New 24" Penryn iMac owners....screen bleed fixed???

[SaSaSushi]

i just ordered Apple Care JUST so i could have onsite service on my display... i even checked online and asked apple on the phone if my desktop computer could get onsite service because of my iMac's gradient... i don't exactly live close to an apple store, nor do i care to pack and carry this heavy 24" iMac all the way across town...

"sure no problem, just give me your credit card number for Apple Care and then i'll transfer you to an onsite technician"...

...

"hi, i'm an onsite technician, and i can't do an onsite evaluation of your screen because i don't have the equipment to do so, you'll have to take it back to the apple store... bye!"...

APPLE SUCKS!!!!!!!!

Holy cow, what sort of service are you expecting?!? A gradient is not a "fixable" problem by any Apple tech. The only service is replacement of the panel. If you're within the 14 days of initial purchase most gradient-sensitive folks just replace the entire machine (I've even heard of some cats who exchanged iMacs up to 16 times! lol)

I don't live anywhere near an Apple Store either but I have realistic expectations and nothing but great experiences with Applecare.

I had a slight smudge on the initial LCD panel that shipped with my current iMac that I didn't even notice until about 4 months into using it. I called Apple and they sent out a courier with all the boxes for shipping and picked it up. It was back within 4 days with a new LCD panel. When that LCD panel's backlight developed problems about 2 weeks ago I called them again and the same deal, only it was back in 3 days this time.

Oh, by the way, it may be a little late for you but if you ordered Applecare from Apple you paid too much. You can get it far cheaper from L.A. Computer (as I did) or on eBay.

 

[Darkroom]

Holy cow, what sort of service are you expecting?!? A gradient is not a "fixable" problem by any Apple tech. The only service is replacement of the panel. If you're within the 14 days of initial purchase most gradient-sensitive folks just replace the entire machine (I've even heard of some cats who exchanged iMacs up to 16 times! lol)

I don't live anywhere near an Apple Store either but I have realistic expectations and nothing but great experiences with Applecare.

I had a slight smudge on the initial LCD panel that shipped with my current iMac that I didn't even notice until about 4 months into using it. I called Apple and they sent out a courier with all the boxes for shipping and picked it up. It was back within 4 days with a new LCD panel. When that LCD panel's backlight developed problems about 2 weeks ago I called them again and the same deal, only it was back in 3 days this time.

Oh, by the way, it may be a little late for you but if you ordered Applecare from Apple you paid too much. You can get it far cheaper from L.A. Computer (as I did) or on eBay.

i understand they couldn't do onsite fixing, but i specifically asked if they could come to evaluate the screen, see that there is indeed an error, and then take it with them. whatever, i'll just swap it out within 30 days for a new one.

apple care from LA Computer is a great deal... but after looking at their site, it seems to be only available in the USA? whatever, it's too late now...

 

[Darkroom]

I wish you hadn't mentioned the yellow discoloration! The new iMac I just set up has tolerable backlight bleed and a mild gradient, but now that I see the cool->warm->cool discoloration, I can't stand it. It's particularly bad on the MacRumors forums, where the grey background behind the text makes it pretty hard to ignore!

i'm sorry, but the truth hurts... and yes, it IS particularly bad on macrumors site ... i can imagine every single photographer, designer, film maker or visual artist who was ever trained in color using the new iMacs scratching their heads when they first start using these new iMacs.

i found that by going to Sys Prefs > Displays > Color, switching from Apple's default "iMac" display profile (which is warmer) to the "Adobe (1998)" display profile (which is colder), then the screen gradient doesn't seem as bothersome, although it's still present.

 

[SaSaSushi]

i understand they couldn't do onsite fixing, but i specifically asked if they could come to evaluate the screen, see that there is indeed an error, and then take it with them. whatever, i'll just swap it out within 30 days for a new one.

