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Green Button - Maximize, Not Full Screen
- Thread starter bladerunner2000
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I have already discovered that, and set Shift-click to go fullscreen. Thanks again.to return to the old functionality, i believe you'll want to use this setting:
(zoom window below cursor)..
i only briefly tried it but it appears to do as you desire.
View attachment 569844
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but hey, i gotta turn this thing off now.. i personally just like the default yosemite behavior
Now I'll use ThemeEngine to edit the button so it no longer shows the fullscreen icon
It's fine that you like the Yosemite default, I won't be touching it on my 13" rMBP. I simply rarely if ever use it on my 27" riMac.
i rarely use fullscreen on my desktop either.. mostly when i'm going through a design with someone in rhino (they don't need to be seeing anything else other that what i'm showing them), reading PDFs, or slideshows (or quicktime/vlc/etc).. ie- when consuming content rather than when creating it.. other than that, i have plenty of screen space to work with (2 x 27")
on my laptop (15") i work in fullscreen with rhino & numbers.app because i need the real estate.. (in addition to using full screen for presenting as i do with desktops)
People's screen sizes, workflows, and even input devices vary greatly, which is exactly why there should be a setting to restore the old behavior of the green button. Hopefully this 3rd-party solution will work as well (or nearly as well) as an official Apple one.
Edit: There appears to be some inconsistencies in specific apps, but most work fine with the fix.
On laptops like you mentioned, the screen space taken up by anything other than the content is very valuable, and swiping between fullscreen apps using the Trackpad is very fluid. The same is not true for desktops, where the Dock and menu bar can remain on screen and still leave plenty of space for the content. If the input device is something other than an Apple Magic Mouse or Trackpad this can make it a lot harder to multi-task with apps in fullscreen mode.
Earlier, you mentioned double-clicking the title bar, but many people like me prefer the green button, or to use the double-click for minimize. Like Option-click, this is an incomplete solution for people who rarely use fullscreen mode.
Just my thoughts on the topic.
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In truth Kallt did post last week on this utility. Sometimes it is hard to keep up with all of the posts.
Unfortunately, most of these utilities have some issues with reliability and compatibility. Nonetheless, I am glad they are available.
Thanks to all those who have posted valuable suggestions.
Of course, I am still in favor of a Maximize option. A Maximize option will:
- Maximize productivity for those who use a mouse, do extensive multitasking and need as much screen space as possible.
- Increase user satisfaction. This is clearly an issue of interest amongst Mac users. (10,000+ viewers proves this)
I think we are kidding ourselves if we take the "My way or the highway" approach. Nobody likes to be derided or forced. This attitude has cost BlackBerry, Microsoft and Apple some serious grief over the years.
I like the rest of you would like to see the Mac capture market share. Rising market share brings cool apps and devices to the Mac that improve our lives.
Based on my experience and that of other teachers, I know Green button is affecting Mac sales.
With all of the talent and capital Apple has this should be an easy option to implement. So why not ask?
Take Care.
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the second point, i'm not trying to argue.. more users will be satisfied.
the first point though..
i understand that some of you are putting in requests etc to apple.. and i'm telling you, youre giving very little reason as to why maximizing is desired.. like-> very little.
if they're going to make a major change (another one) to one of the key identifiers/trademarks of os x (red,yellow,green) then you're going to have to give a very strong case..
- Maximize productivity for those who use a mouse.
ok.. i use a mouse and i'm also wish to maximize productivity.. (not just using this for example.. it's real.. i really do use a mouse and i'm always looking to increase productivity.
but your statement says absolutely nothing as to how or why productivity will increase.. if i take your statement as written, all i have to do is maximize a window and i'll suddenly get things done more quickly.. and i'm telling you, doing that does nothing for me.. what am i doing wrong? how do i use max view for max productivity?
