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Janichsan

macrumors 68040
Oct 23, 2006
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- The ones that will be on the future iPads according to the rumors is Mini LED right?
There actually were rumours about both.

Apple has invested heavily in µLED technology, even buying a company working on these things a few years back. However, marketable and affordable µLED screens still seem to be a couple of years away. There still is not a single display with this technology available.

Rumors about mini LED displays for iPads and MacBooks are more recent, still relatively vague, but not implausible. Mini LED displays are already available, although I don't think I have ever seen one in the relatively small size required for laptops or tablets: all I've seen so far are larger TVs, which have fairly coarse LED backlighting grids.

- When you say conventional LCDs, does it mean IPS?
Yes.

- Those technologies do have burn in issues as well?
As there still are no real-life experiences with µLED displays whatsoever, it's hard to say with absolute certainty. But the whole idea behind using inorganic LEDs instead of OLEDs is in fact that inorganic LEDs should have no problems with bleaching and a much longer lifetime. So there should be no burn-in.

Mini LEDs have as much or as little burn in as every other currently available LCD.
 
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Astonish_IT

macrumors regular
Sep 1, 2017
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There actually were rumours about both.

Apple has invested heavily in µLED technology, even buying a company working on these things a few years back. However, marketable and affordable µLED screens still seem to be a couple of years away. There still is not a single display with this technology available.

Rumors about mini LED displays for iPads and MacBooks are more recent, still relatively vague, but not implausible. Mini LED displays are already available, although I don't think I have ever seen one in the relatively small size required for laptops or tablets: all I've seen so far are larger TVs, which have fairly coarse LED backlighting grids.


Yes.


As there still are no real-life experiences with µLED displays whatsoever, it's hard to say with absolute certainty. But the whole idea behind using inorganic LEDs instead of OLEDs is in fact that inorganic LEDs should have no problems with bleaching and a much longer lifetime. So there should be no burn-in.

Mini LEDs have as much or as little burn in as every other currently available LCD.

Thank you very much for your answer.

Actualy yesterday after reading your post, i have watched some videos to see if there was any monitors that i could see with those technologies and as you said, what i learned are does:

- MicroLed screens are still too expensive to produce, apparently Samsung had shown a concept which was a wall/screen and apparently it lets you make huge screens as well with very high resolutions, but also it is still veery expensive.

- Mini LED screens apparently has minimised the burn in compared to OLED screens, they offer a much vivid colors and bigger contrast with a major brightness compared to normal IPS panels but it still can not offer true black like OLEDs but it comes close compared to the IPS panels of today.

- I saw a review of a monitor 32 inch monitor from Asus on youtube with the mini led technology, other than that it is around 3000 dollars (if i remember right) , it is also very bulky that the reviewer was saying that it needed the bulk to ventilate and cool down the mini Leds. So after seeing that, i was asking to myself if they make miniLed on the thin form factor of iPad pro, it could translate into an iPad that warms up a lot? And this could also have a bad effect on the battery no?

- Apparently MSI as well introduced a laptop in CES 2020, called Creator 17, which is housing a Mini LED display and they are saying that it is the first laptop to have it.

- Apple's new super expensive display is using mini Led as well right? Or is it going to be introduced on the next gen?

So as you say, it is still very vague, but still, very interesting to see. But also looking at the prices of the existing examples, the price would hike quite a bit if they use the technology.

Thank you again for your detailed answer and pointing me out those two technologies that I had no idea of the difference and neither the existence of the micro Led technology.
 

Falhófnir

macrumors 603
Aug 19, 2017
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HDR is one thing that I really do want to see on iPads, and by the sounds of it, mini LED is the path to doing it (outside of much more expensive micro LED and otherwise-compromised OLED). If there's a March iPad Pro refresh without it definitely skipping to see if this model happens at the end of the year.
 

