Nintendo: Apple's Latest Prey

[Rodimus Prime]

On the contrary, children I've seen playing DS's are now only playing on iPads. DS's lie collecting dust, because children realize all the things they can do on an iPad besides games. Like fingerpainting.

I would be saying I have seen more on DS.

Just look at it in terms of cost. iPad $500+ cost of games. DS + some games under $200. Tell me which is a better deal.

I would not mind a DS if I had the spare funds the games for it are just well better than that of an iPad or any phone so to kill time it would just work out to be better.

 

[*LTD*]

I would be saying I have seen more on DS.

Just look at it in terms of cost. iPad $500+ cost of games. DS + some games under $200. Tell me which is a better deal.

I would not mind a DS if I had the spare funds the games for it are just well better than that of an iPad or any phone so to kill time it would just work out to be better.

DS games that show up for iDevices tend to be better in quality and depth.

Don't be too quick to run out and get a DS. The dedicated handheld gaming device's days are numbered. It's a far different game in the Post-PC era.

They've still got *some* life in them, but they're not forward-looking devices.

 

[neiltc13]

DS games that show up for iDevices tend to be better in quality and depth.

Don't be too quick to run out and get a DS. The dedicated handheld gaming device's days are numbered. It's a far different game in the Post-PC era.

They've still got *some* life in them, but they're not forward-looking devices.

I think you are missing the point. Some games on iOS might look better than DS or 3DS games, but that doesn't make them "better in quality".

I will take a game that looks slightly worse but which I can play without feeling frustrated by the lack of tactile controls and feedback any day of the week. That to me will give an experience that is definitely "better in quality".

 

[Liquorpuki]

I'm violating human anatomy.

Everytime I see "violating human anatomy" in this thread, I laugh because you guys sound like you're talking about prison rape

Until Jeff Vogel released Acadon, and has had great success with it despite its high price, there were no even serious western rpgs on the platform. Why is this? The answers to all of this has nothing to do with apple or the actual hardware of the pad, it is all the blame on developers and publisbers. No one is forcing them to play the game of chasing for the bottom or the dollar, they choose to. There is a hardcore market or one could form if they just took some risks. So quit blaming theplatform or apple people. Its not their fault things are the way they are, its the take no risk mentality. Im sick of ign articles or others cobstantly blaming the device when any game on it could work if the right approzch was taken.

Some random thoughts.

Avadon is a retrogame. When a retrogame becomes the defacto cream of the crop on a platform, as opposed to a niche genre, I think that indicates a quality problem. Same with games like Infinity Blade, which would be nothing more than tech demos on other platforms, but stir the iOS gaming community... not because they're good games but because there's nothing better.

The Apple pricing model rewards race to the bottom pricing, just like it rewards disposable games at the expense of quality games. Once in a while, a dev will put in some effort and a good game will float to the surface but what's the point in developing a hardcore game when a $1 flash game IP ripoff can make the same amount of money with way less development time?

DS games that show up for iDevices tend to be better in quality and depth.

No they don't. The DS games that don't show up on iDevices tend to be better in quality and depth because they're proprietary franchises that Nintendo develops in-house and works to preserve the value of.

Notice how unlike the console makers, Apple does zero game development. It has no vested interest in the gaming market beyond using it to sell hardware.

 

[decafjava]

Avadon is a retrogame. When a retrogame becomes the defacto cream of the crop on a platform, as opposed to a niche genre, I think that indicates a quality problem. Same with games like Infinity Blade, which would be nothing more than tech demos on other platforms, but stir the iOS gaming community... not because they're good games but because there's nothing better.

.

Well IMO there are very good games for ios-I have not played avadon but what the heck is wrong with retro games? They are popular on other platforms and furthermore games like Infinity Blade and F-Sim (both of which I have) are very good games.

 

[*LTD*]

Well IMO there are very good games for ios-

It isn't just your opinion, it's fact. This is the fastest going segment in gaming.

The better converged devices become in gaming (in particular iOS devices) the worse it will be for the makers of dedicated gaming handhelds.

