Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.

What do you think is the source of the graphics issues on Mac Pro (Late 2013) ?

  • Hardware

    Votes: 69 53.1%
  • Software

    Votes: 28 21.5%
  • Hardware & Software

    Votes: 32 24.6%
  • Other

    Votes: 1 0.8%

  • Total voters
    130

MackyMcMac17

macrumors newbie
Jan 24, 2018
22
3
Update: I can't get it to freeze yet with the latest OS update (10.13.3). It's been 3 days. It looks good but I can no way claim that it's resolved yet.

BTW..Sorry for the colorful language but this thing has pissed me off for a long time. I have an old mac mini that has a way better uptime that this thing...

My Mac Pro (late 2013) is the one with the d300 video cards (never replaced)...
 

FilthyMcNasty

macrumors member
Sep 2, 2014
76
5
I can totally understand not wanting to get rid of it, it's a great machine when it works.

1/ The issue is very irregular, so no way to tell. I've had mine for nearly 3 years and it didn't get worse over time, nor did it get any better.

2/ Apple care extends the original 12 month warranty to 36 months. It can't be extended beyond that. You can buy apple care during those first 12 months of ownership from new.

3/ We don't have a clue, i doubt Apple has a clue. Most repairs include replacing the gpu boards and the glitch looks gpu related so odds are those gpu's are the cause.

Maybe what you had was just an installation issue. Just use your mac as intended and watch it closely. Do not hesitate to call apple when you get an issue. The more you bother them, the better your changes are for getting a repair.
Thank you voyager77!

I do wonder what data Apple actually have on this. It's a type of problem I've never seen nor heard of, in 25+years dealing with computing products, mostly PC at home or work, and a couple years in IT on mainframes and networks. Compatibility problems with other makers products.. sure.. seen tons of that.. but a machine that just randomly crashes? Nope..

Well since I previously posted, I'm pleased to say this Mac has behaved impeccably. :)

I have applied the latest patches, as per MackyMcMac17. Be interested to see how others find this update. If you take the update details at face value - every update addresses stability issues! Could it be they have finely fixed this never ending saga?

Watch and wait...
 

Kris Kelvin

macrumors regular
Dec 28, 2005
246
179
At least in my case, there seems to be a correlation with the type of cable used.

My config: MacPro6,1 (built in 2016), 2 x original D300, 64GB RAM, upgraded Xeon E5-2697v2, LG 34UM95@3440x1440
Problem experienced: GUI freezes except for mouse cursor; apps continue to run though and proper shutdown/reboot is possible (SSH or keyboard shortcut)

When using a Thunderbolt cable (1m or 2m), I average about one freeze per day and sometimes experience multiple ones within minutes.
When using a mDP-to-DisplayPort cable (2m, DP 1.2), it's only about one freeze per week.


Edit: Never mind, after logging 80 freezes, the cable doesn't appear to make a difference (just an unlikely coincidence).
 
Last edited:

FilthyMcNasty

macrumors member
Sep 2, 2014
76
5
So, one week old machine here, and three lock ups today.

So disappointing.

I don't understand how cabling could (or should!) have any influence on a computer locking up, but I have been switching monitors around so I might experiment on that front whilst deciding what to do next, but it's not looking good.
 

FilthyMcNasty

macrumors member
Sep 2, 2014
76
5
I was in the same situation @FilthyMcNasty, I took it in and had both cards replaced. Some have also said upgrading to the latest version of High Sierra has helped as above. Worth a try.

Latest patches were applied.

I dunno what to do tbh. I think I need to see what cover I have first, but you can buy a not horrible used car for the sort of money I spent here I sort of expect a computer that works - or if it doesn't, not to have to have a battle on, to have it put right. From what I've read it seems the onus is on the buyer to do a lot of running around, and their word isn't accepted at face value even with documented evidence of lockups (why would a computer user try to have a computer fixed like for like parts if they weren't having issues!?!).

Will see what Apple have to say, but given the technology is quite old, I don't know if I want to invest tons of time dealing with a problem that is barely acknowledge, with no guarantee of a fix, on a product that I've just purchased and is literally brand new ..

I'm in a tight spot tbh as I'm coming from a 2008 3,1 that is rock solid day in day out. I do want to stick with Apple and macOS, but what product is there for someone who wants a headless unit (in my research, seems some iMacs seem to have inherent faults anyway!)...

Do I buy into even older cMP machines for a hefty sum, when I could get a brand spanking new Windows machine which is technically far superior to anything I can get from Apple for a lot less money. I loathe Windows now, but my options seem limited...

Tough decision.
 

SamPotts

macrumors 6502
Sep 25, 2010
278
59
Sydney, Australia
I'm sure if it's less than 30 days (technically 14 but most do 30), you can ask for a replacement machine. If it's used that you've bought then you *might* still have AppleCare. If you do, I'd extend it to 3 years.

