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HatMine

macrumors member
May 31, 2016
88
104
C:/
Technically, yes they still do. However, it is embedded into the SoC. So my point and findings are still valid.
Well no, they do not have a T2 chip. Apple says so themselves. However, the functionality the T2 chip provided is likely provided by the M1 SOC in the newer Macs, which I guess is what you mean. But that does not mean that they have T2 chips, or that the corresponding hardware inside the M1 Macs operates the same way as the T2 chip did in Intel Macs.

Again, most people here seem to agree that this is a PD-problem, and as far as I know, the T2 chip has nothing with PD to do.
 

Cludch

macrumors newbie
Jan 20, 2020
5
1
Well, I just wanted to share my experience and that this is not a M1-only problem.
And yes, this seems to be a PD problem. The T2 chip is responsible for booting and is sometimes during usage fried.
So as soon as the MacBook goes to sleep and you try to wake it, the T2 is addressed. As the T2 is unable to work and therefore verify and allow the boot process, the device stays powered off.

I did read a more technical analysis of this a long time ago.
And I think that Apple explicitly said the the "T2 chip" is within the M1 SoC during one of the WWDC talks. But I might be mistaking as this is quite some time ago.
 
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darngooddesign

macrumors P6
Jul 4, 2007
18,362
10,114
Atlanta, GA
I apologize for my snark, I understand what you meant. Was this as much of a widespread issue, well as much as one thread on MR is widespread, on the Intel Macs with the T2? What about USB-C iPads?
 
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Cludch

macrumors newbie
Jan 20, 2020
5
1
I apologize for my snark, I understand what you meant. Was this as much of a widespread issue, well as much as one thread on MR is widespread, on the Intel Macs with the T2? What about USB-C iPads?
No worries! It seems to be more widespread with the M1 Macs. I have heard a few reports with the Intel Macs and a few Apple Service Providers told me that they had this issue before (Intel-Era) but not that many cases.
I haven't heard about bricked iPad Pros, however, i did no research in that direction. Do the iPad Pros have Power Delivery? Maybe they handle it differently / better.
 

helveta

macrumors regular
Mar 31, 2012
164
18
That's rather troubling. Presumably that LG monitor charges it too? I don't suppose you feel like putting your serial number into the site that dgtvc shared above to see when your MBA was made? I'm assuming it's an M1-based MBA?
Yes it’s an M1 and the monitor charges it too.
 

darngooddesign

macrumors P6
Jul 4, 2007
18,362
10,114
Atlanta, GA
No worries! It seems to be more widespread with the M1 Macs. I have heard a few reports with the Intel Macs and a few Apple Service Providers told me that they had this issue before (Intel-Era) but not that many cases.
I haven't heard about bricked iPad Pros, however, i did no research in that direction. Do the iPad Pros have Power Delivery? Maybe they handle it differently / better.
iPads get their power through the USB-slot, but not many people are using hubs or monitors with them, 3rd-party battery packs are in more use for iPads than with Macs. So you'd think that if the "T2" functionality were at risk there would be burned out iPads as well as M1 Macs, both of which have it in the SOCs.
 
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rsucre

macrumors member
Feb 1, 2007
38
7
I called the authorized service center today and they said that they are awaiting replacement main board and Touch ID for my MBA M1 from Apple. Should be ready in about 5 days. I'm surprised that Apple is not just sending a complete replacement. I just hope to get it back in perfect working order and with the root cause corrected.

Hope we get to the bottom of this.
 

HatMine

macrumors member
May 31, 2016
88
104
C:/
I called the authorized service center today and they said that they are awaiting replacement main board and Touch ID for my MBA M1 from Apple. Should be ready in about 5 days. I'm surprised that Apple is not just sending a complete replacement. I just hope to get it back in perfect working order and with the root cause corrected.

Hope we get to the bottom of this.
To be fair, it should not be surprising since it would be more expensive to replace the whole computer. I mean, surely the screen, keyboard, casing and (probably) battery still work fine?
 

Zazoh

macrumors 68000
Jan 4, 2009
1,516
1,121
San Antonio, Texas
To be fair, it should not be surprising since it would be more expensive to replace the whole computer. I mean, surely the screen, keyboard, casing and (probably) battery still work fine?

I would demand a new one. Let Apple keep that one and use as a refurb replacement when they figure out what is wrong. They are not treating it like a manufacturing default. All the data is on the board so it’s not like there is data recovery at risk.
 
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HatMine

macrumors member
May 31, 2016
88
104
C:/
I would demand a new one. Let Apple keep that one and use as a refurb replacement when they figure out what is wrong. They are not treating it like a manufacturing default. All the data is on the board so it’s not like there is data recovery at risk.
Well at least in my country, you are not able to demand a replacement. It is the seller that decides how they want to fix the problem. Obviously, if the problem is never fixed, you are eventually able to demand a refund. But right from the get-go you cannot demand a refund or replacement unit in the general case.
 
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rsucre

macrumors member
Feb 1, 2007
38
7
To be fair, it should not be surprising since it would be more expensive to replace the whole computer. I mean, surely the screen, keyboard, casing and (probably) battery still work fine?
Labor is not cheap and there’s the chance of breaking something else. This is a 1 month old MBA. Come on!
 