Astonish_IT

macrumors regular
Sep 1, 2017
155
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HDR is one thing that I really do want to see on iPads, and by the sounds of it, mini LED is the path to doing it (outside of much more expensive micro LED and otherwise-compromised OLED). If there's a March iPad Pro refresh without it definitely skipping to see if this model happens at the end of the year.

To be honest I would like to wait for the mini LED update as well but i dont know if they will update the iPad Pro at the end of the year if they update it on march, it just seems too early compared to their update timeframes till now. And I dont know if my patience (as I realy wanna pass to a usb c ipad pro) and the performance of my 1st gen iPad pro will permit me to wait. I will most probably update it with the march update either it has the mini led or not :) But if you can wait, definitely wait for it. But then this question comes to my mind:

- how good it would be a 1st gen Mini LED iPad Pro.. would it be better to wait for the second gen for them to perfect all the complaints that may occur from the first gen, so in any case, it is win win or loose loose situation :D
 
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Ludatyk

macrumors 603
May 27, 2012
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I really hope that the 2020 iPad Pro receives a significant upgrade like you've mentioned.

Significant upgrade? I’m not so sure. 2018 upgrade was a significant upgrade compared to the 2017 and I have a feeling Apple will apply the method they used with 1st generation iPad Pro and 2nd generation iPad Pro. And I’m comparing the 12.9” model... since that model hasn’t changed much in dimension.

CPU Upgrade, camera upgrade and ProMotion display... which in hindsight I don’t think it was a significant upgrade, however this is all subjective. But IMO, I believe that it’s a “S” upgrade. And I feel this upcoming upgrade will be a “S” upgrade. I‘m sure I’ll upgrade to it.. since I’m very connected with the iPad Pro line, but I won’t rush to do so.

HDR is one thing that I really do want to see on iPads, and by the sounds of it, mini LED is the path to doing it (outside of much more expensive micro LED and otherwise-compromised OLED). If there's a March iPad Pro refresh without it definitely skipping to see if this model happens at the end of the year.

So, you are under the impression that Apple could release TWO iPad Pro models within a year? I highly doubt that. And, I’m anticipating a screen upgrade. I don’t know how Apple plan to achieve this... but similar to how they approached the iPhone 11 Pro and iPhone XS, they introduced Super Retina XDR Display. And as others have noted, a RAM upgrade as well.. Camera upgrade and CPU upgrade is a given.
 
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mr.anthonyramos

macrumors 6502a
Apr 25, 2015
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So, you are under the impression that Apple could release TWO iPad Pro models within a year? I highly doubt that. And, I’m anticipating a screen upgrade. I don’t know how Apple plan to achieve this... but similar to how they approached the iPhone 11 Pro and iPhone XS, they introduced Super Retina XDR Display. And as others have noted, a RAM upgrade as well.. Camera upgrade and CPU upgrade is a given.

Apple had done this before and it isn't impossible that they will do it again. Analysts speculate a refresh this March with a whole new iPad at the end of the year. I'm not saying this is certain, but it isn't impossible that this could happen since a few have already chipped in.
 
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Ludatyk

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May 27, 2012
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Apple had done this before and it isn't impossible that they will do it again. Analysts speculate a refresh this March with a whole new iPad at the end of the year. I'm not saying this is certain, but it isn't impossible that this could happen since a few have already chipped in.

Never said it was impossible, I just highly doubt it. And since we are in a discussion about the iPad Pro, the answer is no. Apple haven’t done it before.
 

Falhófnir

macrumors 603
Aug 19, 2017
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So, you are under the impression that Apple could release TWO iPad Pro models within a year? I highly doubt that. And, I’m anticipating a screen upgrade. I don’t know how Apple plan to achieve this... but similar to how they approached the iPhone 11 Pro and iPhone XS, they introduced Super Retina XDR Display. And as others have noted, a RAM upgrade as well.. Camera upgrade and CPU upgrade is a given.
Not so much that I expect it, but currently there's rumours of both a March refresh and mini LED coming late in the year, so until it's further clarified or amended it's as reasonable a guess as to what will happen as anything ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

audioaudio

Suspended
Jan 9, 2020
14
4
I had other gen iPads before, but the iPad Pro 2018 is legit. Great productivity work in terms of marking up pictures/screenshots/drawings to send to people to correct. But to get to the Markup option takes too many clicks. No need to hide it in the mark up icon menu twice.
 

