects. Losing coordination seems to be my main symptom of pwm sensitivity on the 14 Pro Max.

But I’ve still got my sim in my iPhone 14 Pro Max. I still fully intend to use it. I’ll even watch videos on it. I’m just not going to use it enough that it messes me up enough to walk around like a drunken monkey.

 

[happy orchard]

My fingers are itching to try the iPhone 14 Plus as the PWM curve is so incredibly smooth.
Anyone else have experience with the iPhone 14 Plus?

As a general rule for living, I don't really like to discourage people.

However, the 14 Plus bothered me just while I was in the Apple Store. My eyes were practically flinching, trying to get away from the screen. My head felt a little off, and after less than five minutes I was nauseated.

For reference, I could almost use the 14 Pro and Pro Max models. Brought them home. Made it many days before I realized my nervous system was just struggling and returned them.

...In case any of that helps you gauge how you might do with the 14 Plus.

 

[happy orchard]

I've ordered it myself. It arrives tomorrow.
I couldn't help it as it's the only iPhone from the 14 series that I haven't tested yet.

And I really hope it works for you.

 

[Sultan13]

Yes I’m sensitive to all of that stuff (not sure about the WiFi), and smells. Covid temporarily impaired my sense of smell and it was the first time I felt like I knew what it was like to be “normal” like my husband and live life not hyper aware of every scent. I still don’t think I have fully regained my original sense of smell. I do want it back. To put it in Harry Potter terms, I’m tired of being a Nose-Muggle. It’s boring. I want my Wizard Nose back. 😆

I’m not diagnosed with any kind of neuro divergence, my official diagnosis is “atypical migraine”, but I’m a female in my mid 50’s and girls just weren’t evaluated at all for ADHD, nor subtle manifestations of autism, and especially not in my lower economic class nor ethnicity in my schooldays.

I do have much younger fully affluent male cousins who were diagnosed with ADHD and now have a daughter who I’m hoping to have evaluated for ADHD over the summer. So I suppose it’s possible I have something along those lines that’s slipped through the cracks. Goodness knows, even now, my daughter just narrowly slipped through the cracks. But that’s due to the pandemic.

It’s an interesting theory to follow up on. But I suspect pwm isn’t good for ANYONE, whether they suffer noticeable symptoms or not. I’m sure temporal dithering that Apple now enforces on the LCD’s isn’t a treat for the nervous system, either.

I’m now back on my iPhone 11 for general web surfing and emails. I decided I can’t afford any more falls or crashing my head into hard objects. Losing coordination seems to be my main symptom of pwm sensitivity on the 14 Pro Max.

But I’ve still got my sim in my iPhone 14 Pro Max. I still fully intend to use it. I’ll even watch videos on it. I’m just not going to use it enough that it messes me up enough to walk around like a drunken monkey.

Knowing why our brain gets some conditions different and why we think different is big plus in our cases. So we can enjoy big plus sides and reduce the negative parts.

So all in all it’s a big win. But for oled displays amd some other we need to take care more to feel comfortable to be in „always happy“ state all the time.

Good to hear you feel same.

 

[Proteinaceous]

Yes it is definitely not just the flicker or pwm rate which causes the headache/migraine/motion sickness. I used an iPhone X without any issue for 3 years (apparently this had the worst pwm). I couldn't use the 12 series or the 13 series. It's probably the display engine/driver on the newer apple devices which is causing issues for people with some degree of astigmatism. From a medical point of view, the easiest way to explain it is that when you have astigmatism, the image from the screen doesn't land directly onto your retina. This causes ciliary muscle spasm/movement which leads to the feeling of motion sickness/migraine. I personally don't have any issue using many other Samsung, hauwei devices with OLED. I just can't bring myself to switch to Android, as my iPhone 11 still supports iOS 16 and works well enough for my needs.

The newer MacBook Pro line and iPad Pro may be causing migraines due to the slight offset that you are experiencing on your retina. The 120hz can also play a role, because your brain may be more comfortable with 60hz. This varies from person to person. I'm personally looking forward to the iPhone SE next year as long as it is more similar to the iPhone 11 then the iPhone XR.

