iMac Pro VESA-Gate

[gobikerider]

I would never buy gen 1 of a apple product, sounds like they rushed it a bit, maybe they ran out of r&d cash?

According to Rossman, screws made out of tin versus more durable stainless steel

They didn’t run out of anything they got lazy and it needs to STOP. The butterfly keyboard, iOS 11, and iMac Pro support all shows a blatant disregard for quality control and its plain infuriating for any company let alone Apple. They decided to use a cheap oem to make this “Apple” VESA mount for a computer that cost upwards of $15,000 and then still they have the audacity to put that disgusting Apple markup on the thing. I’m so done with Apple rn

 

[trifid]

So many animojis that Apple forgot how to make Pro stuff.

 

[eVolcre]

They didn’t run out of anything they got lazy and it needs to STOP. The butterfly keyboard, iOS 11, and iMac Pro support all shows a blatant disregard for quality control and its plain infuriating for any company let alone Apple. They decided to use a cheap oem to make this “Apple” VESA mount for a computer that cost upwards of $15,000 and then still they have the audacity to put that disgusting Apple markup on the thing. I’m so done with Apple rn

Is that a typo? 15k USD for an iMac pro? Wowza.

 

[flyinmac]

Is that a typo? 15k USD for an iMac pro? Wowza.

$13,926.98 for the maximum configuration.

Doesn't take many clicks to get there, and honestly, looking at the final specs, it feels a bit light on the specs for that much money. Not that I've done a comparison check on this one vs. another brand yet. But... Seriously, for this much money, I personally need a LOT more than this. Perhaps a new office addition to install it in (included in the price) would make the price tag easier to swallow.

Considering that the parts apparently have come from the cheapest bidder, while disregarding quality, I think I can pass.

When getting bids for contract work, you're supposed to set the bar for expected quality of production. And, if the product doesn't deliver on expected quality, then the contract is void and the supplier is out (or the supplier still eats the cost and comes back with a rebuild that does meet the quality standard). Apparently Apple has forgotten how business works.

Glad they're not in charge of who I hire for projects. The windows I just had put in the building would probably be made out of plastic, be full of holes, and installed crooked, and they'd be "yep... good enough for us."

 

[maflynn]

You guys are gutsy. I’d never have the cojones to hang a 27lb USD 5000 machine on the wall just supported by 5 screws. Not very good screws at that looking at this video. What if a screw breaks when it’s hanging? Crash landing on your desk and more than likely not covered by Applecare.

More so now that we find out they're just cheap zinc screws

 

[eVolcre]

$13,926.98 for the maximum configuration.

Doesn't take many clicks to get there, and honestly, looking at the final specs, it feels a bit light on the specs for that much money. Not that I've done a comparison check on this one vs. another brand yet. But... Seriously, for this much money, I personally need a LOT more than this. Perhaps a new office addition to install it in (included in the price) would make the price tag easier to swallow.

Considering that the parts apparently have come from the cheapest bidder, while disregarding quality, I think I can pass.

When getting bids for contract work, you're supposed to set the bar for expected quality of production. And, if the product doesn't deliver on expected quality, then the contract is void and the supplier is out (or the supplier still eats the cost and comes back with a rebuild that does meet the quality standard). Apparently Apple has forgotten how business works.

Glad they're not in charge of who I hire for projects. The windows I just had put in the building would probably be made out of plastic, be full of holes, and installed crooked, and they'd be "yep... good enough for us."

View attachment 763196

That’s nuts for something tied to a set screen. I mean, I’m sure there’s people who can use those specs but it’s edpected to last, what? 6 years at least? Less? More?

Either way apple care runs out in 3 years and now you have a machine that costs 13 grand that can’t be easily opened up or fixed and if something goes wrong with the screen that’s it.

Dunno, just me, if I’m spending anything north of 5k I’d want a Mac Pro or its windows equivalent. Easily opened. Separate multiple screens etc. an all in one is a consumer item. Use it, junk it, buy again and at 2000 that’s fine. Pro level? Even at the 5k level there has to be a better option. Unless it’ll be obselete in 3 years and that’s what the buyers are planning on. No idea, my needs are pretty simply computationally in a desktop system.

