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Intel 12900HK is faster than M1 Max for both single and multi cores.
- Thread starter sunny5
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Agreed, Alder Lake looks very good for desktop towers. Intel will take the sustained performance crown from AMD thanks to their hybrid architecture.
It’s good to see better from Intel, but for laptops they need to at least halve their TDP to compete on a like for like basis imho.
For desktops Apple needs to up their game, which will happen in 2022. If the new full size iMac only has a 10 core CPU (M1 Pro or Max) I will actually be disappointed. In a desktop I don’t care about TDP and want better multi-core CPU performance on Mac without spending $10,000 for a Mac Pro.
Apple have designed a family of chips for Mac with a means of leveraging so that their tech can be used across a variety of devices and form factors. This will mean some side-effects such as excessive memory bandwidth that may not make as much difference in the real world on lower end devices but can still be “sold” as a feature. It will also mean more profits for Apple of course and bring benefits such as the unexpected doubling of the video cores - which again will probably end up being a further quadrupling in a Mac Pro leading to excess and unused cores. So there’s pros and cons to Apple’s approach.
It does feel to me that the new MBPs too heavily focus on video performance - most people are not video editors - but I await the real world tests to enlighten me.
For desktops Apple needs to up their game, which will happen in 2022. If the new full size iMac only has a 10 core CPU (M1 Pro or Max) I will actually be disappointed. In a desktop I don’t care about TDP and want better multi-core CPU performance on Mac without spending $10,000 for a Mac Pro.
Apple have designed a family of chips for Mac with a means of leveraging so that their tech can be used across a variety of devices and form factors. This will mean some side-effects such as excessive memory bandwidth that may not make as much difference in the real world on lower end devices but can still be “sold” as a feature. It will also mean more profits for Apple of course and bring benefits such as the unexpected doubling of the video cores - which again will probably end up being a further quadrupling in a Mac Pro leading to excess and unused cores. So there’s pros and cons to Apple’s approach.
It does feel to me that the new MBPs too heavily focus on video performance - most people are not video editors - but I await the real world tests to enlighten me.
If you can point out what is it what you mean by that image?
These they seem in line with 8+2 cores in systems and obviously beaten by 12, 16, etc cores. The GPU ones seem not so much in line by the raw numbers yet the FPS ones show sometimes 50% FPS average numbers than other current high end graphics cards.
Can’t wait for FCP + DaVinci Resolve (plus all their ML face/object/etc trackers and maskers), Cinebench, Blender (when they drop in the metal backend), compiling code, Logic audio tracks (which the M1 blew out of the water) and assorted games.
The one without the notch.
I doubt it. It will either be shipped with cheapest chipsets in overpriced business desktops or a year too late in professional workstations. Business only buy from those markets, not smaller custom builds or OEMs, not that you can trust them. At least the bottom rate garbage chipsets from AMD aren’t crippling.
I actually had to run shadow ops for a year on a custom hefty Ryzen 3700X build to get enough single thread performance For my workloads. The M1 mini is now fractionally faster (!).
Buying any commercial PC junk just gets you the middle of the road.
The whole PC market for professionals is a ********.
I may be off here, but it’s been a long time since Apple has been the “fastest” in terms of CPU stuff. Even when they were Intel only, they never used the newest chips. Now all of a sudden they have an incredible chip but we have these kinds of discussions popping up. I’m a pro user, ordered the M1Max and it’ll be a solid laptop for at least 5 years for me workflows. I’m rocking a mid 2015 pro right now and it’s been great.
In any case can we just accept that different people have different needs? Earlier there was a comment that TDP doesn't matter because it's all laptops anyway. Well there's a difference to me between a laptop that sounds like a jet and burns my lap versus something that is cool and quiet. Depending on my personal needs, I may need the jet and the 2nd degree burns, or maybe I just need to Netflix and chill. Maybe I need Windows, Boot Camp, whatever.
This year I got a maxed out 2020 Intel iMac precisely because I needed two obscure Windows apps that 0% of this forum has ever heard of, and maybe some Unreal Engine stuff. Was that good or bad? I don't know but I needed those apps and so I took the plunge and no offense I'd rather have an Intel Mac running Windows than a PC running Windows if you get my drift.