Interesting hypothesis, but I’m not sure this is the cause for our issues. Though I do have astigmatism in both eyes, I wear glasses to correct the issue. Anecdotally, I know others that have astigmatism who use OLED phones with no problems. Astigmatism is also fairly common so if this was the cause, there would be a LOT more people reporting issues with OLED screens.

Having said that, certainly can’t rule out that it is a potential contributing factor (among other factors).

 

[moviemaster7777]

Long time lurker on this thread and have loved hearing everyone's experience, so I finally decided to share mine:

I've been an Android (Pixel) user since the beginning but have always thought about switching to iOS for many different reasons.

Two years ago I decided to buy a used iPhone 11 Pro and play around with it to see if I liked iOS or I wanted to stick with Android. This is when I learned about PWM issues first hand as I'd never had a problem with phones before, though not many I've owned were OLEDs.

Right out the box were headaches and almost a sinus pressure-like feeling. I could tell right off the bat that there was just something different about this phone's screen aside from resolution and brightness. Sent it right back, did some research online and came across this forum and learned about PWM issues.

Fast forward to last week, and again I've been feeling the itch to switch since the battery on my phone is struggling. Ordered a used iPhone 12 Pro Max, set it up with WP to 65%, attention off, dark mode, True Tone Off(and On) and for a few minutes was ok. But after playing around for about an hour on Youtube and with different apps I started feeling dizzy and like I couldn't focus. Headache and sinus pressure was back. Putting it down and walking away I still felt hazy and like my head wasn't right.

Went to sleep, woke up all better, and went back to my (OLED) Pixel 5 the next day, no issues. It might sounds dumb but the screen almost feels soothing? Tried the iPhone again the following day, same deal, looking like it's going back.

Really looking like the only option at this point would be an SE if I really wanted iOS. I know the 11 is LCD but part of me still thinks that while it is definitely a PWM issue, FaceID is contributing somehow. But definitely positive to hear that some people are having varying success with different 14 models. Might have to give it another try!

So an interesting update for me - I decided to put my SIM in the 12PM before I returned it and use it for a day or two as my daily. I noticed that I wasn't getting headaches or dizziness and the screen was starting to feel a little more like my Pixel 5? Occasionally i was having trouble focusing but not nearly as much or as bad as when I first set it up. I think for me, sitting at home in 1 or 2 rooms staring at it constantly made matters much worse initially, add to the fact that I was still using my Pixel 5 so I had something to compare it to. More interesting than that though, is the 13P finally came in the mail and I set about setting that up so I could try the physically smaller iPhone, but that started giving me headaches and dizziness all over again. Thinking I might give it a try anyways in a few days if it's a similar case to the 12PM, but very curious as to why the 13P gives issues when I would expect it to be better than the 12PM.

 

[jimmy_uk]

So an interesting update for me - I decided to put my SIM in the 12PM before I returned it and use it for a day or two as my daily. I noticed that I wasn't getting headaches or dizziness and the screen was starting to feel a little more like my Pixel 5? Occasionally i was having trouble focusing but not nearly as much or as bad as when I first set it up. I think for me, sitting at home in 1 or 2 rooms staring at it constantly made matters much worse initially, add to the fact that I was still using my Pixel 5 so I had something to compare it to. More interesting than that though, is the 13P finally came in the mail and I set about setting that up so I could try the physically smaller iPhone, but that started giving me headaches and dizziness all over again. Thinking I might give it a try anyways in a few days if it's a similar case to the 12PM, but very curious as to why the 13P gives issues when I would expect it to be better than the 12PM.

Every screen on every OLED phone is a lottery it would seem + all the software changes. 😞

 

[PwmMen]

Here is a video of the iPhone 14 Plus. It looks very quiet, very similar to the iPhone 12 Pro. But now the most important thing after about 5 hours of display use. I don't notice anything, not even a very slight discomfort. Except for the iPhone 12 Pro, I have never had that with any iPhone. The very flat PWM curve actually seems to have an effect. I'm surprised and I'll see if it stays that way over the next few days. Keep your fingers crossed.

