iMac Freezing Fix ETA?

[flopticalcube]

I am a some one who is looking to buy his First Apple Mac ( iMac ) and I am watching the unfolding
Freezing story with some hope, Two questions ..

1. where you live if you go into an Apple store to but an iMac , could you ask that the machine
be un packed and fired up there in the shop , to see just how it performs..?

2. can some one please explain this phrase I keep seeing ...

Apple- fix this problem or a class action lawsuit is in order.

what is a class action lawsuit, and how does the sort out
all the current iMac problems..?

sorry if the above are dumb questions

Thanks siam ( Thailand )

1. Yes you can and it is a good idea too.

2. A class action (in this case) is when a group with a common grievance sue a particular company for a product flaw. The case is handled on behalf of the entire group. I don't think we are there yet.

You have to remember that the majority of iMacs are fine but a few have this problem.

 

[siam]

Thanks .. flopticalcube

I was just wondering if there were any people who have the freezing problems
and they tried out the iMac in the shop first ..?

just curious about a class action lawsuit , and not knowing much about
Apples History, has a class action lawsuit been served on Apple in the Past..?

also as a potential buyer of the iMac ( fingers crossed ) when I go to the apple store , and ask them to fire up the machine I want to buy ( not just the one on display ) as a new comer to Apple I don't really know what to do on the iMac
to test if theres a hidden problem, this is assuming Apple have sorted out the
current freezing problems, so I am looking for a beginners step by step what / how to test your new iMac in store . As I would hate to take the new iMac home which is going to be a days journey to reach home from the Apple store, and fire it up only to find there a major problem..? so it would be great if I ( a total Apple Beginner ) could in some way test / try out the new iMac in store
first ..?

sorry it this is a bit off topic...

Siam

 

[atthecross]

I've posted about my recent experience on other threads, but here goes...

I am now a firm believer that this is a hardware issue.

I am on my third 24" iMac and I can tell you that this new one feels a lot zippier and has ZERO freezes so far.

I have been trying to freeze it as follows:
1. played all screen savers
2. played all itunes visualizers, as well as turning off the option of capping at 30fps
3. Frontrow usage from coverflow to playing movies full screen
4. Timemachine usage


all this with everything and the kitchen sink running in the background and installing all my software simultaneously.

ZERO FREEZES!!!

In my experience, it did seem like a software issue at first because with my last machine I was able to roll back to 1.0 in tiger and did not have a freeze in 6 days.

So initially I did believe it to be software related, but now with a machine that works I am sure it is hardware related because it is sooooo much more responsive.

There has been speculation that a software fix will just mask the problem and not really resolve it, I don't know about a conspiracy but I just wouldn't do it knowing how a 'good' machine is supposed to work.

my two cents is, if you are having freezing issues.... RETURN THE UNIT!!!!

 

[miggalvez]

Here's my story:

I bought my first iMac on September 18. It froze from day one. The freezes were random and not very frequent (maybe 4 or 5 a week), but they were annoying. During the first week of October I learned that Apple acknowledge this issue and that they were promising a fix by the end of the month. I patiently waited.

I pre-ordered Leopard thinking that the fix would be included in the new OS. It wasn't. But Leopard brought me something for which I am grateful (so to speak). The freezes could be replicated (Arabasque screen saver, Time Machine, etc). I waited until the "fix" came out on Nov 1 (I think it was), but it still froze. I took it yesterday to the Apple Store where I bought it. In 30 minutes I was walking out with a new one. While the "genius" was looking at it I asked him if he was aware of this issue. Very timidly and in a low voice he said that "he had seen one or two with the same problem." I couldn't get any other word out of him. I asked if I could test the new one to make sure I didn't get another "freezer". Since Leopard was not installed and since in Tiger the freezes could not be replicated (that I know of), I asked him to let me hook a laptop with Leopard installed to the new iMac. We did and everything was perfect.

And here I am enjoying my new iMac with 0 freezes.

My advice to all those with freezing problems. Exchange it for a new one. They might say that they need to send it for repairs. Stand your ground and insist on a new one. Ask to see the manager if needed.