If you are even within driving distance of an Apple Store I think you're lucky. The closest one to me is a 3 hour (and about $150 in tolls) drive away from me in Osaka.

I know it's hard to really properly evaluate a machine at the Apple Store but some have suggested you have the sales staff open up a machine you're intending to purchase, power it up and have a look at the screen before taking it home.

For those with really bad gradients they are obvious right from the gray boot screen, much brighter on the left than the right.

apple care from LA Computer is a great deal... but after looking at their site, it seems to be only available in the USA? whatever, it's too late now...

Yeah, sorry I should have considered that. I had it shipped to my parents in New Jersey who then shipped it on to me here in Japan.

At any rate, Applecare is definitely worth it even at Apple's prices.

 

[imac123]

my current lcd

as a about-to-be-new imac owner i was really worried when reading all the threads about how bad the screens are.

but to make other about-to-be imac owners feel better, today I looked at my current LCD monitor and turned off the lights and put on a black background and it too had quite a bit of bleed and was FAR from an even black background.

and did I notice any of this in the 2 yrs i've used it??? no... b/c when am I going to use it in the dark w/ a dark background??? only if i watch movies (which I haven't done yet but may occasionally w/ the imac... not often enough to care much). as for the color gradient... i bet my current monitor has some of that too (its a cheap monitor) but my eyes don't notice it.

I can definitely see how these 2 issues are a problem for those doing professional image editing or for those w/ sensitive eyes. But i think for normal use for the avg person, and for the avg eye, and w/ the avg imac, neither of these issues are a big deal.

 

[minik]

Went to the Apple Store (Bellevue Square) with my faulty 3.06Ghz BTO iMac w/4GB of RAM. Although I made an appointment, my ProCare membership does make a different. The Mac Genius fired it up and agreed the defects. He first told me that that since it's a BTO iMac, he would have to send it back and Apple sends me a replacement.

I asked him, do you guys have any 3.06Ghz iMac and swap the memory. He went back and said there is a 3.06Ghz model as well as the memory upgrade. *Sounds good to me*. I saw the memory module cardboard marked as 2X2GB and costed $400.

The Mac Genius treated my iMac as a return and reissue a receipt with a stock 3.06Ghz iMac and extra memory upgrade. He reminded me to call AppleCare tomorrow for transferring my warranty info.

Got back home, the display looks decent. Fired up Software Update, a whooping 13 software updates ranging from iLife '08 to Safari 3.1.1.

 

[Darkroom]

Went to the Apple Store (Bellevue Square) with my faulty 3.06Ghz BTO iMac w/4GB of RAM. Although I made an appointment, my ProCare membership does make a different. The Mac Genius fired it up and agreed the defects. He first told me that that since it's a BTO iMac, he would have to send it back and Apple sends me a replacement.

I asked him, do you guys have any 3.06Ghz iMac and swap the memory. He went back and said there is a 3.06Ghz model as well as the memory upgrade. *Sounds good to me*. I saw the memory module cardboard marked as 2X2GB and costed $400.

The Mac Genius treated my iMac as a return and reissue a receipt with a stock 3.06Ghz iMac and extra memory upgrade. He reminded me to call AppleCare tomorrow for transferring my warranty info.

Got back home, the display looks decent. Fired up Software Update, a whooping 13 software updates ranging from iLife '08 to Safari 3.1.1.

when you say the display looks decent, do you mean it's better but still bad? i know some people are saying they have received perfect screens, while others are receiving flawed displays continuously...

so how's the bleeding / gradient on the new display?

 

[SaSaSushi]

i found that by going to Sys Prefs > Displays > Color, switching from Apple's default "iMac" display profile (which is warmer) to the "Adobe (1998)" display profile (which is colder), then the screen gradient doesn't seem as bothersome, although it's still present.

I HIGHLY recommend that you at least do a detailed calibration of your iMac with SuperCal, expecially if you're using the machine in a professional photo/video editing capacity.

If you have a colorimeter even better.

