Highly highly doubt it's because of your minute plan lol. Minutes and data = 2 separate things.
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iPhone Need PROOF that PDAnet hides tethering from Att? ***We need a Verizon iPhone owner***
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Highly highly doubt it's because of your minute plan lol. Minutes and data = 2 separate things.
Really?
Theft Shmeft. Internet tethering, whether agreed upon or not is not theft. It may not be honest, but it isn't theft. I'm sick of the peons happy to eat the scraps from the table and lock the doors to their jail cells before they tuck themselves in at night. The cell phone companies do not have the right to dictate whether or not one can tether. They have worked long and hard and spent a lot of money to shape society to allow them to do so, but that doesn't mean they should.
About 10 years ago, Comcast lost a big law suit because they were charging for multiple computers in a home and throttling Internet on p2p connections. In the end the ruling was that intenet is a point of service sale, and does not extend beyond the connection. That means that Internet companies have no right to dictate what happens beyond that connection, whether it be what kind of network one wants to set up. Even if they feel like letting neighbors access their network. Also it means that one can use whatever software they want.
I see no reason why this wouldn't extend to mobile devices. The only thing is that the mobile companies have squashed or settled any similar cases, keeping the matter away from the courts, so that precedent can't be set for mobile Internet. It's only by accepting the belief that they can charge us for whatever they want, and that they can change the rules along the way, that we allow them to do so.
Theft Shmeft. Internet tethering, whether agreed upon or not is not theft. It may not be honest, but it isn't theft. I'm sick of the peons happy to eat the scraps from the table and lock the doors to their jail cells before they tuck themselves in at night. The cell phone companies do not have the right to dictate whether or not one can tether. They have worked long and hard and spent a lot of money to shape society to allow them to do so, but that doesn't mean they should.
About 10 years ago, Comcast lost a big law suit because they were charging for multiple computers in a home and throttling Internet on p2p connections. In the end the ruling was that intenet is a point of service sale, and does not extend beyond the connection. That means that Internet companies have no right to dictate what happens beyond that connection, whether it be what kind of network one wants to set up. Even if they feel like letting neighbors access their network. Also it means that one can use whatever software they want.
I see no reason why this wouldn't extend to mobile devices. The only thing is that the mobile companies have squashed or settled any similar cases, keeping the matter away from the courts, so that precedent can't be set for mobile Internet. It's only by accepting the belief that they can charge us for whatever they want, and that they can change the rules along the way, that we allow them to do so.
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That's what they were initially doing ten years ago, and this ruling prevented this from evolving further with Internet providers. For me this is a clear case of precedence, and I think the only reason cell companies get away with charging beyond the point of connection is that it hasn't appeared at a high enough court level.
It like this, Imagine if you are buying a car. Lets say you are getting a nice new BMW M3, and you work the deal to pay oh 70,000.00 for your new loaded M3. Then the sales person says, Now thats only for you to drive in right? You can not carry anyone else, or let anyone else drive the vehicle. Should you decide you want to carry passengers you will have to pay 100,000. for the same vehicle.
That makes perfect sense right? No Wrong! It only makes sense to the guy selling the car. He has a big ***** eating grin on his face and thinks Suckers.....
Thats why DeLavega is always smilling..... Suckers....
That makes perfect sense right? No Wrong! It only makes sense to the guy selling the car. He has a big ***** eating grin on his face and thinks Suckers.....
Thats why DeLavega is always smilling..... Suckers....
Theft of service no matter how you twist it.
I'll never see how this is a "theft of service", no matter what kind of spin people try to put on it. Let's say that I subscribe to cable, and I have one tv hooked up to it in my living room, then another in my bedroom. Is the bedroom tv considered stealing cable? Of course not. Same channels, same cable company, same data being transmitted. How I choose to use said data is up to me, not any carrier, plain and simple. All this is is another way for cellphone companies to gouge you, and it's not right by any means.
Your analogy is horrendous. The iPhone is the car in this analogy, right? How is the iPhone carrying other people's data? Or... I don't even know what you're trying to say.
If you want to use a car analogy, you could say that data is like gas. And a gas station wants $3 per gallon for gas, but $3.50 per gallon if you use the gas to go to the other side of the country.
