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No new M3 Mac Studio. No new adult size iMac…. for YEARS.
- Thread starter Suzzzabelle
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pretty easy to spew off a bunch of pure speculation and call it "pretty simple"
Pretty ironic to accuse someone of the very thing you've done the entire conversation so far.
It's also pretty telling though that instead of actually discussing any of the points I brought up, and trying to dispute them with information, you just brush it off with a sentence. Kinda make it looks like everything you're saying is just trolling.
Pretty ironic to accuse someone of the very thing you've done the entire conversation so far.
It's also pretty telling though that instead of actually discussing any of the points I brought up, and trying to dispute them with information, you just brush it off with a sentence. Kinda make it looks like everything you're saying is just trolling.
I think you’ve misunderstood my tone
You didn’t bring up any points and we are both just speculating. That’s the point
We’ve both created plausible scenarios, but there is no actual information available to confirm or dispute any such information
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Well, what some customers want anyway. Personally, I am so much happier with the Mac Studio than an iMac. Not all of us want an all-in-one desktop.
There are no reasonably specced base model computers, and the upgrades necessary to make them decent are far too expensive. My budget for any decent new machine is about $1000, and if I stretched it to my absolute max about $1500. I would consider the Mac Studio to be a high end "prosumer" machine, and even at $2000 it STILL comes with a ridiculously low 512GB storage as base that you'd need to spend $200 to get you up to a passable 1TB storage configuration, which brings it to $2200!
I'm so tired of the pricing scheme they play.
I'm so tired of the pricing scheme they play.
Do you live in my area? No....so how is this a wrong statement? I regularly......nearly on a monthly basis have Spectrum here to "repair" the equipment outside the house. I get large latency spikes with GeForce now that makes it nearly impossible to use. I suffer issues with multiplayer games too. This is a known issue with Spectrum in my area. Everybody in my area hates Spectrum but its our only choice. So please, get your facts straight before saying I am wrong as you are the wrong one. Internet as a whole in the US is very very very poor. Some areas have it better, but most of the areas do not. I know many people spread across the US and most of them have poor internet experiences. Fiber isn't available at every home in the country you know.
I am so sick of the condescending attitudes on this site. Why post anything at all if you just say "WRONG!!!!!" HOW am I wrong? How is what I said an absolutist statement? It is MY EXPERIENCE and for a lot of people I know for goodness sake.
Maybe if Apple didn't charge 10x the cost of RAM and SSD upgrades they would sell more desktops.
There is literally no case/motherboard/PSU combination that is worth a $3,000 markup between a Mac Studio and a Mac Pro. And Apple wonders why these things don't sell? Its $3,000 for just PCIe slots! That is nearly a fully maxed out Windows PC capable of playing the most demanding games with half of the budget spent on the GPU alone. JUST for PCIe capabilities?
There is no reason going to 4TB of SSD on the Mac Studio is worth $1,000 when I can get a SAMSUNG SSD at 4TB at around $300 that performs even better than Apple's. Maybe THAT is why their desktops are not selling.
There are a lot of those types of comments lately. 10 years ago this was a much nicer place. I don't know why people post these things. Like the one I responded to where they said I was wrong about my OWN experience with Spectrum in my area. People just get so emotionally attached that any criticism towards GeForce Now or Apple they need to say rude comments.
Yes exactly! And you know the crazy thing? Building a desktop yourself is well within your budget and it can perform even BETTER than Apple's base machine which is higher cost! Yep, and people wonder why Apple's desktops don't sell well.
I think it's more likely that Apple made the conscious decision to replace the large iMac with the mini / Studio + Studio display. If they wanted to make a 27" iMac, they clearly have all the parts to do so. They just have no intention of doing so, and in fact have publicly stated this.
The large iMac was arguably popular by default, in that it was the only option for a reasonably-priced yet performant desktop Mac. If Apple stuck an M3 Pro or Max in a Studio Display, how much would you expect them to sell it for?
Uhh yeah what gives? Seems clear Apple is less interested in desktops.
lol certainly not all. No serious datacenter is powered entirely by laptops with (or without) screens either. So we still have that.
Oh right, the “device not being blessed with iOS/iPadOS/macOS/whateverOS software update from Apple? TRASH” crowd. Must be fortunate for them that Apple nowadays offer 5+ years of software update support, otherwise they’d be extremely compelled to update their device every 1~2 years still.
Lmao. Might as well tick tock the development cycle like Intel used to do: tick year improve nodes and tock year improve design.
I don’t know. Maybe Apple silicon chips are still in its infancy? Or ARM’s performance ceiling is way too high?
Stop spec shopping and start shopping based on the tasks you want to do.
Is Apple ram expensive? Yes. Does the box do what you need it to do in a performant manner? That’s the more important question.
Comparing say a MacBook with 8 gigs to a windows 11 pc with 8 gigs is hilarious.
The MacBook is snappy, silent, etc.
the PC notebook will be sitting idle (as far as productivity goes) with fans blasting and CPU thrashed running teams consuming almost all its ram with windows background crap.
Per pic. That’s a freshly imaged windows 11 23h2 machine running basically no apps other than teams. The fan was clearly audible.
My MacBook Pro (16 gig, but…) was right next to it running teams inside of a windows 11 arm VM along with the rest of my workload and dead silent.
Oh and the terminal prompt running was not running a script or anything in that shot. I had just used it to ping something.
And no it wasn’t doing background software install first run stuff. Look at the uptime in task manager. 5 days.
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Apple started becoming laptop-orientated a long time ago - well before Apple Silicon. Their desktop machines have generally been laptops with either no (mini) or big (iMac) LCD screens.