 

[126351]

Trouble is, with BTO, you're pretty screwed because Apple can weasel out on the phone. Hence I am not buying one; I want a bigger HDD and don't want the hassle of trying to negotiate an exchange, especially when it is with someone who can barely speak English.

 

[denisvj]

new update !!

http://www.apple.com/support/downloads/imacsoftwareupdate121tiger.html

About iMac Software Update 1.2.1 (Tiger)
This update is for 20-inch and 24-inch aluminum iMac computers with 2.0, 2.4, or 2.8 GHz processors running Mac OS X Tiger.

It improves the performance and reliability of graphics-intensive games and applications and fixes an issue that some customers encountered when installing Mac OS X Leopard after applying iMac Software Update 1.2.

 

[mattraehl]

question on freezing

I just got my 24" 2.4 GHz iMac set up the other day. I did an erase-and-install using the Leopard drop-in disc, and used migration assistant to get all the old stuff off my iBook. Then I applied all the updates. I have seen one "freeze", where I was playing with Photo Booth and the various effects. The freeze was like this: I could move the mouse around, but clicking did nothing, nor did any keyboard commands produce results. Now, I have seen this behavior a couple of times over the past 3 1/2 years of using Panther and Tiger on my iBook, so I guess there is the possibility that it could have just been a bug in Leopard, not my iMac. I have used FrontRow quite a bit, and haven't had any problems.

Is the freeze I am describing the same as what others of you are experiencing?

This evening I'll try the iTunes visualizer thing, and running some screen savers, and see if I can force a freeze.

 

[sabesh]

I just got my 24" 2.4 GHz iMac set up the other day. I did an erase-and-install using the Leopard drop-in disc, and used migration assistant to get all the old stuff off my iBook. Then I applied all the updates <snip>

Hi,

Do iLife, Front row & Photo booth get installed when you do this? I plan to do the same when I get my first Mac (iMac) and want the s/w that's supposed to come with it.

Thanks,

Sabesh.

 

[Mindflux]

Hi,

Do iLife, Front row & Photo booth get installed when you do this? I plan to do the same when I get my first Mac (iMac) and want the s/w that's supposed to come with it.

Thanks,

Sabesh.

You have to reload iLife from your Tiger restore discs. It's not a big deal. Front Row & Photobooth are part of Leopard if I'm not mistaken.

 

[l33r0y]

Trouble is, with BTO, you're pretty screwed because Apple can weasel out on the phone. Hence I am not buying one; I want a bigger HDD and don't want the hassle of trying to negotiate an exchange, especially when it is with someone who can barely speak English.

If the unit is faulty, it is faulty. Apple cannot get out of that. The 'will not restoke if it is a BTO/CTO" is only relevant if the unit is *not* faulty and the purchaser changes their mind about buying it.

 

[atl27426]

Hey guys,

Just installed Leopard on my new 24" SiO2 iMac. Seems like it is crashing even more now...

What's the story with the Update?

Apple working on a fix?

When can we expect to see it?

Just wanted to join in on this and fill everyone in on what seemed to work for me. Bought my iMac 24" on Aug 9th, didn't have any problems at least any that I noticed. Installed all upgrades over time even iMac 1.1 still no problems.

The few days back when iMac 1.2 came out, I installed the firmware and started having the freezing problem, getting artifacts when I would open up my wigets, mostly around the black clock and then the entire system would freeze.

Notices firmware was the same that many have posted on this forum and others 212 ending numbers.

So to back this out I did an archive and install, I knew it would come to that after talking to Applecare a few times. Anyone notice how their wait times have gone from 5 min back in Aug to 90 mins in some cases.

In an case rolled back to video driver firmware, EFI Driver Version: 01.00.207, seems to have fixed the problem, at least no hangs in two days.

I still believe this is a software issue for several reasons. I use to be a pc gamer this is exactly what would happen if you downloaded a bad driver from nvidia or ati or even more so if you would try to overclock your video card.

Also has anyone noticed if you check device manager in Windows the ATI card on the iMac shows as a 2600XT, called Apple that day and verified it is not an XT chipset. I knew that day over time we were going to run into driver/firmware issues. Not sure with patch 1.2 if that still shows in windows, can anyone verify this?

