There toys i got one cos its fun but truth is its just a huge iphone ios is same on both this thing needs its own OS the 12.9 apps look silly on the home page
Got a tip for us?
Let us know
Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
Let’s face the facts, this years iPad update is meaningless
- Thread starter Aluminum213
- Start date
- Sort by reaction score
right, I love the idea of the iPad, it's a technical marvel. Sadly, it only does really basic things well. One day Apple will admit that iOS on the iPad is **** and have some sort of iOS/macOS hybrid on the device, till then it's just what you said... a toy
If anything, this just makes me want to ARM chips in laptops
That is my main takeaway also.
I love my iPad because of the form factor and technology and in spite of iOS as the software honestly
I never really bought the story that we could not make a touchscreen iteration of MacOS. Apple just didn’t want to put that work in and now they’re working backwards in all sorts of convoluted ways to get there anyway
Why didn’t Adobe do it before?
Of course, i’m not privy to internal politics (which i’m Sure was a big part), however here are my guesses :
- Hardware Power - only with the 12” iPad Pro (and the Pencil) did photoshop make sense on the iPad - even then the audience was too small to invest in. With the popularity of the 10.5” iPad Pro, the commitment of powerful enough hardware and the increased number of people that had an iPad with a Pencil did Photoshop become practical.
- Strategy for Mobile - Adobe’s initial mobile strategy was to focus on snapshots of tasks and make apps where people were going to spend minutes, not hours. They were focused on mobile, tablet included, being an accessory to a laptop experience - still valid for creation, just not standalone.
- Someone already proved it can be done and there was an audience - Adobe probably never expected Affinity Photo coming to the iPad. Others beat Adobe to the punch and they were caught with their pants down. The reaction to Adobe’s announcement is proof of an audience - there are lots of people that praise it and are eagerly anticipating, and others who are going to stick with Affinity (mostly due to Adobe’s Cloud).
- Adobe, as well as others, put some pretty big stock in the Web apps. The thought was to put their apps in a web browser and they could be accessed (eventually) by any device (and you wouldn’t need to install a local copy).
- Photoshop on the Surface - Adobe decided to partner with Microsoft on the Surface instead of Apple and the iPad. The apps would already run, but they created a redesigned interface for touch. Adobe realized that Photoshop (and their other apps) weren’t going to work as well with Pen and Touch vs. Mouse and keyboard. Unfortunately only Illustrator and InDesign really came through with a halfway decent reconfiguration (remember, Photoshop on the iPad may have feature parity (eventually) but the interface had been redesigned for mobile/touch/pen).
- Audience - as hard as MS pushes creativity on the Surface, Adobe knows it has a larger creative audience on the iPad. People have been begging Adobe for “full” Photoshop on the iPad forever - now it’s finally coming to fruition.
I include business in the broad term “developer” simply because, to me, it is a broad term - everything from big players like Apple, Adobe, and Microsoft, down to the software developer who runs their own business, writes code, creates visuals, and has to be their own marketing.
I do have some productivity apps, such as Affinity photo. And yes I could have clarified that it is how I have ended up using it, although I did hope in 2015 it could replace a mobile computer, it does still have too many limitations to be a sole machine for my needs, so yes it is a luxury consumption device now.
Let's all agree, iOS in its current state is a bottleneck for the iPad becoming more useful.
Yes, no one of us knows the exact reasons, but indeed we can speculate
.That's definitely huge possibility. And that is not a factor on Developer side as well. It's on Apple. So in that sense we can say that actually this change (improved hardware) might be a key in the future when it comes to software enhancements.
Not just Adobe though. A lot of companies think this way. We do have our own mobile application and we do go to similar train of thoughts. The ideas with enhancements are always more than the actual people available for doing them. People always prioritize. Now let's be honest here. If we forget about this forum how many people want Photoshop on an iPad and how many actually use iPad as a consumption device. That's what matters in the end. Not everyone that has iPad would pay for Photoshop or need it.
That does make sense!
Yet this begs the question why Adobe chose to team up with Microsoft and not Apple. My guess is because it was easier to make it work for Surface (still Windows OS, despite the pen) then for a whole another OS (iOS). And then this adds another question - how easy it is to develop such app for iOS? How many people you need, how much time you need and how this investment compares to the profit you will get from said app. Like I said it's always about profit.
Completely agree with this. It was about company politics above anything else. However even this for me proves something. Someone being reluctant or showing concerns is a sign in itself. I bet that outside of this forum there are a lot of people that don't even know what RAM means, let alone how much RAM iPad Pro has. We might be a small fraction of people that actually care about this. Same goes for people wanting Photoshop on iPad. I am pretty sure that such exists. I am just not sure that they are that many.
