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Goodbye Apple TV, Playstation 3 rules!
- Thread starter petvas
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I like having a HD optical drive, having an actual OS option to use, streaming 1080p HD content, upgrading the HD easily, playing games and I now like the idea of having DRM free recorded TV content that I can use on any player of my choosing. None of this theTV can do. All of it, it should be able to do.
You clearly don't understand the role the
TV was designed to play in your entertainment center. It's a remote head for iTunes, that basically all it is meant for. It does this task VERY well. I understand that if iTunes lacks the content you want or is too expensive (such is the case for much of Europe) it would not be a compelling device. As for 1080p, it will be literally years before being realistic to stream 1080p over the internet. By that time an updated device can be made. For the time being, it's not worth the extra cost to support it.
Games? Are you nuts, by your logic, every cable company is missing the boat by not supporting games in their receivers. It's not a game machine and it's not worth the extra cost to support it.
DRM-Free recorded TV? What makes you say that the
TV can't support it. If you record the show, you can put it in any format you want. How does the PS3 support this any differently? Now if you mean, the purchase of DRM-free TV; well, it's still 2008, can you point me to ANYBODY who offers this? If somebody was to supply DRM-free TV content, there would be nothing stopping you from watching it on the TV anyway.A custom OS on a streaming TV head? for gods sake, what on earth for? That's not even remotely related to it's function. (BTW with a little bit of hacking you can install full OSX on it, but why would you?)
A bigger HDD? again why? It's a streamer. It plays over your network. Smart sync rules limit the need for it further. The money you would be spending on a new HDD would be better spent on an 'N' router.
Why play physical media? A drive is VERY expensive and not part of the role of a streamer.
Here are some of the important things that the PS3 can't do:
Seamless sync with iTunes
Add content directly from TV UI
Rent/buy Movies
Buy TV Shows
AirTunes speaker for iTunes
Reverse sync purchased Movies and TV shows back to iTunes
Realtime stream video Podcasts (underrated feature)
I think its funny after all this arguing just sitting back and realizing the only reason people are buying PS3s are for Blu-Ray players not because of their games...all 12 of them.
I've had my PS3 for four months and finally picked up a game. And I am LOVING "Rockband" to death!
Yeah it is funny watching a guy trying to defend his PS3 purchase decision.
Even for use as a Blue Ray player ...
That's the ticket ....' I want a Blue Ray player so instead of buying a dedicated Blue Ray player, I'll buy a gaming console! '
Just got finished watching ' Bandits " on our Apple TV .... was not a bad movie.
Funny i just bought a ps3 for GTA and ratchet and clank..dont really care about blue-ray...i have an apple TV ever since it's introduction...and i do have to say the ps3 is a lot better for streaming stuff to the tv..especially non-apple supported videos..i dont need to convert my divx anymore..
the only thing ps3 can't do is sync with itunes, which is a pain..and rent/buy videos...but the selection is so bad anyway for the apple tv i couldn't care about the latter
While the movie section is a definite work in progress, the TV selection is excellent as compared to every other provider (now if they could just get BSG...). Every non-NBC show I have looked for is available.
Keep in mind that the
TV is ment for people who purchase content BTW - with a minimum of fuss, you can add DivX Support (and many other formats)to the
TV via Perian. Just Google Patchstick for details.For twice the price I not only get superior quality in terms of video playback, but can play PS2/3 games and DVD's? Sounds like a better value to me.
The movies and TV shows that I can download with the PS3 XMB are of lower quality then the
TV because they don't exist! The main function of the TV is content delivery to your TV. What you get with a PS3 is wishful thinking that it may have this function at some point in the future.If this functionality is not important to you, well it's hardly a surprise that for you the
TV does not seem like a good value. It would be like comparing a cabinet to a refrigerator and not taking in consideration that one keeps things cold. If you only need a box with shelves, a refrigerator is not a good value. Not that the PS3 is a bad value, but what you are getting is a device with relatively little overlap in functionality compared to the
TV.you get what you pay for. i couldn't agree more though. ps3 is so much more than an apple-tv and will always be. i bought my ps3 the first day it came out here in japan and while i have considered the purchase of an apple-tv, i find the apple-tv redundant. yes, the ps3 is more money but one could easily make the same argument that macs being just that bit more expensive - and that also it's just that bit more enjoyable to use.
ps3 is a good buy and i'm willing to bet that maybe some people here own a ps3, most do not. if i had both and i had to chuck one, apple-tv is gone.
ps3 is a good buy and i'm willing to bet that maybe some people here own a ps3, most do not. if i had both and i had to chuck one, apple-tv is gone.
