Who would have thought that customers demand good quality on products costing thousands of dollars. How dare them, right? We should instead worship corporations.
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I honestly hate MacBook Pro M1-M3 keyboard
- Thread starter bearinthetown
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Not that I have noticed, they all have the same feel to me.
There's a difference between quality and design decisions. Much of the complaints center on not liking the feel of the keyboard/trackpad, which is a personal preference and a design decision on Apple's part. Personally, I use a multi-button mouse and if Apple got rid of the trackpad and put in a gumdrop mouse like on the old ThinkPads, I'd probabay prefer that to a trackpad; but that would just be my preference and not mean Apple's current design is flawed or low quality.
No, just realize there is a difference between design decisions and poor quality. The current design trend is towards meeting customer desires for smaller and thinner at each screen size; thus Apple and others make design decsions to meet that preference and sell more machines.
So a keyboard that gets shiny after several weeks of usage is their design choice? They go for surprising disco style or what?
I was told by an Apple Partner that all the new keyboards on the M1-M3 Macs , the iMac, etc. use the same keyboard. The Keyboard is essentially the underside of the top cover and the trackpad is included w the portables. It is an effort to design /use standard Apple Parts.
I have a M1 MacBook Pro 64g/2TB portable that I cannot type on because the keys are not what I am accustomed to using on my previous Macs. The best keyboard for me is on a Intel Based, MacBook Pro (Retina, 15-inch, Mid 2015. Yes, an old one.
Apple continues to blow it on the keyboard designs. Smaller is not better. Standard is better. The only thing achieved by smaller is I cannot touch type. I learned to touch type in High School during the Summer. My Neighbor was a typing teacher, and I took typing for 2 weeks. Best thing I ever learned.
These new keyboards are a pain for touch-typists. Perhaps not so much for 2 finger peck typists. I am seriously considering a different brand of computer and I have bought Macs since 1984. Yes, I am that old.
I think the new M series Mac portables have the trackpad and the keyboard as perhaps 1 replaceable piece. Maybe , maybe not. I was told that and i am not willing to take apart my M1 64G/2T just to find out. No reason to void the warranty.
I seriously question some of the directions Apple seems to be going in and not going in. At 77, I can do that with some degree valididty. On my M1 MacBook Pro, I think there is interaction between the Trackpad and the Keyboard and I also think the Keyboard impinges at times on the surrounding aluminum case. The Mad Passes all tests; so, they don't to anything except waste my time which at my age is valuable.
Apple needs to go back to the Old Keyboard Size. The New M series keyboards are a different size - measure them against an Intel Mac Keyboard. Sure, they can make production improvements, but not change the size.
I have a M1 MacBook Pro 64g/2TB portable that I cannot type on because the keys are not what I am accustomed to using on my previous Macs. The best keyboard for me is on a Intel Based, MacBook Pro (Retina, 15-inch, Mid 2015. Yes, an old one.
Apple continues to blow it on the keyboard designs. Smaller is not better. Standard is better. The only thing achieved by smaller is I cannot touch type. I learned to touch type in High School during the Summer. My Neighbor was a typing teacher, and I took typing for 2 weeks. Best thing I ever learned.
These new keyboards are a pain for touch-typists. Perhaps not so much for 2 finger peck typists. I am seriously considering a different brand of computer and I have bought Macs since 1984. Yes, I am that old.
I think the new M series Mac portables have the trackpad and the keyboard as perhaps 1 replaceable piece. Maybe , maybe not. I was told that and i am not willing to take apart my M1 64G/2T just to find out. No reason to void the warranty.
I seriously question some of the directions Apple seems to be going in and not going in. At 77, I can do that with some degree valididty. On my M1 MacBook Pro, I think there is interaction between the Trackpad and the Keyboard and I also think the Keyboard impinges at times on the surrounding aluminum case. The Mad Passes all tests; so, they don't to anything except waste my time which at my age is valuable.