Even this analogy is full of holes though because once you get to the end of town, you need more gas, so what? You're going to steal it? No, you pay for more gas (data).
You may never see it, which sounds pretty closed-minded, but it is what it is. You signed a contract, thus agreeing to it's terms.
Using your analogy, the cable company, you're full of holes too. You signed a contract with that cable company and it allows the use of that data over coaxial cable to multiple TVs. It just so happens that you have a similar contract with your cellular provider, but it doesn't allow the use of that data, this time over cellular towers, to other devices.
Tough cookies. You signed those contracts. Don't complain just because you don't like the terms of one of them as much as you like the terms of the other. Speak with your wallet and cancel your cellular deal.
Everyone is right
Ok first off if it is stealing then yes we want to steal data. Second you can call it stealing but technicly when you tether with the pdanet app how does it hide it? does any one know? well ill tell you, it uses you data in app like all other apps and then sends it to what ever your using so actually you iphone is using the data not what the iphone is sending it to. If ts an ipad, then your ipad is technicaly using your phone but your phone phone is using the data. Its kinda like this you have say 700 minutes on your phone you use those minuts to talk well if i borrow your phone to make a call now im using your minuts but im not paying for it and your not paying extra for me to use it but its not in your contract that i can use it is it. Well you ipad is just borrowing your phone to make a call. so really no its not stealing. if i use 10 gigs on my phone, which i usually do without tethering, or if my ipad were to borrow my phone and use 10 gigs, my phone still used 10 gigs any way you look at it and isnt what you are all saying is we pay for our phone to use the data. Well our phone is using the data.
Ok first off if it is stealing then yes we want to steal data. Second you can call it stealing but technicly when you tether with the pdanet app how does it hide it? does any one know? well ill tell you, it uses you data in app like all other apps and then sends it to what ever your using so actually you iphone is using the data not what the iphone is sending it to. If ts an ipad, then your ipad is technicaly using your phone but your phone phone is using the data. Its kinda like this you have say 700 minutes on your phone you use those minuts to talk well if i borrow your phone to make a call now im using your minuts but im not paying for it and your not paying extra for me to use it but its not in your contract that i can use it is it. Well you ipad is just borrowing your phone to make a call. so really no its not stealing. if i use 10 gigs on my phone, which i usually do without tethering, or if my ipad were to borrow my phone and use 10 gigs, my phone still used 10 gigs any way you look at it and isnt what you are all saying is we pay for our phone to use the data. Well our phone is using the data.
AT&T Umm.. not very fond of them
All of you saying that its "theft of service" are right... Technically and that is because of what your contract states of course. Now do people pay like no other for an AT&T plan? HELL YEA!!
AT&T is just one greedy as ********** company. No matter how you twist it!! Cough Cough...
AT&T = Monopoly wanna beess (Not technically) but they are.
I think this is why thousands and thousands of people like to rebel against them.
All of you saying that its "theft of service" are right... Technically and that is because of what your contract states of course. Now do people pay like no other for an AT&T plan? HELL YEA!!
AT&T is just one greedy as ********** company. No matter how you twist it!! Cough Cough...
AT&T = Monopoly wanna beess (Not technically) but they are.
I think this is why thousands and thousands of people like to rebel against them.
I've tethered on and off again on Verizon since my BB Storm2 and PDANet and on my iPhone 4 and 4S with MyWi and sometimes the OnDemand feature. I don't use it much, maybe 1-2 times a month, if that, and never had any issues at all with it. Then again, I don't go crazy with the data usage. Can't remember the last time I've had more than 1GB of usage on my line.
Maybe if everyone would cancle their data plan at once, and tell att that we all want unlimited data back, well theyed have no choice. For all the moral people on here saying its not right, well we really dont care. do you realize the website your on. most of the forums on these sites are for finding was around paying extra for things we dont want to pay for weather it be right or wrong, we dont care. why dont you all go start your own forum and talk about how wrong we all are for not wanting to give away money we dont have to for thing we want. are you all honestly giong to tell me that every single song youve ever put on a cd or mp3 player, that you payed for it. If you say yes YOU ARE A LIER!!!! so just back off and let us all have our fun risking what we feel like risking. no one is hurting you personally.
