The point is you could use it to get work done instead of saying "Look at the new shiney"
Got a tip for us?
Let us know
Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
Is the new Mac Pro a failure?
- Thread starter ZombiePhysicist
- Start date
- Sort by reaction score
- Status
Apple needs the Xeon CPU in the nMP in order to offer the number of expansion ports that they do. I'm not sure if Intel manufacturers non Xeon parts with the high number of PCIe lanes the Xeons offer.
Manage this poll to be on macrumours main page, then we speak about, this is only a sub-forum on macruours where users arrive so-often.
You still crying for what the Mac Pro liked you, and not for what it does for a pro, do you complaint on versatility? what about 6 Thunderbolt 2 ports, need more versatility? what about to pack it on a backpack and walk across an entire airport absolutely in-adverted you have a 9000$ machine on your back?
If you name versatility to have 6 Sata Spinenrs inside the case, I call it past.
Define Mac Pro Audience? DIYers or CPU/GPU Intensive apps users, c'mon.
Actually very few corporations-medium business do such kind of upgrades, long discussed, only frequent Mac Pro Upgrades are on Memory and Storage, and while there is no official Apple storage upgrade kits for nMP there are from OWC and eBay (apple spares).
I only see the nMP is not the system that kids looking to swap components appeal to buy, it's perfect for me and a lot of people, I have to wait 3 months for my nMP when I ordered it, one of the longest wait line for any apple product (if not was the longest).
Ok ... So let me explain .... Thunderbolt IS a Chipset/Subsystem feature that is NOT present on the Classic Mac Pro and some PC's. This card does NOT bring Thunderbolt to these systems. It Brings 10 Gig eithernet. It just so happens that Thunderbolt equipped Systems and Thunderbolt Expansion boxes are "Backewards" compatible with 10 Gig E. So ... one of these cards allows you to connect to these devices through networking. NOT real Thunderbolt but if you can connect thunderbolt devices to your Classic Mac Pro or Hackintosh ... isn't that the point. Solutions is what people are looking for not just another "You can't get there from here" ...LOL
And I do agree with another statement of yours ... I too wish Apple still made a Classic style Mac Pro ... just along side the New one ... not replacing it. For that matter I really would love a "Retro" looking Mac Classic with the nMPRO sized components. Almost went back to Hackintosh to build one but everytime I think about all the hours there I just decided to leave it as is.
The enthusiast versions of the core i7 line do support the same number of PCIe lanes as the xeon line. I do not really understand the desire for Apple to adopt the enthusiast (6-8 core) core i7 versions of Intel's CPUs. They are based on very similar processors as the Xeon line and share the same performance, clockspeeds, socket, chipsets, etc. The main difference for the purpose of a workstation is ECC memory support. They are also similar prices. The Xeon line just has a lot higher ceiling because they offer 10+ core versions.
The poll about a Gamer-Mac (i7/nMacPro) is open
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/poll-would-you-appeal-an-gamer-mac-based-on-nmp.1947137/
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/poll-would-you-appeal-an-gamer-mac-based-on-nmp.1947137/
Seems to me a poll about the Mac Pro is appropriately placed in the Mac Pro forum.
You continue to define "what it does for a pro" as "only those requirements which are met by the nMP" while all the while ignoring all the other pros for which it does not.
Really? This is all you've managed to take away from the discussion about the cMP?
That's your definition. One you've crafted so you can continue to apologize for the nMP.
This has already been discussed. The fact you don't like the answer in no way pigeon holes businesses into this definition you've created.
Of course this is only what you see...because you're failing to look anywhere else. As someone once said: There is none who are so blind as those who choose not to see.
Your entire apology for the nMP is based on something you've created in your mind. It ignores anything which doesn't fit your limited thought of what the Mac Pro should be.
Even notwithstanding the unsubstantiated allegations of 'ballot box stuffing'. There's of course additional irony if said claims come from a Johnny-come-lately account who apparently has enough free time to average multiple posts per day (vs a handful per week).
A point which has been raised before, but which has fallen on deaf ears: the facts of the matter are that the nMP is even more of a niche product than the cMP was, which can only impose an even greater limit on its audience & appeal. And regardless of just who it is that was cut out .. sure, say its the hobbyist/prosumer/SMB - but their dollars are just as good as the big corporate "Pro", so the business equation still brutally comes back to: fewer sales = lower revenue.
And since Apple has gotten out of the peripheral business (a long time ago), the additional revenue generated by those more expensive Thunderbolt externals doesn't even go to Apple at all, but to a 3rd Party company...which again begs the question of what Apple corporate is actually benefitting from by purposefully constraining themselves.
I'm not sure who owns the rights to thunderbolt anymore but if it's still apple then Apple will make money on every thunderbolt accessory sold.
similar to Lightning.. if, say, Sony makes a lighting headphone, they'll have to pay Apple some money due to the proprietary connector..
same with the OWC ssd upgrades.. Apple is making money off those.
In principle, the poll itself is quite interesting. I wonder what people think about other machines, for example a poll "Is the retina MacBook a failure?", or "Is the 2015 refresh of the 15" retina MacBook Pro a failure?".
Here in the new Mac Pro corner, it's kind of a loaded question since it's a completely different machine from the classic Mac Pro.
Apple trademarked the name thunderbolt, but the tech belongs to Intel (Light Peak)
Thanks for quickly doing the homework on answering this question for me.
