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iMac 17,1 (Retina 5K, 27-inch, Late 2015) EFI firmware update failures
- Thread starter zorinlynx
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They all read from the same script.
What's amazing is that I know for a fact that at least half dozen people, including me, have been on the phone with Apple over this. Plus, when eficheck tells you that something is wrong, it asks if you want to submit the information to Apple. Which I do every month or two when it runs and gives me the warning.
Or, they could just read the forum here or Howard Oakley's blog to get an idea.
The support folks we puny, lowly customers get to interact with may well be trying their best and they certainly are friendly. They may not know about this problem. But, somebody up the line does. Or, I suppose, whoever should know is either incompetent or willingly looking the other way. Neither of those is especially helpful to iMac owners, nor is it honest or noble.
Ok, so then the question is:
Apple has known about the fault for a few years and are hiding it. SO did they knowingly sell the computers with the issue and if so, its a little like VW and the diesel emissions. as they have had plenty of time to re-call and fix? The remaining silent does add to suspicion for sure.
Apple has known about the fault for a few years and are hiding it. SO did they knowingly sell the computers with the issue and if so, its a little like VW and the diesel emissions. as they have had plenty of time to re-call and fix? The remaining silent does add to suspicion for sure.
The why Don't we all go together to a firm that does class action suites against apple for defective hardware. like:https://www.hbsslaw.co.uk/contact
I have just dropped them an email they have a class action suite currently against apple. if people had purchased a car they would be jumping up and down. I say what's the difference is apple knew and have hidden this, then the question is did they sell the product knowing this, when did they discover it and why did they not re-call.
Hello wrw2570 and all others,
I think it's time to put some pressure on Apple, too.
My iMac 17,1 stucks on 170.0.0.0.0 since the first install of Catalina in 10/2019, having troubles with instability (black screen) and since Big Sur persisting failures to get in recovery mode, all well known.
Though the problems are well documented and communicated (also thanks to Howard Oakley), Apple keeps on fooling their customers, and this makes me sick. Already in 12/2019 I've made the same experience with Apple's phone support (second level Ireland) getting on my iMac remotely and viewing reports and so on. I tried them several times, also writing on Apple's feedback page, no response, no solution.
Assumed there is an incompatibility of that model containing ssd blade with Catalina/Big Sur and Apple knowlingly blocks efi-updates and fools owners, that's a criminal business conduct in my mind, like already compared to Audi scandal. This behavior is unworthy for a top company, and I'm wondering what's going on in Cupertino the last years - do they have lost connection to the user, too high flying?
I'm not keen on getting money suing Apple legally, but Apple has to admit the error, saying yes there is a problem and the customers are right (as always), we gonna do something for you until next update or end of year, or we will callback your machines and exchange the logicboard, or any other solution. But pretending there's no problem at all is really contemptuous to all (mostly faithful) users, who often started from the first hour and who maybe have invested a lot of money in Apple over the years, not regarding the tremendous waste of time trying to solve the problem yourself. Only a few have had success with enormous effort. That is Apple's fault!
I think continuing to wait and hope Apple will clear the situation does not lead to the goal, not after more than one year complaints. The lies of the Apple support and the long reaction time clearly shows me that Apple denies the problem.
So, it's on the user to make the next step (I know the ball is in Apple's court, but they won't move).
The time has come to strike an organized blow against Apple for customer rights. You've made the first move in the right direction. How about setting up an internet forum/site to unite as many as possible fooled Apple users (only iMac 17,1 late 2015 5k Retina) to join class action as mentioned above? Best to take Howard on board.
Does anyone have any other suggestion to proceed?
I think it's time to put some pressure on Apple, too.
My iMac 17,1 stucks on 170.0.0.0.0 since the first install of Catalina in 10/2019, having troubles with instability (black screen) and since Big Sur persisting failures to get in recovery mode, all well known.
Though the problems are well documented and communicated (also thanks to Howard Oakley), Apple keeps on fooling their customers, and this makes me sick. Already in 12/2019 I've made the same experience with Apple's phone support (second level Ireland) getting on my iMac remotely and viewing reports and so on. I tried them several times, also writing on Apple's feedback page, no response, no solution.