Now on the reason that they are taking away unlimited that is for many reasons both moral and un. the un first, they tryed to make it out like they were doing something good for the customer saying some people dont use much data so they dont like paying 30 dollars for unlimited so we are going to offer them smaller plans for cheaper, when it was really "we can make alot more money this way". and you cant say its not like that because i mean 200mb for 15 dollars im my god i can use 200 mb in ten minuts. if you have an iphone 4 whic plays movies in HD, netflix in HD uses 2.2gb in just 1 HOUR, so 200mb our even 2 or 4 gb is ubsurd. This means that if you own one of the nice new phones and are stuck with one of these plans you cant even enjoy the best features of your phone. On the ligit reason for getting rid of unlimited was to downsize to amount of people like me out there using well over 10 gb and clogging up the air. Because we all know the more people that are on the slower and more cramed up things get. and if you didnt know that goes for the whole network and the internet for that matter.
Back to the main question yes pdanet works. i was tethering with something else and got emails(like 4 or 5) texts (4) leters (4) then an sms that i was being switched to a tethering plan so i called and said no im not and i did not get switched since then i have used pdanet and have never heard from them again which im obviously being watched now. So yes it works. For how long, DK.
Now on the reason that they are taking away unlimited that is for many reasons both moral and un. the un first, they tryed to make it out like they were doing something good for the customer saying some people dont use much data so they dont like paying 30 dollars for unlimited so we are going to offer them smaller plans for cheaper, when it was really "we can make alot more money this way". and you cant say its not like that because i mean 200mb for 15 dollars im my god i can use 200 mb in ten minuts. if you have an iphone 4 whic plays movies in HD, netflix in HD uses 2.2gb in just 1 HOUR, so 200mb our even 2 or 4 gb is ubsurd. This means that if you own one of the nice new phones and are stuck with one of these plans you cant even enjoy the best features of your phone. On the ligit reason for getting rid of unlimited was to downsize to amount of people like me out there using well over 10 gb and clogging up the air. Because we all know the more people that are on the slower and more cramed up things get. and if you didnt know that goes for the whole network and the internet for that matter.
Back to the main question yes pdanet works. i was tethering with something else and got emails(like 4 or 5) texts (4) leters (4) then an sms that i was being switched to a tethering plan so i called and said no im not and i did not get switched since then i have used pdanet and have never heard from them again which im obviously being watched now. So yes it works. For how long, DK.
Hey guys know no one knows 100% for sure how Att is catching people tethering but it sucks that they take away your unlimited data if you tether
Most of the people using MiWi have been caught and because of this PDAnet has come out with an update to their tethering app that claims to "hide tethering usage". It uses different levels of security to do this (1 and 2) and seems to try and fool Att into thinking your computer is an iPhone while you tether.
The only problem? There is no way for an Att person to see if PDAnet is actually working and fooling Att to think your computer is an iPhone. This is because when they take away your unlimited and upgrade you to the 4gb data pro plan it doesn't tell you if you are using tethering data or regular iPhone data.
The solution? If a Verizon iPhone owner who has unlimited data purchases the $20/mo 2gb tethering plan option, they keep their unlimited data and have a separate bucket of tether data to draw from. This means that if a Verizon owner with the 2gb tethering option uses PDAnet "Level II" protection to tether and can tell us Att owners if it draws from their 2gb tethering data bucket or if PDAnet actually fools Verizon to think that you aren't tethering (if it only uses your unlimited).
If anyone knows a Verizon iPhone owner that already has the tethering feature or is willing to do this it would be greatly appreciated by myself and the community
Eventually Verizon is going to kill off unlimited data as well and if they do that then they will target Verizon unlimited data owners as well. If you do this and PDAnet works you will also be helping yourself down the line avoid Verizon switching your unlimited plan in the future once it's not available.
The steps:
- Verizon iPhone owner w/ unlimited data
- Purchase the 2gb tethering add on
- Use PDAnet to tether using level 2 protection
- See if it used your unlimited data or your 2gb tethering data
Thanks again for your help.