I believe that in-terms of value, the PS3 wins. Even thought, Steve Jobs said 'no computer required' for the Apple TV, it's still pretty much an extension to iTunes.
I bought my 60GB PS3 for $599, the UI is okay-ish. I like the flash memory card slots, USB ports, and the ability to install Linux on it. (I know....)
The Apple TV for me is just a movie rental device since I rather watch a full length movie on a TV set than a computer monitor.
I bought my 60GB PS3 for $599, the UI is okay-ish. I like the flash memory card slots, USB ports, and the ability to install Linux on it. (I know....)
The Apple TV for me is just a movie rental device since I rather watch a full length movie on a TV set than a computer monitor.
The $399 PS3 does NOT play PS2 games. That's part of how they dropped it to $399. The other models do.
And from someone who Sony got $450 out of for PS2 units, let me tell you that they were NOT reliable as DVD players. The first unit stopped playing DVDs within a year. It also stopped playing games (literally) before 2 years, interestingly enough at about the time when they launched the slimmer version.
So before everybody gets their pants fancied over a PS3, do beware that just because it does something doesn't mean it does it well. Has everybody forgotten why people buy Apple products in the first place?
Blu Ray quality is great - I love it. I'll tell you what though, I have movies on blue ray, but my wife watches them in low res 4:3 quality on our digital recorder (cable tv) because it's so easy if she wants to just dial up a movie and watch it, she doesn't have to get the disc out, wait for it to load, wait for the stupid logos and copyright warnings. So that's it. Personally I put the disc in, a, I notice the quality, b I paid for the disc, so I'm going to use it!
But for me the one single thing the PS3 does that just is it's resounding best feature ever is the upscaling of DVD's, man this thing on a 1080p good TV, makes DVD's just look fantastic. It's like all your DVD collection was suddenly made into a 720 collection.
Loading movies into the PS3 is a pain I don't have a fast network, it's at the tail end of my wireless network so damn slow, so I use a usb drive, but the whole process is boring and inconvenient, I don't bother usually.
What is the solution? I think right now blu ray is the solution, yes you have to pop the disc in etc, but it's worth it for the quality you get. If you want to download rental movies, you just have to buy an apple tv as well.
I'm not getting an apple tv until it's 1080, I personally I don't know why they didn't do that in the first place.
But for me the one single thing the PS3 does that just is it's resounding best feature ever is the upscaling of DVD's, man this thing on a 1080p good TV, makes DVD's just look fantastic. It's like all your DVD collection was suddenly made into a 720 collection.
Loading movies into the PS3 is a pain I don't have a fast network, it's at the tail end of my wireless network so damn slow, so I use a usb drive, but the whole process is boring and inconvenient, I don't bother usually.
What is the solution? I think right now blu ray is the solution, yes you have to pop the disc in etc, but it's worth it for the quality you get. If you want to download rental movies, you just have to buy an apple tv as well.
I'm not getting an apple tv until it's 1080, I personally I don't know why they didn't do that in the first place.
Obviously bringing up a Sony product and claiming it being better than an Apple product on a Mac forum, is deemed to stir up a lot of fuzz.
Entry level Apple TV (40Gb) is $229 and entry level PS3 (40Gb) is $399.
The PS3 plays more file formats than the Apple TV, not everything (mkv) and not with all features (srt/subs), but a lot more than the Apple TV.
The PS3 plays Blu-ray discs and does brilliant DVD upscaling. Whoever talked about the poor DVD playback on the PS2, that doesn't apply here.
Apple TV has video rentals, the PS3 doesn't. Not yet, but it's most likely on it's way. I still think that the iTunes library will be superior.
