Who brought up that the Xbox lacks a keyboard and trackpad and isn't a multipurpose device again?
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In 3 years, 50% of all computers capable of playing AAA games will be Macs
- Thread starter senttoschool
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An Xbox? No but I think it's a perfectly valid gaming comparison. No, it's not a "do it all" device but you can easily get an okay laptop (PC/used Mac/whatever) and an Xbox (or PS5) for the price of a new MBA.
You think it’s a valid gaming comparison to compare a console that needs power to a thin laptop with great battery life..
OK
Yeah, because for the same $1000 you can get a MBA or you can get an Xbox and a Surface Laptop or whatever. If you care more about gaming the Xbox will give a better experience and for web browsing/word processing/basic computer stuff a $500 laptop can do 90% as well. Get it?
No they are not 1:1 perfect replacements but I think it's fair to compare them since if you can afford the MBA then the Xbox was a valid option. It's not like comparing against a 4090 with 13900K and 128GB RAM that's quadruple the price.
This is really disingenuous.
The whole argument that is being discussed is a certain someone (aided by others) was trying to say the MacBook Air is bad because it get’s beaten by: a desktop “el cheapo”, a console plugged in permanently, and a hand held gaming device, with a crappy keyboard and awful battery life. Myself and others are saying if you want to judge the performance of the MacBook Air, you judge it against similar laptops with similar trade offs.
It makes no sense to say “yeah but you can get 4 different devices, if you buy second hand and you dont care about quality or the os”… I mean sure, that’s true, but it’s hardly a valid method of comparison. Everybody, literally everybody knows a desktop with a 6800 or an xbox gets better gaming performance. You haven’t given any great insight with this fact, because….it’s a different class of device.
That doesnt mean the Air isn’t a good computer. It just means it doesn’t suit your priorities. Others may disagree
I think it's fair to judge on value per dollar. If used bothers you, you can get a new laptop and gaming console for the same money. And if you care about the quality of the OS there's some fantastic free ones out there that aren't trying to get you sign up to 15 services or buy 4 dozen other tie in products to get things to work as they should. If you want macOS and an Xbox for the same money well then you can buy used.
And this isn't a thread about best thin and light laptop, it's a thread about the AAA gaming performance of Macs. Gaming consoles are where a good majority of AAA games are played so it seems pretty ridiculous to say not to compare the AAA gaming performance of the two. This console gen is just starting to ramp up and leave last gen behind so I think it will be interesting to see how well actual current gen AAA games (e.g. Ratchet and Clank, Starfield, stuff not doable on PS4/Xbox One) do on Apple Silicon ESPECIALLY compared to the most affordable ways to play those games.
No. Value per dollar of what? They have to be comparable.
If this is true...
then this is nonsense.
We both know part of this discussion is those trolling and telling Mac users they are stupid for wanting to use Macs to game.
Gaming performance per dollar. It's comparable. You can compare them. Many ways, visually, feel, quantitatively.
It's not nonsense to compare to consoles. They are the AAA gaming greatest common denominator. Is your only bar for AAA capable that the game runs?
If you want to use a Mac to game that's fine IDGAF. I just think a console or gaming handheld is a perfectly valid comparison for gaming performance. No, maybe they won't perfectly meet your needs but maybe a Mac might not meet your gaming needs either? I don't recall calling anyone stupid.
In other words just another typical discussion on MR falling under rule 7 of the forum rules. People ignore explanations, don’t answer counterquestions and move goalposts so far from the original topic that they forget what the discussion was about and even contradict themselves and then everything is back to square one, rinse and repeat. To summarize what people said here:
- Macs are worthless unless they can do 60 fps in games.
- If you use lower quality or MetalFX to reach 60 fps they’re worthless because they have bad graphics.
- If you use quality settings and MetalFX for better graphics they are worthless because they can’t do 60 fps.
- Macs are worthless and Mac gaming menaingless if you in games can’t read bottle labels across the room.
- The number one immersion factor in horror games is the ability to read wine bottle labels from far distance.
- To solve puzzles in games you have to be able to read bottle labels across the room. Otherwise you’re screwed and must buy a PC or console.
- If you stop in the middle of the game, take screenshots of a detail across the room, leave the game to crop and magnify the shot but can’t read/see clearly there is no point in continuing. The game is ruined and you have no other option than quitting and ask for refund or buy a PC or console.
- Macs have bad graphics because they lack ray tracing. Gaming on PC/console without ray tracing is totally fine though.
- Since MBA costs twice as much as Xbox it should have the same performance in games and ray tracing.
- Since MBA costs twice as much as Xbox it should have 2x 200W 12TFLOPS GPU, or at least one in the same thin fanless form factor.