So just wanted to share my experience with this problem, have to say im starting to get really annoyed having to even think about this after switching to my first Mac.

Saw rumors that we might see a fix this week, if now im seriously going to start putting pressure on Apple, this simply is unacceptable, im sure we all feel that way. So much for "it just works".

 

[sabesh]

You have to reload iLife from your Tiger restore discs. It's not a big deal. Front Row & Photobooth are part of Leopard if I'm not mistaken.

Thx! I used your info to find a relevant thread:

https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/378261/

Cheers,

Sabesh.

 

[Mindflux]

Just wanted to join in on this and fill everyone in on what seemed to work for me. Bought my iMac 24" on Aug 9th, didn't have any problems at least any that I noticed. Installed all upgrades over time even iMac 1.1 still no problems.

The few days back when iMac 1.2 came out, I installed the firmware and started having the freezing problem, getting artifacts when I would open up my wigets, mostly around the black clock and then the entire system would freeze.

Notices firmware was the same that many have posted on this forum and others 212 ending numbers.

So to back this out I did an archive and install, I knew it would come to that after talking to Applecare a few times. Anyone notice how their wait times have gone from 5 min back in Aug to 90 mins in some cases.

In an case rolled back to video driver firmware, EFI Driver Version: 01.00.207, seems to have fixed the problem, at least no hangs in two days.

I still believe this is a software issue for several reasons. I use to be a pc gamer this is exactly what would happen if you downloaded a bad driver from nvidia or ati or even more so if you would try to overclock your video card.

Also has anyone noticed if you check device manager in Windows the ATI card on the iMac shows as a 2600XT, called Apple that day and verified it is not an XT chipset. I knew that day over time we were going to run into driver/firmware issues. Not sure with patch 1.2 if that still shows in windows, can anyone verify this?

So just wanted to share my experience with this problem, have to say im starting to get really annoyed having to even think about this after switching to my first Mac.

Saw rumors that we might see a fix this week, if now im seriously going to start putting pressure on Apple, this simply is unacceptable, im sure we all feel that way. So much for "it just works".

How did you roll back the Video card firmware? Just curious .

 

[atl27426]

How did you roll back the Video card firmware? Just curious .

You have no choice but to reinstall from your OS disks. It bites, at least with Windows you could roll back drivers, not so with OsX. The best option is to at least do an archive and install and have all your user settings stay the same.

I still had to reinstall Photoshop CS3 because support files got messed up and had to reinstall printer drivers but that was about it, everything else was okay, even keep my iWork stuff and user files like iTunes.

I would still back all that stuff up just to be safe.

Believe me I was praying when I called Applecare that I was missing something and there was a way to roll back drivers, there isn't to the best of my knowledge and based on what Applecare told me.

Overall I would say the entire process without the CS3 issue took about two hours.

 

[Mindflux]

You have no choice but to reinstall from your OS disks. It bites, at least with Windows you could roll back drivers, not so with OsX. The best option is to at least do an archive and install and have all your user settings stay the same.

How does reinstalling the OS reload an older firmware? Drivers, yes.. firmware? No?

Maybe I am miss understanding.

 

[atl27426]

How does reinstalling the OS reload an older firmware? Drivers, yes.. firmware? No?

Maybe I am miss understanding.

What it does is it resets your operating system, fireware, drivers all back to the same settings when you first got your machine. Sets everything back to how the iMac was shipped (factory settings). It will remove all updates that have been done on your system since you got it.

Its pretty much reformatting your harddrive and installling a clean copy of everything. You can even go one step further with OSX and do an Erase and Install, this totally removes everything, OS, Software, User data and settings and you would have to reinstall everything and resetup everything. That is why I did an archive and install, that at least saved my user data which saved me some time.


Archive and Install is also very popular for people going from Tiger to Leopard, its cleaner than just doing an Upgrade but not as destructive as Erase and Install.

 

[ascender]

Yip, but it won't roll back any firmware updates surely? Everything else yes, but firmware that's been flashed up to a later version will need to be specifically flashed back down by a new update or a manual process.