So it all comes down to what is important to you. Do you download a lot of films, TV series, etc. through torrents and other places, the PS3 is the choice. If you download a lot through iTunes and the video rental is appealing to you, the Apple TV is the choice. Better syncing with iTunes, or Blu-ray/Upscaling DVD player. You can't really compare the two. I have a PS3 and I'm loving it. As a Mac user for many years, I'm not even slightly interested in getting an Apple TV - I use Netflix and until the library of the iTunes rental can match it, I have no reason to switch.
My setup right now is MacBook Pro 2.6ghz with Medialink, works flawlessly with my PS3 that is hooked up with a 1Tb MyBook. The PS3 is hooked up to my Sony XBR4 TV through HDMI and the TV is connected to my Stereo which is also connected to my Airport Express AirTunes. It's fantastic, for me. I'm sure other people have great solutions with Apple TV, and I find it more interesting to hear about that than people trying to claim what is better. They are very different, period.
And as for the people throwing in punches about the weak gaming library of the PS3, you obviously never heard of...
Entry level Apple TV (40Gb) is $229 and entry level PS3 (40Gb) is $399.
The PS3 plays more file formats than the Apple TV, not everything (mkv) and not with all features (srt/subs), but a lot more than the Apple TV.
The PS3 plays Blu-ray discs and does brilliant DVD upscaling. Whoever talked about the poor DVD playback on the PS2, that doesn't apply here.
Apple TV has video rentals, the PS3 doesn't. Not yet, but it's most likely on it's way. I still think that the iTunes library will be superior.
So it all comes down to what is important to you. Do you download a lot of films, TV series, etc. through torrents and other places, the PS3 is the choice. If you download a lot through iTunes and the video rental is appealing to you, the Apple TV is the choice. Better syncing with iTunes, or Blu-ray/Upscaling DVD player. You can't really compare the two. I have a PS3 and I'm loving it. As a Mac user for many years, I'm not even slightly interested in getting an Apple TV - I use Netflix and until the library of the iTunes rental can match it, I have no reason to switch.
My setup right now is MacBook Pro 2.6ghz with Medialink, works flawlessly with my PS3 that is hooked up with a 1Tb MyBook. The PS3 is hooked up to my Sony XBR4 TV through HDMI and the TV is connected to my Stereo which is also connected to my Airport Express AirTunes. It's fantastic, for me. I'm sure other people have great solutions with Apple TV, and I find it more interesting to hear about that than people trying to claim what is better. They are very different, period.
And as for the people throwing in punches about the weak gaming library of the PS3, you obviously never heard of...
The TV allowed me to do something for me that my 360 or PS3 never could. It enabled me to cancel my cable TV service. It has completely replaced my cable box while providing all of the shows I watch and saving me money each month. Everything is on-demand, commercial free and legal. This is all wrapped in a GF friendly UI.
In short this thread is kind of pointless. TheTV replaces your TV service, not the need for a game system/DVD player.
TV allowed me to do something for me that my 360 or PS3 never could. It enabled me to cancel my cable TV service. It has completely replaced my cable box while providing all of the shows I watch and saving me money each month. Everything is on-demand, commercial free and legal. This is all wrapped in a GF friendly UI.In short this thread is kind of pointless. The
TV replaces your TV service, not the need for a game system/DVD player.Oh I understand fully. And I mentioned ages ago that it was a stupid product to release in Europe until recently, all you could do is play Pixar shorts from the iTunes store (Disregarding non-legal video). Wow lol.
TV is for all intents and purposes, a hardware model for Apple to sell more iTunes and integrate more into iTunes.Yes, the average home won't be able to handle 1080p streaming until something like FTTH is common place and cheap. I for one don't fancy waiting years, be my guest.