The Mac Pro was an outlier, that Apple radically downsized in 2013 and subsequently seemed to hope pros would replace with an iMac. There was a brief reversal later with 2019 version, which returned to the workstation format... shortly before the Apple Silicon transition was announced the following year.
Apple Silicon is fundamentally derived from the A-series iPhone SoCs. Stretching that to a laptop (or laptop-like desktop) is straightforward enough, but precludes using a dedicated GPU. This rules Apple desktops out of high-end 3D use (including gaming).
Mac Pro users are well used to getting short shrift by Apple and now it's the turn of big-screen iMac users. The Studio makes a decent case for itself, but now seems to be getting the familiar slow / uncertain update treatment. Paying well over the odds for a fully-loaded laptop, just to have it sit there in clamshell mode plugged in to the wall, not using its screen and its glued-in battery gradually degrading, is not a great solution. Frankly, you're better off moving to Windows for desktop use; Macs make a much more compelling case for themselves as laptops.
The Mac Pro was an outlier, that Apple radically downsized in 2013 and subsequently seemed to hope pros would replace with an iMac. There was a brief reversal later with 2019 version, which returned to the workstation format... shortly before the Apple Silicon transition was announced the following year.
Apple Silicon is fundamentally derived from the A-series iPhone SoCs. Stretching that to a laptop (or laptop-like desktop) is straightforward enough, but precludes using a dedicated GPU. This rules Apple desktops out of high-end 3D use (including gaming).
Mac Pro users are well used to getting short shrift by Apple and now it's the turn of big-screen iMac users. The Studio makes a decent case for itself, but now seems to be getting the familiar slow / uncertain update treatment. Paying well over the odds for a fully-loaded laptop, just to have it sit there in clamshell mode plugged in to the wall, not using its screen and its glued-in battery gradually degrading, is not a great solution. Frankly, you're better off moving to Windows for desktop use; Macs make a much more compelling case for themselves as laptops.
It’s tough now that they sell a monitor for the price they used to sell an entire ‘entry level’ all in one system. We all know they love their high margins. Wonder if they would (could) create one for $1999? For many the all in one is still preferred over separates…one power cable, very convenient for classrooms, particularly.
I expect they could do a 27" with a base M3 chip in it for $2K. Would you be interested? Or would you prefer to buy a mini Pro + a decent 4K 27" display?
Aye. I first left the Mac platform in the late-G4 era, when I got into 3D modelling with 3ds Max. I returned after Apple transitioned to Intel, thinking that perhaps now we'd get the best of both worlds - fast / cheap commodity hardware and Mac OS. In the end I wound up having to buy a laptop (a MBP, after briefly trying a 24" iMac), before moving to a second-hand 2009 Pro, riding the updates and upgrades until last year.
I'd come to the conclusion that Apple are just intrinsically laptop / AIO focussed; this had been consistent through multiple architectures and would never change. As a primarily desktop user, I was better off on Windows than trying to fit s round peg in a square hole.
Reburb Apple Studio Display + M2/3 Mac Mini > any 27" iMac. More power, ports, and greater flexibility at around the same price. Swap out the Mac Mini for a refurb Mac Studio and it's > than an iMac Pro at around the same price.
And when it's time to upgrade you don't have to waste a perfectly good monitor for more power.
And when it's time to upgrade you don't have to waste a perfectly good monitor for more power.
There are no refurb studio displays available
Apple has done a real disservice to macOS users by making 5k the default resolution required for the gui to look its best because no one really makes 5k displays
I use a 32” 4k that looks good enough, but everything looks so much better as soon as I boot in windows and even Linux now because the gui of the os can scale to whatever resolution you want
Which quite frankly sucks because macOS is my preference and where I spend most of my computing time
Plus there's also the reduced I/O (compare the 16" M3 Max MBP to the M2 Max Studio), the bigger footprint and, perhaps most importanly, the noise. Users have reported that the fans need to spin up big time on the 16" M3 Max when under load, making it fairly noisy. A Studio has much better TDP, and thus can remain much quieter under load.
Yes, if you get the laptop you can also carry it around. But maybe you don't want or need a serious laptop for when you're mobile, and thus would rather have a Studio for home use plus a 13" Air for portability.
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Yeah, but that's comparing an M3 to a 4 year old, 10th-gen Intel chip, so of course it's going to be better. And I should hope a 2023 Studio is an upgrade on a 2017 iMac Pro! A modern PC would trounce those old machines too (and the Studio for that matter).
The complaint is that an Apple customer used to buying a relatively high-end desktop (i.e. a specced-up iMac) is now being asked to buy an entry level desktop (mini) + a screen that costs as much as a 27" iMac.
I agree my statement was poorly worded and sounds more like opinion than actual fact. Saying something is the only way to go was a phrase people used to use back in the day such as “buying a Ford is the only way to go”, meaning in their opinion is the best choice. I should’ve said if you’re interested in gaming, it’s the best way to go. that’s more of an accurate statement.
No, because we’re talking about PC gaming of course including a Mac as a PC because it is a personal computer. If you’re talking about console comparisons such as PlayStation 5 versus Nintendo Switch one could argue one is superior, but I don’t think that’s on the same level as Windows versus Mac. A better comparison would be if some new developer were to make a console with a few dozen games available versus Nintendo.
In the end, everyone has to make their own choice as to what they want to do, but when it comes to gaming playing on a Mac severely limits the variety of games.
Maybe, but if that were the case they would lower the BTO costs. Apple is happy to sell the ones they do with the egregious BTO costs than to sell more at lower price. And this has always been the case.