HatMine

macrumors member
May 31, 2016
88
104
C:/
Labor is not cheap and there’s the chance of breaking something else. This is a 1 month old MBA. Come on!
Legally speaking, the age of the device does not matter in this instance (again, in my country). I am also not picking sides here, I am just pointing out that it is not strange at all that Apple is trying to repair the broken computer instead of replacing it.

As for the risk of breaking it, nothing is risk-free. But the people who do the repairs are trained professionals and have likely done similar repairs before, so I doubt that the risk is significant.

Now, would I be angry if my MBA that is 2 months old broke and I had to wait weeks for a repair? Yeah, of course. But I know that all I can do is wait, and that is what I would do.
 

rsucre

macrumors member
Feb 1, 2007
38
7
Legally speaking

That’s funny because I’m not even thinking about laws or legalities. I just want a MBA that is reliable.

Here I am with 3 MBA M1s that I’m scared to use, especially with USB-C dongles. And that’s not right...

For instance, I never buy AppleCare, was not even considering it. But I’m seriously considering it due to this issue. Otherwise I would not even consider it. That is $250 x 3 = $750 that I will have to spend due to this issue that I was not planning to spend.
 
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HatMine

macrumors member
May 31, 2016
88
104
C:/
That’s funny because I’m not even thinking about laws or legalities. I just want a MBA that is reliable.

Here I am with 3 MBA M1s that I’m scared to use, especially with USB-C dongles. And that’s not right...

For instance, I never buy AppleCare, was not even considering it. But I’m seriously considering it due to this issue. Otherwise I would not even consider it. That is $250 x 3 = $750 that I will have to spend due to this issue that I was not planning to spend.
Well yeah, I also want a reliable computer, and have an M1 MBA myself for which I considered to buy Apple Care. But the thing is, if you charge your device with the original charger plugged directly to the machine, then by the looks of it, nothing bad will happen. So there is a very simple workaround to this issue which can be applied while we wait for an official response from Apple.

Edit: I will also add that I opted to ditch Apple Care mainly because it only lasts for 3 years, which is the same amount of time for which Apple is obligated to repair my device if it breaks, according to my country’s laws.
 
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Zazoh

macrumors 68000
Jan 4, 2009
1,516
1,121
San Antonio, Texas
Well at least in my country, you are not able to demand a replacement. It is the seller that decides how they want to fix the problem. Obviously, if the problem is never fixed, you are eventually able to demand a refund. But right from the get-go you cannot demand a refund or replacement unit in the general case.
By demand I mean communicate with senior management persuasively. In addition, I wouldn’t buy from anyone but Apple directly. I realize that isn’t an option globally. In America, most companies have a department that handles executive communications. The sole purpose is too appease customers. If you don’t go full “Karen” on them, they are typically very accommodating.
 
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rsucre

macrumors member
Feb 1, 2007
38
7
while we wait for an official response from Apple.
Hope they do that soon. My 60-day window to buy AppleCare is ending soon. And “Official Response” from Apple would be key for me to decide. Until then, I’m considering it a lemon.
 
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helveta

macrumors regular
Mar 31, 2012
164
18
I bought applecare while I’m waiting for my appt for repair at the apple store. The store called up 5minutes later (coincidence?) to explain the store procedures. I explained that I had a long drive to the store, would be traveling for the next couple days after the appointment and that it was my only computer and I needed it for work. I was handed off to the manager and she said that if they couldn’t fix it while I was as at the store it would be a exchanged.
 

rsucre

macrumors member
Feb 1, 2007
38
7
I was handed off to the manager and she said that if they couldn’t fix it while I was as at the store it would be a exchanged.
Good for you! The question is if you will be handed a MacBook Air M1 with the same vulnerability. Can you try to get more information from the Apple Store staff? Is this a widespread issue (most likely they will not acknowledge, but who knows)? Thank you!
 

Apple_Robert

Contributor
Sep 21, 2012
35,653
52,441
In a van down by the river
Good for you! The question is if you will be handed a MacBook Air M1 with the same vulnerability. Can you try to get more information from the Apple Store staff? Is this a widespread issue (most likely they will not acknowledge, but who knows)? Thank you!
If his M1 ends up being replaced, it will be the same as what he had and what we all have.
 

rsucre

macrumors member
Feb 1, 2007
38
7
If his M1 ends up being replaced, it will be the same as what he had and what we all have.
Not necessarily. Of the 3 MBA M1s that I have 2 are from one factory and the other from another factory. Perhaps this issue is related to one factory. How you know otherwise?
 

rsucre

macrumors member
Feb 1, 2007
38
7
By the way this reminds me of something. I have a MacBook Air cover (shell) that does not fit the bottom part of the MBA M1s from one of the factories. The same shell fits the MBA M1 from the other factory. It seems that there is a 1mm or less difference somewhere. I find that interesting.
 

eyetic

macrumors member
Mar 22, 2020
39
25
Question, my m1 is arriving next week, would be safer if I use one USB C to charge with its original charger and the second USB C port to use the hub which connects to the external monitor?
 

helveta

macrumors regular
Mar 31, 2012
164
18
Or would it matter which USB port you use. I would assume they were the same but I saw a YouTube video telling how to do a clean install from another Mac and they specifically said to use the back USB port.
 
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