 

[maflynn]

That’s nuts for something tied to a set screen.

Yeah, if I needed pro level machine and my budget was 15k, I don't think I'd be spending that budget on an AIO type computer, but that's me. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

[Truefan31]

Hope this gets as much exposure as Linus’s experience .

 

[maflynn]

Hope this gets as much exposure as Linus’s experience .

I'd say the odds of that occuring will go up if it impacts other users. I'm not sure many users take the mount on once its installed - translation I'd say this will probably fly under the radar.

 

[762999]

RIGHT APPLE PICKED THAT MANUFACTURER THEN MARKS IT UP TO $80 HELL NO

Well that part is genius because it makes them print money. The dumb part is us buying it!

 

[0248294]

Quinn already responded with the news that the Apple Store got back with him and offered either a repair to replace the entire shell of the iMac Pro, or straight up a new one, which of course he went for. But more interesting, Apple's Executive Team contacted him, according to Quinn, both inquiring if the Store had helped him fix it, but also with the request of him sending in the damaged VESA mount to their engineering team for them to examine it. Shows you that Apple is feeling that they can't ignore this one.

 

[gobikerider]

Quinn already responded with the news that the Apple Store got back with him and offered either a repair to replace the entire shell of the iMac Pro, or straight up a new one, which of course he went for. But more interesting, Apple's Executive Team contacted him, according to Quinn, both inquiring if the Store had helped him fix it, but also with the request of him sending in the damaged VESA mount to their engineering team for them to examine it. Shows you that Apple is feeling that they can't ignore this one.

They cant

 

[Truefan31]

Quinn already responded with the news that the Apple Store got back with him and offered either a repair to replace the entire shell of the iMac Pro, or straight up a new one, which of course he went for. But more interesting, Apple's Executive Team contacted him, according to Quinn, both inquiring if the Store had helped him fix it, but also with the request of him sending in the damaged VESA mount to their engineering team for them to examine it. Shows you that Apple is feeling that they can't ignore this one.

Basically just use better screws if you’re not going to change the design.

 

[trifid]

I want Phil Schiller to comment on this right now. I think Apple's credibility on Pro products is on the floor and Phil needs to acknowledge and make this right.

And no excuses this time Phil.

 

[pier]

With the exception of the iMac 5K, the complete Mac lineup is crap right now.

The Mac Pro and the Mini are outrageously overpriced and completely obsolete.

The Macbook and Macbook Pro are plagued with keyboard problems.

The iMac Pro seemed like a good product for a particular target, but it’s so niche not even Apple can give proper support. And that VESA mount... it’s completely unbelievable that Apple would allow something like this to happen on their most expensive product.

The state of the Mac is really depressing and it’s been like this for years now. It seems every step Apple takes makes the situation worse.

 

[Truefan31]

Looks like it's made FP on MR now.....good.

 

[eVolcre]

Looks like it's made FP on MR now.....good.

Excellent. I took @maflynn advice and sent the link with a writeup to tips@macrumors.com. Looks like they do check that account.

 

[Truefan31]

Excellent. I took @maflynn advice and sent the link with a writeup to tips@macrumors.com. Looks like they do check that account.

I sent the yt link to AppleInsider too but I doubt anything will come from it

 

[Moodles]

With the exception of the iMac 5K, the complete Mac lineup is crap right now.

The Mac Pro and the Mini are outrageously overpriced and completely obsolete.

The Macbook and Macbook Pro are plagued with keyboard problems.

The iMac Pro seemed like a good product for a particular target, but it’s so niche not even Apple can give proper support. And that VESA mount... it’s completely unbelievable that Apple would allow something like this to happen on their most expensive product.

The state of the Mac is really depressing and it’s been like this for years now. It seems every step Apple takes makes the situation worse.

I signed up just to reply to this. I've been using Apple machines since the 80s and things are in a terrible spot now, especially for Pro users, but even the average person using laptops and phones.

From using cheap/incorrect parts to soldering in hard drives and RAM, to having horrible to no repair service, not providing parts, suing repair companies, not making a professional pro ATX tower, using past-gen hardware in new machines, or simply not allowing us to easily install the OS on any hardware—it's a nightmare. But hey, at least they still have almost a 40% profit margin.