FWIW, someone (attribution TBD) made a comment about what the nMP's reception was two years ago. In looking back through my prior comments on that, I was struck by this one:
"The nMP replaces my current system perfectly ..."
... That merely means that you weren't one of the abandoned ones ... this time.
-hh
Thunderbolt belongs entirely to Intel, Except the conector (mini Display port or USB-C) Which is open royalty-free
standard.
I believe Apple doesn't earn a coin on owc storage since they reverse engineer Apple products just Yo offer their options
Thats very sweet of you. But u don't need to worry about me. I am going to switch to an Windows 10 based PC. I pass the whole Hackingtosh stuff. I have read a lot about it on the famous tonymac forums but its to much of trail and error stuff.
I need to turn on my machine, do my job and turn if of. And in a lost hour, i play some Battlefield 4 and thats it. It will be an i7 5820K (or maybe the newer one soon) and overclock it with some simple steps, 64GB DDR4, M2 SSD for the OS + 3 512GB SSDs and a 3TB HDD drive. This all will be helped by an GTX980TI with 6GB memory. Packed in an nice and clean case like an Define S5. This machine is brutal power and will help me a lot in my big digital paintings.
Like i said, the only fear i have is leaving OSX. I do not worship Apple. I do like the brand tho. Just like i enjoy my iphone, ipad, macbook pro and apple tv. Leaving the platform i am used to work with is scary. But that said, almost all of my colages are all-ready moved to the windows platform and havent heard a single complaint. So i guess, it will not be the end of the world
A system is a success or failure based on what it has been traditionally or would be used for.
Apple caring about Mac gamers... That's a good one.... Still laughing... Need air...
I'm not really sure what the purpose of the poll is. It asks about a hypothetical Mac so what is your goal for creating the poll?
Oh, and before I forget.... There do seem to be some gamer in the MP sub forum as per that thread:
https://forums.macrumors.com/thread...far-cry-4-bf-h-drivers-over-clocking.1882500/
https://forums.macrumors.com/thread...far-cry-4-bf-h-drivers-over-clocking.1882500/
For games the Apple hardware is not the problem. It's relatively easy to get an iMac that performs better than a PS4 or a Xbox One. (The 380 in the iMac might be able to, the 390 will be better.) If you want Mac hardware that is good for playing games, you already have it.
Companies like Blizzard aren't pulling out because of the hardware, they're pulling out because of the software. Metal and OpenGL on the Mac are both problems, and the quality of the graphics stack is not good.
Without fixing these problems, people who want to game on any Mac will just be running Windows anyway, and that's not a market Apple wants to go after. And if the hardware isn't the problem, game publishers won't come back to the Mac anyway, even if Apple releases hardware meant for games.
If Mac users want the games back, and they want them to run well, it's better to complain about the software and not the pretty capable hardware.
I agree with a lot of what you've said however it doesn't answer my question regarding the intent of the poll.
And yours by delusion. Yea, people creating accounts to 'rig' the results. Here's a tin foil crown for you.
Of course it will as it now has to cary PCI over it, and, its more bandwidth constrained, which will increase latency as more collisions occur on the bandwidth shared/constrained line.
It's an equally stupid idea to try to pool the bandwidth vs a clean bandwidth pipe. The above grasping at straws is telltale of a losing argument.
I dislike the clinically stupid.
You should write for Trump team...
You read wrong, Thunderbolt practically don't add latency, also it's protocol overhead it's the same as pcie 2.0 each tb2 connection equals to an 4xPcie 2.0
About Latency, please take the time to read this thread http://arstechnica.com/civis/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=1190716&start=280
Please teach your self and don't make unfounded biased assertions.
More on Tb2 vs Pcie :
http://www.tested.com/tech/457440-theoretical-vs-actual-bandwidth-pci-express-and-thunderbolt/
Here is were personal formation arises, and this actually tells you read not an engineer (at least not in electronics or IT) since what you said is actually moot on connectivity. This is like the debate on the parallel port (old printer port) vs usb or serial port, and actually most capture card providers have teach exactly the same as me at the post quoted above.
W/O Thunderbolt you can't connect more than a single device to an pcie x4 slot (you may add pcie bridges, but those bridge add 148ns latency over 8ns latency on TB2.
So it's evident tb2 don't account the drawbacks you insist to blame, while provide a lever of flexibility impossible on pcie (as 100ft remote capture devices on optical fibre tb)
On this regard I'll follow Einstein's teachings, and of course you win me due your longest experience.
Last edited:
Like i said, the only fear i have is leaving OSX. ...
Congrats. Sounds like a nice rig. Given the software you run probably "looks and feels" the same under Win 10 as it does under OS X, fear not. Just spend some time chatting with some Win power users if you need to delve into any serious OS questions.
I just made about a $6000 investment to support a client with a big 4K editing project. Only $275 was actually spent on the Mac, and that was buying a 2011 cMP 3.64GHz 12 core for $2000 and selling a 2009 cMP 2.93GHz 12 core for $1725. All of the other $$$ was spent on hardware upgrades that could work with the cMP or a PC (but not a nMP). One of these days I might switch to a PC, when PCIe 4.0 hit the streets and the cMP can no longer be tweaked to compete. But for now my invest will be more than adequate to service my current 4K project and several more 4K projects to start later in the new year.
- Status