Apple needs to go back to the Old Keyboard Size. The New M series keyboards are a different size - measure them against an Intel Mac Keyboard. Sure, they can make production improvements, but not change the size.
You never address the only point the previous poster is making.....What does the plastic material of the key caps have to do with design-when it is a quality of materials that is being called into question NOT DESIGN. BIG Difference but nice conflation.
There is literally NO excuse to use whatever cheap abs or whatever plastic they are using that will cause a permanent and ugly surface deterioration within weeks to months where as many cheap chromebooks and Windows laptops use cheaper plastic material and somehow it doesn't degrade and this extends into the thinnest and lightest of Windows laptops.
So please answer the question? Why (specially if) design is so important to Apple as is materials and quality they would use a plastic material for years that degrades in aesthetics so quickly to a market that demands the highest quality and pays the highest prices? Wouldn't they expect a such a common wear point that shows wear faster than the competition to be an issue with their very aesthetically aware demographic?
Sorry, no matter what way you slice it, the only way using an inferior plastic that wears out fast is to encourage people to buy a new one. Do you really think the engineers at Apple couldn't come up with a better solution? They couldn't find a polymer (kevlar comes to mind) that would be light and strong? Yet every other laptop company outside of Apple has figure out to put a plastic key cap that doesn't turn shiny after years??
People have a right to be upset at a part of the MacBook that wears or looks aesthetically bad before it should when they pay a premium for design and material and a general expectation that Mac's last longer because of better hardware.
Obviously for a lot of people it is a non functional problem and they don't care but there are a lot of people who value being able to keep their hardware in good condition for as long as possible or may have OCD, ADHD, Autism, etc. and hyperfocus on one thing. They tend to buy Apple because of the attention to detail, but if a detail is bad guess what they will focus on.
But I guess people just have unrealistic expectations of Mac's being more durable than maybe they really are or maybe something has changed??
Well, I agree with you. Sorry I seemed to avoid the question. The keys & all of the product should be top notch. No reason not to be. You paid enough for it to be the best. The older products were more durable. No way around it. I was not fortunate enough for my Mac M1 to fail the Apple Test. The test they ran was electronic, not a way to test fora mechanical problem. Anyway, an Apple Partner did not have repair parts. Apple would not send them any without documented failures. So, I still have the M1 w AppleCare and I will replace it when I have more time. So for now. I still have my Intel MacBook Pro with the real keyboard ! The M1 and all of the newer keyboards are not the same size. Measure one. No more responses to the keyboard issues. I am a long time Stockholder and each off you should have a perfect Mac, you paid for one. Bye.
I thought the keyboard on my old 2015 15" was excellent. The butterfly keyboard on my 2017 / 2019 was good - though the 2017 one did go bad and Apple refused to repair without charging for a whole new topcase.
I do NOT like the keyboard on my 2021 14" M1.
My work PC - an HP Elitebook 845 G6 has a great keyboard. Could be rose coloured glasses but I believe it similar in feel to the one on my previous 2015 Macbook Pro.
I do NOT like the keyboard on my 2021 14" M1.
My work PC - an HP Elitebook 845 G6 has a great keyboard. Could be rose coloured glasses but I believe it similar in feel to the one on my previous 2015 Macbook Pro.
Interesting, but concave keycaps predate Apple and most computers, such as those on the great Selectric keyboard. I guess the grooved design makes this a patentable idea.
I've been using a 14" MBP and a 15" MBA recently. I much prefer the feel of the Air's keyboard, but I have no idea why. The actual underlying keyboards are identical right?
Man, if I could hook up a Selectric and use that as a keyboard I’d be loving life. Best typewriter I ever used.
I got an 14 inch M3 Pro earlier this month and I noticed a couple things;
first, I previously complained about the black background looking kinda ugly compared to my previous computer (MacBook Air early 2014) and the current Airs (which I might have got instead if not for the port and monitor support).