What I am trying to say is that Developers (if we use that term though I disagree with it) run their own business. Their job is not to promote Apple's iPad sales, their job is to make their own profit. To say that it's their fault that the iPad is not a desirable device is a bit of exaggeration. It's not only their fault. It's also about them being nurtured by Apple to be motivated to provide something. For me there are three key players in this equation - Apple, companies that make and sell apps and consumers. And unfortunately they are related and depend on each other to strive and move forward.
I agreed with that way of thinking... back in 2012. Back then you could argue hardware limitations and “mobile mindset”. Here in 2018 any company that develops software needs to re-evaluate their thinking.
As for Photoshop on iPad, I don’t think this forum is a good representation of the market - it’s much bigger than this forum represents.
I think Photoshop is starting to be a unique case in this discussion, but “need” isn’t at stake. It doesn’t MATTER that there may be other, cheaper options that do what you NEED - people want Photoshop and they get upset when they think they’re not getting the “full” or “real” photoshop. This is what got Adobe intro trouble - they started building “need” apps with the Photoshop name... and it BOMBED. At one point there were 5 iOS apps with the Photoshop name that offered more individual tasks but it wasn’t FULL Photoshop. Even now, with Adobe saying FULL feature parity will come in time, people are upset simply because it’s not “full” or “real” - even though they have no idea what will be in the initial release or how long it will take to realize full parity. Even the idea of a redesigned interface gets people bothered - because it’s not “real”.
Having said that, there are LOTS of creatives who WILL use Photoshop on the iPad and get all sorts of great use out of it. Some will even buy an iPad Pro just to be able to use Photoshop on the go.
Long way around, you can’t say the market doesn’t exist if the product isn’t out there. I think there is plenty of evidence that the audience is there, the OS is capable, it’s up to Software Companies to build the apps.
People call it a consumption device because of the lack of apps, or lack of featured apps, in their productivity category. Granted, there are those who call it consumption because they prefer the laptop for creation, or they don’t create, or they had that experience back in 2012 and haven’t changed their mind due to ignorance, but over and over the theme is “i can’t use the iPad because it can’t do __________” and a lot of it comes down to apps (xCode, features in Excel, etc.).
Sure looks that way. Usually there is some sort of hardware limitation as the reason.
After donating my beloved iPad 12.9 gen 1 to my brother half year ago I wanted to buy a new 2018 iPP at WWDC in June. Apple did not release one and I was suffering from not having my 12.9. Bought a 9.7 2018 as an intermediate but it did not work for me.
As I couldn’t stand this situation a bought a used 12.9 iPP gen 2 until a new 12.9 gen 3 would arrive. This gen 2 iPP surprised me with the improvements it brought to me:
The new gen 3 iPP seems not that big jump in relation to the gen 1 vs. gen 2. That are my points why not:
As I couldn’t stand this situation a bought a used 12.9 iPP gen 2 until a new 12.9 gen 3 would arrive. This gen 2 iPP surprised me with the improvements it brought to me:
- My gen 1 had a maximum storage capacity of 128 GB. Because I used it for my photo workflow I very much appreciate the new capacity of 512 GB with my gen 2.
- The display is a big improvement with wide gamut P3, True Tone and especially ProMotion. This 120Hz display is amazing!
- The front and back camera with an added flash was also a big improvement without adding a too big camera bump.
- The gen 2 was lighter with improved battery life.
- The accessories from the gen 1 like the Smart Cover/Keyboard and the pencil are still usable.
The new gen 3 iPP seems not that big jump in relation to the gen 1 vs. gen 2. That are my points why not:
- With the additional Smart Folio the gen 3 weights the same as the gen 2 and is even thicker because of the double sided case (and I like to see and feel the beautiful metal back of the gen 2).
- The display seems to be not better than the gen 2.
- The processor and GPU is more than quick enough with the gen 2. I even did not consider that as a big improvement from gen1 to gen 2. IOS 12 gives me more performance improvement than the new CPU. For my use cases there is simply no need for a better CPU/GPU running with IOS.
- I need the headphone jack for a low latency microphone connection.
- The smaller size seems nice but a 12.9 device stays a 12.9 device and the side bezels seemed useful to hold it.
- I did not miss Face ID from my XR with the iPP. Touch ID works fine with a tablet.
- The rounded corners are a problem for my remote work because the sides get cutted now.
- The gen 3 cost me more than double as much as my used 12.9 gen 2 Cellular with 512 GB and I need new versions of all accessories.
