iPad as a laptop replacement

[Azathoth123]

Here are some interesting comments by Steve Sinofsky.

https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1059663467676762112.html

 

[shamus99]

ipad should run ios

ipad pro should run macos

 

[Jedimindtrick]

I just wish they’d allow you to boot into Mac OS or iOS, similar to how I boot into bootcamp on occasion. Seems like the hardware would support it.

 

[jetydosa]

Would be awesome if it would dual boot - OSX when "docked" into USB-C "laptop mode" - iOS when not docked "tablet mode'. Man this would be huge in my workplace.

 

[powerocool]

is it true that you cannot use the iPad Pro with the LG 5k Ultrafine Display?

Does not work for my LG 5K... it complains about not supporting thunderbolt.

 

[Koh Phi Phi]

Would be awesome if it would dual boot - OSX when "docked" into USB-C "laptop mode" - iOS when not docked "tablet mode'. Man this would be huge in my workplace.

This would not work.

• iOs and OSX are two different operating systems. As such, they would need to be installed in 2 different "hard drive partitions". As a result, you could not share files or apps between the two modes. They would, effectively, operate as two isolated ecosystems that could not talk to each other. So, for example, the photos you take while on tablet mode could not be edited while on desktop mode.
  
  
• Moreover, OSX is not optimized for touch input. That means that you would give up entirely on the touch aspect of your iPad Pro while docked. Not a big deal since you'd have keyboard+mouse, but you would for example not be able to use your pen.

Nah, an iOS + OSX dual "hybrid" model would certainly not work.

Instead, Apple needs to offer two versions of iOS: iOS Standard for iPhones and iPads, and iOS Pro for iPad Pros. As simple as that.

 

[CaTOAGU]

Pretty good article - nails it for me.

Just because the new iPad Pro is as fast as a pro laptop doesn't make it a laptop:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/tech...pro-still-isnt-laptop/?utm_term=.1ef8b8e613a0

Quotes:

The $1,000 tablet was powerful enough to let me write, edit photos and publish this column with little more than my finger, a stylus and a keyboard case. But I also never figured out an efficient way to multitask, sit with decent posture and work for hours, or keep it balanced on my lap.

Since you need to touch the screen to swipe through apps or select things, I couldn’t quite figure out how to sit with the iPad. Hunched over? What about while writing, where the screen is propped up in that case but you still need to reach up to do things? Apple has in the past criticized other tech for causing “gorilla arm syndrome” with vertical touch screens, but it’s done little new to address the problem here.

The iPad Pro’s biggest problem is its software. In iOS 12, the iPad has some ability to make between two and four apps share the screen simultaneously, but not all apps play ball. For example, you can’t make Spotify split the screen with Google Docs or Microsoft Word. Getting apps into these sharing modes also requires finger yoga that’s a lot more work than moving around windows with a mouse.

While iOS 12 has a few keyboard shortcuts that help zip between apps, what I was missing was a degree of information density. Everyone has a different way of working, but sometimes on a Mac I’ll have five windows open at once, passively monitoring messages, email, Slack, Twitter and music. On the iPad, I had to keep flipping through apps in an attempt to stay tuned in. Some iPad apps don’t even show you the time and battery level along the top edge.

The thing is, they're not obliged to use Apples keyboard case, and all laptops suffer from not being ergonomic to use. In fact this iPad could be attached to a desktop monitor and could be used with a standard wireless bluetooth keyboard, which as with standard laptops, would mitigate both of those issues . It really is a *potential* laptop replacement for a huge number of users. Whether it is or not will depend on the specifics of the individual use-case and whether or not the user can adjust to the way iOS does things.

 

[secretk]

The thing is, they're not obliged to use Apples keyboard case, and all laptops suffer from not being ergonomic to use. In fact this iPad could be attached to a desktop monitor and could be used with a standard wireless bluetooth keyboard, which as with standard laptops, would mitigate both of those issues . It really is a *potential* laptop replacement for a huge number of users. Whether it is or not will depend on the specifics of the individual use-case and whether or not the user can adjust to the way iOS does things.

Problem with Bluetooth keyboards is the lag. Or at least I have lag with my 2018 regular iPad. I type fast and quite often there are delays and I have to wait 5 to 10 seconds to see what I have written. This slows me down. Quite often I know that I have made mistake that I need to correct but I have to wait to see it on the screen. Add this to the fact that editing text on an iPad is a nightmare (the lack of proper cursor is annoying) and I have very frustrating situation to deal with.

One last thing. I actually quite often use my laptop in bed for chatting and browsing. I need a stable machine (both display and keyboard) sitting on my lap for this. An iPad with Bluetooth keyboard is not the solution for me.