- MBA should cost $500 or even less really since it can’t perform as well as Xbox in games.
- Xbox is not worthless when it can’t do 60 fps with RT. Suddenly 30-45 fps is very fine, but 30-45 fps without RT is worthless.
- 30-45 fps with RT feels like 60 without RT.
- An upscaled 2K image should have the same quality as a native 4K image, especially if you magnify it three times.
- Expert reviews about MetalFX like the one by Digital Foundry and their comparison with Xbox should be ignored in such discussions.
- Xbox and GPD Win 4 can totally replace a Macbook or any other laptop. They are complete solutions for every need and workload.
- Starfield will be worthless since it only can do 30 fps.
The last one was my own contribution based on the arguments above but this is basically what MR has become and the reason why many have completely left the forum or stopped engaging in discussion. It reminds me of Bioshock and Rapture. The city is falling apart and the Splicers are taking over gradually.
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Oh it's too portable now eh? You can get those parts in a laptop too. Acer has one with a 16" 4K OLED screen with 100% DCI-P3 coverage and 16GB RAM with 1TB SSD for $1080 on Amazon. But I'm sure that's TOO big, the color space coverage TOO good and there's not enough fruit logos on it or something.
Acer 2023 Newest Swift Edge 16" 4K OLED Laptop, Ultra Thin and Light, AMD Ryzen 7 6800U(Up to 4.7GHz), 16GB LPDDR5 RAM, 1TB NVMe SSD, Backlit Keys, Fingerprint, WiFi 6, HDMI, Win 11, CUE Accessories
The Design: The sleek and stunning Swift Edge 16 is made with an alloy that’s 20% lighter and 2x as strong as normal aluminum. Giving you a 12.95mm thin & 1.17kg1 light ultra-portable laptop to accompany you on your nomadic ventures.Processor: AMD Ryzen 7 6800U, Octa-Core, 16 Threads, 2.7GHz Base...www.amazon.com
Having had a MBP with a 256GB SSD and needing to carry around necessary files on a Samsung T5, no thanks. That's clunky and annoying. Apple either needs to stop being tightwads when it comes to storage or use M.2 slots like everyone else before I remotely consider them again.
Here's a fascinating idea which I came up with.
When it comes to comparing a 13 inch MacBook Air, why don't we compare it to OTHER 13 inch laptops?
Indeed, apart from your hostile attitude, you're reasonably close with the 16 inch Acer.
But here's the thing, comparing a 13 inch laptop to a console or to a desktop is like saying 'WHICH IS THE BEST CAR TYPE? A SEDAN, CONVERTIBLE, OR VAN?"
"WHICH IS BETTER, A CAPYBARA, A BANANA OR AN OCEAN LINER?"
Take the desktop PC for example. We could compare a Mac mini to that, because that is also a desktop. We wouldn't do something stupid like compare a base model mini to something with a 4090 Ti, but we could compare a M2 Pro mini to some mid range desktops. That's fair.
Now, on the 256 GB SSD, I agree. If we put RE8 onto something with Ventura, then we're probably only going to have 90 GB or so left, assuming nothing else is on it.
Only after your friend started to make direct price comparison between MBA and Xbox saying ”Xbox is $500 and more capable” without taking anything else into consideration. At the same time not even that $1100 Acer with 6800U you suggested is more capable than Xbox or M1/M2.
Yes, the thread is about AAA gaming performance on Macs but all you and your friends do in almost every post is comparing the cost of it with every other cheaper option as an excuse to not own/buy Macs instead of comparing the performance with similar laptops and GPUs. For someone who ”DGAF” you sure put a lot of effort into trying to convince people who already own/use Macs. It’s fascinating to see that some people always need to give Mac users buying advices and reasons to why we’ve made all the wrong choices and how much more we could get for our money.
First we’re supposed to replace our MacBooks with a single Xbox for both gaming and productivity. Then we’re supposed to replace them with a single handheld gaming device like GPD Win 4 for every purpose. Then we’re supposed to replace them with PC laptops like Acer Swift with similar or worse performance and Win Home. Then we’re supposed to replace them with a Xbox and a cheap Surface. Finally when we’ve sold our MacBooks and bought all those devices it all doesn’t matter because ”IDGAF”.
Well, everything you’ve said could be said about that $1100 Acer you suggested instead of a Macbook too. Why should anyone buy that instead of a Xbox and a cheap/used Surface? Do you hang around Acer forum and try to talk them out of getting Swift laptops too? That goes for every other PC gaming desktop with 4090 or gaming laptop too. Why just not buy a Xbox and cheap Surface and spend the rest of the money on something else? Is your only bar for laptops their ability to handle ”web browsing/word processing and basic computer stuff”? People have different needs. People who prefer Macs and macOS don’t want a cheap Surface.
