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Other Eye-strain while using iPhone X and up
- Thread starter Kitkad
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Everybody reacts different on these panels. The Xiaomi 13t is the favorite of the community on Reddit. Lot of people are happy with this phone. With the 14 series they tried someting new and it doesn't work for everyone. Followed with Motorola edge 40 or the 50 now days. The Honor 200 is interesting and I'm curious about reviews of PWM sensitive people for the Oneplus nord 4. But of course the LCD panels remain the best and safest options for us. I'm also curious about the Google Pixel 9 launching this Tuesday. They are also using the new Samsung panels. I'm curious if made any improvement regarding this issue.
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These anti-flicker settings don’t help enough to be a definitive fix for everyone. It seems like mainly those who already aren’t sensitive appreciate them after learning of PWM.
Apple solved this with Apple Watch nearly a decade ago. Practically nobody is sensitive to the Apple Watch, and that’s because of an ultra low-modulation flicker that corresponds to the refresh rate—not the size of the device.
Apple solved this with Apple Watch nearly a decade ago. Practically nobody is sensitive to the Apple Watch, and that’s because of an ultra low-modulation flicker that corresponds to the refresh rate—not the size of the device.
My Apple watch doesn't bother me because I never look at it directly more than 30 sec or so. But if they figured it out why can't they do the same for the phones? Or what's the reason we haven't DC dimming from 100-50% brightness? Or just higher PWM? Does it have to do with battery efficiency? Burn in risk? Color accuracy?
You guys think MicroLED will be the solution in future phones to the PWM issues some are experiencing?
"Everybody reacts different":- this is why I posted the user comment. There is still no magic bullet despite some Chinese manufacturer's attempts to make some changes. It's still random and user-specific. I'm going to miss the LCD days.....
Exactly.
I am probably in the most sensitive bracket. I cant even peak over at my daughter on her new Ipad without feeling rubbish.
Yet I had an Iphone X for 3 years without a single issue.
But how could you have used the iPhone X for 3 years if you are very sensitive user? . Do you still get any symptoms if you use the iPhone X? Or did your symptoms start after abusing your eyes using the iPhone for 3 years? If so, I think more people will get symptoms after years using these OLED screens.
The iPhone SE 4 looks like the perfect iPhone for those who don’t care about the notch, and don’t need the latest camera technology. However, it will come with OLED screens.
If it comes with exactly the same form factor as the iPhone 14, maybe it will relatively easy to replace the cheap OLED panel for a good LCD screen without losing features such as the dual ambient light sensor. Fingers crossed 🤞🏻
Or maybe Chinese BOE manufacturer uses a higher frequency PWM for those panels. I have the feeling that BOE panels don’t bother my eyes as much as Samsung or LG ones, from the little I’ve been able to test them on the 14 series. But I’m not optimistic.
Hey Apple, are you even reading this thread? FFS, WE ARE EAGER TO SPEND OUR MONIES ON YOUR FLAGSHIP PHONES AND TABLETS AND LAPTOPS (in the future), JUST FIND A ****ING SOLUITON LIKE SOME CHINESE COMPANIES ARE DOING WITH ULTRA HIGH PWM FREQUENCIES!!!
If it comes with exactly the same form factor as the iPhone 14, maybe it will relatively easy to replace the cheap OLED panel for a good LCD screen without losing features such as the dual ambient light sensor. Fingers crossed 🤞🏻
Or maybe Chinese BOE manufacturer uses a higher frequency PWM for those panels. I have the feeling that BOE panels don’t bother my eyes as much as Samsung or LG ones, from the little I’ve been able to test them on the 14 series. But I’m not optimistic.
Hey Apple, are you even reading this thread? FFS, WE ARE EAGER TO SPEND OUR MONIES ON YOUR FLAGSHIP PHONES AND TABLETS AND LAPTOPS (in the future), JUST FIND A ****ING SOLUITON LIKE SOME CHINESE COMPANIES ARE DOING WITH ULTRA HIGH PWM FREQUENCIES!!!