If it helps, when I took mine in, I didn't even need to demo it or show them videos and it was pretty quick and painless. They seemed to just believe me. The same happened when I took my iMac 5K in with image retention issues - had to take that in twice too! If they have the D300's in stock and aren't busy it should only be a few days max.
 

Xde

macrumors regular
Jul 11, 2016
150
35
This weekend I bought a late 2013 nMP (actual build date mid 2015) quad core base model

One week old, but buildt in 2015 ? So long time?
Apple had admitted problems in 2015, but I think, the D300 models are not included-
If your problems continue, worth to talk with Apple about that and the (inofficial) repair program.
https://9to5mac.com/2016/02/06/apple-mac-pro-repair-program-graphics-video/
(In case you did'nt know about.)
Good luck!

btw. if not already done,
try to check your production date here http://www.chipmunk.nl/klantenservice/applemodel.html
 

Kris Kelvin

macrumors regular
Dec 28, 2005
246
179
Turns out there ARE log messages when the D300 crashes. They are just very well hidden.
In my case, the following three error messages ALWAYS coincide with a freeze:

kernel: (IOAcceleratorFamily2) bool IOAccelDisplayMachine2::display_mode_did_change(uint32_t): vendor driver returns false

kernel: (IOAcceleratorFamily2) AMDRadeonAccelerator [2]: transaction ID (28871) generated error (0xe00002d7).

kernel: (IOAcceleratorFamily2) mach_vm_address_t IOAccelResource2::lockForCPUAccess(task_t, enum eLockType, IOOptionBits, bool, uint8_t, uint8_t, int32_t *): after pageoff, sys memory data still invalid or non-linear

kernel: (IOAcceleratorFamily2) mach_vm_address_t IOAccelResource2::lockForCPUAccess(task_t, enum eLockType, IOOptionBits, bool, uint8_t, uint8_t, int32_t *): after pageoff, sys memory data still invalid or non-linear

kernel: (AMDSupport) --> GPU register 7598 read failed. Returning cached or generated value 4000311 instead!

To list such errors from the last 30 days, execute the following command in the Terminal (and have some patience):
Code:
log show --last 30d --predicate 'messageType == fault && sender == "IOAcceleratorFamily2" && NOT eventMessage CONTAINS "unlock"'

This doesn't explain why the freezes are happening, but it might be helpful in proving to Apple that there's something wrong.

Edit: Optimized log query and added additional error
 
Last edited:

MackyMcMac17

macrumors newbie
Jan 24, 2018
22
3
Turns out there ARE log messages when the D300 crashes. They are just very well hidden.
In my case, the following two error messages ALWAYS coincide with a freeze:





To list all such errors from the last 30 days, execute the following command in the Terminal (and have some patience):
Code:
log show --last 30d --predicate 'messageType == 17 && process == "kernel" && NOT eventMessage CONTAINS "lock"'

This doesn't explain why the freezes are happening, but it might be helpful in proving to Apple that there's something wrong.


Thanks for that. You applied the latest OS updates and still get freezes? I also have the d300 and so far the update is looking good-- 8 days so far.

I'm starting to lose hope with the update...
 

SamPotts

macrumors 6502
Sep 25, 2010
278
59
Sydney, Australia
Guess what date my cards were replaced :)

upload_2018-2-1_9-27-13.png
 

FilthyMcNasty

macrumors member
Sep 2, 2014
76
5
Thanks for the encouragement chaps, and I've decided to keep the machine *IF* I get assurances from Apple/retailer that they will resolve the issue to my satisfaction - that is to get the working machine that I paid for, or give me my money back or replace the machine.

After uploading my purchase receipt Apple confirmed 12m limited warranty, 3 year Apple Care would seem like an insurance policy I should consider. Hefty price, but given the nightmare scenario of trying to fix out of the warranty?

I do have this hunch though, that perhaps ALL nMP are affected, or borderline affected, with the problem surfacing only when a slew of variables cosmically coincide. Based on what? Not a lot - just the prolific nature of the problem (I've read about it on other forums too eg http://duc.avid.com/showthread.php?t=390208), and.. gut feeling - it just smacks of a design flaw / general production fault o_O It obviously affects users with all three graphics card options, outside the soft-recall production date window, and regardless of OS version (albeit with varying frequency). I would love to be proven wrong!