 

[.Andy]

I enjoy gaming and will continue to buy a number if different consoles. I love my iOS devices but for me they are an adjunct to my consoles and pc, not a replacement. I have loved my DS and it probably got more play than any other console I have owned. Was holding out to get a 3DS until there were more games but the price drop has swayed me. OOT will be more than a good enough start

 

[Liquorpuki]

Well IMO there are very good games for ios-I have not played avadon but what the heck is wrong with retro games? They are popular on other platforms and furthermore games like Infinity Blade and F-Sim (both of which I have) are very good games.

Nothing's wrong with retrogames as a genre. Everything's wrong with a retrogame setting the standard on a platform that's supposed to be next gen.

And to me, Infinity Blade is a tech demo looped to cover up the fact the devs only squeezed about 20 mins of gameplay in it. I played through that castle once and didn't see the point of doing it over and over and over again.

 

[chrono1081]

I heard that people using the 3DS kept getting nauseous due to the 3d

I can't have one either. I literally looked at it for a few seconds and was sick the rest of the day. Its a neat concept but it makes me seriously physically ill which is a shame because I wanted one.

 

[coochiekuta]

the 3ds struggles because it has no games. by "no" i mean hardly any fresh games.

no one wants to buy a new system to play games they have already played. i have zelda 64 and i like it but i dont need to play it again or buy it again for that matter. 3d or not.

what nintendo can do is enlist the help of apple marketing guys. apple sells old tech, features like they are new ideas. if nintendo learnt that art their system would do better.

 

[FrozenTomato]

I would be saying I have seen more on DS.

Just look at it in terms of cost. iPad $500+ cost of games. DS + some games under $200. Tell me which is a better deal.

I would not mind a DS if I had the spare funds the games for it are just well better than that of an iPad or any phone so to kill time it would just work out to be better.

there's more to the iPad than just games.

 

[PBG4 Dude]

Nothing's wrong with retrogames as a genre. Everything's wrong with a retrogame setting the standard on a platform that's supposed to be next gen.

And to me, Infinity Blade is a tech demo looped to cover up the fact the devs only squeezed about 20 mins of gameplay in it. I played through that castle once and didn't see the point of doing it over and over and over again.

You need to grind to buy the sword that unlocks the dungeon. That will start a new quest. I haven't beaten the 3rd guy yet to see where it goes next though.

 

[KingCrimson]

It isn't just your opinion, it's fact. This is the fastest going segment in gaming.

The better converged devices become in gaming (in particular iOS devices) the worse it will be for the makers of dedicated gaming handhelds.

Why do you care unless you own Apple stock?

there's more to the iPad than just games.

Ah yes, the ever present finger painting app.

 

[Rodimus Prime]

there's more to the iPad than just games.

but this is not what I was responding too. I suggest you read the relevance to that.

This was about kids playing games and in that case the iPad is going to be used for games so $500+cost of games vs less than $200 with several games.
Having over a $300 delta is huge.

In this case on what I was responding to the extra stuff that the iPad can do is just well extra crap you have to pay for and have zero relevance.

 

[FrozenTomato]

but this is not what I was responding too. I suggest you read the relevance to that.

This was about kids playing games and in that case the iPad is going to be used for games so $500+cost of games vs less than $200 with several games.
Having over a $300 delta is huge.

In this case on what I was responding to the extra stuff that the iPad can do is just well extra crap you have to pay for and have zero relevance.

how much is a 3DS game? $30-$40 ?

so $300 = 10 games.

iPad games are l$.99 - $9.99 .


10 games (or more) = $30 on an iPad

 

[Rodimus Prime]

how much is a 3DS game? $30-$40 ?

so $300 = 10 games.

iPad games are l$.99 - $9.99 .


10 games (or more) = $30 on an iPad

And then it goes to quality of games.
30-40 3DS games are going to be much better games. Games for the iPad (even ones that cost money) I would not exactly call great games. They are that of doodle jump and angry birds for the most part.

iPad just can not nor was it design to be a dedicated gaming device. 3DS was designed with only games in mind. The games for the 3DS are also generally going to be better games.

The next thing is no matter what device you have chances are there will be 3-4 games at most that you will play on a regular bases and really those 3-4 are going to be the most played.
So again well over a $300 delta here.

 

[KingCrimson]

Rodimus - there is no point in trying to convince them.

 

[decafjava]

Rodimus - there is no point in trying to convince them.