Wow people are very opinionated on something that doesn't really matter.
To everybody that replied with a OPINION, you are annoying....That is not what this thread is about.
After some research/experience on this here is what I found
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-AT&T seems to be sending letters to iPhone users ONLY. After following a few threads on XDA and from personal experience it has something to do with the iPhone.
-Apps like MyWi, PDAnet, TetherMe used to use the tethering APN, easy for AT&T to see (most apps updated so that there no longer using the tethering APN).
-There seems to be speculation that AT&T is packet sniffing looking at the headers and footers(im not super familiar with this).
-The amount of DATA a user uses seems to be unrelated to getting the letter, I personally got a letter and use roughly 2GB's a month. My buddy used to play WOW over his phone and used to use roughly 140GB's a month (AT&T has since throttled his connection every month, but he never received the letter).
I have a question of my own if anybody can answer this, Can AT&T still see you tethering if you use a VPN (e.g. VyperVPN)? .... Also if you have a opinion about wether tethering is right or wrong, I will tell you right now I Dont Care keep it to yourself.
Thanks in advance
Buffet Analogy
For the record, these buffet analogies are off. Why does everyone assume you want to tether to give internet to someone else. That's ridiculous.
The buffet analogy, which only applies to unlimited users, would be that the food is the data, but the restaurant only allows you to use 1 plate. 1 plate at a time would be like only using your iphone. If you took two plates, it would be like using your iphone and laptop at the same time. I can see where this would become a problem.
For people like me with a 2 gb plan, it would be like telling me i can have 2 lbs of meat at a restaurant. No tethering would be telling me i had to pace myself when I ate. This makes no sense at all. The best part of this is the phone already sets a speed limit on me. I cannot tether another device and use the info any faster than I can stream 2 netflix movies (which would bring me to my limit). This limit is completely a cash grab.
I have not tethered, and unfortunately my work requires we stick with ATT. If it didn't, I'd be gone because I think what ATT is doing is terrible.
For the record, these buffet analogies are off. Why does everyone assume you want to tether to give internet to someone else. That's ridiculous.
The buffet analogy, which only applies to unlimited users, would be that the food is the data, but the restaurant only allows you to use 1 plate. 1 plate at a time would be like only using your iphone. If you took two plates, it would be like using your iphone and laptop at the same time. I can see where this would become a problem.
For people like me with a 2 gb plan, it would be like telling me i can have 2 lbs of meat at a restaurant. No tethering would be telling me i had to pace myself when I ate. This makes no sense at all. The best part of this is the phone already sets a speed limit on me. I cannot tether another device and use the info any faster than I can stream 2 netflix movies (which would bring me to my limit). This limit is completely a cash grab.
I have not tethered, and unfortunately my work requires we stick with ATT. If it didn't, I'd be gone because I think what ATT is doing is terrible.
How long does it usually take to get caught? I tethered a few days last week to download a few episodes of top gear. Used about 4GBs and so far no notice from AT&T about tethering. I did get a notice saying that if I use more than 3gb in future cycles, I'll be throttled. Which implies I have true unlimited for the rest of this month I guess.
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Yawn...A long post doesn't mask its irrelevancy.
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No one knows.
Omg...i have the answer...ugh after a year
Ok so bought pdanet after knowing for sure it worked. So this is what happenned. I had a tethering plan and kept paying 20 dollars for 2 gigs, i only used about a third of a gig a month!!! Hmmm i thought...i got pdanet from cidya and kept checking myverizon.com and to my aurprise all the data i was using was added to the unlimited plan, which i got after feb. your prob wondering wtf? Am i lying, nope. Just call the 1800 number and ask to add a FEATURE! Very important part tell them you want the hotspot feature. A glitch in the system then adds the unlimited data and the stupid hot spot....cool huh? Anyways like i was saying... I kept using my ipad and it was using my iphone unlimited data plan. After a couple of months i dissed the hotspot(cause its kinda suspicious if you get the feature then drop it the next day). Got it peepz... This josh homie how hard was it to answer that question!! Ugh ppl and morals... I deal with ppl everyday and if they could get away with it theyd pay nothing for my services. When it comes down to it you gotta look out for numero uno!!