My Mac Pro Tower finally is laid to rest and I now find myself without a viable option. Regardless of what anyone says, the iMac Pro is not in the same league as a pro Windows workstation. We can't get Xeon E5 v4 cpus or dual cpus with 44 cores or more running, or 2TB of RAM. Hell, we can't even upgrade the new machines or open them to blow out dust. They're overpriced for their hardware and software companies are not even taking advantage of the hardware that has existed for years (nods to Adobe). OS stability and how the OS works is the only thing I see anymore that I like about Apple.

If you use FCP... yeah, maybe you're fine with some external TB3 drives. I do pro audio/music, video, photography and VFX. I need multiple CPUs and lots of cores for some software and high clock speeds for others, while others need multiple GPUs, and I run them at the same time often. Any Apple option leaves me neutered in some way and for a high price. I have no reasonable, affordable option Mac-wise even as an interim until the 2019 pro machines are released but I use certain software that I need to run on a Mac. Even 2013's are astronomically overpriced still.

Now Schiller is talking about a "modular" 2019 Mac Pro instead of an expandable one. Makes you wonder if they're planning some other proprietary monstrosity and crafting their language as such so they can say, "Hey! We never said it was expandable. Just buy our magical Apple modules to upgrade it that have **** specs and only work with Mac." Others hinting at ditching Mac OS for iOS across all devices... good god.

It's a dark time indeed.

 

[campyguy]

I'm not piling on Apple here, owner of 5 base iMPs, all 4 in my offices have the VESA adapter - I haven't installed it on my home office iMP yet, waiting due to my desk not being done. I saw the video, posted #124 in the News page thread. Listened to the guy whine, ended it after around 5 minutes, finished my desk last night.

IMO the guy's a frickin' idiot and a whiner. As I posted in the other thread, the screws are steel.

And, there's Loctite on all of the screws - Blue Threadlocker Loctite, (as opposed to pink or red) - I called out the Loctite in that post but not which type. Anyone with experience with blue Loctite knows one needs to apply heat - with a soldering iron with a pin tip iron or pinpoint butane torch to warm up the fastener and loosen up the blue Loctite, at least apply heat to the removal tool and touch it to each screw for a few minutes - those are the PWT methods, the company specs out 482 degrees F/250 degrees C. I saw the Loctite, used a web search and found the product info in seconds.

The YouTuber is IMO calling out Apple for using cheap screws - they're not cheap screws - I'm calling him out on not being aware of what the screw's materials are (seconds with a magnet proved him wrong), not being aware of what he was installing and using the proper procedure for removing the screws, and going into crisis mode when he's the guy who - pun intended - screwed up. He disassembles the mount properly, this never is an issue. I took the time to read the instructions and assess the installation - IMO the YouTuber is pretty much an idiot who was too lazy to determine how to disassemble the VESA mount. I saw Blue Loctite on the screws as soon as I pulled them from the packaging and knew what needed to be done in case of removal of the mount, IMO he didn't have a clue and chose to manufacture a crisis instead...

 

[gobikerider]

I'm not piling on Apple here, owner of 5 base iMPs, all 4 in my offices have the VESA adapter - I haven't installed it on my home office iMP yet, waiting due to my desk not being done. I saw the video, posted #124 in the News page thread. Listened to the guy whine, ended it after around 5 minutes, finished my desk last night.

IMO the guy's a frickin' idiot and a whiner. As I posted in the other thread, the screws are steel.

And, there's Loctite on all of the screws - Blue Threadlocker Loctite, (as opposed to pink or red) - I called out the Loctite in that post but not which type. Anyone with experience with blue Loctite knows one needs to apply heat - with a soldering iron with a pin tip iron or pinpoint butane torch to warm up the fastener and loosen up the blue Loctite, at least apply heat to the removal tool and touch it to each screw for a few minutes - those are the PWT methods, the company specs out 482 degrees F/250 degrees C. I saw the Loctite, used a web search and found the product info in seconds.