At any rate, no one should be using stock color profiles since they will be totally hit or miss.

 

[Darkroom]

I HIGHLY recommend that you at least do a detailed calibration of your iMac with SuperCal, expecially if you're using the machine in a professional photo/video editing capacity.

If you have a colorimeter even better.

At any rate, no one should be using stock color profiles since they will be totally hit or miss.

i'm not even going to bother calibrating this screen with my spyder3... there's no point with this color cast... i was just stating that the vertical yellow band in the middle of the screen is less apparent with Adobe (1998)...

 

[minik]

when you say the display looks decent, do you mean it's better but still bad? i know some people are saying they have received perfect screens, while others are receiving flawed displays continuously...

so how's the bleeding / gradient on the new display?

I asked the Mac Genius before accepting this replacement iMac. He said the staff will check it since he/she has to power up the iMac and made sure it recognized all 4GB of RAM.

Now looking at it. The screen looks very close to perfect although I believe that I see two slightly brighter spots on the default Dock area. I followed Darkroom's suggestion and set to Adobe (1998) profiler and it seems to disappear.

Yesterday, there was a red vertical line in the middle of the screen and white line across. It's a 'big' improvement as of now.

 

[Darkroom]

I asked the Mac Genius before accepting this replacement iMac. He said the staff will check it since he/she has to power up the iMac and made sure it recognized all 4GB of RAM.

Now looking at it. The screen looks very close to perfect although I believe that I see two slightly brighter spots on the default Dock area. I followed Darkroom's suggestion and set to Adobe (1998) profiler and it seems to disappear.

Yesterday, there was a red vertical line in the middle of the screen and white line across. It's a 'big' improvement as of now.

so the apple store employees hand picked an iMac for you that doesn't have a blue or yellow tint, and with minimal bleed? if so, i'm a little more hopeful now when i take my iMac back soon...

i can easily deal with minimal bleed, but i would really like to have a screen that is next to perfect (IE no color casts)... this cold blue from the top right corner is really killing me.

 

[minik]

so the apple store employees hand picked an iMac for you that doesn't have a blue or yellow tint, and with minimal bleed? if so, i'm a little more hopeful now when i take my iMac back soon...

i can easily deal with minimal bleed, but i would really like to have a screen that is next to perfect (IE no color casts)... this cold blue from the top right corner is really killing me.

In the past, I had no display issues (Studio display, TiBook, iBooks) from ordering online. Now, I learn that I should be more caution and buy from an actual retail store. I'm sure the staff will let you check the screen and/or other matters on the spot (or after the payment).

I also picked a less traffic after dinner hours to visit the Genius Bar. I had 'not so welcomed' service during weekend before.

Since I bought AppleCare and Apple RAM, I wasn't sure will it affect the process. YMMV.

 

[Sir Cecil]

Deleted

 

[JayLenochiniMac]

Deleted

 

[dantay]

A lot of this bleed frenzy is a load of nonsense. Of course, some will have legitimate and annoying bad experiences with faulty screens, but much of the stuff spouted on here is based on.... the black letterbox areas of DVD movies! People who are otherwise happy with their screens put on a Star Trek DVD, see some "bleed" in the black letterboxed areas and cry to Apple "I'm not happy with this, give me a 16th unit!"

Put your DVD film on. Look at the "bleed" in the letterboxed areas. Tilt the screen to a point where it is minimized. Now wait until a dark scene in the movie. Does the "bleed" extend into the actual picture area? Do you know why it usually doesn't? It's because black letterboxing is purposely designed to be less dense than the blacks in the film. If the letterboxing was totally opaque and intense black, it would cause the blacks in the picture to appear dark gray instead of crisp black. It's a compromise. It requires a level of transparency in the letterboxing to prevent lessening the impact of the movie image due to the relative contrast of the blacks.