My comment about DRM refers to the fact that my PlayTV equipped PS3 will be able to record over the air freeview channels in a DRM free format through DVB-T. There you go, PlayTV 'supplies' it - and to my iPod Touch no less
I like to have Linux on the same system that can record TV, media, Play games and Blu-ray. Lambast this all you want - I will sit perfectly happy with the option to do all three in one box instead of multiple. Now that the PS3 is bringing all this convergence, having the option to game etc is
On your comments:
Seamless sync with iTunes / AirTunes speaker for iTunes/Reverse sync purchased Movies and TV shows back to iTunes/Realtime stream video Podcasts (underrated feature)
(Well pretty obvious being a non Apple device and most companies, Apple a very big example, penchant for locking down systems)
Add content directly from TV UI
(All changes with PlayTV anyway, and you can stream using the Playstation XMB anyway, so that's really a mute argument)
Rent/buy Movies/Buy TV Shows
(Well that is still a relatively new development for us in Europe, but I do like that the
TV can do this)~~~
I maintain my love for almost all things Apple. But there are just a few things about their products that just really aren't up to par from an obvious perspective. The
TV is a great concept, and took Apple a 'Take 2' attempt to try to realise it in the first place. I really try to like the Apple TV, but I just can't bring myself to buy one when I have/can get something else with such superiority in options, especially since online content on all formats suck in the UK.Before the PlayTv came along, the comparison between a PS3 and
TV was ludicrous. Now you missed the point that I was talking about a PlayTV equipped PS3 that is has a lot of advantage over me buying an TV, minus the online library, which like I mentioned, isn't a big deal here in Europe/London anyway.I enjoy having physical media, and while I know the future lies in online content - I have a good sense of freedom knowing that I don't have worry about storage limitations or failure, and having the best quality picture and sound and extras for the money I paid for (and the Apple Store is NOT cheap/cheaper over here).
Getting up and having to put a disc physically in? Why, that's why God gave us legs lazy bums
I agree Apple does what it does, very well. Just not to fullest. I would agree with arguments versus other companies regarding their fallibility to all things easy, but Sony is no slouch either. I love Apple, but they are anything but perfect.
The
In short this thread is kind of pointless. The
Comes back to what you will use it for, I want to rip my dvd collection to a compressed file format (H.264) and be able to play files on demand, either system will do that, but the PS3 also gives me blu-ray, upscaled dvds and games, when playtv is released it will also give me full PVR capabilities with full remote access from my PSP, as big an Apple fan as I am that is still kicking the
TVs butt!I would be suprised if we saw the ATV match the PS3s functionality (once PlayTV is released) for at least a couple of years.
see: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zJQSAxqGCTU
Since when can you RENT Blu-Ray over the Internet? There's your apples to oranges comparison. There are NO local places that rent Blu-Ray movies and I'm not going to buy them at $30 a pop to watch them once (as I do with most movies; very few are worth watching multiple times).
What I CAN compare AppleTV to is cable "on demand" HD movies. AppleTV wins hands down. I rented American Gangster via cable the other day. I got a picture that was OK with slow moving scenes and horribly blocky with fast moving sequences. It also "broke up" (lost video or went blocky and/or audio for a second or more) probably about once every 5 minutes on average, sometimes several times in one minute. It was just plain awful, IMO.
AppleTV, OTOH, has consistently delivered a high quality 720P picture. I've got a Panasonic PT-AX100U projector and a 93" screen and of the 4 HD movies I've rented so far, they've all looked better than anything I've seen on cable including HDNet. I very very rarely see significant motion artifacts even during most fast sequences and it never glitches or loses audio. On 3/4 of the movies, it was ready to play within 2 minutes. The one movie took 1.5 hours, but the whole AppleTV network seemed to be running slow that night (previews were taking forever even).
Quite frankly, I don't believe half of what I read about the PS3 1080P picture being miles better given the fact that MOST of you have relatively SMALL televisions and sit too far away to even discern 1080P versus 720P at those distances (eye resolving distance). Unless you are sitting 3 feet away or closer from a 50" set, you wont' be able to tell 1080P from 720P. I imagine that kind of distance IS the distance you use to "evaluate" what you see, but you sit much farther away when actually watching material, thus destroying any clarity you think you've gained. I sit 8 feet from a 93" screen so I am close enough to discern the difference between 1080P and 720P *IF* I had a 1080P projector, but even then the differences aren't going to be night and day. That's STILL 8 feet away and the screen at best looks like a SMALL movie theater screen. 720P looks pretty amazing at 93" and I'd take high quality 720P on a 93" screen over 1080P on a 56" screen any day of the week in terms of appreciation of signal. Compression? If I saw a lot of artifacting, I'd complain. The HD movies I've seen so far on AppleTV look better than HDNet on cable. The way some of you talk, it looks like crap or something and that's just plain false.