Convince "who" of what? I disagree with the OP that idevices will kill Nintendo or PSP I mean I've argued myself that there will still be a place for iPods and any stand-alone mp3 player even though it is easier to just have one device.

Everything else about what constitutes a great game is opinion, I know some of you give no stock to official reviews but even pro game reviewers see some exciting things happening zero-punctuation on iPhone-Games. Not saying it can replace dedicated consoles but there is a market for the type of games you guys dismiss.

I am mainly a pc gamer, the main reason I didn't get a Mac last fall when I upgraded, concentrating on military sims especially WWII flight, armour and naval sims. That can't be replaced by ios games.

However:
http://www.wolves-of-the-atlantic.com/
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=163753

Plus the aforementioned space shuttle landing sim:
http://www.f-sim.com/test2/

The first is not out yet-the second I have and is amazing - short play sessions as suits the format but very realistic. I believe x-plane has ported their sim to ios as well. Not sure how that is.

So I think both will be around for awhile yet.

BTW Kingcrimson voted your post up one-I really hate this post polling feature we are all entitled to our opinions and I respect most of those on this forum.

 

[ngenerator]

Yesterday's Penny Arcade (08/01/11) sums it up perfectly.

 

[decafjava]

Yesterday's Penny Arcade (08/01/11) sums it up perfectly.

BS did you even look at the links I posted? Yes I saw the Penny Arcade strip. I'm sure lots of console games are crap too-and yes so are many ios games, PC games etc. Doesn't change the fact there are very good ios games.

 

[ngenerator]

BS did you even look at the links I posted? Yes I saw the Penny Arcade strip. I'm sure lots of console games are crap too-and yes so are many ios games, PC games etc. Doesn't change the fact there are very good ios games.

Nope, didn't look at them, nor was I responding specifically to you.

Sorry, I should have stated my viewpoint. I am of the clan that would much rather pay $20 for 3 good iOS games (PvZ, Angry Birds, Osmos, to name a few) rather than pay $40+ for one 3DS game. That's why I sold my PSP and DS Lite a few months ago.

If I'm going to play a mobile game, it's going to be a quick "pick up and play" type game (typically on my phone or iPad), not one that I'd have to deal with numerous loading screens just to start playing again.

Plus, 3D is a fad anyways... Looking forward to it dying off as quickly as it did when the Virtual Boy was released

 

[MacNut]

The iPad is in no way as portable as a DS. IMO the iPad is a couch computer, not meant to be taken on the bus or to the playground. If I want to game mobile I will take something that is truly portable.

The iPhone is a better mobile gaming device but the playing surface is too small.

 

[Mackan]

I'm violating human anatomy. Along with millions upon millions of touchscreen gamers (tens of millions? Hundreds of millions?.) We all are. And we keep doing it. And the publishers of these games (in some cases very big names) keep making money, and we keep wanting more.

It looks like an entire gaming industry is growing up around human anatomy violation. It seems these folks (myself included) accept this gaming ecosystem for what it is and enjoy it to such a degree that this very segment is hijacking our standard notions of gaming and challenging the console segment in popularity, revenue, and pace of development.

The gaming industry and publishers seem to fully support our human anatomy violations. And here's the kicker: it's rampant and growing at an exponential rate.

Now what?

The reality is that we *aren't* violating human anatomy. If we were, the entire touchscreen gaming model just wouldn't work and it wouldn't be making the massive inroads that we're seeing. But the model does work. Because it's implemented the right way, and we know what we're in for when we use it.

(Want to see real human anatomy violation? http://www.digitgeek.com/hp-touchsmart-all-in-one-desktop/)

Yeah, there's enough dumb masses out there that you exploit. Simple as that. Nothing more. Gaming on a small touch screen with touch screen controls just suck. Especially FPS-like games.

 

[iOSWriter]

You guys should just get an Icade if you need buttons or tose types of games so bad. It was on sale for only like $60 revently which is way less than a quality arcade joystick on consoles by companies like Capcom (who charge $150 for them). Plus it works out cquwe th games are way cheaper.

 

[*LTD*]

Yeah, there's enough dumb masses out there that you exploit. Simple as that. Nothing more.

Or maybe there's something to it. You might as well get used to this sort of gaming. Not only is it here to stay, but it's on the rise.