I agree that 13.3 and 14 inch laptop keyboards are not super ergonomic. At least for me this is not the case for 15.6 inch laptop (based on the manufacturer and model of course). In fact I like my laptop's keyboard more than the keyboard that is hooked up to my desktop computer.

 

[CaTOAGU]

Problem with Bluetooth keyboards is the lag. Or at least I have lag with my 2018 regular iPad. I type fast and quite often there are delays and I have to wait 5 to 10 seconds to see what I have written. This slows me down. Quite often I know that I have made mistake that I need to correct but I have to wait to see it on the screen. Add this to the fact that editing text on an iPad is a nightmare (the lack of proper cursor is annoying) and I have very frustrating situation to deal with.

One last thing. I actually quite often use my laptop in bed for chatting and browsing. I need a stable machine (both display and keyboard) sitting on my lap for this. An iPad with Bluetooth keyboard is not the solution for me.

I agree that 13.3 and 14 inch laptop keyboards are not super ergonomic. At least for me this is not the case for 15.6 inch laptop (based on the manufacturer and model of course). In fact I like my laptop's keyboard more than the keyboard that is hooked up to my desktop computer.

I'm not doubting your issue in any way. However I've just tried pairing my Apple Magic keyboard with my iPad Pro 2018 and there's no discernible lag at all. I can type just as fast as I can on my desktop machine, I didn't try for very long though so possibly it degrades over time?

Regarding laptop ergonomics, it's not just the smaller keyboard that's an issue, it's the position we adopt when using them. We tend to hunch over, or at least be looking down more consistently, that places a strain on our neck, shoulders and upper back, it's really not that good for us

Your use case of needing to type sat in bed though definitely does lend itself more to a traditional laptop layout. Interestingly there are some iPad keyboard cases that replicate this layout (e.g Brydge teases new keyboards for the 2018 iPad Pros, coming early next year), so even in your use case an iPad Pro could be a potential laptop replacement. Although I'll grant you having to place your iPad in a case that fully replicates a laptop layout may seem a bit redundant, it is still an iPad in the case, so it can be removed and used as just a tablet.

 

[xxray]

I’ve come to realize that as a finance student, I probably won’t be able to replace my laptop with an iPad for years and years to come.

 

[secretk]

I'm not doubting your issue in any way. However I've just tried pairing my Apple Magic keyboard with my iPad Pro 2018 and there's no discernible lag at all. I can type just as fast as I can on my desktop machine, I didn't try for very long though so possibly it degrades over time?

Do you have Ipad Pro or regular iPad? I have the regular 2018 iPad (6th gen). I just bought it last month so it can't be degrading. I assume it's related to the fact that it uses Bluetooth 4.1. Or maybe the Bluetooth keyboard I have is with lower Bluetooth version. That might be possible. Nevertheless I have issues with this.

Oh and if you ask if in the first minutes after pairing is better and then it gets worse then yes. Also it depends on how fast I type. As I type really really fast the lags gets more and more noticeable and I have to stop every 3rd or 4th word to check my screen.

Also I did not find a way to set up the keyboard in iOS and as a result it decides to replace double interval with . which I find annoying. Due to the lag I quite often hit interval twice and this ends up with needless punctuation symbols that then I have to delete. Like I said editing text in iOS is cumbersome so this makes the situation even worse and it just demotivates me to use the iPad with keyboard.

Regarding laptop ergonomics, it's not just the smaller keyboard that's an issue, it's the position we adopt when using them. We tend to hunch over, or at least be looking down more consistently, that places a strain on our neck, shoulders and upper back, it's really not that good for us

I had not thought about this because I don't do it. I really type a lot and I have memorized the keyboard layout so I rarely look at it. I look at my screen while typing. I even know that I will make a mistake that I will see on the screen because on just touch feeling with the keyboard.

Your use case of needing to type sat in bed though definitely does lend itself more to a traditional laptop layout. Interestingly there are some iPad keyboard cases that replicate this layout (e.g Brydge teases new keyboards for the 2018 iPad Pros, coming early next year), so even in your use case an iPad Pro could be a potential laptop replacement. Although I'll grant you having to place your iPad in a case that fully replicates a laptop layout may seem a bit redundant, it is still an iPad in the case, so it can be removed and used as just a tablet.

Yes I have a more traditional Blueooth keyboard for my iPad. However still due to the size and the weight distribution between the keyboard and the iPad, the bigger laptop is better. It's also better for media consumption. I see better. And I do research while chatting and I need to switch. In that case using mouse/trackpad for me is easier. Especially when I am in bed. What can I say. I am lazy .

 

[CaTOAGU]

Do you have Ipad Pro or regular iPad? I have the regular 2018 iPad (6th gen). I just bought it last month so it can't be degrading. I assume it's related to the fact that it uses Bluetooth 4.1. Or maybe the Bluetooth keyboard I have is with lower Bluetooth version. That might be possible. Nevertheless I have issues with this.