Assumed there is an incompatibility of that model containing ssd blade with Catalina/Big Sur and Apple knowlingly blocks efi-updates and fools owners, that's a criminal business conduct in my mind, like already compared to Audi scandal. This behavior is unworthy for a top company, and I'm wondering what's going on in Cupertino the last years - do they have lost connection to the user, too high flying?
I'm not keen on getting money suing Apple legally, but Apple has to admit the error, saying yes there is a problem and the customers are right (as always), we gonna do something for you until next update or end of year, or we will callback your machines and exchange the logicboard, or any other solution. But pretending there's no problem at all is really contemptuous to all (mostly faithful) users, who often started from the first hour and who maybe have invested a lot of money in Apple over the years, not regarding the tremendous waste of time trying to solve the problem yourself. Only a few have had success with enormous effort. That is Apple's fault!
I think continuing to wait and hope Apple will clear the situation does not lead to the goal, not after more than one year complaints. The lies of the Apple support and the long reaction time clearly shows me that Apple denies the problem.
So, it's on the user to make the next step (I know the ball is in Apple's court, but they won't move).
The time has come to strike an organized blow against Apple for customer rights. You've made the first move in the right direction. How about setting up an internet forum/site to unite as many as possible fooled Apple users (only iMac 17,1 late 2015 5k Retina) to join class action as mentioned above? Best to take Howard on board.
Does anyone have any other suggestion to proceed?
How I would do it is collate hard rive models and logic boards (also break down the fusion drive into what part is the blade drive as they are a logical software merger between blade and mechanical). Slam it in excel and post it online here, Howards page and then directly on twitters on the apple feed!
I dunno if you guys are aware, but a user here already posted a workaround for this issue. Pull the SSD out and temporarily replace it with a SATA HDD and do an update and your firmware will be current. Then replace your SSD back.
Not really an acceptable workaround in my book.
On most other computers this wouldn't be a big deal, but iMacs are a pain to disassemble to get at the SSD and hard drive. It's a risky operation and requires replacing adhesive strips, which are not a cheap consumable.
Even though this firmware update failure is not a big deal, I understand the frustration of being left behind on an old version. However having to open the machine up to fix the issue is unacceptable as these are iMacs, not Mac Pros.
For me it's not the right way either to open the iMac - let Apple do it themselves.
They promise iMac 17,1 works with Big Sur, but it doesn't seem so regarding the connection between efi stuck at 170.0.0.0.0 and failure to get in recovery mode properly.
I think there's the point you could put pressure on Apple keeping their promises. Probably a callback action would be the only serious solution.
They promise iMac 17,1 works with Big Sur, but it doesn't seem so regarding the connection between efi stuck at 170.0.0.0.0 and failure to get in recovery mode properly.
I think there's the point you could put pressure on Apple keeping their promises. Probably a callback action would be the only serious solution.
Using USB external to install OS didn't update the fw still 170-----
Purchased the HDD cable and used it to install OS and fw updated to 429----- rightaway. No need to remove the blade.
Purchased the HDD cable and used it to install OS and fw updated to 429----- rightaway. No need to remove the blade.
Hello holycowe,
that would be pretty awesome if you found a way to solve the problem.
Can you please describe in more detail how you arrived at the solution. Which cable exactly, how exactly installed (recovery mode usb?)? Did you open the iMac? Do you have iMac 17,1 late 2015? Thank you very much.
that would be pretty awesome if you found a way to solve the problem.
Can you please describe in more detail how you arrived at the solution. Which cable exactly, how exactly installed (recovery mode usb?)? Did you open the iMac? Do you have iMac 17,1 late 2015? Thank you very much.
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I think what holycowe did was to open up the iMac, install the Apple internal HDD cable and a SATA drive, and installed macOS on a drive, which updated the firmware. This fits with other reports.
The possibly new info here is that he didn’t need to remove the existing SSD blade. Good to know!
The possibly new info here is that he didn’t need to remove the existing SSD blade. Good to know!
Tried cmd+R and Big Sur OS is there. So, new fw for sure fix all that recovery problems. Everything's running perfect.
So, the 170-------fw is blocking the fw updates. In order to pass that 170---- you need to install OS on the SSD or HDD connect by the sata cable (mine didn't come with it)
So, the 170-------fw is blocking the fw updates. In order to pass that 170---- you need to install OS on the SSD or HDD connect by the sata cable (mine didn't come with it)
Just upgraded to Big Sur and I'm suddenly getting the "your computer has detected a potential problem" message like everyone else.