Janichsan

macrumors 68040
Oct 23, 2006
3,108
11,568
- I saw a review of a monitor 32 inch monitor from Asus on youtube with the mini led technology, other than that it is around 3000 dollars (if i remember right) , it is also very bulky that the reviewer was saying that it needed the bulk to ventilate and cool down the mini Leds. So after seeing that, i was asking to myself if they make miniLed on the thin form factor of iPad pro, it could translate into an iPad that warms up a lot? And this could also have a bad effect on the battery no?
Yeah, my understanding is that the higher amount of LEDs produces more heat than conventional LED backlighting. However, you have margin. For instance I guess, you wouldn't need quite the same brightness for a handheld tablet as for a large desktop monitor, so you could use dimmer LEDs with less thermal output.

- Apple's new super expensive display is using mini Led as well right?
Not quite. The technology is similar, but the Pro Display XDR uses "normal" sized LEDs and has fewer dimmable zones. It has 576, while for instance the same sized 32" Asus display has 1152.
 

Ludatyk

macrumors 603
May 27, 2012
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Not so much that I expect it, but currently there's rumours of both a March refresh and mini LED coming late in the year, so until it's further clarified or amended it's as reasonable a guess as to what will happen as anything

There’s rumors of just about anything. And I’m just being realistic... while leaning toward the history of iPad Pro releases. Apple has never released iPad Pro on two different occasions within a year timeframe.

There is a lot of chatter surrounding about mini-LED iPP, who's to say Apple won't release it 1st half of 2020.
 

Falhófnir

macrumors 603
Aug 19, 2017
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There’s rumors of just about anything. And I’m just being realistic... while leaning toward the history of iPad Pro releases. Apple has never released iPad Pro on two different occasions within a year timeframe.

There is a lot of chatter surrounding about mini-LED iPP, who's to say Apple won't release it 1st half of 2020.
Ah, but being realistic is listening to those with a proven track record, not just going with your gut feeling about what 'makes sense' or what Apple have done or not in the past. Apple never released a MacBook Pro in November before now, and certainly not after releasing its predecessor in May of the same year. If the technology is only ready at the end of the year, that's their window to launch it.

Who's to say? Ming Chi Kuo for one, that guy that's about as close to Apple oracle as we have access to. He's saying H2 2020. For something like this, a supply chain analyst is going to be pretty reliable as it's something that's going to leave a supply chain fingerprint.

 

Ludatyk

macrumors 603
May 27, 2012
5,922
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Ah, but being realistic is listening to those with a proven track record, not just going with your gut feeling about what 'makes sense' or what Apple have done or not in the past. Apple never released a MacBook Pro in November before now, and certainly not after releasing its predecessor in May of the same year. If the technology is only ready at the end of the year, that's their window to launch it.

Who's to say? Ming Chi Kuo for one, that guy that's about as close to Apple oracle as we have access to. He's saying H2 2020. For something like this, a supply chain analyst is going to be pretty reliable as it's something that's going to leave a supply chain fingerprint.


It's no point in going back and forth over this. And I'm not going with my "gut feelings" or what "makes sense".... I'm simply going with history. And it's "reasonable" to go with history that helps in matters of product releases.

And, perhaps Ming Chi Kuo is right... but has he had 100% prediction rate. At one point, you're saying... you don't expect it. But you are making a strong stance... that he's right. All I'm saying.. is I highly doubt it. Which I'm in right to have that opinion... based on history.

