When I need to type a lot, I'll use the same folding bluetooth keyboard I use with my N810 (when I want to do a lot of typing on it). And when I need a bigger display, I'll use an external display.
Really, full size laptops == dinosaurs
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HP 2133 UMPC: What the MacBook Air should have been.
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When I need to type a lot, I'll use the same folding bluetooth keyboard I use with my N810 (when I want to do a lot of typing on it). And when I need a bigger display, I'll use an external display.
Really, full size laptops == dinosaurs
So, you lug all of those accessories around when you need them? Sort of limits the portability doesn't it? I would rather have a machine with the features built in, with complete portability. But to each his own.
The bag* I carry it in is smaller than any laptop bag I've ever carried. Its footprint is _smaller_ than the 8.5x11 envelope that the Air commercials show (thicker, but that's not a problem: the main compartment is 6x8.5x3). And the accessories (power cords, etc.) all boil down to a breeze to carry.
That's with the N810, the folding bluetooth keyboard, and my phone. Adding something the size of the EeePC/HP-2133 wouldn't be a problem for size or weight. When compared to the laptop bag I used to have to carry for my apple laptop, and that I'd still have to use in order to carry the MBA if I had one, it's no contest. Even if it was just the Tom Bihn "braincell" (reinforced laptop compartment + 1 side pocket), that's still too large and awkward. The fact that the MBA is thin and light doesn't make up for the fact that you're going to put it in a bag (which will weigh more than the laptop if it's anything other than a non-protective sleeve), and the 8.5x11 footprint is still awkward to carry (and it's still the identical footprint of the macbook).
(* as I already pointed out: the Maxpedition "Fat Boy", which is their smallest messenger type bag (versipack, they call it); really, I'm just one step up from having a utility belt, and all of the freedom and flexibility that goes with that carry size/format/weight/etc. ... there's no way I'll ever go back to lugging around a full size laptop)
The thing looks interesting, in a good way; it may not be Apple-designed but I think it has some potential. It's expandable, from the sounds of it, and it doesn't seem too woefully underpowered on paper. Honestly, sounds like a mid-90's PowerBook from days gone by. 
(Aside -- I've been resurrecting a 190cs and I've been incredibly pleased and amazed at every turn of the way, thank you drive bays, SCSI and PCMCIA slots!)
If they're affordable, this Air owner might look at one, for grins. Not unhappy with the Air, but interested in seeing how UMPCs are. I think it's a different market than the Air's meant for.
(Aside -- I've been resurrecting a 190cs and I've been incredibly pleased and amazed at every turn of the way, thank you drive bays, SCSI and PCMCIA slots!)If they're affordable, this Air owner might look at one, for grins. Not unhappy with the Air, but interested in seeing how UMPCs are. I think it's a different market than the Air's meant for.
- Back to the place you bought it.
- To the nearest dumpster.
- To the store for tiny-handed munchkins, hobbits and elves.
So there!
I don't want to browse on a screen this size.
I certainly don't want to write on a screen this size.
I don't want to type on such a stupidly small keyboard.
So what the hell is it good for?
There is a reason that UMPCs haven't caught on outside of gadget-crazy Japan. That reason is that they kind of suck. The Air did a really nice job at providing a much better vision of what a lightweight computer's form should be. Every manufacturer will follow Apple's lead soon.
I think you all are forgetting an important aspect of the MBA vs. Eee debate. Price. $400 vs $1800. You can't really compare the two even though people love to do it. Personally, I would love an Air but since I already have a 17" MBP and a desktop PC, that would be silly. I need a small UMPC that I can throw in my small bag (or man-purse as my firends call it) and take with me everywhere. I need it only to write my scripts/stories and to maybe surf the web. The Eee and the HP would be perfect. The HP might actually be too big for me since it has all that space around the screen. I like the Air and would like to buy one. Hell, I'll even buy a bigger man-purse to fit it in there but I'm not going to spend $1800 for something I will use just to write a few scripts on while I ride the train to work... Maybe if I sell one of them for a million bucks...