So if you prefer waiting 1-2 days for Netflix to deliver a Blu-Ray rental that may or may not skip like crazy when you go to play it due to scratches having a significantly increased effect on such high density discs compared to DVDs which are already prone to skipping on well used rentals, go ahead. If you have endless money and want to BUY all your movies at $30 a pop, go ahead. That certainly does not fit MY needs. When the PS3 gets some games I might actually like to play, I'll think about getting one and buying a few of my favorite movies to watch in Blu-Ray (my collection of 300+ movies on DVD aren't just going to all be thrown in the trash so I can give Hollywood a small fortune all over again for a POSSIBLE improvement in quality (Blu-Ray is still only as good as the source material being shown and many older movies are grain-city unless cleaned up and remastered properly).
Meanwhile, AppleTV also makes a great photo album display on the 93" screen and streams my 370+ CDs quite nicely to the downstairs with a 2nd unit streaming upstairs with a nice iPod Touch being used as a WiFi remote to select music/rooms to play in without needing a monitor or tv to select the music. That won't work with a PS3 either. Frankly, I'd say I got my $227 worth. Your mileage may vary.
What I CAN compare AppleTV to is cable "on demand" HD movies. AppleTV wins hands down. I rented American Gangster via cable the other day. I got a picture that was OK with slow moving scenes and horribly blocky with fast moving sequences. It also "broke up" (lost video or went blocky and/or audio for a second or more) probably about once every 5 minutes on average, sometimes several times in one minute. It was just plain awful, IMO.
AppleTV, OTOH, has consistently delivered a high quality 720P picture. I've got a Panasonic PT-AX100U projector and a 93" screen and of the 4 HD movies I've rented so far, they've all looked better than anything I've seen on cable including HDNet. I very very rarely see significant motion artifacts even during most fast sequences and it never glitches or loses audio. On 3/4 of the movies, it was ready to play within 2 minutes. The one movie took 1.5 hours, but the whole AppleTV network seemed to be running slow that night (previews were taking forever even).
Quite frankly, I don't believe half of what I read about the PS3 1080P picture being miles better given the fact that MOST of you have relatively SMALL televisions and sit too far away to even discern 1080P versus 720P at those distances (eye resolving distance). Unless you are sitting 3 feet away or closer from a 50" set, you wont' be able to tell 1080P from 720P. I imagine that kind of distance IS the distance you use to "evaluate" what you see, but you sit much farther away when actually watching material, thus destroying any clarity you think you've gained. I sit 8 feet from a 93" screen so I am close enough to discern the difference between 1080P and 720P *IF* I had a 1080P projector, but even then the differences aren't going to be night and day. That's STILL 8 feet away and the screen at best looks like a SMALL movie theater screen. 720P looks pretty amazing at 93" and I'd take high quality 720P on a 93" screen over 1080P on a 56" screen any day of the week in terms of appreciation of signal. Compression? If I saw a lot of artifacting, I'd complain. The HD movies I've seen so far on AppleTV look better than HDNet on cable. The way some of you talk, it looks like crap or something and that's just plain false.
So if you prefer waiting 1-2 days for Netflix to deliver a Blu-Ray rental that may or may not skip like crazy when you go to play it due to scratches having a significantly increased effect on such high density discs compared to DVDs which are already prone to skipping on well used rentals, go ahead. If you have endless money and want to BUY all your movies at $30 a pop, go ahead. That certainly does not fit MY needs. When the PS3 gets some games I might actually like to play, I'll think about getting one and buying a few of my favorite movies to watch in Blu-Ray (my collection of 300+ movies on DVD aren't just going to all be thrown in the trash so I can give Hollywood a small fortune all over again for a POSSIBLE improvement in quality (Blu-Ray is still only as good as the source material being shown and many older movies are grain-city unless cleaned up and remastered properly).