I would not call it hardware limitations so much as general usage limitations. For example the 9.7/10.5 is a small screen to do productivity. At least for me. Granted I have eye issues and I don't see properly. The 12.9 is good as far as screen goes, but it's not mobile. I will have wrist issues constantly if I have to hold it as a tablet. And if it won't be mobile then what is the point in buying an iPad when I can buy a laptop where the keyboard feels better and I can run whatever app I want.
Could be but we don't know it. We have no idea if that's the case or not. Same for Adobe. Of course as any big company they could have done their research and ask their users.
That's also a trend in the mobile I have seen before. I think that it was more valid in the past than now because nowadays most mobile devices have enough storage. There are always two options - you make one big app that includes everything or you make a few small ones. Both approaches have pros and cons. With one big app you require better hardware - ram, storage etc. If most of your users would not use 70 % of it on average they will be annoyed to pay for an app that takes a lot of RAM and storage that they can't use. For those people the smaller apps options work better. Now the best of course is to have both but that is also more expensive to maintain.
Could be the case, but that's just Photoshop. I do see a lot of people wanting to use Photoshop on iPad because of the pencil. However that's a niche case.
I still see however a lot of issues that Apple needs to fix themselves if they want an iPad to be taken as a serious device. At least when it comes to me. iPad is a mobile device that starts from the app. A lot of people start from the file and the data. I have installed around 50 apps on my iPad. The settings menu is a complete nightmare. Every time I work with an app and I want to change something (which happens every day) I have to go to the Settings. That's a waste of my time. Copy/paste is a nightmare too. And let's not even talk about not seeing a cursor and the fact that you can't even properly put the cursor to edit something you wrote.
Copy/Paste is not usable solution either. I am just reading a Word document now and it has pictures in it. And I want to move that picture to a Notes app I have. Now I can copy the picture. However I have no option to paste it. I can drag it. I can't save the image on itself. So in a nutshell I can't do this simple thing. What I had to do is drag the picture to the Photos app and then import it from Photos in the other app. That's also wasting my time. I can do it way faster on a computer.
I download a lot of pictures for a lot of different reasons. Some are for work, some are for entertainment. All of them go into the same photos folder and it's a complete mess and nightmare. On top of it, it decides to backup all of them in iCloud. Half of the images I download I don't want to be backed up. But I have no choice to control that as I can't have good file system to organize my photos in folders and I can't choose which folders to back up and which not.
Most of my work is research. As powerful an iPad is for Photoshop, the ram management for browsers and open tabs is a nightmare. The tabs get reloaded quite often which makes the device unusable. I am talking about Safari here, not just Chrome. And let's not even talk about the Notes app that crashes every other day. All of this is on Apple to fix, not other developers. However all of this stops me from seeing an iPad as a serious device for me.
Personal preferences. For me the hardware is capable, the OS is not. iOS is a frustrating OS to use. I love to use the Apple pencil. I even can manage to find apps that work for me for what I want. I can't however like the iOS itself. Until I have the option to store files where I want, to open files with the app I want, to set up the apps in the app itself and not the settings, the iPad for me will be a device to take notes, sketching ideas and brainstorming and do some creativity.
I don't even use it for consumption because I prefer my 15.6 inch laptop to use for watching movies.
Last edited:
Apple marketing seems seriously confused.... (attached image below)
[doublepost=1541654810][/doublepost]
Just as long as they keep iOS far away from their laptop line!!!!
Attachments
What’s funny is that people actually want to play dumb when someone says that Apple markets the iPad Pro as a laptop computer replacement
They’re not wrong when they say “unlike any computer”
Although, before someone corrects me. Yes, that was a joke. And yes, I’m perfectly aware that by definition, any iPad is technically a computer.
The new apple pencil needs a $1000 dollar charger
Hahahaha
The new apple pencil needs a $1000 dollar charger
Considering this statement makes zero sense....I still like it
But meaningless update? No. Crazy expensive? yes.
Considering this statement makes zero sense....I still like it
What doesn’t make sense? It’s funny because it’s true
I don't know. From what I've read it only works with the new iPads? which is sort of hard to believe.
Please tell me it works with the other iPads also. If it does, then yes, that 'charger' comment would make sense. (Not sure....about anything)
I do know I want the new iPad. Affording it is another story.
Last edited:
Unfortunately the new Apple pencil only works with the new Charger....I mean iPad Pro.
What?
Well then that 'charge' comment makes no sense, as the IPP must be used for it's intended purpose, and not function solely as a charger (as then the pencil would be useless).
Ta da!
Last edited:
you're missing the point completely, the new pencil only works on the new iPad Pros, essentially if you want a double tap capable apple pencil you need a new device, not hard to figure out