There is so much wrong in that last paragraph. You cannot get hold of an eeePC at the moment as demand is outstripping supply, and whatever supplies are available are selling at a premium over their RRP. So much for UMPCs not catching on. People just do not want to spend thousands for a laptop any more. As for Apple's vision - it's just retreading the same waters already trodden by the likes of Sony and Mitsubishi all those years ago.
If HP gets the battery life and price right, this thing will fly off the shelves. There's already a proven market for this.
As for the small screen - people are writing articles and coding on those smaller 7" ASUS screens at this moment. And happily so. Not everyone is cursed with the eyesight of Mr Magoo.
The fact that you're a shell user proves you have no concept of what the industry at large (and society in general) uses or wants.
Sorry, but I think once most people try these, they are going to agree with Mossberg and Jobs that the keyboards are too small to type on and that the tiny displays force you to be constantly scrolling to get anything done, all with too little text on the screen at any given time, and then I think these beasts that may be temporarily flying off the shelves will soon find themselves instead gathering dust there.
If these multitudes are currently coding on 7" screens, they will also soon be Mr. Magoo.
It's not a very high resolution screen though.
Some people might get tired of it, as I think I might if I ever got one, but there's something about having a cheap, ultraportable machine that you can just take anywhere and beat around.
There's something about it until you use one. This is not the next iPod in terms of market impact.
(comments not directed at you, Whorehay)
Really that isn't awful looking. But I only saw Windows and Linux as the choices. No OS X. Hmm. Think I like the MBA. At some poiunt I don't really want the screen too small. I do still need real estate, just not weight. And our 12" PB feels a bit on the small side. So I'll take 13.3 over 8.9. Thanx.
Think I like the MBA. At some poiunt I don't really want the screen too small. I do still need real estate, just not weight. And our 12" PB feels a bit on the small side. So I'll take 13.3 over 8.9. Thanx.
It looks nice, but the average person would be way less productive on that thing. Why? Look how small the kb and touchpad is. Interestingly, the air has a more comfortable keyboard than most 15" laptops I know of (and ALL laptops smaller, too, although it does rival the thinkpads'). It also has a much bigger touchpad. Big touchpad + big screen + big keyboard = more productivity
The HP looks like a great machine but it makes too many compromises for me, though i'm sure a lot of people will be attracted to it for obvious reasons.
The HP looks like a great machine but it makes too many compromises for me, though i'm sure a lot of people will be attracted to it for obvious reasons.
It's not necessarily what the Air should have been, but it's definitely a lot like what I had hoped it was going to be. Thin doesn't matter nearly as much to me as footprint does, and since I rarely use a laptop at a distance greater than about 24 inches, the screen size should be fine. As long as it's not woefully underpowered like the EEE, and comes in at a decent price, it will be something I seriously consider purchasing.
Hopefully Apple is paying attention to products like this. I'd love to replace my ibook with a more powerful, but smaller machine, and I really want to stick with OSX. I want my macbook mini.
Hopefully Apple is paying attention to products like this. I'd love to replace my ibook with a more powerful, but smaller machine, and I really want to stick with OSX. I want my macbook mini.
The resolution of the HP2133 is 1386x768, which compares favourably with that of the Macbook. You will scroll less, as you can squeeze more lengthways. So, no to that argument. That keyboard is about the same size as the Macbook's. Notice the dead space on the Macbook around the keyboard? That is what you are giving up there. Not much use for actual typing.
Don't forget, Apple is selling the iPhone/iPod Touch on the basis that you can surf the web on those displays as well as any laptop, so I doubt that Jobs belongs in any argument that small is impractical.
Yes, and that's really what I was getting at. The potential of the pre-show hype that they were coming out with an ultra-portable design made think Apple was going to do something useful, like release something in the EeePC, OXO, or MID category. Instead, what they gave us was "ho hum", in my opinion.
Yup, and with its resolution, you can still get a good visual experience while getting closer to it (like you're intended to on an iPhone or Nokia N8x0). Not ideal, but good enough on the road. And when you get to a destination, you're just as good as with any laptop: you hook it up to a real display, a real keyboard, and a mouse.
Yup. If Apple enters this market before I'm able to snatch up the Linux version of the HP, I'll get the Apple version. I'd like to have ANY excuse from Apple to stay on their platforms. But, since the draconian iPhone debacle in Sept, the dreadful lack of no-brainer features on the iTouch (bluetooth, the same apps that were on the iPhone, from day one instead of 6 months later for an extra fee), I've been steadily grown more disillusioned by Apple.