 

[bergy]

Just wanted to join in on this and fill everyone in on what seemed to work for me. Bought my iMac 24" on Aug 9th, didn't have any problems at least any that I noticed. Installed all upgrades over time even iMac 1.1 still no problems.

The few days back when iMac 1.2 came out, I installed the firmware and started having the freezing problem, getting artifacts when I would open up my wigets, mostly around the black clock and then the entire system would freeze.

Notices firmware was the same that many have posted on this forum and others 212 ending numbers.

So to back this out I did an archive and install, I knew it would come to that after talking to Applecare a few times. Anyone notice how their wait times have gone from 5 min back in Aug to 90 mins in some cases.

In an case rolled back to video driver firmware, EFI Driver Version: 01.00.207, seems to have fixed the problem, at least no hangs in two days.

I still believe this is a software issue for several reasons. I use to be a pc gamer this is exactly what would happen if you downloaded a bad driver from nvidia or ati or even more so if you would try to overclock your video card.

Also has anyone noticed if you check device manager in Windows the ATI card on the iMac shows as a 2600XT, called Apple that day and verified it is not an XT chipset. I knew that day over time we were going to run into driver/firmware issues. Not sure with patch 1.2 if that still shows in windows, can anyone verify this?

So just wanted to share my experience with this problem, have to say im starting to get really annoyed having to even think about this after switching to my first Mac.

Saw rumors that we might see a fix this week, if now im seriously going to start putting pressure on Apple, this simply is unacceptable, im sure we all feel that way. So much for "it just works".

This is exactly the same experience I have had.I now have Leopard installed have still had a few freezes playing Cod 2 and once with time machine.I have not been impressed with the beta testing leopard got.I believe the freezing problems are video card driver issues. Apple should fix these problems asap.This is also my first Mac, Apple if your listening change your "it just works" slogan.

 

[atl27426]

How does reinstalling the OS reload an older firmware? Drivers, yes.. firmware? No?

Maybe I am miss understanding.

It rolls back your system to factory settings, the firmware that came with the system is reinstalled. Remember your system came with video drivers/firmware the all the upgrades did was upgrade the origninal firmware.

Just to prove my point my firmware was a 212 version under the EFI driver now I currently have this verions.

EFI Driver Version: 01.00.207

Most of the problems you see are xx.xx.212 which is the version I had after downloading 1.2

When you do either and Archive and Install or an Erase and Install you are totally wiping out any updates to software and hardware(firmware) setting your system back to its original state.

You are formatting your harddrive and reloading all original software and firmware/drivers. The difference with an Archive and Install OSX creates a (previous systems) folder with your old apps so you can move applications back over into the new version if you want. You also have the option to save your user data and network settings. Erase and Installs wipes out everything and you have to install all your old apps and user date, pretty much bring you back to the day you got your machine.

Believe me this is pretty common for guys like me who were ex windows gamers, this was pretty much a weekly event, backing out bad drivers.

Applecare if you are still under warranty or purchased Applecare can verify any of this. So can the Apple website.

 

[atl27426]

This is exactly the same experience I have had.I now have Leopard installed have still had a few freezes playing Cod 2 and once with time machine.I have not been impressed with the beta testing leopard got.I believe the freezing problems are video card driver issues. Apple should fix these problems asap.This is also my first Mac, Apple if your listening change your "it just works" slogan.

Yeah I know what your staying, my Mac experience so far as been a bit more stressful then I expected. I still have hope that this will be resolved by decent drivers.

I still believe if it was hardware this problem would happend all the time. Most of the time solid state electronics either work or they don't, of course not always but thats often the case. For those that had problems out of the box it could be bad hardware but logic tells me if I only had problems after installing 1.2 then it appears to be a firmware issue.

Another fact that if you use bootcamp and look in device manager it shows the video card as a 2600xt not a 2600pro. That set off a red flag in my mind from day one that there were going to be driver issues.

I guess only time will tell this problem seems to be so hit and miss the only thing that seem to trigger it is any kind of motion, doesn't even have to be true 3d rendering.

