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I think the “magic” of Apple is starting to come back.

After Tim Cook took control and Jony Ive had his influence, things got shaky. The future of the Mac was uncertain and iOS was a mess.

Then, M series chips came out and that spark came back.

Vision Pro was a swing and a miss.

AI features as of 18.2 are meh. But once the context-based and deeply personalized version of their AI hits devices, I think even more of that Apple magic will come out.

Is it like the old days? No. But you work with what you got. Giving up entirely means certain failure.
 
I think the magic has moved from only the 'magic of the product', to how they fit into our lives.
How they can transform our ideas, perceptions, communication, and even our relations.
But that is a choice we have to do, in how we use the products.
 
The magic faded

The reason Apple was so cool in the past is they were consumer focused because they had to be. The company almost went bankrupt and they had to give users what they want to win them over

That’s no longer the case and you can tell!
 
This is SO missing
It starts at the leadership level that then trickles down to who gets hired (or not)

There are so so SO many bugs and niggles and weird stuff on ALL their devices and software now and that was a huge part of the "magic" ... and man is it gone
That largely comes down to the individuals being hired.

It’s extremely popular to say “eff the company”, not care and take zero pride in your work. Apple has been pretty well insulated from this since their hiring standards tend to be top notch, but it has taken a noticeable hit.

What people don’t understand is that the “who cares” mindset affects everyone and it breeds misery. Employees use the products they create, whether it’s a fast food burger or a high end computer suitable for producing a major hollywood film.
 
Sorry, but this is just dead wrong

Steve was a relentless product guy and we are getting constant offerings from Apple that he would have shot down before we ever say it publicly, as they flat out aren't good enough or serving a purpose of enough utility or interest to a market.

Tim deserves all the hate -- the flop record is getting impressive

Compromised, plain bad things that came out under Steve:
  • The original Mac (artificially crippled on memory and slots despite the engineers' best attempts
  • the iPhone 4
  • the iMac puck mouse - terrible, terrible to use
  • the mighty mouse - worse ergonomics than a $15 USB PC mouse
  • the magic mouse - as above
  • the g4 cube - terrible thermal problems, form over function
  • OS X Lion
  • MobileME
He was not perfect, he made mistakes. He was not a god.

As far as flops under Tim.... Apple is a trillion dollar company, Mac sales are up, they basically own the smart wearables category. I'm sorry what failures are there under Tim again?

And if you say Vision Pro.... you're extremely short sighted. Vision Pro is a prototype device, not intended to sell in volume. If you want a true "swing and a miss" - then look no further than the current Mac Pro. It's an amazing example of apple responding to "Oh, you want a big box Mac with slots and upgradeability? well here, have this SOC on a board thats no more powerful than a studio and no ability to utilise add in GPUs!" - when a major reason people want a big box Mac is for memory expansions, and yes, GPUs for compute.

Also on Vision Pro - the patents date back to 2007. Steve Jobs was thus very much involved in that project.

So if you want to say that product is a failure, include Steve Jobs in the blame, as it wasn't Tim who was responsible for the concept.


The patent filings go back 4 year before he was made CEO, and the design work would go back much further than that.
 
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If they are "peak", there's no where to go but down. Can't keep going up.

I meant "peak" as in all time high, but yes. I'll grant you that implies that they can only go down. That wasn't really what I meant though, so lets just say I think they're at an all time high and still climbing.

Apple have built a software stack combined with hardware integration that nobody else in the industry is anywhere close to. Anyone starting out now to try and replicate that is at least 10-15 years behind. Google and Microsoft are at least 5-10 years behind because they do not have the vertical integration and their software doesn't integrate across multiple platforms.

Google has mobile, they have no relevant desktop/laptop offering. Microsoft has desktop/laptop, they have no relevant mobile offerings. Making those two talk to each other and truly integrate anything like the Apple ecosystem is a bit of a joke.
 
  • Nostalgia Apple seemed more focused on incredible products & delighting customers above all else.
  • Modern Apple seems entirely focused on "another record quarter" & delighting shareholders above all else.
Which is best? Ask yourself this: are you more customer or shareholder?

What is "magic?" It might have been magic to be just as money focused back then but being much better at disguising it via the so-called RDF. Or perhaps the magic was not deception but driven by actually prioritizing delighting customers first and shareholders got theirs as a byproduct of happier customers buying more (what a concept!). Now it's reversed.

Are we chasing nostalgia? Some of us long for:
  • "just works" Apple we think we recall
  • a "Snow Leopard" (just bug squashing & refinements) year or two, instead of the annual parade of new-new-new and then buggy-buggy-buggy through many point upgrades.
  • more customer utility where we could optionally buy the base and upgrade crucial parts at much more competitive rates instead of grappling with trying to strike some kind of ideal balance and feeling robbed when comparing Apple upgrade pricing vs. market upgrade pricing.
  • simple choices in the product mix vs. multiple versions of everything (though this one just doesn't fit a company so much larger than the relatively tiny Apple back in the day, where as little as ONE of something might be all they could handle).
  • flexibility such as the completely unique, high-value benefit of being able to utilize full macOS and full Windows inside of ONE case... vs. leaning on ARM Windows for the latter or going back to buying computers that may be needed (PC) vs. computers that are wanted (Mac). After about 15 years of only Mac, I now own a PC again (because ARM Windows emulation is not full Windows, and app needs trump app wants).
  • a genuine "one more thing" surprise instead of the same things in slightly different sizes & colors or slightly faster speeds.
IMO: for 5-7 years now, Apple is basically drunk on the experience of reporting the "another record quarter" (no longer a) surprise.... and the striving to keep doing that little show drives them to make ever-more nickel & diming decisions that traditional Apple probably would not make... because it didn't seem to be entirely about shareholders back in the day (or old Apple was better at disguising the greed plays most of the time). Through a consumer lens, it's the corporate reporting version of "thinner" seemingly clung to for much too long that- just like the relentless cracks at "thinner"- the benefit no longer seems to fit the sacrifices being made for it.

10 years ago, my household was Apple everything and I wouldn't even consider alternatives. In the last 5+ years, that has evolved into giving much thought to alternatives and embracing them. Why? Most of it revolves around value perception... and taking offense at relentless efforts to delight shareholders at customer expense. The "premium" has fattened and the engineering has evolved much more extras being available only from Apple... at ever-growing Apple margin. For example, I'm offended when I compare Apple RAM & SSD pricing to market rates for the same (I have always tolerated some Apple Premium but 3X-5X premium is too much. This is one of many examples that has actually derailed new Mac purchases on its own). Ugly words like "exploit" seem to fit some decisions.