 

[dstow]

Here is a video of the iPhone 14 Plus. It looks very quiet, very similar to the iPhone 12 Pro. But now the most important thing after about 5 hours of display use. I don't notice anything, not even a very slight discomfort. Except for the iPhone 12 Pro, I have never had that with any iPhone. The very flat PWM curve actually seems to have an effect. I'm surprised and I'll see if it stays that way over the next few days. Keep your fingers crossed.
View attachment 2103967

This fills me with hope - I can't face another 12 months for the 15 which for all we know will exhibit the same behaviour, I'm extremely close to finally pulling the trigger on the 14 Plus - Keep us updated!

 

[pwm away]

but very curious as to why the 13P gives issues when I would expect it to be better than the 12PM.

This could, in part, be due to the higher PWM frequency of the 13 Pro/Pro Max phones, compared to the 12 Pro/Pro Max ones, which didn't have ProMotion yet.

Linking my initial comment here, where I posted a table of the flicker percentage across a range of iPhones (PWM flicker percentages), even though I didn't test the 12 Pro/Pro Max models, I did test the whole 13 range; as you can see, the 12 is in a much lower range than the 13 Pro/Pro Max, and could be a factor.

I'll be able to run the flicker meter across the 14 range in about 2 weeks time; I'll report back on what I find

 

[john g.]

Here is a video of the iPhone 14 Plus. It looks very quiet, very similar to the iPhone 12 Pro. But now the most important thing after about 5 hours of display use. I don't notice anything, not even a very slight discomfort. Except for the iPhone 12 Pro, I have never had that with any iPhone. The very flat PWM curve actually seems to have an effect. I'm surprised and I'll see if it stays that way over the next few days. Keep your fingers crossed.
View attachment 2103967

Just curious, are you saying that you've only used it for five hours total? Or that you had a five hour stint but you've had it for a couple of days?

Optimistic for you.
I haven't tried the 14+ other than in the store.
The regular 14 was good for me for a while until it wasn't.

Sure hope that's not the case for you!

 

[MICHAELSD]

Here is a video of the iPhone 14 Plus. It looks very quiet, very similar to the iPhone 12 Pro. But now the most important thing after about 5 hours of display use. I don't notice anything, not even a very slight discomfort. Except for the iPhone 12 Pro, I have never had that with any iPhone. The very flat PWM curve actually seems to have an effect. I'm surprised and I'll see if it stays that way over the next few days. Keep your fingers crossed.
View attachment 2103967

Better than the standard iPhone 14?

Notebookcheck has their English review so as to avoid confusion in translation.

Apple iPhone 14 Plus smartphone review - Better than the iPhone 14 with a bigger display?

The Apple iPhone 14 Plus is a 6.7-inch smartphone with iOS 16 and an OLED display with a resolution of 2778 x 1284 pixels. Apple uses the A15 Bionic SoC combined with 6 GB of RAM and up to 512 GB NVMe storage. The waterproof Apple smartphone also includes a 12-MP dual camera, emergency SOS, the...

www.notebookcheck.net

The iPhone 14 Plus very likely uses DC dimming to control its display brightness. Since Apple does not specify how controlling the display's brightness functions, we cannot be certain. In any case, the display flickers at a consistent 59 Hz at all the brightness settings we tested. Unlike displays that use PWM (pulse-width modulation) to control the brightness, which usually results in heavily fluctuating frequencies, the consistent flickering of the iPhone 14 Plus' screen should result in significantly less eyestrain and not be an issue even for sensitive users.

Bold words. The flicker does appear flat between 50-75% brightness in particular.

 

[john g.]

Better than the standard iPhone 14?

Notebookcheck has their English review so as to avoid confusion in translation.

Apple iPhone 14 Plus smartphone review - Better than the iPhone 14 with a bigger display?

The Apple iPhone 14 Plus is a 6.7-inch smartphone with iOS 16 and an OLED display with a resolution of 2778 x 1284 pixels. Apple uses the A15 Bionic SoC combined with 6 GB of RAM and up to 512 GB NVMe storage. The waterproof Apple smartphone also includes a 12-MP dual camera, emergency SOS, the...

www.notebookcheck.net

The iPhone 14 Plus very likely uses DC dimming to control its display brightness. Since Apple does not specify how controlling the display's brightness functions, we cannot be certain. In any case, the display flickers at a consistent 59 Hz at all the brightness settings we tested. Unlike displays that use PWM (pulse-width modulation) to control the brightness, which usually results in heavily fluctuating frequencies, the consistent flickering of the iPhone 14 Plus' screen should result in significantly less eyestrain and not be an issue even for sensitive users.