What I can say :

1/ My production date is outside the window of concern - BY A WEEK
2/ It cannot be an overheating issue, my first encounter was during first power up and setup!
3/ Kris Kelvin - great find! My lockups DO coincide with the following :

kernel: (IOAcceleratorFamily2) bool IOAccelDisplayMachine2::display_mode_did_change(uint32_t): vendor driver returns false

I believe the time I see on these logs is associated with when I return to the computer, not when the freeze occurs. Eg computer froze 19:02 (as shown by screensaver).. I return to computer at 19:07.. log shows latter time.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Kris Kelvin

eepyikes

macrumors member
Jun 25, 2011
31
6
Has anyone with this issue also had problems with slow shutdown? Mine can take quite a while to shutdown, sometimes dimming everything but still showing the desktop wallpaper and the hashmark pinwheel thing (not the rainbow one, whatever they're both called) for like a minute.
 

tomvos

macrumors 6502
Jul 7, 2005
345
119
In the Nexus.
My Mac Pro does not freeze (it's only about three months old). However I did check the logs for the message:

kernel: (IOAcceleratorFamily2) AMDRadeonAccelerator [2]: transaction ID (28871) generated error (0xe00002d7).

I did not see this message but instead I see

kernel: (IOAcceleratorFamily2) AMDRadeonAccelerator [4]: transaction ID (789802) generated error (0xe00002d5).

While trying to find out what the meaning of the error codes is I found this website. According to this site the meaning of the error codes is:

0xe00002d5 -> kIOReturnBusy / Device Busy
0xe00002d7 -> kIOReturnOffline / Device Offline


So it seems like the GPU or some subsystem of the GPU which should handle the display did not wake up.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Kris Kelvin

Kris Kelvin

macrumors regular
Dec 28, 2005
246
179
@tomvos Nice work. What GPU do you have? I didn't find a single kIOReturnBusy in the log of the last 30 days.

Based on the error code kIOReturnOffline, it looks like my Mac Pro simply lost the connection to the GPU. As @FilthyMcNasty said, the errors might just be a symptom of a crashed GPU and not an indication as to why it crashed.
 
  • Like
Reactions: tomvos

loby

macrumors 68000
Jul 1, 2010
1,882
1,514
Has anyone with this issue also had problems with slow shutdown? Mine can take quite a while to shutdown, sometimes dimming everything but still showing the desktop wallpaper and the hashmark pinwheel thing (not the rainbow one, whatever they're both called) for like a minute.

Have you tried a simple approach by just reinstalling the OS or starting with a fresh install?
 

uller6

macrumors 65816
May 14, 2010
1,072
1,777
Has anyone with this issue also had problems with slow shutdown? Mine can take quite a while to shutdown, sometimes dimming everything but still showing the desktop wallpaper and the hashmark pinwheel thing (not the rainbow one, whatever they're both called) for like a minute.

Mine also appears to get stuck during both shutdowns or restarts. It will hang at the black screen with spinning wheel, and I'll need to force power down the machine.

Edit: Running 10.13.3 on a quad core D300 machine.
 
Last edited:

filmak

macrumors 65816
Jun 21, 2012
1,418
777
between earth and heaven
Mine also appears to get stuck during both shutdowns or restarts. It will hang at the black screen with spinning wheel, and I'll need to force power down the machine.
And your macOS version is...?
[doublepost=1517666035][/doublepost]
Has anyone with this issue also had problems with slow shutdown? Mine can take quite a while to shutdown, sometimes dimming everything but still showing the desktop wallpaper and the hashmark pinwheel thing (not the rainbow one, whatever they're both called) for like a minute.

And your macOS version is...?
 

uller6

macrumors 65816
May 14, 2010
1,072
1,777
I'm on 10.13.3, but the slow shutdown issue has been happening since 10.13.2. At least I haven't had a single freeze while working (yet) since updating to 10.13.3!
 

filmak

macrumors 65816
Jun 21, 2012
1,418
777
between earth and heaven
I'm on 10.13.3, but the slow shutdown issue has been happening since 10.13.2. At least I haven't had a single freeze while working (yet) since updating to 10.13.3!
Thanks for the info.
10.13 is not polished yet, too many issues... So it may be a software incompatibility or another High Sierra bug...
It's very difficult as there is not a steady OS to spot at once possible hardware problems.:)
Could you please check your SSD for any errors and select the startup disk again in system prefs?
 

eepyikes

macrumors member
Jun 25, 2011
31
6
Thanks for the info.
10.13 is not polished yet, too many issues... So it may be a software incompatibility or another High Sierra bug...
It's very difficult as there is not a steady OS to spot at once possible hardware problems.:)
Could you please check your SSD for any errors and select the startup disk again in system prefs?

10.11.6 but it doesn't matter, I've had latest High Sierra installed as well, same results.
 

Naimfan

Suspended
Jan 15, 2003
4,669
2,017
Are any of the GPUs more or less susceptible? It seems that the D700s are most likely to fail (which makes sense, since they run the hottest), but it *seems* as if the D300 is the next most frequent. Are D500s more reliable?
 
Register on MacRumors! This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.