The YouTuber is IMO calling out Apple for using cheap screws - they're not cheap screws - I'm calling him out on not being aware of what the screw's materials are (seconds with a magnet proved him wrong), not being aware of what he was installing and using the proper procedure for removing the screws, and going into crisis mode when he's the guy who - pun intended - screwed up. He disassembles the mount properly, this never is an issue. I took the time to read the instructions and assess the installation - IMO the YouTuber is pretty much an idiot who was too lazy to determine how to disassemble the VESA mount. I saw Blue Loctite on the screws as soon as I pulled them from the packaging and knew what needed to be done in case of removal of the mount, IMO he didn't have a clue and chose to manufacture a crisis instead...

????Please share pic of “proper removal” as seen in this manual.

 

[flyinmac]

I'm not piling on Apple here, owner of 5 base iMPs, all 4 in my offices have the VESA adapter - I haven't installed it on my home office iMP yet, waiting due to my desk not being done. I saw the video, posted #124 in the News page thread. Listened to the guy whine, ended it after around 5 minutes, finished my desk last night.

IMO the guy's a frickin' idiot and a whiner. As I posted in the other thread, the screws are steel.

And, there's Loctite on all of the screws - Blue Threadlocker Loctite, (as opposed to pink or red) - I called out the Loctite in that post but not which type. Anyone with experience with blue Loctite knows one needs to apply heat - with a soldering iron with a pin tip iron or pinpoint butane torch to warm up the fastener and loosen up the blue Loctite, at least apply heat to the removal tool and touch it to each screw for a few minutes - those are the PWT methods, the company specs out 482 degrees F/250 degrees C. I saw the Loctite, used a web search and found the product info in seconds.

The YouTuber is IMO calling out Apple for using cheap screws - they're not cheap screws - I'm calling him out on not being aware of what the screw's materials are (seconds with a magnet proved him wrong), not being aware of what he was installing and using the proper procedure for removing the screws, and going into crisis mode when he's the guy who - pun intended - screwed up. He disassembles the mount properly, this never is an issue. I took the time to read the instructions and assess the installation - IMO the YouTuber is pretty much an idiot who was too lazy to determine how to disassemble the VESA mount. I saw Blue Loctite on the screws as soon as I pulled them from the packaging and knew what needed to be done in case of removal of the mount, IMO he didn't have a clue and chose to manufacture a crisis instead...

Hmmm.... as soon as you explain that you used a butane torch to disassemble the computer from the mount, I’m pretty sure Apple will flag the computer as warranty void.

If the directions don’t say use a butane torch or heat iron prior to disassembly, then you’re proposing that the end user should do something which will void the warranty, and require skills beyond your average office person.

While I do know how to use a soldering iron and a torch, I can tell you that I have never met another technician or computer IT person who does. It’s a lost skill these days.

Which is fine for me. Because it means I’m the one they come to.

But I can also assure you that the “Genius” and Apple Certified techs also don’t know how to use such tools. It’s not part of their yank this out and stick a whole new part in.

I’ve been in to the Apple repair centers. They were intrigued that I could perform repairs on the circuit level. They don’t do that kind of work. Therefore, it’s not a skill that is in Apple’s repair center.

I stand by my prior statement. The entire design is flawed. The screws should not be part of the support system.

If designed properly, there would be no need for thread locker. The screws would have essentially zero mechanical function.

A properly designed mount, would hold the computer to the support bracket even if the screws were not yet installed. The screws should only be used to prevent accidentally disengaging the computer from the mount.

 

[Truefan31]

I'm not piling on Apple here, owner of 5 base iMPs, all 4 in my offices have the VESA adapter - I haven't installed it on my home office iMP yet, waiting due to my desk not being done. I saw the video, posted #124 in the News page thread. Listened to the guy whine, ended it after around 5 minutes, finished my desk last night.

IMO the guy's a frickin' idiot and a whiner. As I posted in the other thread, the screws are steel.

And, there's Loctite on all of the screws - Blue Threadlocker Loctite, (as opposed to pink or red) - I called out the Loctite in that post but not which type. Anyone with experience with blue Loctite knows one needs to apply heat - with a soldering iron with a pin tip iron or pinpoint butane torch to warm up the fastener and loosen up the blue Loctite, at least apply heat to the removal tool and touch it to each screw for a few minutes - those are the PWT methods, the company specs out 482 degrees F/250 degrees C. I saw the Loctite, used a web search and found the product info in seconds.