If you take a piece of opaque, deep black paper and position it over the letterbox area on your screen, you'll see how the blacks in the film itself instantly look "less black". This is VERY basic and is the same thing as choosing the correct intensity of matting for a framed photograph one would put on the wall. The level of black for letterboxing is carefully judged to prevent swamping the movie's black levels. If it wasn't for this, 90% of complaints about screen bleed would disappear.

Again, this isn't to say many monitors don't have very real problems, but if anyone out there is taking back endless numbers of iMacs because their movie letterboxing shows "bleed" when everything else is acceptable, they should think again. Complain to the guys who produce the DVDs, not Apple. I'd suggest many of those who say their old monitors don't show this "bleed" in letterbox areas are most likely seeing the result of generally duller screens, rather than more even lighting. Maybe the DVD manufacturers need to change THEIR specifications to cater for the brighter, larger computer screens people are watching movies on these days.

What a load of old rubbish! Bleed is bleed.....there are plenty of LCD screens out there with minimal or no bleed and also plenty without a noticeable colour gradient. You seem strangely interested in posting on a thread when you don't even have an iMac or anything of any real note to say. Anamorphic films don't present black bars and you can still see the bleed in dark scenes in those.....you really are talking a load of old tosh. Its not just about watching films either......its clearly visible on any dark/black screen....several of apple's own stock wallpapers (earth) show it off beautifully.....I guess they forgot about the black bars?! Do feel free to carry on but it really is getting a little old now.

Anyhoo......my 16th and final unit is ok.....not perfect by any stretch.....but better than the others with regard to bleed and gradient......and no inverter buzz either. The imac is the only product that fits my need for decent design and solid OS so i'm glad I persevered. I wish everyone who is looking to get a 24" imac the best of luck.....great design and OS.....very variable screen.

 

[shanmui1]

Anyhoo......my 16th and final unit is ok.....not perfect by any stretch.....but better than the others with regard to bleed and gradient......and no inverter buzz either. The imac is the only product that fits my need for decent design and solid OS so i'm glad I persevered. I wish everyone who is looking to get a 24" imac the best of luck.....great design and OS.....very variable screen.

hi Dantay, after your experiences I would value your opinion here.

Currently, I am using 17 " Philips 170 B4 LCD, 8bits 16M, antiglare coating. It says in Display Profile something like Target White point = 4500 k, Target Gamma = 2.60, warm yellowish white, which I find doesn't tire my eyes. I would like a bigger screen for working on text and now seems like a good time to think about upgrading from my 2002 MDD. Since I need a full upgrade, I'm thinking about the 2008 iMac. I don't want the mini.

What do you think of the new 24 iMac screen (assuming it's a good one) for reading text or numbers for 6 or 7 hours at a stretch? I want to move my colour setup over, can the 24 iMac be calibrated to those values?

Thanks in advance.

 

[MortonH]

Anamorphic films don't present black bars and you can still see the bleed in dark scenes in those..... It's not just about watching films either......its clearly visible on any dark/black screen....several of apple's own stock wallpapers (earth) show it off beautifully.....I guess they forgot about the black bars?!

Also, the new nVidia option on the 24" makes the iMac a viable gaming machine, but I can't imagine how the dark scenes in an atmospheric FPS will look with a big blue glow in the corners.

Maybe game developers will start programming their monsters to hide in the areas with light bleed so they can sneak up on you ...

 

[dantay]

hi Dantay, after your experiences I would value your opinion here.

Currently, I am using 17 " Philips 170 B4 LCD, 8bits 16M, antiglare coating. It says in Display Profile something like Target White point = 4500 k, Target Gamma = 2.60, warm yellowish white, which I find doesn't tire my eyes. I would like a bigger screen for working on text and now seems like a good time to think about upgrading from my 2002 MDD. Since I need a full upgrade, I'm thinking about the 2008 iMac. I don't want the mini.

What do you think of the new 24 iMac screen (assuming it's a good one) for reading text or numbers for 6 or 7 hours at a stretch? I want to move my colour setup over, can the 24 iMac be calibrated to those values?

