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macOS 10.15 Catalina on Unsupported Macs
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I am still dealing with what seems to be issues with duplicate UUIDs on disks from dd clones on the same system.
'til I get that resolved, I am just gonna make a few dd images that have different UUIDs from fresh installs. Kinda of a pain bit it will work
'til I get that resolved, I am just gonna make a few dd images that have different UUIDs from fresh installs. Kinda of a pain bit it will work
On Mac Pro 5,1, some App Store apps do not validate, others do. Moving the disk to another system they do fine, but moving the disk back to the 5,1, the problem persists. Examples: Fantastical 2 and Tweetbot 3.
Here is a good article on cloning APFS volumes using rsync.
https://www.belightsoft.com/products/resources/apfs-bootable-clone-with-command-line
You can mount the Data and OS volumes separately on Catalina of a non running OS system using the diskutil in the command line.
diskutil list
-> Get drive numbers
diskutil mount /dev/disk#s1
-> Mount Data
diskutil mount /dev/disk#s4
-> Mount OS
open /Volumes
-> see mounts
[doublepost=1560102565][/doublepost]
Could the apps require a min device? I haven't done much with AppStore apps, but that could be a huge gotcha. All the more reason for authors to release both on the AppStore and publicly. Least on the Mac we still have that option as developers (not that every developer will separate channels for releases).
I have faked my 3,1 to be a Mac mini but it's not the best idea as it could blow your NVRAM.
[doublepost=1560102934][/doublepost]Getting back to AirPlay on unsupported Macs.
I was able to stream to my AppleTV over Airplay to send movies to my AppleTV from Mojave. I did this when FOX shows were available on my desktop but not my my AppleTV over DirecTVNow which they recently fixed.
That is just Video to my AppleTV through my own app.
Not mirroring, but if that is possible then mirroring (maybe even piping it as video) or side car to iPadOS could be possible. Figuring that part out is beyond me at this point. The movies streamed from the MP3,1 to the AppleTV were flawless and the benefit was most streams did not have the commercials in them. A good example was FOX and CW. All I am saying if video streaming is possible via AirPlay, them mirroring should be possible.
Oh, another way would be to use VNC from the AppleTV to a Mac via a custom app. I think something like that might work if VNC protocol is on the AppleTV. Might be able to do the same on an iPad. Well I know that is cuz I used to have a VNC app for the iPhone (not mine though). lol. But VNC will not have video acceleration.
https://www.belightsoft.com/products/resources/apfs-bootable-clone-with-command-line
You can mount the Data and OS volumes separately on Catalina of a non running OS system using the diskutil in the command line.
diskutil list
-> Get drive numbers
diskutil mount /dev/disk#s1
-> Mount Data
diskutil mount /dev/disk#s4
-> Mount OS
open /Volumes
-> see mounts
[doublepost=1560102565][/doublepost]
Could the apps require a min device? I haven't done much with AppStore apps, but that could be a huge gotcha. All the more reason for authors to release both on the AppStore and publicly. Least on the Mac we still have that option as developers (not that every developer will separate channels for releases).
I have faked my 3,1 to be a Mac mini but it's not the best idea as it could blow your NVRAM.
[doublepost=1560102934][/doublepost]Getting back to AirPlay on unsupported Macs.
I was able to stream to my AppleTV over Airplay to send movies to my AppleTV from Mojave. I did this when FOX shows were available on my desktop but not my my AppleTV over DirecTVNow which they recently fixed.
That is just Video to my AppleTV through my own app.
Not mirroring, but if that is possible then mirroring (maybe even piping it as video) or side car to iPadOS could be possible. Figuring that part out is beyond me at this point. The movies streamed from the MP3,1 to the AppleTV were flawless and the benefit was most streams did not have the commercials in them. A good example was FOX and CW. All I am saying if video streaming is possible via AirPlay, them mirroring should be possible.
Oh, another way would be to use VNC from the AppleTV to a Mac via a custom app. I think something like that might work if VNC protocol is on the AppleTV. Might be able to do the same on an iPad. Well I know that is cuz I used to have a VNC app for the iPhone (not mine though). lol. But VNC will not have video acceleration.