Ok so bought pdanet after knowing for sure it worked. So this is what happenned. I had a tethering plan and kept paying 20 dollars for 2 gigs, i only used about a third of a gig a month!!! Hmmm i thought...i got pdanet from cidya and kept checking myverizon.com and to my aurprise all the data i was using was added to the unlimited plan, which i got after feb. your prob wondering wtf? Am i lying, nope. Just call the 1800 number and ask to add a FEATURE! Very important part tell them you want the hotspot feature. A glitch in the system then adds the unlimited data and the stupid hot spot....cool huh? Anyways like i was saying... I kept using my ipad and it was using my iphone unlimited data plan. After a couple of months i dissed the hotspot(cause its kinda suspicious if you get the feature then drop it the next day). Got it peepz... This josh homie how hard was it to answer that question!! Ugh ppl and morals... I deal with ppl everyday and if they could get away with it theyd pay nothing for my services. When it comes down to it you gotta look out for numero uno!!
Wirelessly posted
Wow finally got a legit answer after the long 16 pages of thread.
Anyway for those moral ppl, reply my question please.
Yesterday my sister needed to browse internet with ipad while we were on the train. But the train had no wifi. Since her ipad had 3g feature, i took out my sim card from the iphone and put in her ipad. Yes, i could simply use pdanet and tether but my phone had low battery. Is that stealing? Either way, if i swapped sin card or tether, she'll be able to access internet. And the usage goes through from my 200mb data plan(yup. 200mb)
Joshsal13 said:
Wow finally got a legit answer after the long 16 pages of thread.
Anyway for those moral ppl, reply my question please.
Yesterday my sister needed to browse internet with ipad while we were on the train. But the train had no wifi. Since her ipad had 3g feature, i took out my sim card from the iphone and put in her ipad. Yes, i could simply use pdanet and tether but my phone had low battery. Is that stealing? Either way, if i swapped sin card or tether, she'll be able to access internet. And the usage goes through from my 200mb data plan(yup. 200mb)
I read about this somewhere, ive never done it, did it work? I think you have to change something in settings in order for it to work. I wouldnt know how to answer that.
Technically putting a cell phone SIM in a non-phone device is also against AT&T's TOS, so the argument is moot.
Ill give you a better example. I have been a customer of AT&T since 2003. When the razor came out I got the unlimited data plan for $30.00. Everyone knows now that you couldn't do a much on the Internet with a razor from 04 vs. a iPhone. But I kept the "unlimited" data plan anyway. Technology has advanced and now AT&T tells me that I'm using to much of my "unlimited" data and they're going to slow me connection down. WTF! When I only used 25kb it wasnt a problem to take my money since 2003. But now I have a iPhone it's a problem. Mean while I've never gotten a refund check for not nearly using 2,3 gigs of data. Ms. Technology person, if did your home work phones could tether for free before companies figure they could lock them and force you to buy a data plan. Look up the word "UNLIMITED" there is no grey area when you use the word. It was a marketing plan that backfired on AT&T to get more customers and now they have to live up to there end. Should have called "the unlimited data plan with limits." I've never slowed my payment down!
Just because it's in a contract does not make it legal. It is a one-sided contract where the other party has no say in it. There are law suits every day about something in a contract that is not enforceable. Since there has not been a law suit over the tethering aspect of the ATT "contract", neither side of the argument can be considered definitive. Personally, I feel that if I pay for a data plan, then tethering should not be an additional charge. I object to paying for the same data twice. To me, it's simply corporate greed which is morally unfair. I feel that there is a decent (but not certain) chance that one would prevail against ATT in a court of law. But until someone actually files suit against ATT for this, we'll just continue to argue here without resolution. Do-gooders vs. tethering fairness. From a personal standpoint, I do not tether, nor am I jailbroken. I used to jailbreak and used to tether (though only for the exercise in actually being able to do it). If Verizon, Sprint or T-Mobile does not have a separate tethering plan, then the people who want to tether should consider changing carriers. The more people leave ATT over their policies and customer service, the more likely they might be to actually care about customers wishes and desires. I know that last sentence is a joke.