The YouTuber is IMO calling out Apple for using cheap screws - they're not cheap screws - I'm calling him out on not being aware of what the screw's materials are (seconds with a magnet proved him wrong), not being aware of what he was installing and using the proper procedure for removing the screws, and going into crisis mode when he's the guy who - pun intended - screwed up. He disassembles the mount properly, this never is an issue. I took the time to read the instructions and assess the installation - IMO the YouTuber is pretty much an idiot who was too lazy to determine how to disassemble the VESA mount. I saw Blue Loctite on the screws as soon as I pulled them from the packaging and knew what needed to be done in case of removal of the mount, IMO he didn't have a clue and chose to manufacture a crisis instead...

Lol so he’s supposed to know to use a soldering iron to remove screws when it doesn’t say anywhere to do so from the kit he purchased? Why didn’t the AppleCare support inform him of this instead of just passing him off to the OEM while not giving him the contact info? An apple branded kit with apple instructions and apple support number for customer service but they can’t do anything. For a 5k “Pro” machine.

And it was apple who mangled his stand trying to get it back on. No excuses.

 

[pier]

I signed up just to reply to this. I've been using Apple machines since the 80s and things are in a terrible spot now, especially for Pro users, but even the average person using laptops and phones.

From using cheap/incorrect parts to soldering in hard drives and RAM, to having horrible to no repair service, not providing parts, suing repair companies, not making a professional pro ATX tower, using past-gen hardware in new machines, or simply not allowing us to easily install the OS on any hardware—it's a nightmare. But hey, at least they still have almost a 40% profit margin.

My Mac Pro Tower finally is laid to rest and I now find myself without a viable option. Regardless of what anyone says, the iMac Pro is not in the same league as a pro Windows workstation. We can't get Xeon E5 v4 cpus or dual cpus with 44 cores or more running, or 2TB of RAM. Hell, we can't even upgrade the new machines or open them to blow out dust. They're overpriced for their hardware and software companies are not even taking advantage of the hardware that has existed for years (nods to Adobe). OS stability and how the OS works is the only thing I see anymore that I like about Apple.

If you use FCP... yeah, maybe you're fine with some external TB3 drives. I do pro audio/music, video, photography and VFX. I need multiple CPUs and lots of cores for some software and high clock speeds for others, while others need multiple GPUs, and I run them at the same time often. Any Apple option leaves me neutered in some way and for a high price. I have no reasonable, affordable option Mac-wise even as an interim until the 2019 pro machines are released but I use certain software that I need to run on a Mac. Even 2013's are astronomically overpriced still.

Now Schiller is talking about a "modular" 2019 Mac Pro instead of an expandable one. Makes you wonder if they're planning some other proprietary monstrosity and crafting their language as such so they can say, "Hey! We never said it was expandable. Just buy our magical Apple modules to upgrade it that have **** specs and only work with Mac." Others hinting at ditching Mac OS for iOS across all devices... good god.

It's a dark time indeed.

Couldn't agree more.

I've argued in these forums that the iMac Pro is not a Land Rover, but a SUV for camping enthusiasts. The tower Mac Pro was a true Land Rover. It worked on rugged muddy terrain all day long, and it was easy to repair and upgrade. Why can't Apple simply go back to that?

If I was working on video, 3d, vfx, motion graphics, etc, I'd be moving to Windows for my workstation. Hardware wise the difference is so huge it's not even funny.

For graphic design, dev, etc, my iMac 5K is a superb machine only dragged down by buggy High Sierra.

 

[gobikerider]

Couldn't agree more.

I've argued in these forums that the iMac Pro is not a Land Rover, but a SUV for camping enthusiasts. The tower Mac Pro was a true Land Rover. It worked on rugged muddy terrain all day long, and it was easy to repair and upgrade. Why can't Apple simply go back to that?

If I was working on video, 3d, vfx, motion graphics, etc, I'd be moving to Windows for my workstation. Hardware wise the difference is so huge it's not even funny.

For graphic design, dev, etc, my iMac 5K is a superb machine only dragged down by buggy High Sierra.

Mac Pro is coming in 2019