-do extensive multitasking
what's funny is that apple's implementation of zooming is a means to multitask more efficiently than maximizing a window.. they're going to need a very strong example of how you're able to multitask better using maximized windows in your workflow as opposed to using their zooming feature.. i could show plenty of examples of zooming being useful in a multitask environment and none where a maximized window helps.
i mean, think about it some.. if multitasking, you generally have a few windows open at once.. dragging things from a finder window into an app window.. switching between apps.. etc.. if you maximize one of those windows, everything else on the screen is now hidden.. i can't just click on the doc window behind this one to focus it because it's covered with the blank canvas of the maximized window.. those files can't be grabbed even though they're right there behind huge white space.. etc.
can you please give an example.. a real world example.. like a real person using a real piece of software to perform a specific set of tasks type of example-- of a multitasking scenario being benefitted by the inclusion of maximized windows in the flow?
-and need as much screen space as possible.
i gather you mean "and need as much screen space as possible except not really all available space" ..
because fullscreen gives you as much screen space as possible.
It's a bit of a mix. You can now use 1 app on 1 display and use the other one(s) for something else. That's an advantage because you can now use multiple apps instead of 1 but it is also a disadvantage because you can't use multiple displays for 1 app. In some cases where you have 3 displays it is nice to be able to use 2 for 1 app and the 3rd display for something else (documentation for example).
That's because I disagree. Your request however is the one that is terrible arrogant and selfish due to something that we call "tunnel vision". The only thing you see is your own problem and your own solution. My point is that you need to leek beyond that since what you are trying to do might not be the solution to the problem at all. But I get your point: you have no interest in a solution at all since the only thing you are after is complain and insult people. Try Reddit, that seems to be the place for people like you.
That is not how your posts come across (and yes this is a hint).
I know they do and for that we already have many tools. Also I know that these things and the "solution" you are suggestion will fix the issues some people are having.
In bold dark red is the problem. This is called "change" and as any psychologist can tell you people dislike it strongly. It is the biggest problem any sysadmin/IT guy/girl has to fight when making any kind of change. These can be big changes like going from software a (Windows) to b (OS X) or simple ones like putting the icon 1 row higher. People will go frantic about it. That's why no IT person is impressed with the stories in this thread. We do try to reduce the issue with educating people but we've also seen that people have very little interest; some do, they know it is important to be educated in order to use the new software and they'll benefit from that because it makes their job easier but some simply don't want to (they are exactly like teenagers).
I've seen people become like jelly when working with a computer. Trying to fit the USB A connector into an RJ-45 slot. By merely looking at it you know it can't possible fit yet they are forcefully trying to get it to fit. Why? Beats me. There is this toy for toddlers. It's this huge box with a lid that has holes in them. The holes are round, square, rectangular, triangular, etc. and you get blocks shaped similarly. The child has to fit the correct piece into the correct hole. Nearly all of them are able to do that, yet an adult still tries to put the USB A (small rectangular) into an RJ-45 slot (larger square)...
Actually it is forcing behaviour, you guys simply don't see that. Like I said, there will be users that oppose this option by complaining there are too many options which causes confusion for them.
No you are reporting this as a user, your profession doesn't matter. As an IT guy I'm saying that your point of view is quite different from reality based on my experiences with user behaviour. That same experience also tells me that most users misinterpret their issues. They come up with solutions that they think will fix their problem but in reality don't because their problem is quite different than what they think. They'd come up with using earplugs when the door creeks while the actual solution is to oil the hinges. You need to have an open mind and look beyond your issue in order to see the solution. One needs to view his/her own way of working critically as well. Sometimes it simply is you who is doing things incorrectly and the system merely responds to that.
I understand that people want to make the window bigger and therein lies the problem. How much bigger will depend per user. Some want to entire display in order to multitask better which is nothing but an idée fixe since the window will now cover up everything but the menubar and dock. Other windows and the desktop are not reachable any more. Fullscreen does the same thing but will also omit dock and menubar. For those people the best option is to change the fullscreen mode: have an option to keep menubar and dock in view instead of hiding. Or, if they simply want to switch between apps, use the app switcher and/or mission control (these are the tools meant for that job).
For others we need actual window snapping that doesn't use fullscreen mode or the fullscreen one needs to do things a bit differently. When you quit 1 app you'll be taken back to the desktop with that app, the other one is left open in the background where it takes the entire screen. It would make more sense if both apps returned to their previous sizes or if the other one stays like it (thus snapped to 1 side of the display). You can then decide to return to the previous size with the other app as well or start a different app and use it along side the already snapped app.