Everyone has their "enough is enough" moments. And goodwill is not a bottomless well to be endlessly burned. It seemed- whether true or not- that old Apple was better at striking a good balance at pleasing shareholders AND customers... always leaning to the latter (or just seeming to do so). Now one of those groups seems to rarely be thrown a bone. I didn't name which but I bet the one I was thinking of jumped into your mind as you read the line. If so, that's pretty sad when contrasted against the halo'd Apple we can recall so fondly.

If there is anything to this, is there anything modern Apple can do about it? Of course. Investing in consumer goodwill is as easy as investing in maximizing shareholder ROI. Some choices can be made to throw consumers more bones instead of almost aways favoring maximizing ROI. More value for the money can drive more sales... which then benefits shareholders too. It's mostly about choices & decisions... where sometimes delighting customers is made more important than harvesting every possible nickel. It seems Apple could use a better ear(s) to their customers vs. (seemingly) measuring all by whether "another record quarter" is realized.
Mic drop. I think you put this so eloquently. I came from Amiga to Mac, and all through my early adult life in the video and film scene: Mac’s are for people who want to be creative, PCs are for folks who like to tinker to make things work. Those days are loooooong gone. Once Avid went to PC and the disaster that was FCP 10 happened, that really took the wind out of our sails. I’m still on the Apple ecosystem, but I’m not sure how much longer. The phones are buggy. The M1 is amazing but the software hasn’t caught up. The prices are crazy high. There’s no more “it just works.”
 
Do you think the “Apple magic” is gone?
not gone... just that we have gotten older and times change...
• Are we just being nostalgic for the Steve Jobs days?
mmmm... there will simply never be another Steve Jobs... Apple is now a gigantic corporation so put it in perspective...
• If you were an Apple fan in the ’80s, ’90s, or early 2000s, do you feel like the “vibe” is different now compared to the era of 2018 and beyond?
yes, yes, and yes to the time frames... as to the vibe... times change... you also have to change... nothing stands still or it will wither and die...
• Is it possible for a company this successful to ever feel countercultural again?
puzzling question... is T-Mobile still a counter cultural company??? Apple is simply too big and doing things better and having things "that just work" is a better target...

happy holidays
 
Apple has been putting out borderline junk for years. In its worship now of shareholders (eg. See higher level Apple executives, etc.) and thus slavish devotion to releases on a certain schedule combined with cutting costs in every conceivable way (eg. See China manufactering, etc.) Apple lost its way about ten years ago. Its software releases are bugridden messes. Now today I have to sit through a very lenghy download (18.2) for what I know will then mean bugs and settings I have to go back and reset so as not to allow Apple to stalk me the way it wants to, as well as essentially selling me to people by making certain things default to openess unless, as indicated, I go back in and change things back AGAIN. In general most updates are worthless. They keep employees employed and eventually force you to buy a new phone because, of course, as part of Apple's dedication to "privacy" (LOL) you actually do not get a choice with regard to the updates. Macs these days also are garbage. The purported great screens they advertise on, for example, the Macbook Pros are increasingly problematic and go bad in various ways. My 2009 Maccbook Pro screen is still in perfect shape. Every subsequent screen has been a problem until this last one--a mid 2023 model--simply cracked a year into the same type of use I have given my three previous Pros and laptops of other brands. As said, Apple these days is borderline junk and I have bought my last. Furthermore, most often I know more than the "geniuses," which actually is not saying much, and their attitudes are if you scratch just slightly below the surface one of extreme arrogance and entitlement. For being, are they even glorified?, retail employees I am not sure why.
 
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Let me start by saying this: I am an unapologetic Apple fanatic. I’m talking all in — products, design, marketing, stores, history, the whole ecosystem. If it’s Apple, I’m interested. And if you’re here on MacRumors, I’m guessing you might feel the same way.
No, I don't feel the same way. But don't worry, I'm just neither an Apple fanatic NOR an Apple detractor. But I do think you're spending an awful lot of time thinking about things you can't change.

Please read on.
...

Is the “Apple magic” gone? Or are we just chasing the nostalgia of the old days?
Some years ago, Apple entered a "commodity phase" of its existence.
It happened to all of them who came before:
  • Chrysler was once a jewel of car manufacturing.
  • Standard Oil once filled the skies with its oil rigs, and it powered the world.
  • General Electric certainly made "magic" when it was making light bulbs, and when it made the automatic washing machine? OMG, that freed up housewives to do other things with their limited time. That was magical all right.
  • At one time, IBM could do no wrong. The IBM Selectric typewriter brought a golden age to millions of secretaries who were paid by the word. Before the Selectric, the typewriter options were terrible, and that was when they WEREN'T breaking down and jamming.
  • IBM began a second golden age when it joined the mainframe computing race. Today, only IBM makes mainframes. Ain't nobody complaining that IBM has "lost its magic".
  • By comparison, companies like Microsoft, Oracle, Sun Microsystems, and more were AFTER IBM already broke up the ice for them.
Many of these companies and many more certainly brought "the magic" of new, innovative, and even game-changing technologies. We're seeing that now from Elon Musk's companies. Every other day it seems, he's launching another rocket with 23 more starlink satellites. And every other day, he's landing boosters on barges or plucking them out of the sky.

But every one of them eventually entered a "commodity phase", and only a few have been able to go back to the thing you call "The Magic". Is it possible that Steve Jobs, if he hadn't died when he did, could have kept that innovation going?

Maybe. But probably not. Even Henry Ford outdated himself. He was still using the wood from shipping crates to build the seating and other elements of his cars long after other manufacturers started doing bigger and better (and fancier) things.

Steve Jobs had a rare vision, that's for sure. But not every leader makes a good leader "forever". We just will never know. For sure, Steve Jobs was at times very stubborn. That served him well for the time he was with us. But would it have carried Apple for another 30 years? I say not likely.

And we need to admit to ourselves that Tim Cook hasn't done an AWFUL job with Apple. Look at just a few things that Apple has done in the time that Steve Jobs hasn't been at the helm.

They have brought the iPhone, iPad, and Mac into the new era. Sure, some people hate iOS, while others can't figure out where the iPad fits into things.

