That would be my question too, which is why I responded to the other post as I did. I don't think it would necessarily be the best solution either. I'm sure Apple has considered it, however.
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Masimo CEO: Apple Watch Blood Oxygen Sensor is Not Reliable, Customers Are 'Better Off Without It'
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That would be my question too, which is why I responded to the other post as I did. I don't think it would necessarily be the best solution either. I'm sure Apple has considered it, however.
Perhaps it was arrogance… i dunno. But ya gotta think somebody at Apple dropped the ball here.
Yeah like I said mine was anectdotal as sometimes it was giving me some pretty whacky readings. I never looked at it or cared until I had covid 3 different times. In fact I'd love to shut it off and only use it manually so I can squeeze some battery life out of my AW6.
So he's saying that all the other monitors out there, like the ones the medical assistant or nurse puts on your finger for a minute to check your SP02, are no good? Okay, thanks.
And, a $499 watch that only does sPo2, pulse, hydration index, perfusion rate, and has some other health/fitness features? I can see why he's alarmed - why are folks going to want to spend $499 for something with a limited feature set, when they buy something less expensive that has many more features and capabilities? Once there's something that matches Masimo's features, their watch sales will fall off a cliff.
According to their Web site, there's another watch coming (the "Masimo Freedom"), and if you spend $499 to buy their W1 Sport watch, they'll give you $500 off the purchase of the Freedom, when it launches. The Freedom must be expensive, like Apple Watch Ultra 2 expensive.
And, a $499 watch that only does sPo2, pulse, hydration index, perfusion rate, and has some other health/fitness features? I can see why he's alarmed - why are folks going to want to spend $499 for something with a limited feature set, when they buy something less expensive that has many more features and capabilities? Once there's something that matches Masimo's features, their watch sales will fall off a cliff.
According to their Web site, there's another watch coming (the "Masimo Freedom"), and if you spend $499 to buy their W1 Sport watch, they'll give you $500 off the purchase of the Freedom, when it launches. The Freedom must be expensive, like Apple Watch Ultra 2 expensive.
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For those that are unaware. Masimo has been around a long time and were basically first to the pulse oximetry game within healthcare. I was using Masimo branded pulse ox as an RN in the ED more than 15 years ago. Way before Apple made the Apple Watch.
Apple should go into court and use Kiani's own statements against him. He claims Apple stole Masimo's tech, and then puts down the Apple Watch. He's talking out of both sides of his mouth.
Their fingertip pulse oximeter (MightySat) is $299! I wonder how many takers they get for that? All the doctor's offices I've been in use the $20-$50 ones from Amazon. Their business model is unsustainable.
Their fingertip pulse oximeter (MightySat) is $299! I wonder how many takers they get for that? All the doctor's offices I've been in use the $20-$50 ones from Amazon. Their business model is unsustainable.
Exactly. I don’t use it often, but that being said…it’s not up to someone else to say if I’m better off with or without something. The CEO is crossing into ”cringe” territory. You can get a point across without being a petty ******bag 😂
He's not really talking out of both sides of his mouth. He’s saying Apple stole their good tech but is applying it wrong/poorly. It's still (potentially) theft regardless of how poorly they may feel Apple is currently using it.
I have one of Masimo oxygen sensors for about three years. My experience, not very accurate, terrible App, inconsistent interface with Apple Health App and inconvenient to use. Apple Watch oxygen sensor transparent, there all the time (no trying to find it), gives hundreds more readings for setting a baseline then Masimo’s product. Apple Watch accuracy, at Dr office BP, Oxygen, Heart-rate recorded. Dr. Left office for a moment. Checked the Heart-rate and Oxygen on the watch. Spot on. The real win for Apple hundreds of readings establishing a baseline over extended time. Now where did I put that Masimo oxygen reader.
All you folk have to realize is that Masimo has FDA approval for one of its products - that is huge! To get that it has to accurately read O2 in a random population. That means accurate readings among those with darker skin that creates issues with readings if I remember that stuff from a few years ago. That is why the fingertip sensor is best because all races have a clear cuticle/nail area and the fingertip underneath is not pigmented. Masimo must have perfected this for the wrist.
That is why individual testimony is either good or bad on the Apple watch, so you can’t rely on it. However the people talking about their experience are probably being truthful. Masimo actually could correct that problem now and so his statement could be considered a correct one.
If my medical inferences are incorrect then please correct me with evidence.
That is why individual testimony is either good or bad on the Apple watch, so you can’t rely on it. However the people talking about their experience are probably being truthful. Masimo actually could correct that problem now and so his statement could be considered a correct one.
If my medical inferences are incorrect then please correct me with evidence.
Well a Trillion dollar company like Apple just doesn’t forget that the patents for the O2 sensor belonged to Masimo. So yeah, it was either arrogance or stupidity. I say arrogance because they’ve won so many legal battles before. Perhaps they just thought they could get away with it.
No, apple may believe the patent will ultimately be voided.
So if apple believes the patent was not valid to begin with, they are not acting with arrogance or stupidity. (I do not know what apple thinks, but they pay $1b in attorney fees to not drop the ball. It’s a small possibility know the ball was dropped but I think more of a calculated risk)
And not to forget that some of the patents have already been invalidated…
Masimo made 479 million in the last quarter of 2023. They are doing just fine and you could've found out that yourself with a two minute search. I do understand however, that would undermine your belief with facts.
It’s also a fact that all but one of Masimo’s patents were deemed invalid in court. So it seems their case wasn’t as watertight as people here are making it out to be.
Nevertheless, a win is a win for Masimo, and victory is written by the victors.
Yeah I think this is a better measure than earnings because we don't know a) how they did the accounting (for one quarter no less) and b) whether they really are "doing fine" based on one quarter of earnings. Also, earnings per share is well below the industry for 2019-2022.
Maybe Masimo is "doing fine" or maybe not but the Apple import ban probably won't make a material difference on their bottom line. They still need to win some damages in court (or get a settlement) and that hasn't happened yet, if it ever will.
Edit to add from Masimo's SEC filing on Jan. 10, 2024, the Apple litigation is dragging them down:
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The decline was due to them spending 1 billion buying Sound United.
They took on a lot of debt with that purchase and shareholders didn't like it.
Their core business is still very profitable.
What was the rationalization for buying Sound United?
Also how does a person stay as the CEO after basically dropping the value of the company stock by near 60%?
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Indeed. Just like customers of the iPhone were holding it wrong
But kidding aside: copying and implementing a patent are two different things…Masimo is not a patent troll (they already exist for 35 years and have experience in the medical industry). They got theirs FDA approved, Apple did not.
Apple tried to copy their patent (the court confirmed this). Then (apparently) implemented poorly (see anecdotal evidence of very low readings in oxygen levels by the AW). Turn it around and you could say that Apple tried to use Masimos hard work on this and outsell their watches by a poor copy of that feature.
Except I recently had an approved medical finger monitor for most of a day and it was pretty much spot on with my ultra.
Anything in this world has up sides and downsides..
Unless you can come up with a better way, best of the worst will have to do...
People smarter than me have suggested better ways, improvements to the existing system.
Nothing changes because the lawyers and legislators of the large corporation patent and copyright owners keep it this way.
The downside is it is stifling innovation. It won’t be the best of the worst forever if people keep actively trying to make and keep it bad.