 

[CIrawI3riCIge]

It rolls back your system to factory settings, the firmware that came with the system is reinstalled. Remember your system came with video drivers/firmware the all the upgrades did was upgrade the origninal firmware.

Just to prove my point my firmware was a 212 version under the EFI driver now I currently have this verions.

EFI Driver Version: 01.00.207

Most of the problems you see are xx.xx.212 which is the version I had after downloading 1.2

When you do either and Archive and Install or an Erase and Install you are totally wiping out any updates to software and hardware(firmware) setting your system back to its original state.

You are formatting your harddrive and reloading all original software and firmware/drivers. The difference with an Archive and Install OSX creates a (previous systems) folder with your old apps so you can move applications back over into the new version if you want. You also have the option to save your user data and network settings. Erase and Installs wipes out everything and you have to install all your old apps and user date, pretty much bring you back to the day you got your machine.

Believe me this is pretty common for guys like me who were ex windows gamers, this was pretty much a weekly event, backing out bad drivers.

Applecare if you are still under warranty or purchased Applecare can verify any of this. So can the Apple website.

Firmware is an embedded program that tells devices how to function. It is stored on chip in memory or microcontrollers. It is not on the hard drive. (Re)installing the OS does not in itself alter the firmware.

 

[Mindflux]

Firmware is an embedded program that tells devices how to function. It is stored on chip in memory or microcontrollers. It is not on the hard drive. (Re)installing the OS does not in itself alter the firmware.

That's what I was getting at. But maybe Apple does it differently? Most likely not. I bet his video ROM version is still 212 even if his EFI Driver isn't.

 

[atl27426]

Firmware is an embedded program that tells devices how to function. It is stored on chip in memory or microcontrollers. It is not on the hard drive. (Re)installing the OS does not in itself alter the firmware.

Thats true, but in the case of hardware like video cards the firmware is nothing more then a device driver. When you reinstall the OS you are rolling back the to the original device drivers for all the system hardware, which is why a reinstall worked.

I have yet to see anyone post a problem with the current driver I am using. Everyone that has going to Leopard gets pushed to 212 and anyone that downloaded any Imac "updates" has the same issue.

I would be very hard pressed to say this is a hardware issue seeing I bought my system in Aug and people getting systems a week ago are having the same problem. Over three months of bad video chipsets, that is highly unlikely.

 

[wakerider017]

Thats true, but in the case of hardware like video cards the firmware is nothing more then a device driver. When you reinstall the OS you are rolling back the to the original device drivers for all the system hardware, which is why a reinstall worked.

I have yet to see anyone post a problem with the current driver I am using. Everyone that has going to Leopard gets pushed to 212 and anyone that downloaded any Imac "updates" has the same issue.

I would be very hard pressed to say this is a hardware issue seeing I bought my system in Aug and people getting systems a week ago are having the same problem. Over three months of bad video chipsets, that is highly unlikely.

This post is completely inaccurate. There is a BIG difference between drivers and firmware...

See Wiki:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Graphics_card

Video BIOS

The video BIOS or firmware chip is a chip that contains the basic program that governs the video card's operations and provides the instructions that allow the computer and software to interface with the card. It contains information on the memory timing, operating speeds and voltages of the processor and ram and other information. It is possible to re-flash a BIOS (enable factory-locked settings for higher performance) although this is typically only done by video card overclockers, and has the potential to irreversibly damage the card.

 

[atl27426]

That's what I was getting at. But maybe Apple does it differently? Most likely not. I bet his video ROM version is still 212 even if his EFI Driver isn't.

Nope Rom driver gets rolled back also.

ROM Revision: 113-xxxxxx-207

Funny part about all this is when I bootcamp into Windows my ATI card shows as a 2600XT not Pro under my current EFI version. After I downloaded 1.2 it showed as a Pro card.

I am guess like everyone else but to me this still appears to be a driver issue. My system would freeze on demand under EFI Driver 01.00.212, I can get to to freeze at all under 01.00.207. Ive been running my system for three days solid trying to get it to hand and I can't.

Apple needs to put out a solid device driver that will work for everyone, clearly they don't have one yet.