But let me tell you this: Apple technology WORKS. Even when Microsoft was doing its world-changing innovation, there was a lot of stuff that didn't work on the Microsoft side. The BSOD screen is pretty much a meme now, right? That didn't happen because Windows was reliable. We all know it wasn't back then. But it got better. I believe that was because Apple took them to task.

I’m talking about the era of Steve Jobs’ keynotes, Jonny Ive’s “aluminum unibody” monologues, and Tony Fadell’s iPod magic wheel.
I never cared about all of that. A lot of us didn't see any of that as "magic". It was just innovation, brought about by innovative thinking.
The era of “Hello, I’m a Mac, and I’m a PC” commercials...
I loved those commercials, but by the time they were out, PCs were working a lot better. I used PCs back then, and didn't get my first Mac until 2021. When Mac/PC commercials were out, we were all learning how to make PCs more reliable, both at the user end, as well as at Microsoft's end.

The innovation for Microsoft was less about the UI and more about the engine under the hood. In fact, Microsoft's attempts to CHANGE the UI is where they tripped themselves up. Remember Windows 8 and "Metro apps"? It was all junk.
...and overnight campouts outside the Apple Store to get your hands on the newest product. Back when seeing someone with a clamshell iBook (shoutout to Elle Woods in Legally Blonde) was like spotting a unicorn in a sea of dull, black, plastic IBMs.
Whole generations of people never once camped out overnight for an Apple product.

And a lot of people waited all night for a chance to buy Windows 95 too, remember that?

It never bothered me to have a "dull black plastic IBM" (or Dell, or HP, or gray Sony, etc.). It was more important to me what the product could DO. Not how it looked. My current tower computer is STILL in a black case, because that serves the form factor very well. And I think I bought that case back in 2012. I upgraded its guts for like the 4th or 5th time in 2021, and it's still black. Which is fine because it sits under the desk and does all the modern things I demand of it.
Back then, Apple felt exclusive. It had this it factor — a cultural cachet that was hard to put into words. To own an Apple product was to signal that you got it — that you saw something others didn’t. You weren’t just using a “computer,” you were tapping into an experience, a lifestyle. MacBooks, iPods, and iPhones were cool in a way that was undeniable.
I think that's a "you thing".

I have Apple equipment now. A watch, an MBP, and a couple of iphones and a couple more iPads. Sure, they're "pretty". But I never thought I was "winning" in life because I bought something made by Apple.
But where do we stand now?

Apple is still a leader in design, functionality, and that coveted hardware-software integration that just works. Their products are arguably better than ever, with the M-series chips blowing minds, AirPods becoming a cultural icon, and the Apple Watch quietly dominating the wearables market. From a technical perspective, you could argue the magic is still there.

But is it cool anymore?
I think you're being a little overly introspective. In all honesty, anything from Apple is way too expensive to be "cool".
I’m not so sure. Seeing someone with an iPhone 15 Pro doesn’t feel the same as spotting someone with a first-gen iPhone in 2007. AirPods used to be instantly recognizable (and a bit of a flex), but now, every other tech company has its own knockoff version. The “cool factor” that used to come with owning an Apple product feels… commonplace. Ubiquity has its downsides.
I wear airpods when I'm gardening. I never thought about trying to be cool. I only care about getting stuff done. The gear is fun to use and as I said above, it looks pretty too, so that's good enough for me.
Have we reached “Peak Apple” culturally?

Maybe it’s just me being nostalgic, but it feels like Apple is less of a “rebel brand” and more of an industry mainstay — the safe, dominant choice.
Rebels in the '60s and '70s are today's democrats.

The "stuffy conservatives" of that time period are now the rebels. Everything changes.
It’s become expected that people have an iPhone.
I don't expect that. Why do you?
MacBooks aren’t revolutionary anymore; they’re just good laptops.
I'd say an ARM-based laptop that doesn't make noise or blow out hot air is pretty revolutionary. Yes, it's "a good laptop", sure. But if Apple didn't come out with the M series, we would all still be thinking you had to put an AMD or Intel chip in your laptop, and we'd all still be wasting electricity and getting our laps burnt by hot exhaust air.
Nobody’s camping outside stores anymore (well, maybe for an iPhone launch, but even that’s more spectacle than necessity now). And where are the “I’m a Mac” ads of today? Tim Cook doesn’t have the same showmanship as Jobs did, and while Craig Federighi is fun, he’s more “likable uncle” than “cult-like visionary.”
Covid killed store camping. But even before that, none of these things were enjoyable or desirable. Sheesh, just let me place my order and pay online, and have the stuff shipped. I'm busy and I got stuff to do.
Don’t get me wrong — I’m not saying Apple is bad. In fact, I think they’re putting out some of the best products they’ve ever made. But the feeling of owning an Apple product is different. It used to feel like you were part of a movement. Now it just feels like… you own a phone.

So, I’m putting it to the MacRumors family:

Do you think the “Apple magic” is gone?
No. I suspect that it was never magic except in your mind. Apple is in a different phase of its lifecycle, and you probably should be too.
• Are we just being nostalgic for the Steve Jobs days?
Steve is dead. The world came to this realization many years ago, and has moved on. This may sound harsh, but maybe you should too.
• If you were an Apple fan in the ’80s, ’90s, or early 2000s, do you feel like the “vibe” is different now compared to the era of 2018 and beyond?
Like I said, I'm neither a fan nor a detractor. To me, Apple didn't really "make it" until they came out with the iPhone, and then again when they kept improving it. And YET AGAIN when they kept improving iPad. And YET ONE MORE TIME when they took ARM and made Apple Silicon.

But I don't care about "vibe". We all should be making our own vibe. Don't leave that responsibility to a nameless, faceless corporate entity. Apple ain't your mama.
• Is it possible for a company this successful to ever feel countercultural again?
Anything is possible.

But "counterculture" has not always been a good thing. Sometimes it was bad. Sometimes it was violent. Sometimes it resulted in innocent people dying for no real reason or purpose.
I’d love to hear your thoughts — especially if you grew up in the Apple golden years and have watched the shift happen in real-time. Are we living in Apple’s best era yet, or have we lost something intangible along the way?
You do you, but if you were my brother, I'd be worried about the possibility that you haven't found a purpose in life that makes you excited to be you.