The new Pixels are out and its bad like always..
Nick from AndroidCentral tested the phone out:
The Pixel 9 series utilizes 240Hz PWM dimming across the board, meaning the Pixel now has the slowest PWM rate on any major phone. The lone exception is the Galaxy Z Flip 6. We know that Pixel displays can push this number 20x higher, so we're not sure why Google hasn't made any positive changes yet.
The new pixels use the same new M14 OLED displays of Samsung which the iPhone 16 line up will also use. So this is kind of bad news. But maybe Apple will do some magic on their own. Who knows. Lets stay positive
Nick from AndroidCentral tested the phone out:
The Pixel 9 series utilizes 240Hz PWM dimming across the board, meaning the Pixel now has the slowest PWM rate on any major phone. The lone exception is the Galaxy Z Flip 6. We know that Pixel displays can push this number 20x higher, so we're not sure why Google hasn't made any positive changes yet.
The new pixels use the same new M14 OLED displays of Samsung which the iPhone 16 line up will also use. So this is kind of bad news. But maybe Apple will do some magic on their own. Who knows. Lets stay positive
The X must have been at a Hz that didnt bother me, cant explain it. There are quite a few like me.
Upgraded to 11pro, that plus every OLED screen since is awful after only a few seconds.
I have no Iphone X to re-test anymore.
And btw, 'abuse my eyes'? 🤣
We need to find someone famous yet broke enough to accept a bit of cash from us to claim they have PWM issues and take it to the press against Apple 😀.
Why cant anyone famous have our condition?
Yeah… IKR.
Hey Marques, you’re the biggest tech influencer. I’m pretty sure Apple will hear you. If you’re reading this, please make a video talking about this issue and ask Apple to follow the path other Chinese brands have, adopting a much higher frequency PWM.
Why I’m not asking DC dimming, you may ask? As far as I know, OLED displays need to use PWM to work properly. So I think it’s way more likely for Apple to adopt this 1.000-2.000Hz frequency rates for the PWM, that is already being used in the industry, and make it easier to use for the vast majority, instead of asking for a solution that Apple would refuse to allow because of their disadvantages on an OLED screen.
Dave (Dave2D), if you’re reading this, it would be nice if you made a video about this as well.
Honestly I don’t know any other famous person in the tech world that Apple would listen to. Maybe iJustine but I honestly doubt she will complain about anything regarding Apple.
And, honestly, I think the units that reviewers, press and techfluencers receive are highly cherry-picked to offer the best displays with the less amount of discoloration or green-pink tint, with better viewing angles and, who knows, maybe finely tuned PWM to be as comfortable as possible, regardless of the manufacturing costs of such units.
Why don’t you write them 🤓. I did write them. They didn’t respond. But if more people try maybe they will listen. I’ve noticed YouTubers mention PWM in there reviews but only with the Chinese phones. Which is positive but they don’t really care. Or they truly understand if the phone if have a good implementation to help this issue. So if more people address this who knows. Even try to write Apple, Samsung or Google. Let your voices be heard instead of complaining here.
The only person who is really addressing this issue is Nick from Android central. Back in the days Zollotech was also one of us. But he is lucky and the new phones don’t bother him.
There is no chance that Marques would risk his relationship with Apple, especially considering he has one-to-one interviews with the CEO, Tim Cook. While he might explain what PWM is, he wouldn't go as far as to "suggest" to Apple how they should improve it.
As for Samsung, they couldn't care less about PWM and are the primary manufacturer of OLED displays. Although Apple may request customised displays from Samsung, they ultimately have to accept whatever Samsung has developed for the upcoming cycle. Additionally, there's the issue of competition: if Apple were to adjust their displays, it could potentially have a negative impact on colour accuracy and battery life—risks they cannot afford to take, as it might make the competition look more appealing.
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While not exactly the same I find the fact Android Central has had (some) empirical coverage on PWM and other display issues to be encouraging.