However once having it in my house in front of me instead of merely looking in the store I actually really liked the look and even liked looking at it next to my wedge Air. Maybe if I had an M3 Air in my house next to it I'd still feel a bit negative about that keyboard look though.
Second the typing experience is better than I feared after finally making the jump out of the pre butterfly keyboard era, though it does feel a little bit cheaper in terms of sound and plasticyness but I think that's just because it's a bit different than my 2014 Air and I'll get used to it. It is fun in a way to have a new typing sound.
first, I previously complained about the black background looking kinda ugly compared to my previous computer (MacBook Air early 2014) and the current Airs (which I might have got instead if not for the port and monitor support).
However once having it in my house in front of me instead of merely looking in the store I actually really liked the look and even liked looking at it next to my wedge Air. Maybe if I had an M3 Air in my house next to it I'd still feel a bit negative about that keyboard look though.
Second the typing experience is better than I feared after finally making the jump out of the pre butterfly keyboard era, though it does feel a little bit cheaper in terms of sound and plasticyness but I think that's just because it's a bit different than my 2014 Air and I'll get used to it. It is fun in a way to have a new typing sound.
I find my2012 Air keyboard to be much better than my M2 Air. I somewhat don't like the typing feel of the M2 Air. Heck, I even got used to the butterfly keyboard in the 12" Macbook and in some ways preferred it to the M2 Air keyboard. Weird.
I just realized that the Cherry SX isn't a mechanical keyboard. Interesting. I had no idea that Cherry also made a scissor switch board. I wish it were possible to try one of these out. It might be a fun one to have in my collection. I wish that the 10 key wasn't there though.
Most Cherry keyboards aren't mechanical. They are just known for that. I used their G83 series for many years and it's actually superior to most of their mechanical offerings.
People say they're the exact same (for some reason), but I'm pretty sure they're not. I've owned an M1 Air, M2 15 inch, 14 inch pro and 16 inch pro. The airs feel exactly the same (even between the M1 wedge and M2 flat design), and the pros feel exactly the same. So it's either the pros have a different keyboard, or the thickness of the bottom case makes it feel hollow and different.
I'm not sure of the technical terms of actuation, travel etc, but the Airs despite being on a thinner body feel higher travel to me, less "bounce back" force on my fingers, and slightly spongy (in a good way) like it's shielding the force from my fingers. As opposed to the pros, it feels like I'm tapping my fingers on a marble floor tile in terms of hardness and force, but also feels like I'm pressing into something hollow on the bottom fro some reason. This why I'm so glad they released a 15 inch Air. The keyboard on it feels way better but the 13 inch's screen size was always too small for me.
Another thing that makes me pretty sure the chassis might make the keyboard feel different is that the trackpads actually have a softer click on the pros than the Airs. If I set the trackpad click to max on the pros, it only feels like I'm at the halfway on the Air's settings. The airs can produce a harder click despite being at the same setting.
Even if they're supposed to be exactly the same, they're likely to have variations. That's because it's not always a single supplier providing a part. Two or more suppliers may make the same keyboard according to specifications, but it wouldn't be a shock if they were actually a little bit different.
I used to have serious RSI. I had a 2010 and 2012 Macbook Pro. I was more sensitive to minute differences because my hands hurt so much that sometimes the slightest difference would matter. My hands hurt less on the 2010's keyboard than it did on the 2012's keyboard even though both were Unibodies and the keyboards looked identical and seemed to be the same in every way.
No issue here on my M1 Max and I still have my 2019 16 inch with Touch Bar and the type flow is th same to me
Last month, I switched to a MacBook Pro for the first time, and I have to admit that I'm still getting used to the keyboard. Many times it doesn't register my keystrokes because the travel is very shallow, so I don't feel like I've pressed it, i.e., the difference between sufficient and insufficient pressing is small. I would definitely like better feedback.
Yeah, they aren't world class keyboards
They skew a bit too much towards space savings to accommodate the overall thickness goals of Apple
I guess they are at least better than Butterfly keyboards were (but that's a pretty low bar)