If you were my brother, I'd tell you that I think all this introspection is holding you back from enjoying...whatever it is you should be enjoying. And I'd ask you if you were okay.

Assuming that I'm reading too much into this, I'll just end with this.

If you're bored by technology, then go put your phone in a waterproof case and go fishing. You have no idea how doing something that requires you to be still and quiet can help you find peace in life.

Or find a dance partner and take up salsa dancing. Or find a bingo hall. Touch grass, meet people, and use your laughter and your voice to make real HUMAN connections in life.

And do like most of the rest of us do; wait 3 or 4 generations before upgrading your technology and get off the treadmill.

The world is out there. Go enjoy it. Apple can take care of itself. Or not. Either way, neither you nor I will be able to "bring back magic", unless we do it for ourselves and our loved ones.

Good luck.
 
No, I don't feel the same way. But don't worry, I'm just neither an Apple fanatic NOR an Apple detractor. But I do think you're spending an awful lot of time thinking about things you can't change.

Please read on.

Some years ago, Apple entered a "commodity phase" of its existence.
It happened to all of them who came before:
  • Chrysler was once a jewel of car manufacturing.
  • Standard Oil once filled the skies with its oil rigs, and it powered the world.
  • General Electric certainly made "magic" when it was making light bulbs, and when it made the automatic washing machine? OMG, that freed up housewives to do other things with their limited time. That was magical all right.
  • At one time, IBM could do no wrong. The IBM Selectric typewriter brought a golden age to millions of secretaries who were paid by the word. Before the Selectric, the typewriter options were terrible, and that was when they WEREN'T breaking down and jamming.
  • IBM began a second golden age when it joined the mainframe computing race. Today, only IBM makes mainframes. Ain't nobody complaining that IBM has "lost its magic".
  • By comparison, companies like Microsoft, Oracle, Sun Microsystems, and more were AFTER IBM already broke up the ice for them.
Many of these companies and many more certainly brought "the magic" of new, innovative, and even game-changing technologies. We're seeing that now from Elon Musk's companies. Every other day it seems, he's launching another rocket with 23 more starlink satellites. And every other day, he's landing boosters on barges or plucking them out of the sky.

But every one of them eventually entered a "commodity phase", and only a few have been able to go back to the thing you call "The Magic". Is it possible that Steve Jobs, if he hadn't died when he did, could have kept that innovation going?

Maybe. But probably not. Even Henry Ford outdated himself. He was still using the wood from shipping crates to build the seating and other elements of his cars long after other manufacturers started doing bigger and better (and fancier) things.

Steve Jobs had a rare vision, that's for sure. But not every leader makes a good leader "forever". We just will never know. For sure, Steve Jobs was at times very stubborn. That served him well for the time he was with us. But would it have carried Apple for another 30 years? I say not likely.

And we need to admit to ourselves that Tim Cook hasn't done an AWFUL job with Apple. Look at just a few things that Apple has done in the time that Steve Jobs hasn't been at the helm.

They have brought the iPhone, iPad, and Mac into the new era. Sure, some people hate iOS, while others can't figure out where the iPad fits into things.

But let me tell you this: Apple technology WORKS. Even when Microsoft was doing its world-changing innovation, there was a lot of stuff that didn't work on the Microsoft side. The BSOD screen is pretty much a meme now, right? That didn't happen because Windows was reliable. We all know it wasn't back then. But it got better. I believe that was because Apple took them to task.


I never cared about all of that. A lot of us didn't see any of that as "magic". It was just innovation, brought about by innovative thinking.

I loved those commercials, but by the time they were out, PCs were working a lot better. I used PCs back then, and didn't get my first Mac until 2021. When Mac/PC commercials were out, we were all learning how to make PCs more reliable, both at the user end, as well as at Microsoft's end.

The innovation for Microsoft was less about the UI and more about the engine under the hood. In fact, Microsoft's attempts to CHANGE the UI is where they tripped themselves up. Remember Windows 8 and "Metro apps"? It was all junk.

Whole generations of people never once camped out overnight for an Apple product.

And a lot of people waited all night for a chance to buy Windows 95 too, remember that?

It never bothered me to have a "dull black plastic IBM" (or Dell, or HP, or gray Sony, etc.). It was more important to me what the product could DO. Not how it looked. My current tower computer is STILL in a black case, because that serves the form factor very well. And I think I bought that case back in 2012. I upgraded its guts for like the 4th or 5th time in 2021, and it's still black. Which is fine because it sits under the desk and does all the modern things I demand of it.

I think that's a "you thing".

I have Apple equipment now. A watch, an MBP, and a couple of iphones and a couple more iPads. Sure, they're "pretty". But I never thought I was "winning" in life because I bought something made by Apple.

I think you're being a little overly introspective. In all honesty, anything from Apple is way too expensive to be "cool".

I wear airpods when I'm gardening. I never thought about trying to be cool. I only care about getting stuff done. The gear is fun to use and as I said above, it looks pretty too, so that's good enough for me.

Rebels in the '60s and '70s are today's democrats.

The "stuffy conservatives" of that time period are now the rebels. Everything changes.

I don't expect that. Why do you?

I'd say an ARM-based laptop that doesn't make noise or blow out hot air is pretty revolutionary. Yes, it's "a good laptop", sure. But if Apple didn't come out with the M series, we would all still be thinking you had to put an AMD or Intel chip in your laptop, and we'd all still be wasting electricity and getting our laps burnt by hot exhaust air.

Covid killed store camping. But even before that, none of these things were enjoyable or desirable. Sheesh, just let me place my order and pay online, and have the stuff shipped. I'm busy and I got stuff to do.

No. I suspect that it was never magic except in your mind. Apple is in a different phase of its lifecycle, and you probably should be too.

Steve is dead. The world came to this realization many years ago, and has moved on. This may sound harsh, but maybe you should too.

Like I said, I'm neither a fan nor a detractor. To me, Apple didn't really "make it" until they came out with the iPhone, and then again when they kept improving it. And YET AGAIN when they kept improving iPad. And YET ONE MORE TIME when they took ARM and made Apple Silicon.

But I don't care about "vibe". We all should be making our own vibe. Don't leave that responsibility to a nameless, faceless corporate entity. Apple ain't your mama.

Anything is possible.

But "counterculture" has not always been a good thing. Sometimes it was bad. Sometimes it was violent. Sometimes it resulted in innocent people dying for no real reason or purpose.