That said, I think the PC space is very cool and all that. I look forward to see what AMD reveals w/ Zen 4. Alder Lake looks very cool (but let's not compare 65+ watt parts with 30 watt parts), and everything else happening in computer land.
This year I got a maxed out 2020 Intel iMac precisely because I needed two obscure Windows apps that 0% of this forum has ever heard of, and maybe some Unreal Engine stuff. Was that good or bad? I don't know but I needed those apps and so I took the plunge and no offense I'd rather have an Intel Mac running Windows than a PC running Windows if you get my drift.
That said, I think the PC space is very cool and all that. I look forward to see what AMD reveals w/ Zen 4. Alder Lake looks very cool (but let's not compare 65+ watt parts with 30 watt parts), and everything else happening in computer land.
Anandtech’s breakdown of the base M1 Mac mini showed that a single high performance core had the capability to almost fully saturate the available memory bandwidth and on a 128bit bus - 58Gb/s out of the available 68Gb/s. This has never been seen before and is already 4x higher that what Alder Lake is capable of. Whilst the M1 Max could potentially still be limited at 410Gb/s on a 512bit bus, it’s going to breathe a lot more freely than the base M1.
The 2020 Mac Mini Unleashed: Putting Apple Silicon M1 To The Test
Intel’s Alder Lake available memory bandwidth is 80-90Gb/s for the entire package on DDR5 and it’s memory bandwidth per core is significantly less than the base M1, let alone the M1 Max. I’m confident that the M1 Max will outperform Alder Lake by a significant margin in real world performance and even more so on battery power as Alder Lake is 125W tdp on it’s own.
All processors get hot.
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Bro I literally have a gigantic Intel iMac that have I have to micromanage temp and fan noise wise next to my M1 Mac mini that I've literally never heard the fans spin up. Each computer has it's uses. I'm glad I have both. Do I wish I never had to hear my iMac? Sure. But I need to boot into Windows from time to time and I still need the EGPU from time to time. Can you please admit you have some weird bias against Apple? Like this whole thread is you trying to convince Mac people that Windows is somehow amazing. C'mon, it's a joke.
iPhones don't have fans. My M1 Air doing heavy workloads barely gets warm and it has no fans. These chips are insanely efficient. I don't expect the Pro and Max to get hot even under heavy loads.
Well, IDK about Fitness but I do have an Apple Card and sub to Apple TV+ from time to time. I don't know but I feel like you have some unrealistic expectation of what Apple should be.
That said, I appreciate your reply, and I apologize if I came across particularly combative.
Cheers.
You're right! The game is over! Where can I order one? And where's Anandtech's analysis?
If I was trying to out run a missle which travels at mach three then obviously the MiG 25.
I always love these types of anecdotes which attempt to point out a one off issue as a failing of an entire product line.
What kind of stats do you do, @leman? I'm a cognitive science grad student, so I've been getting into a lot of Bayesian mixed-effects models using RStan and brms. A friend of mine who upgraded from a ~2015 MBP to an M1 Air said his Stan models that used to take 3+ hours now only take 20-30 minutes, so I'm extremely curious to see if the improved memory bandwidth with the M1 Pro/Max will push that even further. Do you have an M1 machine to compare to your 16" yet, or have you been holding out for the M1 Pro?
Wait, since when do Windows laptops support GPU PCIe passthrough to guest VMs? I'd imagine a lot of systems that designed to balance dGPU and iGPU based on power demands would run into trouble if the dGPU suddenly went AWOL after boot. My understanding was that it's a rare setup people sometimes use on desktops with an extra GPU (I've seen people do this to get graphics acceleration in macOS VMs on Windows/Linux).
Some quick Google searching shows that this does seem to work for some people on some iGPU/dGPU laptops, but others report nothing but headaches. Given how much this probably depends on manufacturer-specific BIOS stuff I can't imagine it's officially supported by VMWare or the QEMU-KVM team. Would certainly be a neat feature for certain niche workflows, though!