Bold words. The flicker does appear flat between 50-75% brightness in particular.

Part of me cannot believe that you haven't tried it yet

 

[moviemaster7777]

This could, in part, be due to the higher PWM frequency of the 13 Pro/Pro Max phones, compared to the 12 Pro/Pro Max ones, which didn't have ProMotion yet.

Linking my initial comment here, where I posted a table of the flicker percentage across a range of iPhones (PWM flicker percentages), even though I didn't test the 12 Pro/Pro Max models, I did test the whole 13 range; as you can see, the 12 is in a much lower range than the 13 Pro/Pro Max, and could be a factor.

I'll be able to run the flicker meter across the 14 range in about 2 weeks time; I'll report back on what I find

I thought that the higher refresh rate of the ProMotion screens would effectively make the flicker so fast it was unnoticeable. Going off of your tests, the 12 (since you didn't test the 12PM but should be the same) is less than half of the percentage of the 13P, which would back up my experiences. Wondering if when you test the 14 line you can try turning ProMotion off for some of the tests to see if that has any effect.

 

[MICHAELSD]

Part of me cannot believe that you haven't tried it yet

I’m strategically waiting for the extended holiday return window.

I would like to think that Apple’s display team monitors this thread so we’re providing valuable feedback about what does and doesn’t work. I’m still optimistic they took my suggestion of just copying the Apple Watch brightness controller, which is also 60Hz. If I had to guess there’s probably more to the story we need to figure out and certain brightness levels may have extremely low amplitudes whereas others still had to use some degree of PWM.

The charts appear different between iPhone 14 and iPhone 14 Plus, perhaps better on the Plus. I assume the larger battery allows them more freedom for lower amplitudes, although iPhone 13 Mini has the best thus far and that has the smallest battery of that generation.

 

[dimitricook]

Very cool that the 14plus has no PWM due to Notebookcheck
I assume that we can call the 14 dimming the same since it almost measured the same right?
It is very strange the Notebookcheck writes something very different for both phones about the pwm/dc dimming. I think there where different teams or people reviewing the phones.

 

[john g.]

Very cool that the 14plus has no PWM due to Notebookcheck
I assume that we can call the 14 dimming the same since it almost measured the same right?
It is very strange the Notebookcheck writes something very different for both phones about the pwm/dc dimming. I think there where different teams or people reviewing the phones.

I was just going to post a similar thing. Can anyone explain to me why the 14+ screen would be any different (or better) than the regular size 14?

 

[happy orchard]

Better than the standard iPhone 14?

Notebookcheck has their English review so as to avoid confusion in translation.

Apple iPhone 14 Plus smartphone review - Better than the iPhone 14 with a bigger display?

The Apple iPhone 14 Plus is a 6.7-inch smartphone with iOS 16 and an OLED display with a resolution of 2778 x 1284 pixels. Apple uses the A15 Bionic SoC combined with 6 GB of RAM and up to 512 GB NVMe storage. The waterproof Apple smartphone also includes a 12-MP dual camera, emergency SOS, the...

www.notebookcheck.net

The iPhone 14 Plus very likely uses DC dimming to control its display brightness. Since Apple does not specify how controlling the display's brightness functions, we cannot be certain. In any case, the display flickers at a consistent 59 Hz at all the brightness settings we tested. Unlike displays that use PWM (pulse-width modulation) to control the brightness, which usually results in heavily fluctuating frequencies, the consistent flickering of the iPhone 14 Plus' screen should result in significantly less eyestrain and not be an issue even for sensitive users.

Bold words. The flicker does appear flat between 50-75% brightness in particular.

I have a hard time believing there is no PWM on the 14 Plus. I can freakin' see the flicker.

Maybe this is a translation thing? Maybe it was supposed to say "Unlike OTHER displays that use PWM..."

My trust in notebookcheck is pretty much gone.

All that said, I'm still happy it's working for some people.

 

[MICHAELSD]

I have a hard time believing there is no PWM on the 14 Plus. I can freakin' see the flicker.

Maybe this is a translation thing? Maybe it was supposed to say "Unlike OTHER displays that use PWM..."

My trust in notebookcheck is pretty much gone.