You do you, but if you were my brother, I'd be worried about the possibility that you haven't found a purpose in life that makes you excited to be you.

If you were my brother, I'd tell you that I think all this introspection is holding you back from enjoying...whatever it is you should be enjoying. And I'd ask you if you were okay.

Assuming that I'm reading too much into this, I'll just end with this.

If you're bored by technology, then go put your phone in a waterproof case and go fishing. You have no idea how doing something that requires you to be still and quiet can help you find peace in life.

Or find a dance partner and take up salsa dancing. Or find a bingo hall. Touch grass, meet people, and use your laughter and your voice to make real HUMAN connections in life.

And do like most of the rest of us do; wait 3 or 4 generations before upgrading your technology and get off the treadmill.

The world is out there. Go enjoy it. Apple can take care of itself. Or not. Either way, neither you nor I will be able to "bring back magic", unless we do it for ourselves and our loved ones.

Good luck.
Great post. Couldn’t have said any better.
 
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It is an interesting time in the PC market. The hottest segment is the mini PC. The CPU/GPU combination is now fast enough for most things for most people. The M4 mini is actually overpowered for most tasks. The M1 is enough for most things, and my desktop (a Ryzen box running Linux) is barely faster, and it's fine too even though I do the "real work" on that.

On that track the Ryzens are snapping at the heals of the M4, and Intel's newest is right behind. Apple's problem is finding something to do with all that CPU power for the 99% of the population that doesn't do video editing. AI isn't going to give Apple a competitive advantage because everyone else is doing it too.

And Apple is still over priced too. The competition is putting dual M2 slots in the machines as well as a TB of storage and often 32 GB of RAM and coming in well under Apple's price for equal capacity. Thunderbolt is a non-issue for most people, those ports will be used for USB 3 hardware.

So Apple has not so much lost their magic as they have unbalanced the ecosystem, if you like. More CPU Power isn't doing most people any good. More RAM? Well, honestly 16 GB is fine, 8 would be cramped on the Linux box, and I suspect that it will be cramped if I were to try to use AI on the M1. More storage? Definitely. 512 GB should be the base, and there should be an M2 slot for a TimeMachine drive. Every cheapskate Chinese miniPC has two M2 slots.

Also, strong-arming people into using iCloud isn't appreciated either. Why can't my iPad be a Sidecar screen when it's connected to the M1 by a cable without logging both of them into iCloud? (pet peeve).

On laptops Apple's M-series is still the best because battery life matters. The competition will catch up soon enough. On the desktop I really couldn't recommend a Mac unless you were video editing nearly exclusively.
 
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I started using Macs (G4 power Mac) in the late 90's for as my job as a graphic designer for print.
Back then, every print house used Mac only (in the UK) and was pretty much industry standard. Macs back then were widely used for the pro/business/power users and were great machines.
Over time, things seemed to have flipped with Apple now being a 'lifestyle' company selling lifestyle products.
Print work has all but died and now video work is my work thing.
For power users/business users who want a desktop with big monitors, Apple just don't have anything suitable for me and for sheer power, they just can't compete with the Nvidia cards where things are running for many hours a day.

The Mac Studio Ultra I had was a great machine when It first came out but even with the M2 Ultra Studio, that will be x3 generations behind PC very soon once the 5090 is released within a month (as rumour has it).

I'd love an M4 Studio Ultra but I have no idea when Apple will bring that out and that's my biggest issue with Apple... always waiting and by the time its actually released, Nvidia have taken my money instead.
Being stuck with a non upgradable Pro Apple machine is also a backwards step for the pro/business user.

And contrary to belief about Apple products holding their value for resale, I had a long slog time trying to shift my M1 Studio Ultra for a half decent price when I sold it... and that was before the M2 Studio was released.
 
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I will repost a response I put up a long time ago. It's not all entirely mine, but I kept it because I thought it captured the mood perfectly.

***Begin Long Diatribe***

There's a broader point to be made about the differences between Apple then and now. Whether it should be interpreted as Apple "losing their way" is a matter of perspective.

The simple fact of the matter is that Apple is a fundamentally different company than it used to be. The company can't help it. It's like if you went from paycheck-to-paycheck living, crashing on friend's couches, to a million-dollar a year job. You can claim to be the same person inside, but you're not. When your relationship with your surroundings changes dramatically, that filters down into your core, and it changes you. You can't help it, and you can't control it.

30 years ago, Apple was a company that living on the edge, metaphorically couch surfing. Its existence buoyed by a small population of die-hard fans that looked to it for technology and aesthetic leadership. It had a flock. That was its sustenance. That core group that was willing to follow where it led. Its investor pool was also similar - believers (and a few long-play speculators). You don't hold shares in a company teetering on the edge of non-existence unless you truly believe in it.

When the vast majority of the population that drives your existence are true believers, it gives you flexibility to bring that population with you as you navigate your challenges. If that population is small, then the small revenue limits your options, but their strong loyalty also lets you do things. You can change technology stacks quickly (OS9 => OSX). You can kill off entire classes of partnerships (clones). The population backs you, because they believe. Back in the late 90s, Mac users held a special pride. It took a certain about of personal conviction to stand the tide against "the default". You suffered, and struggled to be a mac user in the face of lack of software choice, and lack of hardware compatibility.. because it was worth it, and you "were a mac user”.

The proportion of Apple's userbase today that are true believers is far smaller. Likewise for their investor base. The current user base and investor loyalty is not based on conviction, or a personal identity-based affiliation

The current user base and investor loyalty is far more grounded in pragmatic self interest. For this user base, it’s a combination of their understanding of Apple products as “good products” and “cool products”, their understanding of the Apple brand as a trustworthy, fashionable, quality, desirable brand. For investors, it’s the typical investor mix - some mix of growth-oriented investment and revenue-oriented (i.e. dividend-oriented) investment.

This is the kind of loyalty most companies have to work with. It’s not as strong as the kind of identity and conviction-based loyalty that sustained the company through it’s dark days.

The problem is that this new, more pragmatically loyal user base and investor base is also what gives Apple its new identity as the most successful company in the world. If Apple’s product quality takes a stumble, some significant chunk of this user base moves on. If Apple’s brand is perceived as less fashionable than it used to be, or less fashionable than it used to be, some significant chunk of that user base moves on.

The user and investor base isn’t a flock anymore. It can’t “be led” like it used to. The company that could forge ahead with drastic decisions, relatively assured that its user base would follow, cannot make that assumption anymore.