Meanwhile, AppleTV also makes a great photo album display on the 93" screen and streams my 370+ CDs quite nicely to the downstairs with a 2nd unit streaming upstairs with a nice iPod Touch being used as a WiFi remote to select music/rooms to play in without needing a monitor or tv to select the music. That won't work with a PS3 either. Frankly, I'd say I got my $227 worth. Your mileage may vary.
@MagnusvonMagnum:
Let's see if we are indeed comparing apples to oranges here. First, we have to define what we want more from a media center. For me, its primarily watching movies in high quality. Now, that is the "What". Secondly, we have to define the way we are getting the movies, that is the "How".
Now, I am comparing two devices that can offer me the above functionality. How they do it doesn't interest me!!!
The Playstation offers me much better quality (yes, uncompressed 1080p Video looks much better than compressed 720p). Maybe we won't be able to tell the difference between uncompressed 1080p and uncompressed 720p but Apple TV offers only compressed movies with blurry visuals...Let's also not forget the sound...DTS versus Dolby Digital...You know the winner...
Now, how we get the movies. The Apple TV wins here but I have found a nice way to get my blu-ray discs delivered home (www.videobuster.de). Not as good as Apple TV but I can live with it.
Let's see if we are indeed comparing apples to oranges here. First, we have to define what we want more from a media center. For me, its primarily watching movies in high quality. Now, that is the "What". Secondly, we have to define the way we are getting the movies, that is the "How".
Now, I am comparing two devices that can offer me the above functionality. How they do it doesn't interest me!!!
The Playstation offers me much better quality (yes, uncompressed 1080p Video looks much better than compressed 720p). Maybe we won't be able to tell the difference between uncompressed 1080p and uncompressed 720p but Apple TV offers only compressed movies with blurry visuals...Let's also not forget the sound...DTS versus Dolby Digital...You know the winner...
Now, how we get the movies. The Apple TV wins here but I have found a nice way to get my blu-ray discs delivered home (www.videobuster.de). Not as good as Apple TV but I can live with it.
You don't need to be sorry! DTS is higher quality Audio with much less compression than Dolby Digital. It provides a sound that is very clear. Dolby Digital is good but not that good.
http://www.audioholics.com/educatio...s-dts-a-guide-to-the-strengths-of-the-formats
Blu-ray video is compressed. Using H.264 (though a large number of discs use low bitrate MPEG-2).
Also, blu-ray is still not a proven format. It still accounts for only a very small percentage of the market. It's competing with DVD, legitimate downloads, HD cable, HD satellite, FiOS, etc.
Blu-ray requires an actual investment in the player and the discs. AppleTV is just a hub. If iTunes HD movie rentals go under, you can still use it. If blu-ray goes under.. well, you're out of luck.
As other people have pointed out, Sony has removed more and more features with each new PS3 hardware revision. What will they remove next?
Sony also has a history of changing their stance on things, going back on their word, even going so far as to not keep their word and then delete all press releases regarding that information from their websites (just google the US release of the PS2 HDD for one example).
Sony is about as untrustworthy as they come.
The PS3 can still be used even if Blu-Ray vanished from the market.
You still make an investment in buying an AppleTV...I dont see the difference here, only that the PS3 is delivering the best quality. If you dont care about the best quality, then the AppleTV is fine...
You still make an investment in buying an AppleTV...I dont see the difference here, only that the PS3 is delivering the best quality. If you dont care about the best quality, then the AppleTV is fine...
I'd agree on that (where's my Gran Tourismo for my PSP, originally pictured as a 'launch' title and still yet to appear!). It does make me a little nervous, I like the idea of Blu-ray playback, the PVR functionality (playTV), remote access via the PSP, upscaled DVDs and games. Photos in 1080 would be cool to, but if you put those aside the main function I want is video file playback on the TV from re-encoded DVDs and hopefully in HD as well. It seems the PS3 is better at this, but then does cost a hefty amount more, is a little more tricky then using a ATV (which would be easy to sync in iTunes, PS3 needs some software to stream from the PC/Mac).
If the ATV could do remote access and PVR functions it would win hands down, if they had a blu-ray drive on it then I would buy one today! I suppose it comes down to what you want from a computer attached to you TV.