All that said, I'm still happy it's working for some people.

The appearance of the display flickering in slow-motion makes me extremely skeptical. However, Apple Watch also has a constant 60Hz flicker so it’s still possible for it to work. The flicker in slow-motion looks similar.

 

[MICHAELSD]

Deleted, but it was a video of the Apple Watch in slow-motion that didn’t upload properly. The 60Hz flicker is more noticeable than expected, while at the same time I haven’t heard of PWM sensitivity to an Apple Watch since it flickers at 60Hz without using PWM. It seems plausible that’s what Apple has done on iPhone 14/iPhone 14 Plus, as it’s the only explanation for a consistent 60Hz rate.

 

[john g.]

I have had two different Apple watches over the past five years or so and not once have I had any symptoms from the watch. The regular 14 felt OK for a while and then lots of dizziness. So, it seems like lately the 14+ is somehow different. I'm very skeptical but I'll wait for other peoples findings.

Whether I try it for myself or not I haven't decided. I would probably wait for the extended return policy of the holiday season if I did.

I just don't see how or why the larger screen would be substantially better than the regular size vanilla 14.

 

[Chrispy]

I think there's definitely some benefit behind the use of a fixed frequency on the 14 line. I can verify that the 14 Plus screen very much flickers, so there is PWM at play, but not to control the dimming. You can see in slow motion video that the flickering doesn't change with brightness, it just becomes more noticeable the darker the screen gets because the flicker shows most on gray. Both the 14 (for the brief time I used it) and the 14 Plus are miles better than the 14 Pro was for me, and perhaps that is because the flicker is at a locked frequency. The majority of my issues with the 14 Plus came down to attributes of OLED in general, regardless of PWM. So I'm likely becoming a less reliable resource for PWM sensitivity if all OLED is off-putting to me.

Fingers crossed for everyone out there still trying to find a device that fits you well! Everyone is different, so don't give up until you feel like it's not worth the energy anymore. At this point, I'm content sitting things out to see what happens with the updated SE, but I'm a fairly light phone user so not a huge deal for me. I would just like to have something fresh and new after four years with the good ol' XR.

 

[francerex]

Deleted, but it was a video of the Apple Watch in slow-motion that didn’t upload properly. The 60Hz flicker is more noticeable than expected, while at the same time I haven’t heard of PWM sensitivity to an Apple Watch since it flickers at 60Hz without using PWM. It seems plausible that’s what Apple has done on iPhone 14/iPhone 14 Plus, as it’s the only explanation for a consistent 60Hz rate.

tbh, I believe that not many complain simply because people do not stare at their watch for extended periods of time

I am fine with my series 4, but I remember having eye-strain when I first set it up

I have a hard time believing there is no PWM on the 14 Plus. I can freakin' see the flicker.

Maybe this is a translation thing? Maybe it was supposed to say "Unlike OTHER displays that use PWM..."

My trust in notebookcheck is pretty much gone.

All that said, I'm still happy it's working for some people.

Yeah, it's probably a translation issue. The plus is exactly like the regular 14.

The flickering is constant but still there.

 

[The.Glorious.Son]

I have been trying to be content with my 11 but after Apple botched two battery replacements in a row, resulting in my needing a third battery and a new screen, now I am having reception issues I didn't have before as well as screen dimming due to internal heat I suppose. For my needs I must have minimum 256GB and there are no models available in the Apple Refurb section (I won't purchase second-hand elsewhere).

I am hoping that on 11/1, the extended return window will open as I do not want to try another 14 with only a 14 day return window. Even if common sense says one should know if they are impacted by the PWM much sooner than that, having a good go with one of the phones could be self sabotaged with my anxiety as I get closer to the point of no return. I would take a beating on resale and I don't want to do that on principle alone.

So, I am going to try the 14PM again now that the chiropractor has my neck and headaches under control. I just cannot get myself to even try the vanilla 14. Does that seem irrational to others? I realize no matter what, a usable, eye comfortable 14 is better than my 11 but on the other hand, I think I would be jaded not having the features of the pro models. Particularly when it comes to the front and rear cameras and brightness levels of the screen. The 14 would have to be AS comfortable on my eyes as the 11 for me to have internal peace. Did I mention I hate this sh**?