Instead of leading a flock, it now has to cater to an audience. This is a drastically different relationship.

Their relationship with shareholders is likewise different. Back in the 90s, people used to argue that Apple should just cash in the $4 billion they had in the bank, return it to investors, as that would be a bigger value than forging ahead with their products. Apple’s investors could certainly have forced that outcome, but they didn’t. They hung on, through dwindling marketshare and sales numbers, because they believed in the company.

Are the bulk of shareholders today just as likely to stick with them as those core shareholders from yore? If profits start dropping.. is this new shareholder population as willing to just go along with it? Or are they going to start thirstily eyeing those juicy hundreds of billion dollars sitting in the bank? How much would it take for this new population of shareholders to decide “hey, it was a good ride, let’s force the Apple directors to squeeze some of that juice out for us”?

In this new reality, that original core user and investor base.. those true believers.. they don’t matter anymore. They got to enjoy the ride from the start, but now their secluded island has been inundated by a population of visitors that outnumbers them by a couple of orders of magnitude.

This new population sets the tone for what kind of company Apple will be, because they have the power in this new relationship.

Has Apple “lost its way”? Apple has slowly transitioned into a much more traditional company, and its behaviour will start to match those of a traditional company’s behaviour. If you want to consider that as them “losing their way”, then yeah.

I wouldn’t call it “losing their way”, though. Circumstances changed, and the company changed, and that’s just the way she goes.
Apple has gone from innovating to flowing, this is the share holder influence, we don't take risk. Apple has made its share of white elephants that disappeared in to obscurity. but it taking these risk that got us the iPod the iPhone. the days of wonder are long gone. and it shows.
 
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Think of it like this: 20 years ago was like Christmas morning. We couldn't wait to see what new present each new gadget or update brought with it. Now its Christmas day afternoon, we're full of turkey and have room to breath.
 
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Need a CEO who cares about products and innovation like Steve did. Tim only cares about money for shareholders and hence himself. It’s sad, and people here are saying there’s no innovation to be had. Steve would have shown us many other things during this time. Tim has made himself and the top 1% filthy rich. But the longevity of Apple will fade. Everything is about making an ecosystem instead of interoperability - that is the problem with anticompetitive money only companies.

Apple would have had at least two or three new product categories if Steve were alive. Technology and innovation would be alive and kicking. Steve wasn’t afraid to cannibalize his own products with better categories! Tim just wants to add more products and services to the ecosystem that all only work with each other. And Pro Display XDR proves that best. MacOS scaling makes people buy Apple monitors with their desktop Macs for a good display experience. The list goes on and on.
 
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Spot on.

I think a huge part now is how social media (meta) & the likes of Amazon (& any other large shopping channels) have arrived, evolved & destroyed culture, pulling people to be slaves to their devices.

I hate seeing a bus / train full of zombies staring at their devices on any commute. Kids knowing no better than being attached to their devices (&being bullied virtually). In my day everything was physical, nothing was virtual so u knew everything.

God I miss the good old days, nothing is hidden & u could feel things etc.

My biggest gripe now is that predictive text seems to be absolutely junk now to the point u think apple deliberately makes it constantly wrong to make us use dictate functions / assistants as apple ai approaches. Just makes me want to go back to old school Sony cmd z7 mobile phone (best phone I ever had) & a Walkman for my music. Modern touch screen everything just sucks!
Society - namely people - being so attached to their devices/profiles, is the result, not the cause. It doesn't matter the technology, or the company: human beings crave for something, and keep making the mistake of believing it is something outside of them. Huge mistake.
And a huge shame that companies - namely people - are taking advantage of this craving and turn it into profit. Merely a palliative. Also, the people working in these companies do not know what people are looking for, so in the end they are slaves of this system as well. CEOs included.
 
Some years ago, Apple entered a "commodity phase" of its existence.
It happened to all of them who came before:
  • Chrysler was once a jewel of car manufacturing.
  • Standard Oil once filled the skies with its oil rigs, and it powered the world.
  • General Electric certainly made "magic" when it was making light bulbs, and when it made the automatic washing machine? OMG, that freed up housewives to do other things with their limited time. That was magical all right.
  • At one time, IBM could do no wrong. The IBM Selectric typewriter brought a golden age to millions of secretaries who were paid by the word. Before the Selectric, the typewriter options were terrible, and that was when they WEREN'T breaking down and jamming.
  • IBM began a second golden age when it joined the mainframe computing race. Today, only IBM makes mainframes. Ain't nobody complaining that IBM has "lost its magic".
  • By comparison, companies like Microsoft, Oracle, Sun Microsystems, and more were AFTER IBM already broke up the ice for them.
Many of these companies and many more certainly brought "the magic" of new, innovative, and even game-changing technologies. We're seeing that now from Elon Musk's companies. Every other day it seems, he's launching another rocket with 23 more starlink satellites. And every other day, he's landing boosters on barges or plucking them out of the sky.

I have a bit of a background in economics, outside of my usual career, and will just say that almost all the companies you listed are examples used in academia of failed/derailed/"lost their way" companies. People tout IBM as having lost it's mojo all the time and people absolutely do lament that IBM "lost it's magic".

Anyway, I don't really have much to add, nor do I really care, but the entire tech industry is just boring now. Modern hardware is just commodity tech, and no different in interest, to the majority, than a new washing machine or new tires...nice to have, but not interesting enough to talk and post about, or show off. I work in fairly affluent unit in healthcare, and no one shows off their phones, talks about them, discusses, or cares. Apple isn't immune, nor is Starlink, or IBM, or Samsung, or openAI.

Tech doesn't need to exciting or magical. Boring is fine.
 
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Apple would have had at least two or three new product categories if Steve were alive.

"Past performance is no guarantee of future results".

So what would those new categories have been? Because - if there are new Jobsian miracles to be had, the precursors will be out there somewhere.

Jobs's genius was not pulling novel ideas out of the raw firmament, but spotting emerging ideas that had been poorly implemented or badly marketed and turning them into attractive, better-designed products - the Apple II was not the first self-contained personal computer, the Mac UI was built on concepts developed by Xerox, in turn inspired by The Mother of All Demos in 1968, the iPod was not the first digital music player, the iPhone was not the first touchscreen smartphone... and so on.

