In the end, a computer is a tool, not a fashion statement. I think Jobs understood that. A pure designer doesn't.
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Jony Ive’s vision was killed today
- Thread starter childu
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We’ll see. My 12” MacBook was my favorite Mac ever. It was a platform just begging for Apple Silicon. Hopefully Apple keeps the “consumer” devices minimalist.
The camera bumps on phones are simple physics. Even casual users want better cameras, so there isn’t much choice. But even the basic M1 is overkill for most consumers. So Apple can keep sleek designs for the MacBook Air if they so choose.
Not really. I have used an iPad Pro before mouse support at my “daily driver” just to see if I could move to an iPad instead of a laptop. I agree about bad ergonomics of holding your arm in front of you. Plus it always felt considerably slower than a mouse because I was constantly moving my hand up tot the screen and putting it back down so my arm didn’t get tired waiting for my next “click” action.
That original MacBook Air in January 2008 was all form over function. It frequently had to shut down one of its 2 cores to prevent overheating. The 2 ports it had were in a drop down compartment. And the SSD was a $1000 add-on. Apple released a much improved version in November of that year. I still paid $2499 in 2008 dollars for the SSD version. I’m sure he would have loved the 2015 MacBook’s design as it seems like the MacBook Air he would have liked to have removed from that Manila envelope.
Steve Jobs did do a better job of differentiating between consumer and pro devices, though. He tolerated the Pro users a bit more than Jony Ive.
According to this handy bandwidth calculator (murideo.com), 10k@60 Hz/10 bits/4:4:4 requires 26.73 Gbps with DSC. Yes, DP 2.0 is 80 Gbps. But does the M1's TB4 support this? I'd be surprised. And if it doesn't, i.e., if it's limited to TB4's standard 40 Gbps, you would only be able to drive one 10k, not three.
And even with 80 Gbps you could only connect one XDR without compression (6k@60 Hz/10 bits/4:4:4 = 46.1 Gbps).
But yes, if you compressed the Pro Display XDR with DSC, that would be 12.3 Gbps/display @60 Hz/10 bits/4:4:4, so you could drive three with a single 40 Gbps TB4 cable.
Though Apple's spec's say the M1 Pro and M1 Max are limited to 2 x 6k and 3 x 6k respectively, which may be a GPU limitation.
this forum is really annoying with how a month ago everyone hated the touch bar, and the 2016 mac in general. Now its praised as one of the best lol.
I’ve had 12” macbook, 13” and currently 16” MBP’s and realize that the new pro vision is not for me, I am definitely more toward the prosumer than the pro and prefer portability to heft. It does seem puzzling that a lower tdp platform ends up being put into a larger body, but perhaps this is part of their vision in further segmenting the platforms.
Here is hoping there is a true macbook successor next year, with no fan and impossibly thin and light design.
Thunderbolt is 40Gbps per direction when its bidirectional and 80Gbps when its unidirectional (DisplayPort Alt Mode)
You forgot about the keyboard. They dared something alright. The company known for making one of the best keyboards is also known for making one of the worse keyboards.
And I don't. Even if I did I still live in the wired present and I need my gear to operate in the present, not compromise on usability in the name of "the future."
I was expecting that you’d suggest something like this
Sure, I can do that but it means that I have to carry my charger around (or have a spare one in the office) instead of using my monitors charging capabilities, fiddle with three cables at work instead of two abs then also have a bit of a mess since the HDMI port is located at the wrong side, so I’d have to awkwardly wrap the cable around the desk… it’s simply suboptimal.
Or I could buy a TB dock, but those are not cheap and I can’t really argue that my employee should spend $200 extra because “apple changed the port layout and now my connectivity became slightly more awkward”.
In the end, you win some you lose some. But yeah, the loss of the fourth universal port is somewhat painful.
That is a contradiction. Thermal cannot be fine if the chips cannot run full blast without fans going crazy.
It’s kind of difficult to have a silent laptop if the CPU behaves like a desktop one. The MBP had no problems keeping the i9 clocks over the base level, which is the very definition of “thermals being fine”. The turbo was simply clocked too aggressively. Intel should have left mobile Coffe Lake at 4.4ghz, but then they couldn’t have claimed performance improvements.
In the end, it has nothing to do with Apple. All (but the very thick and heavy) Coffe Lake i9 laptops run hot and loud. In fact, the 15” and later 16” did better than most of the laptops in the market with the same hardware (benchmarks are available, you are welcome to verify yourself). The problem is not laptop cooling system, it’s the use of hardware that had no business being used in a laptop.
So we have agreed that a laptop is compromise? I fully agree that noise is important and if the new MBP (at least the Pro model) under full load will have the sound level of an MP2013, I believe it is one of the main selling points and then the thickness is appropriate (I would have preferred a more iPhone 4 like edges or a more tapered design).
My general concern now that Ive (and Steve) are both gone is that no-one seem to be pushing towards the "impossible". I think one strong reason we got the M chips in the first place was the drive for thinner and lighter. The only person at the event that showed some kind of ambition of being on the cutting edge was Johny and his M chip. The chip is not sufficient. The whole package needs to be. The new MBP is unremarkable except for the performance. Solid, well built but really no surprises.
Just applying the same kind of criticism applied to to the MP2013 (and iMacs), which are thermals, to the MBP. As Johny said last year, it is all about thermals and power efficiencies.
That's why we have a fanless MacBook Air. They can even bring back the 12-inch MacBook design and M1 can run inside it just like it is running in iPads now. Different chips (and computers) have different design goals, and M1 Pro/Max is certainly not designed for extremely light and thin notebooks.
We can split it apart.
The resulting product is having a thermal problem because the thermal design does not work well with the chip.
We can either blame:
- The chip which is too hot.
- The cooling is just insufficient.
To solve the problem we can either replace the chip with a cooler one, or add a gigantic cooling system. The former is harder, and the latter is simpler. Apple took the harder approach.
MP had perfectly fine cooling for its own hardware. It’s whisper quiet while encoding videos full steam (we have one so I know it well). The problem was accommodating hardware that came years later since it increased power consumption significantly. Don’t have any experience with the iMac so can’t comment on it.
In the case of Intels very power hungry chips there are basically the following options:
a) skip the i9 (and lose to the competition in performance)
b) underclothes the i9 (and lose to the competition in performance)
c) have a laptop that runs loud
d) engineer a desktop level cooling solution in your laptop and completely destroy its concept in process
There is just no good option here. Apple chose c) followed by e) make your own faster CPU that runs cooler
Unfortunately it's not quite as thin & light as the now unavailable 12" MacBook. My wife has one & loves it. It's a shame that Apple no longer sell these or an Apple Silicon version.
Yeah, I have a friend who really likes his 12" MacBook. At 2.0 lbs., it was notably lighter than the 2.8 lb. 13" Air. Seems a 12" MB would be an ideal candidate for an M2 chip. No idea if Apple will offer it.