Anyway, it is nice to have a discussion about what could be a good solution and I welcome that but this also means that you have to have an open mind and open up to solutions and opinions from others. I am currently not seeing this behaviour here, it is very much like "you either are with me or you are against me". If you want Apple to fix your issue you need to inform them of your issue and that means sending them feedback. Complaining here won't fix your issues, it'll only add to the very negative atmosphere on this forum.
There have been numerous of these posts and some of them were followed by replies from the users who have the issue. To me that rather gives the impression that the only thing they want is to bash and troll instead of finding a solution or not being able to keep up with what is posted.
It would be even nicer if people actually started talking about these reliability and compatibility issues. You want a solution or not?
Then by all means describe the workflow because I can tell you that the way people have described it now fullscreen is what you want. Maximise is the one you don't want because it doesn't give you the amount of screen space you get from fullscreen. Neither of the two will allow for extensive multitasking due to obscuring every other window and thus requiring mission control/app switcher/dock to multitask. If you want to multitask you don't want fullscreen or maximised windows.
10k views means just that: 10k views. This includes people who are curious, mods checking up on things, people who agree, people who disagree, people randomly clicking on topics, people clicking on the wrong topic, people who've replied and are checking back (people who are actively following and participating in the discussion) and so on. Those 10k views might have come from maybe only 500 people where only 20 agree with you, the rest disagrees or doesn't care.
The interest for the proposed solution stems mostly from people who've switched from Windows/Linux and became accustomed to that way of working. They also want the windows to behave like Windows/Linux does (so everything in 1 window instead of having separate windows).
Exactly but unfortunately it is the exact behaviour that is being displayed in this thread.
I can tell you that it doesn't. Usually it's the software and the completely different way of doing things as well as pricing that is affecting Mac sales. It isn't just one tiny feature.
Nothing wrong with that, only that this isn't the right place to do it. Apple doesn't read every OS X forum. You need to sent it to them via the feedback form and in this case via the feedback utility in the El Capitan beta. That's why it's there.
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Dyn, why are you against OS X evolving when users like us demand options that don't affect your use of it, but you don't object when Apple implements things itself?
I'm not against that, I'm against not accepting other points of views and possible solutions. Sometimes you just need to look out of your box. That means that in some cases you need to do things differently. From experience I can tell you that it usually is better to go with the flow then continuously fighting it. Forums like these are for sharing experiences, opinions, information and discussing things. They are not meant for bug reporting, feature requests and disagreeing with everything.
So do explain workflows and how workflows benefit from maximised windows instead of evading that question.
So do explain workflows and how workflows benefit from maximised windows instead of evading that question.
In other words, I should cave because you think Apple's way is the only way things should be done, even if they rip off Microsoft's window snapping (split screen) but it's OK if Apple does it but not if users like me. That's some serious bias. I expect you to have some complaints about Apple's window snapping making things 'too cluttered and difficult'.
I need it to maximize because I need all the screen real estate I can get when working in photoshop, illustrator, indesign, lightroom, after effects, etc. without hiding the file menu as I need access to it as well as the dock to flip between applications. This has already been stated by many of us, therefor there has been NO dodging of the question as you imply.
No, in other words you should stop repeating yourself and actually hear someone else out. There are other ways of getting what you want.
Or in other words: show some respect.
You are still dodging the question as there still is no explanation of workflow. There is no explanation why using the menu makes multitasking more efficient instead of using the keyboard, there is no explanation why obscuring other windows makes it easier to multitask (aka switch to other windows) and so on. There is only repeating of "we want it this way and that's it". There is no discussion in that and thus this thread should be locked.
Btw, I wish Apple did rip off the window snapping from Windows. They did a very crappy job with splitview in El Capitan!
Or in other words: show some respect.
You are still dodging the question as there still is no explanation of workflow. There is no explanation why using the menu makes multitasking more efficient instead of using the keyboard, there is no explanation why obscuring other windows makes it easier to multitask (aka switch to other windows) and so on. There is only repeating of "we want it this way and that's it". There is no discussion in that and thus this thread should be locked.
Btw, I wish Apple did rip off the window snapping from Windows. They did a very crappy job with splitview in El Capitan!
[MOD NOTE]
At this point the discussion has turned circular. Closing.
At this point the discussion has turned circular. Closing.
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