Thanks in advance.

Hi,
on the colour value front I don't really know.....as Darkroom suggested I set mine to Adobe (1998) profile in the pre-set profiles as it reduced the gradient and improves the contrast but doesn't blow the detail. The screen panel itself is great for me with good detail in shadow areas (for an LCD) and nice saturated colours. I would imagine if its for pro or semi-pro use its not ideal and I think your chances of getting a reasonable one are honestly pretty low, after all I went through 16! I only web brouse, play a game sometimes watch a movie and edit pics on a basic level so i'm a very light user but love the industrial design (fits well in my interior aesthetic) and the solid OS. The Cinema screens offer better backlighting and more natural colour reproduction so may be a better option for you. The Cinema screens launched in 2004 though so should be due a refresh soon I think. Hope this helps

 

[dantay]

Also, the new nVidia option on the 24" makes the iMac a viable gaming machine, but I can't imagine how the dark scenes in an atmospheric FPS will look with a big blue glow in the corners.

Maybe game developers will start programming their monsters to hide in the areas with light bleed so they can sneak up on you ...

LOL! Nice one

 

[seanster]

All,

This is a common problem with most LCD screens. Spotlights, Mura effect (cloudiness under certain conditions) and light bleed are all very very common - even with the highest quality screens. I own a Sony XBR 52 inch LCD and this also under certain low light conditions will display some inherent spotlights - especially in a dark room with a dark scene.

I am not surprised that the same issues appear with the Imacs. This is a very well known technology issue with LCD screens, not an Apple problem. This technology is still in its infancy.

In fact, you can even say this is by design. If you are sitting in a dark room, with the backlight (or brightness) on full blast, you are going to have this issue. You are also killing your eyes.

As with my Sony big screen, the purpose of the manufacturer giving you the ability to adjust the backlight and brightness on the screen is done on purpose - to allow you to adjust the brightness of the screen based on viewing conditions - thus for the most part alleviating the spotlight / bleeding / MURA effect.

You will never get away from this, until the OLED screens become a reality. I am happily awaiting the arrival of my new 3.06 Imac, and fully expect that under low light conditions there will be some backlight bleed, just as there is with every other LCD screen under similar conditions.

 

[shanmui1]

.....after all I went through 16!

If nobody did that, everybody will just settle for less and less. That's why people complaining about people who just won't accept less that what it should be don't make any sense....

Guess I will have to play with display profile at the store, stare hard at text for a couple of hours or so.... will ask the staff nicely first of course, and try to see if I can get accustomed to using a glossy screen in place of my trusty matte. I can't make this decision lightly since if I buy it, I will be living with this glossy screen for the next few years - which will not be the case if Apple gave us the mythical xMac.

hmmmm... why not give us the xMac but since Apple wants to make us (in this buying bracket) buy a whole bundle like an iMac, the xMac ONLY works with an Apple display?? THEN we can get a matte display.

Oh and I do hope I will find that 1 good iMac out of 16 also Wonder if they will open and let me test all their iMac stock until I find one I like :roll:

 

[dantay]

All,

This is a common problem with most LCD screens. Spotlights, Mura effect (cloudiness under certain conditions) and light bleed are all very very common - even with the highest quality screens. I own a Sony XBR 52 inch LCD and this also under certain low light conditions will display some inherent spotlights - especially in a dark room with a dark scene.

I am not surprised that the same issues appear with the Imacs. This is a very well known technology issue with LCD screens, not an Apple problem. This technology is still in its infancy.

In fact, you can even say this is by design. If you are sitting in a dark room, with the backlight (or brightness) on full blast, you are going to have this issue. You are also killing your eyes.

As with my Sony big screen, the purpose of the manufacturer giving you the ability to adjust the backlight and brightness on the screen is done on purpose - to allow you to adjust the brightness of the screen based on viewing conditions - thus for the most part alleviating the spotlight / bleeding / MURA effect.