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might be some insight on Mac apps here https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/project-catalyst-death-of-macos-apps.2184066/#post-27430110
I was able not to do a replacement on 3,1. Try rebooting. And don't use safe boot.
The first time I got it booted I had no mouse and keyboard. different ports or rebooting. Also try waiting. different ports. if they are bluetooth. turn off and on. if they have USB cords an bluetooth toggle them.
I have issues on a fresh system without networking. kextd stall lag. I have not installed a stall patch yet as once I have it up and running with networking via Ethernet, the stalls go away. Not to say they are still there, but the prelinkedkernel is probably rebuild by then.
I used that Mojave link for my attempts with Catalina. It doesn’t account for the new volumes very well. Never got it to work, that’s why I ended up just dd’ing. But useful to understand how to set up UUIDs correctly.
I ended up with an ext and int Cat with the same UUIDs. No problems.
Just some more data points to throw out here : I cloned the Catalina Partition (not the Data partition) using SuperDuper to an archive file, then restored it to an HFS volume. The resulting HFS USB stick boots to Single User mode with no issues. I'm attaching screenshots showing the booted machine and Disk Utility information. This is on a 2013 MacBook Air, which is a supported machine. I also cloned the BaseSystem.dmg file in the Packaged Catalina installer to an HFS partition on the same drive, and it boots perfectly to the Catalina recovery drive with options. I was able to disable and enable SIP through the terminal and use disk utility with no obvious issues. The most interesting line in the output seems to be the "Failed to mount vm volume (2) error.
Yes, I tried that too, but after typing exit it will stuck or kernel panic, while the Basesystem.dmg will work exactly as a Recovery.
I also tried to fill the vm and Users and Library folders the ones in /Device/ putting its content in the Catalina HFS+ root, also moving the /system/applications/ but apart a working single user nothing else, most probably because it needs some POSIX symlinks to redirect all those new Catalina APFS data system folders inside a structure that HFS+ can interpret. This is possible unless apple have updated also some APFS.kext and APFS.framework, and introduced some new security framework.
I also tried to fill the vm and Users and Library folders the ones in /Device/ putting its content in the Catalina HFS+ root, also moving the /system/applications/ but apart a working single user nothing else, most probably because it needs some POSIX symlinks to redirect all those new Catalina APFS data system folders inside a structure that HFS+ can interpret. This is possible unless apple have updated also some APFS.kext and APFS.framework, and introduced some new security framework.
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Question... I boot my 5,1 to recovery, bring up Terminal, type in the line above and get an error that the command "sudo" is not valid (or something similar). It appears that I am doing something wrong, but I don't know what. Terminal is basically saying that it doesn't understand sudo. Help would be appreciated. Thanks!
No need to use "sudo" from a Recovery Environment or single user mode, cause are already logged as root.
I'm satisfied with bit/block dd transfers for now. Not too fond of mucking around with APFS volumes and am satisfied that details will evolve soon to make this easier. I'm about to test the remote shell block transfers to set up a Catalina partition on my pro 3,1. Or I'll just copy the compressed image over...I am using 32 GB as well.I don't have WiFi, Sound yet. boot can be slow if networking is not working. I need to catch on this thread for possible fixed for my MP3,1. Using Ethernet to a Mac mini over WiFI and USB Sound works, so I am not terribly worried about it.
For rsync or ditto, I was thinking about just cloning the Data volume to another Data volume of two working OS systems. basically migrate your data volume easier on fresh installs. (same users, etc).
I am working on a clone with the UUIDs edited to see if I can have a clone and original exist on the same system. Not sure if there is a checksum in the UUIDs, just changing one character. If that doesn't work, I will just format new disk as APFS and get its UUIDs and then clone to it using those UUIDs.
[doublepost=1560100522][/doublepost]@pkouame Oh for rsync and ditto, you will need to give terminal Full Disk Access to the terminal. It will ask you to relaunch Terminal, but a reboot may be required.
just did another restore:
30769414144 bytes transferred in 137.502351 secs (223773731 bytes/sec = 223.77 MB/sec! )
That is fast but it is going from a PCIe SSD to my SSD Hardware RAID in one slot. It does not run as full speed as a newer system would, but it's fast enough on this old rig.