Oh and if you ask if in the first minutes after pairing is better and then it gets worse then yes. Also it depends on how fast I type. As I type really really fast the lags gets more and more noticeable and I have to stop every 3rd or 4th word to check my screen.

Also I did not find a way to set up the keyboard in iOS and as a result it decides to replace double interval with . which I find annoying. Due to the lag I quite often hit interval twice and this ends up with needless punctuation symbols that then I have to delete. Like I said editing text in iOS is cumbersome so this makes the situation even worse and it just demotivates me to use the iPad with keyboard.



I had not thought about this because I don't do it. I really type a lot and I have memorized the keyboard layout so I rarely look at it. I look at my screen while typing. I even know that I will make a mistake that I will see on the screen because on just touch feeling with the keyboard.



Yes I have a more traditional Blueooth keyboard for my iPad. However still due to the size and the weight distribution between the keyboard and the iPad, the bigger laptop is better. It's also better for media consumption. I see better. And I do research while chatting and I need to switch. In that case using mouse/trackpad for me is easier. Especially when I am in bed. What can I say. I am lazy .

I've got the iPad Pro 2018, 11 inch. I tested it typing into Safari's url bar and into pages but only briefly. It's definitely possible it's a bluetooth issue with either the iPad or keyboard you have, or even an app issue depending on which app you're typing into.

 

[DoubleFlyaway]

Problem with Bluetooth keyboards is the lag. Or at least I have lag with my 2018 regular iPad. I type fast and quite often there are delays and I have to wait 5 to 10 seconds to see what I have written. This slows me down. Quite often I know that I have made mistake that I need to correct but I have to wait to see it on the screen. Add this to the fact that editing text on an iPad is a nightmare (the lack of proper cursor is annoying) and I have very frustrating situation to deal with.

One last thing. I actually quite often use my laptop in bed for chatting and browsing. I need a stable machine (both display and keyboard) sitting on my lap for this. An iPad with Bluetooth keyboard is not the solution for me.

I agree that 13.3 and 14 inch laptop keyboards are not super ergonomic. At least for me this is not the case for 15.6 inch laptop (based on the manufacturer and model of course). In fact I like my laptop's keyboard more than the keyboard that is hooked up to my desktop computer.

You can always use a lap desk. I liked one even when I used a laptop, because it raises it a few inches and I get less neck strain. And with the IPP, it completely removes any issue with regard to lap stability (though I actually find it to be remarkably stable on the lap (2017 version. My 2018 version has apparently fallen off the UPS truck.).

 

[secretk]

I've got the iPad Pro 2018, 11 inch. I tested it typing into Safari's url bar and into pages but only briefly. It's definitely possible it's a bluetooth issue with either the iPad or keyboard you have, or even an app issue depending on which app you're typing into.

I see. I think that the pros use Bluetooth 5.0. This is why I asked. I bet you like your new iPad .

I have used the keyboard in Safari, Chrome, Facebook Messenger, HipChat, Skype, Numbers, Pages, Keynote. The behavior is observed on all of them.

This is why I assume a general issue and not an app issue.
[doublepost=1541698407][/doublepost]

You can always use a lap desk. I liked one even when I used a laptop, because it raises it a few inches and I get less neck strain. And with the IPP, it completely removes any issue with regard to lap stability (though I actually find it to be remarkably stable on the lap (2017 version. My 2018 version has apparently fallen off the UPS truck.).

Good idea! I might try something like this in the future . To be honest I kind of love my laptop so I use it whenever I have the chance . I even take it with me for work. It's not the lightest one (15.6 inch) but I like everything about it so I use it at max. Of course it's also just an year old. We will see how it will be later on.

 

[bnmcj1]

8 years on and still to no use without a trackpad. If it is not a 2-on-1 in 2018 it is obsolete. If you see a tablet only they blew it.

 

[George Dawes]

Apart from spreadsheets I can’t see anything that’s easier on a Mac than on an iPad..

Even that’s improving .

 

[ascender]

So far, so good and very impressed. The only thing I’ve had to do which I thought might be a chore was to FTP a couple of files, but that was nice and easy - the FTP clients have come on so far in recent times in terms of connectivity with other programs that it was straightforward.

The new Smart Keyboard is a big improvement when it comes to typing on the lap, but I’m still not convinced by the design and the bulk it adds, plus the keys on the back, but i guess options are limited.

FaceID is a genius move - its seamless for both unlocking the iPad and for authorising things and passwords etc. I do wonder why it hasn’t reached laptops yet as its such a nice feature to have.