You will never get away from this, until the OLED screens become a reality. I am happily awaiting the arrival of my new 3.06 Imac, and fully expect that under low light conditions there will be some backlight bleed, just as there is with every other LCD screen under similar conditions.

I agree bleed is common, but not ALL screens have it. A small amount of uniform bleed is ok at the bottom of the screen but the point is these iMacs have it everywhere. The pictures i bothered to post show my 20" which is great and the 24" models which are not. I think apple must have a few people working on these forums!

 

[Darkroom]

I agree bleed is common, but not ALL screens have it. A small amount of uniform bleed is ok at the bottom of the screen but the point is these iMacs have it everywhere. The pictures i bothered to post show my 20" which is great and the 24" models which are not. I think apple must have a few people working on these forums!

i know right... all these fanboys saying that it's a "consumer" computer and because of that it's perfectly ok for the screen to be ass? what ever happened to the pristine Mac? my old G3 iMac developed screen issues after 6 years of use!

for all the people on here flaming me for "complaining", you should actually buy a new iMac first to see for yourself instead of defending Apple, like they're your little brother who needs your help.

so your 16th iMac is a keeper? does it have a gradient issues still? how bad? and thank you for returning all those iMacs... i hope more people do like you and show apple that they just can't get away with trying to pawn off junk to people who after years of being mac users rightfully expect better from their products. guess the fanboys will have to wait a little longer before the next update again to give apple a chance to clear out another huge batch of refurbs

 

[dantay]

i know right... all these fanboys saying that it's a "consumer" computer and because of that it's perfectly ok for the screen to be ass? what ever happened to the pristine Mac? my old G3 iMac developed screen issues after 6 years of use!

for all the people on here flaming me for "complaining", you should actually buy a new iMac first to see for yourself instead of defending Apple, like they're your little brother who needs your help.

so your 16th iMac is a keeper? does it have a gradient issues still? how bad? and thank you for returning all those iMacs... i hope more people do like you and show apple that they just can't get away with trying to pawn off junk to people who after years of being mac users rightfully expect better from their products. guess the fanboys will have to wait a little longer before the next update again to give apple a chance to clear out another huge batch of refurbs

Hi Darkroom,
Yeah it ticks me off too when people post with no experience of the problem spout mis-information.....but hey thats a forum!
The latest one is certainly not great.....just the best of bad bunch....couple of specs of dust under the glass and a smudge etc. The bleed is over the right a little and top left (as with all units). If it gets to me within the 14 day return period it will AGAIN go back. To be honest I have had enough of carting units to and fro 5 different apple stores to be told "its within spec" and ask "ok whats your spec?" and be told "no its not available to see!" The gradient is ok-ish using (as you suggested) adobe 1998 setting. Its a shame such a great machine is hobbled with such a Crap-Tastic TM display. Nothing else on the market that does it for me though so stuck with one of these. Did you get one you were happy with?

 

[Darkroom]

Hi Darkroom,
Yeah it ticks me off too when people post with no experience of the problem spout mis-information.....but hey thats a forum!
The latest one is certainly not great.....just the best of bad bunch....couple of specs of dust under the glass and a smudge etc. The bleed is over the right a little and top left (as with all units). If it gets to me within the 14 day return period it will AGAIN go back. To be honest I have had enough of carting units to and fro 5 different apple stores to be told "its within spec" and ask "ok whats your spec?" and be told "no its not available to see!" The gradient is ok-ish using (as you suggested) adobe 1998 setting. Its a shame such a great machine is hobbled with such a Crap-Tastic TM display. Nothing else on the market that does it for me though so stuck with one of these. Did you get one you were happy with?

sadly, i'm looking in to downgrading to the 24" white iMac refurb from the apple store online.

i NEVER would have thought this would ever have happened with apple... what a joke.