Since Mojave it is hard finding good prices on Mac Pro 5,1s. I got this 3,1 for 90 bucks from work. I have another 3,1 that we use as a gaming PC and to flash 680 cards when needed. I only flash stuff for myself now. And latched onto this Galaxy 680 card which for a 2GB card, I swear its faster than any EVGA 680 I've run.
That's a pretty good transfer rate. I can't reach that on my mbp 5,3 with Samsung SSD EVO. More power to you guys...
I didn't realize 3,1s were so cheap these days and yes 5,1s are still in demand! Wish I had one it's still a decent machine. I have a Mac edition EVA 680. How much faster is the Galaxy?
Right if you don't plan on using leaving the source than you're ok. Or if you use an separate Emergency OS install or and you said Mojave, then you can pretty much just re image same drive over and over (make updates, do backups to a disk image, etc).
I'm just working around the problem and trying to leave Mojave behind for awhile. I will probably end up with an install of Catalina on one disk. Mojave on another and Catalina Emergency drive on a small partition.
I got a fresh install down to 24GB And that should compress 20% down from there. Used a solid state hard drive on a supported Mac and it did not "waste" as much space.
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I am just considering new users who may clone a disk image all over the place. The drives are ok, it just will put them all in the same virtual volume creating bless and startup issues.
CCC is on the case too.Still tossing around the idea to have something to support unsupported Macs. Just thinking about a time frame for it. Have so many of my own projects that are in mid flight, but dead simple backup and restore tool could be nice and the content could be managed dynamically. In the meantime 'dd' is pretty awesome along with diskutil commands.
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Right. I forgot that one is already root in the recovery terminal, and that there is no sudo bin anyway in recovery.
Thanks! Now running Catalina on my MacPro5,1 like a champ.
Is anyone developing a patch to get it working on non metal Mac’s even without @dosdude1 pdoesmt feel comfortable with it.
The VM volume is probably missing. It is on the APFS file system.
[doublepost=1560116449][/doublepost]
Well compared to a EVGA 680 flashed and a Galaxy 680 flashed, the Galaxy is about twice as fast. My Galaxy is also brand new. It's hard to find an EVGA 680 that new these days. And that could be also a difference in performance. A worn out GPU compared to a fresh one. Also the EVGA has one Tiny cooling fan the Galaxy is very open and does not generate a lot of heat.
The 2GB Galaxy is the most impressive 680 GPU I've come across. And I've seen a bunch when I was wheeling and dealing for Xmas money.
My Kepler Titan is still 3x faster than the EVGA 680 even when it's not flashed. Right now the Titan is on another 3,1 running windows 10 at 110FPS on high setting in FortNite which is pretty good considering its a 4 core XEON that's 12 years old.
I don't have a Mac Edition 680, but hardware wise I don't think there is a difference between a PC 680 and a Mac Edition 680. You might have a nicer decal. The think the Galaxy 680 stays cooler with its DirectCU and dual fans. It's only 2x height which is better than those beefy ASUS DCU's @ 3x height.
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i think a lot of people are trying to figure it out(my friend and i included)
it’s just tricky cause as someone said Apple changed a lot of frameworks
I’ve been noticing boot slow downs after a few boots. Probably missing patches and it is early.
I will still be doing UIKit, SpriteKit and ARKIt the old way. My main interest was making sure Catalina would run so I can start learning SwiftUI. i’m A full time web app developer at a startup but long term I want to do Swift full time. Server side, Client side, UIKit, SwiftUI, doesn’t matter. I am spending the next year going my skills. There are about available Swift jobs where I live. The only thing you really need to pass is a test but the employers are so picky it’s make or break on just one simple test that is far from a real world problem to solve. So I am going to get my five project in the App Store. do a good job on the coding and make the source available. Kind of turning the tables.
I would to see any apps you put in the App Store
I’ve been noticing boot slow downs after a few boots. Probably missing patches and it is early.