I like how people casually suggest we should exchange our MacBooks for Surface laptops. Sure, Xbox for gaming sounds fun but that Surface is many times inferior to MBA in every aspect. Have you even looked at the specs? You can only get a Surface Go 3 for $499 with dual-core i3-10100Y, 4GB RAM, 64GB storage, Intel UHD 615 and worse screen quality. That CPU/GPU is 4-7 times slower than M1 if not more. You have to pay at least $700 for a Surface Laptop Go 2 with only quad-core i5-1135G7, Intel Xe Graphics and 4/128 GB RAM/SSD still with half the performance of M1 if not less and worse screen quality. And you complained about MacBooks with 256GB SSD and 8GB RAM and wouldn’t consider Apple again because of that you said? But suddenly cheap Surface devices sound like good capable laptops? In other words anything is better than Macs again.
It’s very unlikely that gamers who are very particular about their HW and tech specs, as we’ve seen in this discussion, would settle for a cheap Surface with those specs even if they had a Xbox. Don’t think Xbox is that much fun to tolerate such a downgrade. It's even more unlikely that Mac users who already pay higher prices for higher standards would do such a thing.
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Here is another idea. Replace Macbook with other simliar PC laptops or that Acer and compare them with Xbox, GPD Win 4 or Surface laptop. You could use all those arguments about not getting a Macbook against those PC laptops and as reasons to why PC guys should ditch their laptops and get Xbox, handheld gaming devices and/or cheap Surface devices. I guess there is no fun in that though.
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Probably nothing. Valve doesn't seem to report the number surveyed so its hard to say for sure but it's it's likely still within the margin of error.
So statistically macOS and Linux OS share is just a rounding error?
Yeah, the swings are interesting.
No, I'm saying let's suppose the "true" Mac userbase proportion is 2% and the margin of error is +- 0.5%. Then the low end would be 1.5% and the high end 2.5%. This would cover this month and last month. Surveys aren't censuses, there is always some error.
June 2023 Steam Survey puts Apple Silicon at 58.64% (+2.60%) market share on macOS.
M1 Ultra finally makes its appearance in the data.
| SoC | Market share | Change |
| M1 | 30,89% | +0,12% |
| M1 Pro | 9,95% | +0,46% |
| M1 Max | 3,84% | +0,38% |
| M1 Ultra | 0,18% | +0,18% |
| M2 | 10,34% | +0,77% |
| M2 Pro | 2,50% | +0,55% |
| M2 Max | 1,03% | +0,22% |
M1 Ultra finally makes its appearance in the data.
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Remember that all other machines are recognised by model number (Mac13,x or Mac14,x) now and not by the MacBookAir or MacBookPro string. The MacBookPro identifier have been around a lot longer and consists of all models based on M1 and prior.
In that way those two hardware strings makes the data unusable.
If you sort by those strings we can decipher it falls pretty much as expected with the M2 MacBook Air at 43% and the M2 MacBook Pro at 21% (although that data is obviously skewed with the missing data for the M1 Macs besides the Mac Studios).
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I don't need to have any cooperation with Apple, even if I have a particularly excellent game. The decision to migrate to Apple is foolish, but of course, I cannot say that other companies' actions are foolish. They have their own considerations, and I also have my own. I am only targeting me, and I won't represent the entire industry. That's just your own opinion. I'm just telling you, many people won't choose apples. Even if you list some big brand games and log in to this platform.
Apple also has no authority to represent the entire industry, it is only a part of it,
And it is a very small range that can be ignored.
Yeah, but I choose to ignore Windows. So there is no competition.
Your math is way off. The Surface Laptop starts at $899, so you'd only have $100 to spend on an XBox using your self-imposed $1000. In fact, the Surface Go 3 ($399) would be the only Surface device you could get along with an XBox and stay within that $1000 limit, and that only includes the tablet and power adapter - no keyboard included. Spec wise, that tablet would be a dog, running an Intel Pentium 6500Y with only 4GB RAM and 64GB eMMC storage, not even a baseline SSD in that machine.
You can get a Surface Laptop Go for less than $400.
Microsoft Surface Laptop Go 12.4" Touchscreen, Intel Core i5-1035G1 Processor, 4 GB RAM, 128GB PCIe SSD, Up to 13Hr Battery Life, WiFi, Webcam, Windows 11 Pro, Platinum Silver
Microsoft Surface Laptop Go 12.4" Touchscreen, Intel Core i5-1035G1 Processor, 4 GB RAM, 128GB PCIe SSD, Up to 13Hr Battery Life, WiFi, Webcam, Windows 11 Pro, Platinum Silver
www.amazon.com