I am patiently waiting for the iPhone 16 like everyone here, but I have little hope that they made any improvments regarding this issue. I have been reading and looking in to these android phones with high PWM or with DC dimming. And I have been using iOS so long. So to be honest i'm really getting more excited to try someting new out. Like the Xiaomi 13, Honor 200, Motrola Edge, Razr or the OnePlus. Maybe I'll be lucky and I can use these phone's witouth any issue or very light symptons like some people on Reddit. And I can get a modern phone with better screen and camera. My iPhone 11 looks so bad and outdated after 5 years usage. One thing I have learned is I won't ever upgrade my phone after 2 years again. I have saved lot of money because PWM. My iPhone 11 did a real good job for 5 years but it's really time to upgrade now. If Apple can't provide me someting good. It's time for someting new and different. Maybe I will love Android or maybe I will hate it. But i will get someting new and a modern looking phone. And if i do get symptons from these phones it will be very depressing....
I made the Pixel 8 Pro's display 20x better with a single line of code
And all it took was the work of a humble genius in the custom ROM community.
www.androidcentral.com
It's possible but it affects the color accurcy on the Google Pixel. But the Chinese phones don't have these issues with high PWM. So they just have to do more research?
I'm not suggesting Apple couldn't do it - I don't think they care to (money/time/resource).I made the Pixel 8 Pro's display 20x better with a single line of code
And all it took was the work of a humble genius in the custom ROM community.
It's possible but it affects the color accurcy on the Google Pixel. But the Chinese phones don't have these issues with high PWM. So they just have to do more research?
It’s guaranteed that more than a few employees have read parts of this thread, and my guess is they just laugh.
Apologies if this has already been addressed, but I'm curious to hear whether people sensitive to PWM also experience discomfort under LED lighting in general.
I myself don't have any issues with headaches, eye strain, etc with my iPhone 15 Pro display, but at the same time I DO notice the flickering on it, especially if I move the phone across my field of vision. I also notice a similar effect when waving a hand under LED lighting. Again, it doesn't cause headaches or anything but it's pretty ugly to see and makes me almost want to go back to good old incandescent lighting.
Anyway, again, curious how the PWM-sensitive folks experience LEDs.
I myself don't have any issues with headaches, eye strain, etc with my iPhone 15 Pro display, but at the same time I DO notice the flickering on it, especially if I move the phone across my field of vision. I also notice a similar effect when waving a hand under LED lighting. Again, it doesn't cause headaches or anything but it's pretty ugly to see and makes me almost want to go back to good old incandescent lighting.
Anyway, again, curious how the PWM-sensitive folks experience LEDs.
I am a photographer and I use Nikon cameras with electronic viewfinders so I put my eye up to the viewfinder and instead of seeing the subject via a mirror the screen changes to a viewfinder which is electronic.
The viewfinder is OLED and over say a wedding day I take 3000 shots so I expose my eyes to OLED for a lot,
Not heard of anyone suffering from these but I have no pain or side effects.
I've seen conflicting accounts of the PWM on the iphone 13,14 and 15.
I have an 11 which gives me no issues but is broken. 13 pro is OK. I just tried 14 pro and it burns my eyes, causes tearing etc. I tried a 15 pro in store and seemed uncomfortable. Is the 14 pro 480hz at highest brightness or 240 hz? What about 15 pro? I know this has been discussed here but after a year or two (in the case of the 14 pro) I wondered if a consensus had emerged? One wrinkle is the 13 pro I have is a work phone and the other would be personal, so I'd be switching periodically between the two. Wonder if I should just get a refurbed 13 pro.
I have an 11 which gives me no issues but is broken. 13 pro is OK. I just tried 14 pro and it burns my eyes, causes tearing etc. I tried a 15 pro in store and seemed uncomfortable. Is the 14 pro 480hz at highest brightness or 240 hz? What about 15 pro? I know this has been discussed here but after a year or two (in the case of the 14 pro) I wondered if a consensus had emerged? One wrinkle is the 13 pro I have is a work phone and the other would be personal, so I'd be switching periodically between the two. Wonder if I should just get a refurbed 13 pro.