I will still be doing UIKit, SpriteKit and ARKIt the old way. My main interest was making sure Catalina would run so I can start learning SwiftUI. i’m A full time web app developer at a startup but long term I want to do Swift full time. Server side, Client side, UIKit, SwiftUI, doesn’t matter. I am spending the next year going my skills. There are about available Swift jobs where I live. The only thing you really need to pass is a test but the employers are so picky it’s make or break on just one simple test that is far from a real world problem to solve. So I am going to get my five project in the App Store. do a good job on the coding and make the source available. Kind of turning the tables.
Very cool and good strategy.
I’ve been noticing boot slow downs after a few boots. Probably missing patches and it is early.
I will still be doing UIKit, SpriteKit and ARKIt the old way. My main interest was making sure Catalina would run so I can start learning SwiftUI. i’m A full time web app developer at a startup but long term I want to do Swift full time. Server side, Client side, UIKit, SwiftUI, doesn’t matter. I am spending the next year going my skills. There are about available Swift jobs where I live. The only thing you really need to pass is a test but the employers are so picky it’s make or break on just one simple test that is far from a real world problem to solve. So I am going to get my five project in the App Store. do a good job on the coding and make the source available. Kind of turning the tables.
A part of my day job is managing full stack web development. So we're Typescript/Angular on the client stack and dotnet C# on the server on Azure cloud. Experimenting with a nice MEAN stack on the back end as well. The fact that Visual Studio Code rocks on the Mac allows us to do cross-development fairly easily (hate windoze based development). I would also add WebAssembly to your learning curve - it's the future - and many high level languages like Swift are supporting WebAssembly as a target. This basically means you'll be able to do full stack UI development in Swift instead of any of the Javascript based frameworks currently out there (Angular, React, Vue etc...) Look it up. Sounds like you should migrate to the West Coast pretty soon...
Good luck.
Zero Mac App Store app problems, TweetBoot 3 works perfectly.
I installed from scratch with VMware Fusion to a raw disk and shutdown at InstallAssistant, running it from my real MP5,1.
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ight bud, thanks for the tedTalk.
[doublepost=1560132377][/doublepost]did @dosdude1 abandon the project :/
I would to see any apps you put in the App Store
Thx. I'd mention one in public beta, but don't want to promote on this thread. I'll just say and an X to my handle. Google. Has to do with SXM. Sort of a revival.
Good question. I am pretty sure he will make a patch tool for Catalina. I think the hold up is mainly no acceleration on non-metal GPUs. And we are only on Dev. beta 1. Pretty early.
I was not that involved the last go around. dosdude1 could be worn out as well. This stuff is pretty demanding for with people just doing this in their free time.
I did notice that Power Management is not working on MP3,1. No charging via USB. I am gonna try some manually patches from Mojave. And No still WiFi or Sound. haven't done any patches. I've been busy just coming up with good clone techniques. And deciding how committed I am to be using Catalina when I have production work to get back to. A lot of devs will be great new stuff! and then great old stuff that has to be at least maintained. If you keep the logic away from the UI though. SwiftUI should not be a big deal. However, I have some Apps were the UI is extensive even on a simple 4 page app and unless going to SwiftUI makes a lot of sense for awhile I will probably support iOS12 for at least a 6 months to a year. And then SwiftUI 2.0 will be out.
I am glad my MP3,1 should make it another year. It is too bad more machines will be cutoff.
My iPad mini 2 which just got iOS12 added to it Nov. 2018. It was in iOS land for a couple years. Apple finally beefed it up but just yanked it again with iPadOS. I think mainly because it did have not a pencil. Only reason I can think. I may get an iPad mini 4 just to stay current. Not sure yet.
I do hope Apple takes SwiftUI to the NeXT level: Android and Windows 10. It would take a lot but they could dominate the landscape. I mean if I have an App that runs on desktop, mobile, watch and TV, wouldn't you want it to run on the same size screens on other platforms? SwiftUI is a good first step but it could be just a glimpse of what Apple is up to.
I think we could do something really cool for dosdude1. Even if he says or goes, I think we should pool our money together and get dosdude1 an amazing gift. I can think of only 1 thing that would be fitting and I think there are enough people here to do it. With over 2.8 million readers on the Mojave thread. I don't think it would take much to get dosdude1 the ultimate Mac gift. Just throwing it out there because he has done so much for the unsupported Mac community. This is not to take away from anyone else, just a good nod to someone who is kind of a big deal.
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