Meanwhile - credit where credit is due - Tim Cook (as well as making a shedload of money) has had a few major breakthroughs - the standout being the introduction of Apple Silicon. Apple demonstrated that x86 was not the only choice for laptops and desktops - and this has visibly shaken up the industry. Whether the result will be a wider switch to ARM or other architectures (if Microsoft's push to ARM with Copilot+ PCs works out) or just makes Intel and AMD double-down on power efficiency (might even be the death of Intel) we'll see.

Meanwhile - while the M4 Macs are taking some flack for stingey RAM/SSD and hilariously badly placed power buttons - they do seem to be getting people excited. I've got plenty of criticisms of the M4 Mini, but it certainly has the "cool" factor, and I think that - in the last few years - the Mac desktop has somewhat come back from the dead.

And Pro Display XDR proves that best. MacOS scaling makes people buy Apple monitors with their desktop Macs for a good display experience.
Again, I have plenty of flack to throw at the ProXDR and Studio Display but there's little on the market to compare with them in terms of the important bit - display quality & resolution - and they're strictly optional purchases. Fixing the "MacOS scaling" issue would be nice - but would also break just about every application and probably be less robust in a situation where you had a "mixed economy" of different resolution screens.

One big problem is all the FUD that is circulating suggesting that third-party 4k UHD screens have serious problems with MacOS. In reality, unless you have bionic super-vision, you'll barely notice the scaling unless you deliberately go artefact-hunting and you can easily switch to 2:1 mode for pixel-perfect 4k images, at the expense of a slightly chunky - but perfectly usable - system UI.

The one thing Apple could do in this respect is stop using labels like "2560x1440" for scaled modes, that make them sound like low-resolution when they're in fact "5k downscaled to 4k" and show far more detail than a 1440p display would.

Plus, ~220ppi is the standard across Mac laptops - which Apple are keeping ahead of the game c.f. PCs in terms of display quality & features - and like it or not, laptops are where most of Apple's money is now.
 
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Personal computers and smartphones are "mature" technology these days - exciting new developments aren't coming along so frequently - this years tech mostly does the same thing as last year's tech, 10% faster and with 20% more adverts.

1977: The Apple ][ - keyboard-driven, 8 bit, program it in BASIC...
1984: The Macintosh - GUI, 32-bit internal processor in a completely different class, completely new GUI-based computing paradigm.
vs.
2017: 15" Apple MacBook Pro
2024: 16" Apple MacBook Pro - yay! it's faster and has better battery life but recognisably the same device.

Smartphones hit maturity far more quickly - 2017 gave us the iPhone X which pretty much cemented the current design and brought us that technological marvel - the notch! The current iPhone may be a bit better in every way but, again, if you return from 8 years on a desert island you're not going to be amazed.

...but that's not Apple, thats the entire consumer electronics industry - the last 20 years have been incremental improvements, with nothing like the massive leaps of the 80s and 90s.

So, we've got Apple Vision and the like... that Apple seems to see as the next big thing, but which ultimately is just incrementally evolving Virtual Reality, the idea of which has been around for years (even Half Life: Alyx was 4 years ago...) I don't thing Apple's - er - vision of VR/AR as a tool for day-to-day work is going to come to anything while you have to cosplay as Cyclops to use it - the sort of "smart contact lenses" or even "smart glasses" the size and weight of regular sunglasses that you could use for 12 hours a day are still sci-fi for the moment.

Then of course the "new sexy" feature is "AI" and... well, this is not a place for an anti-AI rant, but it actually leaves me cold. It's clever, and may turn out to be extremely important (or it may die a death once it starts getting trained on its own output...) but... at the moment, seems to be causing more problems than it solves, and rather than being "cool" it's more of a worry, especially with the "emperor's new clothes" attitude that the industry is showing towards "AI" systems that manifestly don't work, and the danger of flooding the world with AI-generated error-filled dross... Sorry, but I really, really don't want AI summarising my emails for me with the current potential for getting it seriously wrong.

...not that some broader aspects of "AI" haven't been quietly improving - things like text recognition, speech recognition, face recognition, language translation now seem to work pretty smoothly - which is great practically but in terms of "cool" these techs had their initial "wow" moment many years ago.

TL:DNR, I think that for anybody who lived through, or has studied, the 80s and 90s, current tech progress is slow to deliver "cool" new concepts (even if progress is still happening), is repeating mistakes of the past with new tech, and tainted by cynicism that has replaced some of the optimism of the past.
Tell me you haven’t owned an Apple silicon machine without telling me.

Yes I lived through the 80s.

Apple silicon is the biggest leap in performance and efficiency I’ve seen in at least 30 years, possibly since I’ve been alive.

486 to the original Pentium would come close but they were literally melting on release and had a lot of teething issues.

M series knocked it out of the park and is still getting way better year on year upgrades than we’ve seen out of Intel since the 90s
 
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"Past performance is no guarantee of future results".

So what would those new categories have been? Because - if there are new Jobsian miracles to be had, the precursors will be out there somewhere.

Jobs's genius was not pulling novel ideas out of the raw firmament, but spotting emerging ideas that had been poorly implemented or badly marketed and turning them into attractive, better-designed products - the Apple II was not the first self-contained personal computer, the Mac UI was built on concepts developed by Xerox, in turn inspired by The Mother of All Demos in 1968, the iPod was not the first digital music player, the iPhone was not the first touchscreen smartphone... and so on.

Meanwhile - credit where credit is due - Tim Cook (as well as making a shedload of money) has had a few major breakthroughs - the standout being the introduction of Apple Silicon. Apple demonstrated that x86 was not the only choice for laptops and desktops - and this has visibly shaken up the industry. Whether the result will be a wider switch to ARM or other architectures (if Microsoft's push to ARM with Copilot+ PCs works out) or just makes Intel and AMD double-down on power efficiency (might even be the death of Intel) we'll see.

Meanwhile - while the M4 Macs are taking some flack for stingey RAM/SSD and hilariously badly placed power buttons - they do seem to be getting people excited. I've got plenty of criticisms of the M4 Mini, but it certainly has the "cool" factor, and I think that - in the last few years - the Mac desktop has somewhat come back from the dead.


Again, I have plenty of flack to throw at the ProXDR and Studio Display but there's little on the market to compare with them in terms of the important bit - display quality & resolution - and they're strictly optional purchases. Fixing the "MacOS scaling" issue would be nice - but would also break just about every application and probably be less robust in a situation where you had a "mixed economy" of different resolution screens.