Computer runs fine but I can't sell my iMac in the future if it's going to flag this message up.
Anyway to prevent BigSur from checking the firmware and this message from popping up?
Computer runs fine but I can't sell my iMac in the future if it's going to flag this message up.
Anyway to prevent BigSur from checking the firmware and this message from popping up?
Howard at Eclectic Light in this article https://eclecticlight.co/2021/03/23/how-to-update-your-macs-firmware/ Claims that some customers have gotten Apple to act and fix the issue. I can say, I made 7 calls and was stalled each time, which is why I went the DIY route. So, for those affected, be persistant!
Hmm, this is very interesting. Just read through this tread quick. I've seen this problem being reported in other threads and was afraid I'd get the same problem with my 17.1 iMac. But, since mine was shipped with only spinning rust it never got stuck on 170.xxx.... at all. Seems to confirm that the issue is blade related.
Side note, have anyone actually installed an OWC Aura Pro x2 in an 17.1 and got it working properly?
OWC says it's not compatible with 17.1 iMac and I guess this BOOT-ROM issue is part of that. I got a super good deal on one and bought it without thinking much. But since I'm well past 170.xxx and now on 428.xxx it shouldn't be a problem right? Got the WD Black SN750 and a Sintech adapter that I planned on using also, so might just give the OWC a try and see if it works.
Side note, have anyone actually installed an OWC Aura Pro x2 in an 17.1 and got it working properly?
OWC says it's not compatible with 17.1 iMac and I guess this BOOT-ROM issue is part of that. I got a super good deal on one and bought it without thinking much. But since I'm well past 170.xxx and now on 428.xxx it shouldn't be a problem right? Got the WD Black SN750 and a Sintech adapter that I planned on using also, so might just give the OWC a try and see if it works.
No, I installed a M13 Feather Turbo which also marked my machine as not compatible and probably for the same reason. It works fine with the later firmware. I was having an issue with it throttling back on the read/writes. Now it's working pretty well with a third-party Trim driver (Trim Enabler). I tried the trimforce command but it didn't seem to help. Now I get the top speed (about 3gb read/write) most of the time. It still seems to get fouled up and throttle down requiring a restart to clear the disck cache.
You need to be somewhat handy or know someone who is. The blade sits on the back of the motherboard so you'll have to disassemble the entire machine to get to it. Another panel in the back (like the memory) would have negated that but it's not Apple's way.
Apple had a very good idea in limiting the internal expansion capabilities of their products. That meant that they had to deal with far fewer driver issues and incompatibilities. That was a good thing. They may have taken it a bit far with limiting memory expansion and the ease of replacing hard drives, but that was a choice that could be argued both ways.
However, along the way they've broken this entire idea of keeping things working. The software has become what they didn't want the hardware to be. That is, a bunch of incompatible components that may or may not work well within the system. And, they consistently make changes to things that already work well and have been proven to make them break.
https://eclecticlight.co/2021/04/03/big-sur-can-prevent-ulbow-mints-and-t2m2-from-browsing-its-log/
Don't their engineers have anything better to do?
It makes me wonder just how much regression testing they do and whether Apple engineers actually use the products they build. Certainly, this is a failure of Apple management. They exist in their own gardened palace. Just ask anybody who has had to deal with providing Apple with either components or outside services. The arrogance is ultra strong, even when the facts don't support that. Steve Jobs could get away with that, because that was his pathology. The others? Not so much.
The latest successful iMac owner who reported to Howard's blog is getting his iMac replaced by Apple, because they couldn't fix it.
That's not actually a fix, though. Is it? It does help the unhappy customer, but that's not the same as fixing the problem at the software level. If that customer wanted to continue using Mojave or Catalina, for whatever reason, he'd be stuck now, right?
I think that the lesson to be learned here is that Apple may not be really interested in product longevity. They want to do just enough to keep people interested long enough to buy a new product. Remember how Windows users used to get so frustrated with how messed up their computers were that they'd give up and buy a new one? We may be getting there with Apple. Environmental sustainability, my keister!
The other lesson is that since they don't seem to be interested in fixing software bugs so much, these may propagate forward in perpetuity.
https://dilbert.com/strip/1995-11-13
Does anybody really believe now that Apple would do the kind of thing they did with Snow Leopard? That is, an operating system release intended almost entirely to clean things up for the long term.