In the last year, I've moved from Apple Mail (was my favorite mail client since 1990 when I started using Nextstep, but the last few years it had more and more feature problems) to Thunderbird, from Safari to Firefox (again, too many mis-features and missing features on Safari), and when I got my N800, I saw that the Linux community had finally "gotten it" with respect to GUI quality. So why WOULDN'T I go to a Linux UMPC if Apple isn't going to get their crap in order?
But, if Apple doesn't show me that there's still some actual interesting things going on over there (and, no, the iPhone, iTouch, and MBA don't qualify, in my book), then I'll be going with the Linux version of the HP UMPC when it comes out.
Actually, what I would probably really like to see, rather than a tiny-laptop format from Apple, is a tablet that has a virtual split thumb keyboard. The Samsung UMPC originally had a virtual split thumb keyboard instead of the split real thumb keyboard. As you held the sides, and you needed to type, translucent overlay keys for the left and right thumbs appeared in the upper left and upper right corners of the display.
Then give it a removable fold under cover, that protects the screen, can be held flush against the back when holding it like a tablet, or used as a kickstand when at a desk (fold under == as you hold the sides, the cover folds under the bottom edge, not over the top; you'll see why when I get to the WWAN). 2 or 3 USB ports, micro-DVI out, audio out, power, wifi, express card slot, and bluetooth (DUN, PAN, FTP, real HDI and SPP to use any bluetooth keyboard, not just certain bluetooth keyboards) ... and _maybe_ a WWAN capability (or place the express card slot in a way that it doesn't get in the way of your hands when you hold the sides of the screen; so maybe it's on the top edge; if not that, then make sure the iPhone can share its WWAN with the device, either via wifi or bluetooth). I might also give it one or two full size SDHC card slots (it's really a staple among the UMPC and MID families to have some form of SD card, and doing it via USB is actually kind of annoying). Give it a screen around 8". No optical disk.
Typing on the go: virtual thumb keyboard.
Typing at a random table: bluetooth keyboard
Typing at your desk: USB keyboard
Let it do the same things for an optical drive that a MBA does (the one and only thing that I liked about the MBA is it's ability to "borrow" the optical drive of your desktop computer).
The reason the fold under cover is removable: let 3rd parties make keyboard replacements for the cover.
I think that's what I'd really want with a Mac based UMPC.
In the "2nd generation wishlist" I said a twist-screen laptop/tablet format, but I think that's actually slightly clunky. I'd prefer an actual tablet, like the virtual keyboard oriented Samsung (O2?) UMPC.
Ditto this little HP monstrosity. It certainly does not qualify as a "proper computer" at that size. With .5 lb more you get a fully functional, real computer in the MBA. In short, this thing is a toy. Thank god apple made an actually useful ultraportable. (yes, I'm aware that some of you think portability is defined by footprint, but I strenuously disagree. Weight is what matters.)
Weight mattered when you're talking about luggables vs heavy laptops. When it comes down to these devices, weight is like arguing over the weight of a sheet of paper vs a feather. It doesn't matter.
Footprint makes a huge amount of difference.
Good thing I can pay 1/3 as much money for my toys as you do for your "real/proper computers", and yet do heavy lifting real work on them. I feel sorry for your accountant, having to keep track of all of the money you waste.
Try them side by side. The keyboard and display size will not compare at all.
The Touch and iPhone have touch screens and limited functionality that is more appropriate to the size. Browsing on the go on one is useful and yet does not compare to browsing on a screen 13.3" or larger.
As for Jobs, he clearly stated that Apple found the smaller displays and smaller keyboards to be trade-offs that were unwise, hence the size of the display and keyboard of the Air which he sees as a big advantage. I'd rather have my screen and keyboard, all at 3lbs in a wafer thin unit than this UMPC with a small keyboard, small display and chunky build. Then again, you may want exactly that.
As for Apple, they clearly don't, and hence they didn't introduce one, but went the way of the Air. Soon, all PC makers will follow suit and the UMPC will continue to be nothing more than a minor niche product.