You are giving me these articles... based of rumors. But if you look at the history of iPad Pro releases... which by all means are facts. Apple has never released a iPad Pro on two different occasions within a year. If I'm wrong by the end of this year... please reference this.
 

cws

macrumors newbie
Jan 9, 2020
24
20
Another possibility:
1. Apple doesn't seem to be shy about introducing new product tiers lately, and
2. the Mini-LED technology might be more expensive.

So perhaps Apple might refresh the 11" and 12.9" iPad Pro using a conventional LED backlight at existing price points, and introduce a new tier of 12.9" later in the year using a Mini-LED backlight that is more expensive ("iPad Pro XDR").
 
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Falhófnir

macrumors 603
Aug 19, 2017
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Another possibility:
1. Apple doesn't seem to be shy about introducing new product tiers lately, and
2. the Mini-LED technology might be more expensive.

So perhaps Apple might refresh the 11" and 12.9" iPad Pro using a conventional LED backlight at existing price points, and introduce a new tier of 12.9" later in the year using a Mini-LED backlight that is more expensive ("iPad Pro XDR").
If it happens as currently rumoured, yeah this is pretty much what I would expect. Still worth it for HDR to me!
 

Astonish_IT

macrumors regular
Sep 1, 2017
155
147
Another possibility:
1. Apple doesn't seem to be shy about introducing new product tiers lately, and
2. the Mini-LED technology might be more expensive.

So perhaps Apple might refresh the 11" and 12.9" iPad Pro using a conventional LED backlight at existing price points, and introduce a new tier of 12.9" later in the year using a Mini-LED backlight that is more expensive ("iPad Pro XDR").

Actualy I was thinking something like that too, iPad Pro XDR 5G or may be they go even more mad and introduce 15 inch iPad XDR only for the artists/professional with also extra ram..etc a bit like the iMac Pro and then the year after introduce the mini Led on the "regular" pros.
 

xxray

macrumors 68040
Jul 27, 2013
3,113
9,402
HDR is one thing that I really do want to see on iPads, and by the sounds of it, mini LED is the path to doing it (outside of much more expensive micro LED and otherwise-compromised OLED). If there's a March iPad Pro refresh without it definitely skipping to see if this model happens at the end of the year.

I thought HDR was already on iPads Pros for a few years now?



 

cws

macrumors newbie
Jan 9, 2020
24
20
The HDR10 format allows for a maximum of 1000 nits of brightness, and HDR10+ and Dolby Vision allows for 4000 nits or more (although that's obviously for future proofing and not a realistic target anytime soon.)

It looks like Apple might call things XDR when they have at least 1000 nits -- the Super Retina XDR on the iPhone 11 Pro (with 800 nits typical / 1200 nits peak) and the Pro Display XDR (with 1000 nits sustained / 1600 nits peak).

The iPhone 11 and current iPad Pro "only" have 625 nits and 600 nits, respectively.
 
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scotsmandc

macrumors 6502
Sep 26, 2015
396
268
Obligatory reminder of the terms, so that everyone is really on the same page:

Mini LED displays are conventional LCDs with a backlighting consisting a grid of individually addressable LEDs.

Micro LED (µLED) displays are displays were every pixel is an LED made from inorganic materials.

i only eat organic foods therefore i must have an organic screen to stay organic.
 
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Astonish_IT

macrumors regular
Sep 1, 2017
155
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Even tho it is off topic, yesterday i had to prepare something like a brochure / presentation with pages on iPad pro, Pages and a Logitech Keyboard.. god i love this device! My 2017 15 inch Macbook Pro was just showing the screen saver, I realy do enjoy using this device even tho there is a learning curve on such apps (I am used to Indesign) but also on the other hand it is so nice just to touch and place objects with fingers..etc, can't wait for the 2020 iPad pro! =)
 

Synomenon

macrumors 6502a
Apr 5, 2011
808
422
Has anyone heard or read anything regarding an updated iPad Mini that's physically designed like the most recent Pro. models (FaceID, thinner bezels, etc.)?
 
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