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Navigon 1.5

jamespa66 said:
I have a 3GS and have never experienced any of what you are mentioning. Wonder if it has to do with hardware differences in the 3G vs the 3GS.
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That is exactly the point I was making. Works great on a 3GS, but very sporadically, in regards to performance, on a 3G. They really need to note this in the app store. They also really need to respond to concerns regarding this. From a customer service perspective, they are horrible, IMO.

Oh sure, they are great if you are happy. But, as I said in a previous post, I have yet to have them even acknowledge an e-mail, or facebook posts, regarding 3G performance. They obviously know the product does not work as it should on a 3G, and are simply ignoring that fact.
 
I'm assuming that whenever there are updates to the map/POI database, they will be delivered as part of a software update like this, right? I haven't noticed if previous updates included map updates.

Not insinuating that a database update is part of 1.5, but it would be a logical time for one.
 
Please improve performance on the 3G. Because the way it is right now, is close to unusable! And you're taking a lot of money for this...

I really want to like the Navigon App - so I'm not hoping they make it "3GS-Only". But the App really needs some improvement.
 
Navigon Twitter announcement ...

NAVIGON_US NAVIGON Macworld Promo: MobileNavigator iPhone NA $69.99 (norm $89.99),Traffic Live for $19.99 (norm $24.99) ends 2/15 http://bit.ly/1EUjxJ
 
wilco440 said:
Speaking of "assisted" GPS, is there any way that the triangulation part can be turned of. Here in Australia we can buy unlocked iPhones (on 3G), and so I run mine without a plan, and just top up the prepaid whenever its necessary.

Since I've been playing with Navigon I've noticed that it bites into my prepaid, rapidly. Nothing else would be doing this as I hardly ever use the phone for calls, SMS etc, but as soon as I use GPS (at least with Navigon, with and without being in a TomTom car mount) my prepaid takes a sudden nosedive.....

Anyone else seen GPS doing the same thing?
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This is exactly what I was bitching about when they introduced the triangulation feature in 1.4 without any way to turn it off. I knew it would suck for non-data plan users. :(
 
globalist said:
This is exactly what I was bitching about when they introduced the triangulation feature in 1.4 without any way to turn it off. I knew it would suck for non-data plan users. :(
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Getting an iPhone w/out a data plan is like buying marijuana that doesnt get you high
 
What he said. But the only thing I can recomend to you guys is to rove your sim card when using navigon. Maybe that would work. But no traffic of course.
 
globalist said:
This is exactly what I was bitching about when they introduced the triangulation feature in 1.4 without any way to turn it off. I knew it would suck for non-data plan users. :(
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I looked on the Navigon site and also on iTunes but can't find any confirmation that Navigon introduced triangulation in 1.4. Can you point me to somewhere that confirms this and also this it actually uses data?

Thanks
 
sjdigital said:
I looked on the Navigon site and also on iTunes but can't find any confirmation that Navigon introduced triangulation in 1.4. Can you point me to somewhere that confirms this and also this it actually uses data?
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It is not up to the apps whether "triangulation" (or more accurately positioning using nearby cell towers or WLAN access points) is used. The apps simply call the relevant API of the iPhone OS (Core location framework) to request location information. The OS then tries to determine the location as accurately as possible using whatever means are currently available (depending on whether GPS reception is possible, any known WLAN APs/cell towers are visible and WLAN is turned on). For determining the location without GPS, a data connection is required since it then has to query a (large and constantly updated) online database of known APs and cell towers.

So no, "triangulation" was not introduced in Navigon 1.4. It was always used, and always used data for the lookup. But possibly older versions ignored non-GPS-based location information that it didn't consider accurate enough.
 
hyptest said:
Do you have traffic turned on?
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No.

The simplest solution looks like putting the phone into Airplane Mode before running GPS. As far as I can tell, that'll stop any phone usage on my SIM card, and Navigon still seems to work OK (at least in the car dock) except.... no phone calls (like...duh). More testing required....
 
As an experiment to determine whether Navigon does use the GSM network I reset my data usage and then immediately started Navigon. It was a cold start as I had previously closed the App yesterday some 40 miles (65 kilometres) away. I didn't time how long it took to get a fix but once it did I shut it down and checked my data usage. It showed 11KB sent and 30KB received. I reset the data usage again, restarted Navigon and waited until it had got a fix once more (only a few seconds) and then checked the data usage once more. This time it showed zero. So this would seem to suggest that Navigon does indeed utilise Assisted GPS to speed up the cold start.

As to whether it uses cell tower triangulation, and if so, at what data cost, remains to be seen. Next time I'm out and about with it, I'll use the same routine and see if it shows any data usage.
 
sjdigital said:
As to whether it uses cell tower triangulation, and if so, at what data cost, remains to be seen. Next time I'm out and about with it, I'll use the same routine and see if it shows any data usage.
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It will use cell tower triangulation as long as it doesn't have a GPS lock. It can also use nearby WLAN access points for positioning (that's why you often get a pretty accurate position indoors). Once it knows its rough position, it is also easier to acquire a GPS lock provided there is line of sight to a sufficient number of satellites.

Check this page to learn more about how the non-GPS positioning works (Skyhook is the service used by the iPhone):

http://www.skyhookwireless.com/
 
Rigby said:
It will use cell tower triangulation as long as it doesn't have a GPS lock. It can also use nearby WLAN access points for positioning (that's why you often get a pretty accurate position indoors). Once it knows its rough position, it is also easier to acquire a GPS lock provided there is line of sight to a sufficient number of satellites.

Check this page to learn more about how the non-GPS positioning works (Skyhook is the service used by the iPhone):

http://www.skyhookwireless.com/
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Interesting stuff - thanks for the link. But how do we know that any given navigation app uses the Skyhook service? Navigon have told me that they don't use any data service (although my unscientific test of the Assisted GPS would seem to suggest that they do).
 
sjdigital said:
Interesting stuff - thanks for the link. But how do we know that any given navigation app uses the Skyhook service?
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There is no other way for an approved app to determine the location (through GPS or cell ID) than going through the official Core location framework, since they do not have direct access to the hardware.
Navigon have told me that they don't use any data service (although my unscientific test of the Assisted GPS would seem to suggest that they do).
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They don't use the data service directly, but the Core location framework does when using cell towers or WLAN APs for positioning.
 
MBHockey said:
So 1.5 won't be out until spring?

I read that here: http://eon.businesswire.com/portal/...d=news_view&newsId=20100209005973&newsLang=en

It's $10 for the panorama view
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great update!

re: spring ... that makes sense, although would prefer it out now! ... but when i read the full list of features, i thought to myself 'wow - when did they have time to do the development?' ... this is a major upgrade and will take a bit to do it well.

p.s. no mention of improvements on 3G device!?!? ... maybe it's taking 'til spring to finish some of that development too. here's hoping
 
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