One big problem is all the FUD that is circulating suggesting that third-party 4k UHD screens have serious problems with MacOS. In reality, unless you have bionic super-vision, you'll barely notice the scaling unless you deliberately go artefact-hunting and you can easily switch to 2:1 mode for pixel-perfect 4k images, at the expense of a slightly chunky - but perfectly usable - system UI.

The one thing Apple could do in this respect is stop using labels like "2560x1440" for scaled modes, that make them sound like low-resolution when they're in fact "5k downscaled to 4k" and show far more detail than a 1440p display would.

Plus, ~220ppi is the standard across Mac laptops - which Apple are keeping ahead of the game c.f. PCs in terms of display quality & features - and like it or not, laptops are where most of Apple's money is now.
I agree with much of what you have said but it’s not the fact that those monitors aren’t great. It’s that to get good image quality must have Apple products. My XDR and Studio displays look amazing on MacOS but my 4K display and even 8K (TV) don’t look crisp. That’s Apple’s way to ensure people must buy Apple to get a good image. Again, it’s a simple fix in the scaling options Apple could implement but choose not to as they want to act as proprietary or anticompetitive as possible for the MONEY.
 
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They’re tools to get things done.

As far as the things they can do go, they are faster and more powerful than ever before.

We’re peak apple right now, and i don’t think they’re in decline at all.

Exactly.

I wasn't an Apple owner during the "nostalgia" days, I came along in 2016 over dissatisfaction with Android phones I had used, or a ton of basic reasons (frequent software updates, just more solid feeling hardware, etc) despite giving up a few tricks I liked about droids (especially "always on alerts/display" of basics on phones).

I bought a 10S Max at release, gave my wife the 8 Plus, and we just traded them in for new 16s....Pro Max and Plus. Owning a cell phone for 7-8 years with OG battery in this era is amazing lifespan; the devices worked really well even with some 10S Max bugs on the release.

In the world of "universally owned product" - that which is so common as to basically be ubiquitous - the quality bar is EXTREMELY high. Usually products with such universal saturation become cheap, poor and miserable.....sorta like airlines, LOL. But given how Apple is THE phone, it stays THE phone for a reason, because they just keep making those solid, steady improvements without managing to cheapen the product. They might have even a non-tech guy like me being a bit impatient about an always on display, but they finally got to it (16 Pro Max). So even on the things that are slow on the come, the good ideas DO come and get incorporated usually.

Ands as an audio fiend I can certainly relate to nostalgia. But considering that level of nostalgia they are in a pretty good place considering how this usually foes. It brings thought to another "Mac", McIntosh Laboratory in New York State, who is one of the audio nostalgia kings that still produces great products today, albeit with very similar arguments and threads like this one. But they are both still here, and working hard to push envelopes - as to whether we always like which direction of course isa matter of debate.
 
Let me start by saying this: I am an unapologetic Apple fanatic. I’m talking all in — products, design, marketing, stores, history, the whole ecosystem. If it’s Apple, I’m interested. And if you’re here on MacRumors, I’m guessing you might feel the same way.

But as we approach the end of 2024, I can’t help but ask a question that’s been on my mind for a while:

Is the “Apple magic” gone? Or are we just chasing the nostalgia of the old days?

I’m talking about the era of Steve Jobs’ keynotes, Jonny Ive’s “aluminum unibody” monologues, and Tony Fadell’s iPod magic wheel. The era of “Hello, I’m a Mac, and I’m a PC” commercials and overnight campouts outside the Apple Store to get your hands on the newest product. Back when seeing someone with a clamshell iBook (shoutout to Elle Woods in Legally Blonde) was like spotting a unicorn in a sea of dull, black, plastic IBMs.

Back then, Apple felt exclusive. It had this it factor — a cultural cachet that was hard to put into words. To own an Apple product was to signal that you got it — that you saw something others didn’t. You weren’t just using a “computer,” you were tapping into an experience, a lifestyle. MacBooks, iPods, and iPhones were cool in a way that was undeniable.

But where do we stand now?

Apple is still a leader in design, functionality, and that coveted hardware-software integration that just works. Their products are arguably better than ever, with the M-series chips blowing minds, AirPods becoming a cultural icon, and the Apple Watch quietly dominating the wearables market. From a technical perspective, you could argue the magic is still there.

But is it cool anymore?

I’m not so sure. Seeing someone with an iPhone 15 Pro doesn’t feel the same as spotting someone with a first-gen iPhone in 2007. AirPods used to be instantly recognizable (and a bit of a flex), but now, every other tech company has its own knockoff version. The “cool factor” that used to come with owning an Apple product feels… commonplace. Ubiquity has its downsides.

Have we reached “Peak Apple” culturally?

Maybe it’s just me being nostalgic, but it feels like Apple is less of a “rebel brand” and more of an industry mainstay — the safe, dominant choice. It’s become expected that people have an iPhone. MacBooks aren’t revolutionary anymore; they’re just good laptops. Nobody’s camping outside stores anymore (well, maybe for an iPhone launch, but even that’s more spectacle than necessity now). And where are the “I’m a Mac” ads of today? Tim Cook doesn’t have the same showmanship as Jobs did, and while Craig Federighi is fun, he’s more “likable uncle” than “cult-like visionary.”

Don’t get me wrong — I’m not saying Apple is bad. In fact, I think they’re putting out some of the best products they’ve ever made. But the feeling of owning an Apple product is different. It used to feel like you were part of a movement. Now it just feels like… you own a phone.

So, I’m putting it to the MacRumors family:

Do you think the “Apple magic” is gone?

• Are we just being nostalgic for the Steve Jobs days?

• If you were an Apple fan in the ’80s, ’90s, or early 2000s, do you feel like the “vibe” is different now compared to the era of 2018 and beyond?

• Is it possible for a company this successful to ever feel countercultural again?

I’d love to hear your thoughts — especially if you grew up in the Apple golden years and have watched the shift happen in real-time. Are we living in Apple’s best era yet, or have we lost something intangible along the way?
It’s fading. Under its leader Cook 👩‍🍳 apple 🍎 is not Apple .
 
They’re tools to get things done.

As far as the things they can do go, they are faster and more powerful than ever before.

We’re peak apple right now, and i don’t think they’re in decline at all.
What world 🌎 are you living in?
 
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