My main concern about all of this was having to touch the screen a lot - there’s clearly some muscle memory to undo here and also I’m doing it far less now I’ve learned some of the keyboard shortcuts.

Sitting at my desk with the iPad and a Magic Keyboard is a nice setup. The iPad screen really is stunning and without the bezels its a really nice format in terms of size v weight v footprint.

Knowing keyboard shortcuts have made a big difference to the whole experience and in terms of minimising when i have to touch the screen. But boy, a small trackpad would make all the difference.

I think its really interesting (and disappointing) that all this cool, cutting edge stuff and performance is only available in the iPads though. It does make me wonder if the first ARM MacBook is going to offer feature parity with the latest iPad Pros... but running macOS.

 

[Mahasamatman]

The only thing I’ve found that I can’t do is to download and write to SD Cards firmware update files for my Fuji cameras and lenses. There’s a, usually turned off, desktop in my office that I can do that on if needed but I’ve not needed to for a while.

 

[TrueBlou]

This would not work.

• iOs and OSX are two different operating systems. As such, they would need to be installed in 2 different "hard drive partitions". As a result, you could not share files or apps between the two modes. They would, effectively, operate as two isolated ecosystems that could not talk to each other. So, for example, the photos you take while on tablet mode could not be edited while on desktop mode.
  
  
• Moreover, OSX is not optimized for touch input. That means that you would give up entirely on the touch aspect of your iPad Pro while docked. Not a big deal since you'd have keyboard+mouse, but you would for example not be able to use your pen.

Nah, an iOS + OSX dual "hybrid" model would certainly not work.

Instead, Apple needs to offer two versions of iOS: iOS Standard for iPhones and iPads, and iOS Pro for iPad Pros. As simple as that.

Yeah the big issue is macOS not being touched optimised. I use it with Remote Desktop, it works fine, the Pencil is a decent stand in for a mouse. But it is anything but perfect. I don’t mind it for a small amount of use, but it would drive me bonkers if that was the everyday option. It’s why I gave up with my Surface Pro too and at least with that you could use a mouse.

Either Apple would need to introduce mouse support, at the very least. Or optimise macOS for touchscreen use to the point where it was like iOS .... Hang on

 

[Knowimagination]

So after trying the 12.9 gen 2 for a while and that failing I can now happily say that my new 11” pro has completely replaced my MacBook Pro usage. I still have a desktop PC that I mainly use for gaming, but at this point I have gotten rid of my MBP and I currently don’t see any reason why I would miss it.

 

[TrueBlou]

So after trying the 12.9 gen 2 for a while and that failing I can now happily say that my new 11” pro has completely replaced my MacBook Pro usage. I still have a desktop PC that I mainly use for gaming, but at this point I have gotten rid of my MBP and I currently don’t see any reason why I would miss it.

Good luck with it. I hope it works out for you in the future too.

It can, I did the same thing in 2016, albeit I prefer the 12.9. But two years of just iMac and iPad Pro has worked perfectly.

 

[Fozziebear71]

So after trying the 12.9 gen 2 for a while and that failing I can now happily say that my new 11” pro has completely replaced my MacBook Pro usage. I still have a desktop PC that I mainly use for gaming, but at this point I have gotten rid of my MBP and I currently don’t see any reason why I would miss it.

What can the 11" do to replace your MacBook Pro that the 12.9" failed at?

 

[The Samurai]

Apart from spreadsheets I can’t see anything that’s easier on a Mac than on an iPad..

Even that’s improving .

• Organising files
• Multiple windows
• True multi tasking
• Full version of Word (not dumbed down)
• Trackpad / pointer to easily navigate

 

[Koh Phi Phi]

What can the 11" do to replace your MacBook Pro that the 12.9" failed at?

Exactly! What exactly can you do now in the new iPad Pro 11" that you couldnt do on your previous iPad Pro?

The previous iPad Pro was already overpowered for the kind of tasks you can do in iOS. There is absolutely NO advantage, from a productivity workflow point of view, of upgrading to the new iPad Pro if you had the previous generation. Maaaaaybe the USB-C, but not really due to iOS's restricted integration capabilities: you cannot plug-in a USB pen drive, you cannot dual (not mirror) to an external monitor, etc.

So, to reiterate the question: What can the 11" do to replace your MacBook Pro that the 12.9" failed at?

 

[Knowimagination]

What can the 11" do to replace your MacBook Pro that the 12.9" failed at?

Yeah I should have been more clear on that. I had hardware issues with touch sensitivity on my 12.9 that made it to where I was more likely to just grab my MacBook Pro rather than deal with the frustration of trying to do something on the iPad Pro and continuously getting slowed down by touch input temporarily not working.

If it had been working fine, I’m sure that I would have been able to replace the MBP back then.